Army Sex Consent Card?

TSgt Joshua Copeland — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 21:57:27 -0500

Army folks, please tell me this is a joke?

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2015 10:03 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 22:03:39 -0500

MSgt Copeland,

As an Army Sharp rep I will tell you that this may be a joke; a tasteless joke; but is most definitely not real. I hope that some Soldier out there does not think that this can get them out of a bad situation that they put themselves in. A yes can always become a no. Doesn't matter whether it is signed off by both parties 2 minutes ago. It upsets me that Service Members are trying to find ways around doing the right thing instead of just doing the right thing.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2015 10:03 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 22:03:41 -0500

I've never hear or seen this before. If I had to guess, it is probably a unit thing.

Response by SPC Lukas Jones made Feb 26 at 2015 10:09 PM

SPC Lukas Jones — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 22:09:17 -0500

It's fake. I don't think even a unit would sign off on the creation of such an item. As SSG Schmidt said, a yes can become a no. And no always means no, regardless of some dumb card having been signed or not.

Response by MSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2015 11:12 PM

MSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 23:12:46 -0500

Lol!!! Now THAT just made my day! Thanks!

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2015 11:23 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 Feb 2015 23:23:25 -0500

As a VA/SHARP, let me state emphatically this is NOT a legally viable safeguard to prevent someone from filing a charge of sexual assault against you! This is nothing more than barracks lawyering at it's finest! I am not an attorney, but in most states, a couple of signatures on a card is not a valid contract; particularly after the consumption of a few drinks! Know the law where you live. When you go out, don't go alone and have a plan. Above all else, just do the right thing, even when nobody else is watching you!

Response by SSG Rob Cline made Feb 27 at 2015 6:40 AM

SSG Rob Cline — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 06:40:26 -0500

Totally fake. There's no DA/ SF form number on the bottom. :)

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Feb 27 at 2015 9:57 AM

Capt Richard I P. — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 09:57:57 -0500

A lot of people have reacted mentioning that this won't be considered valid consent across the board. While I can see there could still be commentary on impairment before signature and coercion, surely a signed consent document is more credible than a verbal agreement intrinsically? We're getting to the point where the only ironclad mutual consent will be video recording of the entire interaction, from initial meeting through parting, with multiple mentions of no impairment or coercion by both parties, demonstrations of competency prior to and following the act and repeated camera sweeps of the surrounding area before, during and after to show the context.

I think I've established my bona-fides elsewhere on related threads as a firm believer in consent and against assault, and in empowerment and protection of all people, but consent rules are becoming unattainable. This makes people want to ignore them and drop back to just muddling through it the old fashioned way. This creates more risk of it going wrong.

Response by SGT Jim Z. made Feb 27 at 2015 9:59 AM

SGT Jim Z. — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 09:59:45 -0500

Not legal or real in the eyes of the Army but it is kind of funny and something Duffleblog.com would carry.

Response by CPT Zachary Brooks made Feb 27 at 2015 9:59 AM

CPT Zachary Brooks — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 09:59:56 -0500

I have heard that some colleges are attempting to get contracts such as this. While it should help to protect the soldiers, it is still way to nanny state to me. If you make bad choices, you will sadly have to deal with them.

This is why we encourage groups and keeping an eye on your buddy.

Response by CPT Aaron Kletzing made Feb 27 at 2015 10:52 AM

CPT Aaron Kletzing — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 10:52:24 -0500

I have a clarifying question -- is this a real thing? Or did someone make this up? Please clarify if you know for sure. This seems completely made-up to me...I hope some unit somewhere didn't actually think about making these and disseminating them...

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Feb 27 at 2015 11:13 AM

LTC Paul Labrador — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 11:13:39 -0500

It's a joke.....but a sad one because this is almost what it takes to CYA these days....

