Should all E4 Team Leaders be Laterally Appointed to Corporal?

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 08:54:06 -0500

I believe that ALL Team Leaders should be NCOs. My Company has a plethora of Team Leaders that are E4 due to low numbers of Sergeants but most are kept at Specialist bar few exceptions where some are brought into the NCO Corps. I personally believe being a Corporal was a great experience. It brought me into the NCO Corps and kind of bridged the gap between Sergeant Team Leaders and myself. When I was a Specialist Team Leader I found myself in a very awkward position. A position where I could not hang out with other Specialists and Below because of wanting to seperate myself as a Leader but also found difficulty finding comraderie with Sergeants because I was not yet an NCO. After putting on the Stripes I found it easier to seek mentorship from other Team Leader peers because they were more willing to assist me as an NCO.<div> </div><div>Part Two, I believe it helps validate your position as a Team Leader with your Soldiers when you are an NCO. I personally did not feel like I had an issue with this as a Specialist but I know there are some that it would make a difference for.  Overall, I believe E4's serving in a Skill Level Two slot should be an NCO. I know there are some that say, if you want to be an NCO get promoted but in my opinion if you are doing an NCO's job why not be an NCO if the Rank is there for just that reason.  Look forward to hearing peoples' different takes on this topic.</div>

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2014 9:00 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 09:00:45 -0500

Yes, if you are in a leadership position with troops under you, you should be appointed as a Corporal.  Aside from the excellent points you make it is also a motivator to those selected to fill leadership positions to better themselves and their Soldiers.  It demonstrates that the Command recognizes their dedication and professionalism.  

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2014 9:27 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 09:27:24 -0500

CPL Michl I think that's a great idea, unfortunately in my experience as a support Soldier, mostly what I have seen is the rank of CPL given to those that cannot make points as a consolation prize without them having any Soldiers under them or serving in a higher position

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Mar 6 at 2014 3:52 PM

SGT Ben Keen — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 15:52:04 -0500

I think you bring up some great points.  I know when I was coming up the ranks, I was leading a team as a Specialist and I had the exact same feelings as you outlined as far as being stuck in this weird middle ground between "lower enlisted" and "NCO".  Things got a lot better when I went through PLDC (now WLC) at Ft Campbell.  

Response by SSG Jason Hoadley made Mar 6 at 2014 4:56 PM

SSG Jason Hoadley — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 16:56:32 -0500

E-4 Team Leaders,  If they have completed WLC and SSD along with a favorable board score, should have hard stripes.  But being someone that wore the rank of Corporal, do not be shocked or offended when you get tasked with "low level" NCO tasks  SDNCO, UPL observer and such.. I think it's way to seperate the team leader from the team..

Response by SFC Jeremy Boyd made Mar 6 at 2014 5:04 PM

SFC Jeremy Boyd — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 17:04:19 -0500

Having been a Corporal myself, I do see the value in it and I agree that E-4s in a leadership position should be appointed to Corporal.  In addition to it being a rather easy DA Form 4187 appointment to complete, it allows for that E-4 to be an NCO without costing the Army or DoD another dime, which seems to be on the minds of the higher echelons of leadership in the Army trying to cut costs.  The argument is obviously easier to make for someone who has attended the promotion board, but should not be limited to that alone.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2014 6:10 PM

SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 06 Mar 2014 18:10:36 -0500

There are times in the Army when you are expected to start acting like the rank above you, and and live up to those responsibilities as well. The first big instance of this is the E-4 rank. Everyone wants to feel important in the Army, but a lot of leadership is being able to influence your Soldiers outside of the rank structure. Don't get me wrong, being an NCO certainly helps a great deal, but it isn't the be all, end all of getting your Soldiers to work for you. IAW AR 600-8-19 Enlisted Promotions and Reductions: A SPC will be appointed to CPL when the Soldier is assigned and works in a SGT position. The position must be the Soldier’s PMOS or CPMOS. They cannot, or should not, make someone a Corporal unless they are serving in a MTOE/TDA slot that is actually an E-5 slot. I am in complete agreeance with a few others in this thread that you should meet the following optional requirements as well as this hard one. The two being that you are a WLC graduate, and have been recommended for E-5 by a promotion board.

