SFC Michael Hasbun 47234 <div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>It&#39;s generally accepted that over the last decade of war, we have placed a lot of standards to the side in order to facilitate the war effort. Over the course of the war, there has been a great deal of institutional change and lessons learned. Now, my question(s) are the following; <br />If, in the course of our war fighting, which is the primary mission for our Armed Forces, we set certain standards aside as being irrelevant to the war effort, and the mission was a success, does that not indicate that those standards may not be needed?<br />If so, now that the wars are winding down, why would we reinstate those standards? Is that not just ignoring a decades worth of lessons learned? Is it wise to institute standards that we know are obsolete to the actual mission for the sake of &quot;well, we don&#39;t have anything else to focus on without a mission&quot;?Should we not be examining our performance over the last decade and creating NEW standards based off of lessons learned and not just rehashing what we just got done discarding as irrelevant or not vital to the mission?<br />Does the foretold end of the current conflicts HAVE to mean going back to the way things were? Can we not move forward instead of backwards? 2014-01-30T15:35:32-05:00 SFC Michael Hasbun 47234

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>It&#39;s generally accepted that over the last decade of war, we have placed a lot of standards to the side in order to facilitate the war effort. Over the course of the war, there has been a great deal of institutional change and lessons learned. Now, my question(s) are the following; <br />If, in the course of our war fighting, which is the primary mission for our Armed Forces, we set certain standards aside as being irrelevant to the war effort, and the mission was a success, does that not indicate that those standards may not be needed?<br />If so, now that the wars are winding down, why would we reinstate those standards? Is that not just ignoring a decades worth of lessons learned? Is it wise to institute standards that we know are obsolete to the actual mission for the sake of &quot;well, we don&#39;t have anything else to focus on without a mission&quot;?Should we not be examining our performance over the last decade and creating NEW standards based off of lessons learned and not just rehashing what we just got done discarding as irrelevant or not vital to the mission?<br />Does the foretold end of the current conflicts HAVE to mean going back to the way things were? Can we not move forward instead of backwards?

2014-01-30T15:35:32-05:00 2014-01-30T15:35:32-05:00 CW2 Joseph Evans 47247

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>The effects of the war over time are an indication that we need to return to the pre-war standards. A mentality of get the job done has crept into today&#39;s army and is part of the problem why we couldn&#39;t get the job done.&lt;div&gt;The lessons learned are not being thrown away, which is part of the reason for pruning the Army down to just those that were able to get it done in a professional and ethical manner, in a sense, returning to the way it was getting done at the start rather than what it deteriorated into.&lt;/div&gt;

2014-01-30T16:28:32-05:00 2014-01-30T16:28:32-05:00 1LT Private RallyPoint Member 47352

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Let me play devil's advocate here:<br><br>Did the absence of the enforcement of some of these standards enable, hinder, or leave unaffected mission success?  Especially in the sustainment world, I personally witnessed how forsaking what some call "Old Army" standards led to a complacent, shady, unfit/infirm, and self-satisfied force that would get the job done but never be able to sustain an organization into the future.<br><br>Let us look at the standards that have fallen by the wayside.  Some of them are obviously relics of a high-readiness/low-combat era followed by pervasive peace time reductions.  I'll take the starch &amp; shine disfigurement of battle dress as an example for that. The same goes for the 1950's style haircuts.  [Don't get me twisted, I won't change mine but I don't see more hair as being unprofessional.]<br><br>However, others are time tested standards that ensure long-term mission success beyond the "get the job done now" approach.  A climate of high physical fitness with a focus on good life choices and consistent risk management in garrison creates a resilient and competent fighting force with high survivability.<br><br><div>The only thing that separates us from an armed mob or mercenary force is a keen adherence to discipline and tradition which includes appendix-like vestigial things such as drill &amp; ceremony.  Part of that is a semi-rigid subculture that forsakes a lot of modern modes of self-expression for a facade of austerity.</div><div><br></div><div>---------------------<br><br>Let's use the thumb-in-the-eye test.  Every standard which is justified with reasoning that would be just as sound if we replaced said standard with "getting a thumb thrust into your eye once a day" should go.  Things such as singing, reciting a creed, or marching together have been scientifically proven to build a concept of "us" and thusly pass the thumb-in-the-eye test.  Things such as picking up pine cones with your naked butt cheeks while reciting the unit history upon promotion to Sergeant E-5 ... well, not so much.</div>

