Armed civilian misfires AR-15 while guarding a recruiting station. Thoughts on civilians guarding points of interest?

2015-07-24T17:00:28-04:00

http://www.lancastereaglegazette.com/story/news/local/2015/07/23/armed-volunteer-fires-shot/30574117/

I read an article about one of the civilians misfiring his AR-15 while standing guard by a recruiting station. Thankfully, nobody was hurt but it does not excuse the lack of trigger discipline. Now, I'm aware that not all civilians are as careless as this, but there are a few people out there who are trying to do what they think is right, but they do not have the training required. Therefore, I feel that it can do more harm than good if the guards are not prepared.

I ask RallyPoint because I'm curious as to what other veterans think. True, a lot of the volunteers standing guard probably have trigger discipline and training with said weapon. However, I would not say that 100% of them have the bearing, which makes me believe that a few of them are doing a lot more harm than good. By no means am I saying that all armed civilians are undisciplined (hell, some of them can teach me a thing or two), but there are a few of them that could use a bit more.... attention, as said in the article.

So my question is, do you think that armed civilians standing guard next to points of interest is for the benefit of the good, or are they going overboard? Personally, I think that the recruiters themselves should be assigned a weapon to them in self defense and be trained on it. Though, this is just my opinion and would like to hear about what the community thinks.

(Sorry for the wall of text)

Man guarding recruitment center accidentally fires shot

An armed volunteer guarding the U.S. Army Recruiting Center accidentally fires gun.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Jul 24 at 2015 5:12 PM

2015-07-24T17:12:11-04:00

I think it should be our trained soldiers guarding their own areas. While I appreciate the thought, civilians lack the quality control and background checks necessary to do the job properly.

Response by SSG Trevor S. made Jul 24 at 2015 6:42 PM

2015-07-24T18:42:13-04:00

I really appreciate the citizen and Veteran show of support and solidarity with our recruiters. Until our recruiters and other personnel in softer security areas are able to legally defend themselves, should recruiters pull guard mount inspection on volunteer guards to include weapons status?
-also-
Others have brought up the point that we have not vetted these volunteers, and this is a great way to get another bad guy in close. Should we possibly require a training course with a back ground check for these volunteers?

Response by SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. made Jul 24 at 2015 10:17 PM

2015-07-24T22:17:42-04:00

Those darn ADs.

Response by SSgt Alex Robinson made Jul 25 at 2015 12:25 AM

2015-07-25T00:25:41-04:00

First and foremost the weapon should have had the safety on. Second on level headed, competent people should handle a firearm so as not to jeopardize the safety of others.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 25 at 2015 12:35 AM

2015-07-25T00:35:57-04:00

"I was out here and was talking to a guy who wanted to look at my AR-15," said Reed in an interview with the Eagle-Gazette. "I was trying to clear the weapon and hand it over to him when it went off. I thought it was empty and must have missed it."

^^ Taken from the article that was linked. FLAGS EVERYWHERE.

Response by Capt Seid Waddell made Jul 27 at 2015 11:30 AM

2015-07-27T11:30:30-04:00

When military policy creates a vacuum...

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 27 at 2015 11:30 AM

2015-07-27T11:30:34-04:00

Just more fuel for discussion.....Fayetteville Gun Show this weekend another Gun Expert shot himself...bright side was not outside a recruiting office....downside again just begs the question of how "safe" are people with conceal carry permits.

http://www.fayobserver.com/news/crime_courts/wilson-man-injured-when-gun-accidentally-discharges-at-crown-coliseum/article_239c7c68-13a6-53c3-95e8-74fd8059fd7e.html

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 27 at 2015 11:31 AM

2015-07-27T11:31:10-04:00

With civilians, accidents are bound to happen. Arm those service members that ARE trained. RECRUITERS.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 27 at 2015 11:32 AM

2015-07-27T11:32:43-04:00

Response by LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow made Jul 27 at 2015 12:25 PM

2015-07-27T12:25:50-04:00

Unbelievable. The self appointed militia guarding the military. That's as bad as having rent-a-cops guarding the military.

I understand that the Law of Posse Comitatus rules need to be resolved, but it's outrageous that military personnel who are armed fully in combat are required to turn in their weapons the minute they get on the plane, and aren't allowed to be armed at home.

I said this in other threads, but "TRAIN AS YOU FIGHT". The argument has been posed that we shouldn't arm the military because they don't get trained, with the exception of Combat Arms. That is a flawed argument on two points.
1) How many logistics trains, with women soldiers (who at the time were not yet allowed to be combatants) had to engage in battle in Desert Storm and OIF/OEF? These supposed "non-combatants" were in fact most definitely combatants - the minute they were attacked. That is also why I think the AR regarding Chaplains being trained to shoot is wrong. While I understand and support the Geneva Convention rules that Chaplains are unarmed non-combatants, the reality is that if your RP/56D/whatever is taken out, and you don't know how to shoot his/her weapon, you're dead too. That is contrary to religious law and human nature (as I understand and practice it). If I were a Chaplain on A/D, you can bet I'd know how to shoot everything my troops had (even if I had to go to a private range to qualify)...
2) TRAIN AS YOU FIGHT says that EVERY person in the military should be trained on every small arm in their respective service's arsenal. It used to gall the hell out of me, as a Command Duty Officer, that I had to carry my .45 in one hand and my clip in the other. I was qualified, and I was one of the most responsible officers around, yet I wasn't allowed to be locked and loaded. If someone shot at me, I wouldn't be able to get off any shots by the time I got the clip in and the slide cycled...

It's time that the Puzzle Palace and the White House get their heads out of the sand and deal with the situation. One dead military person from the hands of a crazy at home is too many. How many more will die before they get their heads out from where the sun don't shine????

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 30 at 2015 11:27 PM

2015-07-30T23:27:00-04:00

There is a positive to it. It shows that the American people are behind the military. Inside of riots and hate there is respect and community.