Response by SGT Richard Ellis made May 22 at 2015 4:29 PM

SGT Richard Ellis — Fri, 22 May 2015 16:29:37 -0400

I totally agree, if an E-4 is in the leadership position, he/ she should be wearing an NCO rank.
There are some "NCO's" that I know should be wearing Spec-5 & Spec-6 rank. a couple even admitted that to me.

Response by SGT John Ball made Mar 21 at 2022 1:12 AM

SGT John Ball — Mon, 21 Mar 2022 01:12:30 -0400

I happily accepted my Corporal Stripes after I passed the promotion board. It was a very good learning experience and prepared me for the rank of SGT.

Response by CPL Anthony Chase made Mar 29 at 2022 3:13 PM

CPL Anthony Chase — Tue, 29 Mar 2022 15:13:07 -0400

I was a infantry Team leader and was a cpl. I was also the squad leader as we were shy NCOs, for awhile I was a cpl sporting E-5 stripes doing a E-6 job being paid E-4. One of the best things about the infantry was we all could do each other’s jobs.

Response by SGT Jeffrey Rash made Feb 19 at 2023 9:30 AM

SGT Jeffrey Rash — Sun, 19 Feb 2023 09:30:19 -0500

If an E4 is in a E5 or E6 slot they can be be laterally promoted. You can be slotted one grade down or two grades up. But just because someone is doing the slot, it doesn't mean they should automatically be promoted. They may not be ready due that type of responsibility that being an NCO brings. It's one thing to manage a group of soldiers to get work done, it's entirely a different matter to be a leader and be in charge of their actions 24/7. In my opinion, they should have to compete PLDC before being laterally promoted.

Response by SGT Ruben Lozada made Jun 6 at 2023 6:50 PM

SGT Ruben Lozada — Tue, 06 Jun 2023 18:50:09 -0400

Good evening SSG Private RallyPoint Member. Excellent post. Thank You for sharing this. Excellent question. I think that some TL and not all TLs should be laterally appointed to CPL. Reason for this is because a particular SPC will be a TL position and may not show He or She is capable of becoming a CPL. I recall when I was active duty Army as a SPC. I was always picked last for task being I wasthe new guy without any Army experience. For example, I was put on KP duty when Our unit went to California for training. It sucked, but I did it to the best of My ability. Then again. I was put on KP duty when Our unit deployed to Afghanistan in 2011. It sucked, but I did it again. Then after doing that for like three months I was finally with My squad doing patrols. It felt good not having to do KP again. For Thanksgiving that same year I volunteered to help the cook being that I've done KP before. When Our unit got back state side I was then promoted to CPL. I guess My Squad Leader and Platoon Sergeant saw potential in Me when I was doing KP to become a Team Leader.

Response by MGySgt Rick Tyrrell made Jun 6 at 2023 9:15 PM

MGySgt Rick Tyrrell — Tue, 06 Jun 2023 21:15:19 -0400

I believe “No” is the correct answer. The maturity, experience, and mentorship comes with how you carry yourself. I became the Division Ops Chief as a GySgt (E7) which was a MGySgt (E9) billet. By your logic I should have been promoted two ranks to be with my peers. This obviously did not happen but instead I became a valuable asset which my seniors looked for advice. Learning is a valuable tool. Semper Fi!!!

Response by CPL Joe Zaucha made Jun 1 at 2024 11:44 AM

CPL Joe Zaucha — Sat, 01 Jun 2024 11:44:54 -0400

It’s so bizarre, but until it’s “official” your fellow E4 will consider you nothing more than one of the boys.