2014-01-30T18:41:28-05:00 2014-01-30T18:41:28-05:00 SSG Laureano Pabon 47861

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>&lt;p&gt;History has a tendency of repeating its self, the Geneva convention contains a statement that says: If you are in a war with a country and you win that war, the winning country must pay the losing country to restore it back. (Note: Correct me if I am wrong, while the words are not exact, they do define that meaning).&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now in life there seems to be a little law that goes like this: &quot;That which you resist you become&quot;, But there is a clause under it that goes like this: &quot;If you lose&quot;.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now lets look at history again, WW1, WW2. Germany and Japan.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;What happened?....&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Take a look at Germany today.. Pretty much American, now look as Japan...What do you see? the street lights look a bit like Time square, the males wearing suites for business such as like in wall street in NYC...&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;They fought, they lost , they became like us..&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now look at Vietnam...Did we win? (for this lets look at the Geneva convention and what it stated), The USA never paid Vietnam a anything to restore that country. Look at it today, what does it look like...(Perhaps by pulling away the US might have saved many lives).&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now let look at Iraq. Did we win? If we didn&#39;t why was so much money going to attempt to restore that country?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Lessons learned: what took place in Nam, was enough to develop a new course called SERE&#39;s. SERE&#39;s was a program developed by Vietnam veterans for the sole purpose of teaching what its like to be caught as a POW. When the program started, you would have to be a volunteer and sign waivers that would free uncle Sam from being blamed for what ever took place during your acceptance into that program. SERE during that time was pretty much realistic, so if you broke your leg or your legs were broken, uncle Sam was not responsible.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The book on how to fight a war in the jungles were written from Vietnam. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now the book on how to fight a war in the desert..&amp;nbsp; the authors of this book will be written by those who fought the war in desert storm and so on.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;But if history tends to repeat it&#39;s self, it will be in what we find similar. Vietnam and the current war that I hope we can say is over. These have been the longest.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;WWIII hasn&#39;t happened, if it was avoided then lets not count on&amp;nbsp;that just yet.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;We had an East Germany and a West Germany which is now Germany, how that happened?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Now lets look at Korea, North Korea and South Korea. That is a War that never ended, what stopped was the battle (The fighting), but its still a war that can ignite at any moment.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Another lesson: &amp;nbsp;Pearl harbor, (The awakening of a Sleeping Giant), and lets look at 911 (Another Awaking of the Sleeping Giant). 911 in the veterans community was seen coming, there was enough information for some form of action to be taken, question no knew was when and where until it was too late. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I just hope that when it comes ignoring decades of lessons learned, these lessons are never forgotten. WWIII didn&#39;t happen but that doesn&#39;t mean it can&#39;t, and if it does happen, look at who&#39;s side North Korea will be in (They are still a thread to the US).&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;WHO, WHAT, WHERE, WHEN, WHY.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;If the US knew WHEN and WHERE, 911 would have been avoided. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;It would be interesting is someone can figure out the equation of WHEN and WHERE to anything, because that&#39;s what we need to master. If this equation where know, then the all time remark: &#39;History has a tendency of repeating it self&#39; as a chain will be broken. We will be set free from its condemnation that holds us prisoner to its desire.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;

2014-01-31T11:16:33-05:00 2014-01-31T11:16:33-05:00 1SG Eric Rice 49108

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>As we transition our Army into its next phase we are the ones who determine its fate. Should some standards be left in the past and/or adapted to meet future requirements? I for one believe so. But we must also get back to holding ourselves and our soldiers to a higher standard. We have gotten away from the personal responsibility concept. Across the Army we have NCOs afraid to make on the spot corrections for fear of potentially ruining their career. This goes back to standards and discipline being set aside.   

2014-02-01T22:08:56-05:00 2014-02-01T22:08:56-05:00 2014-01-30T15:35:32-05:00