Response by CPT Zachary Brooks made Feb 27 at 2015 11:18 AM

CPT Zachary Brooks — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 11:18:19 -0500

I think it is based on this "Yes means yes" initiative out of California. Another good idea with terrible implementation:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/alisonvingiano/a-new-california-law-requires-college-students-to-give-conse#.poOJBVdvx

A New California Law Requires College Students To Give Consent Before Sex

The "Yes Means Yes" law is the first of its kind.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2015 11:53 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 11:53:44 -0500

I have to admit that I have mentioned something like this in safety briefs. Get a signed consent form. I have also stated that it doesn't mean things can't change, but it's best to be sure from the get go. I've mentioned checking your partner's identification to properly determine if they are of legal age before partaking in any bumping of naughty bits. I don't like the bottom part of this at all. That's dangerous and points towards this being thought of as a get out of jail free card, when it isn't even close. Bring that card in with a smug look on your face after being accused of rape and you'll likely make your situation much worse.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2015 12:21 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 12:21:57 -0500

TSgt Joshua Copeland , although this was a joke, I do know that a friend in a WTU said that one unit at her station was attempting to implement a "sexual consent contract".

Regarding the joke, it is certainly not one that I find appealing. Rape is one of the few subjects that I find off-limits for humor, as I was in a unit that had a sexual assault and watched what happened to the unit and the Soldier in question (a friend of mine).

That being said, those that consider this to be a good idea are lacking an understanding of the overall concept of rape. Sexual assaults/rape can begin with consensual sex and progress to rape. It can also begin with a person being under the influence of a drug like Rohypnol that makes people very cooperative, but I don't think anyone would argue that it would be a rape nonetheless. Various other drugs can reduce peoples abilities to accurately make decisions.

This card to me illustrates several major flaws we have in our society.

First, rape is a "male" problem. When I was a sophomore in college, a "friend" decided to use me as a way to get out of college, alleging that I assaulted her in her room. It very nearly ended my career had she pressed charges, as it was her word against mine. Fortunately, she didn't...and 3 months later she sent me an email admitting that she had lied about the assault because she was afraid of telling her parents that she was failing school. Bottom line, it can happen to men and women, and BY men or women. The statistics show that men are less likely to report it...but it is by no means unique to any gender.

Second, rape is not a joke. I get that the sexual harassment classes are obnoxious and annoying. Additionally, I understand that some of the SHARP representatives are oversensitive with regards to what is allowed. However, there is a vast difference between a slightly off color joke and making a joke or threat about raping someone. When I made the comment about this same card while it was circulating on facebook, commenting about the lack of humor in rape, the response was "It's a joke, not a dick. Don't take it so hard." Until we learn to take some things seriously, the problem will continue.

Third, the concept that we need a contract for everything, or that the contract is going to protect us. I know of several rape victims, and their stories are all different. One was raped while she was married. Her husband didn't like hearing "no" and decided he was going to do what he wanted anyways.

1SG Private RallyPoint Member , there are some commands considering these kinds of actions. Generally, it is a well-meaning, but ill-informed commander. I've not seen it personally, but a friend of mine had told me about it happening at her base on a small scale.
v/r,
CPT Butler

Response by SFC Collin McMillion made Feb 27 at 2015 12:25 PM

SFC Collin McMillion — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 12:25:32 -0500

I really think it is meant as a joke, but probably would not be a bad idea considering today's society.

Response by Cpl Jerry Millar made Feb 27 at 2015 1:38 PM

Cpl Jerry Millar — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 13:38:32 -0500

Why is it addressed only to men?

Response by Cpl Mark McMiller made Feb 27 at 2015 2:18 PM

Cpl Mark McMiller — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 14:18:10 -0500

Since it's for the Army, shouldn't there be two lines for both males to sign? :)

But, seriously, is this thing for real? It wouldn't surprise me if it was in this day and age of BS being foisted on our military.

Response by PFC Robert Yonts made Feb 27 at 2015 2:56 PM

PFC Robert Yonts — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 14:56:51 -0500

no its not

Response by CPT Aaron Kletzing made Feb 27 at 2015 7:18 PM

CPT Aaron Kletzing — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 19:18:47 -0500

This is obviously a joke...

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2015 7:24 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 19:24:56 -0500

Compared to how things are done wouldn't be a good idea?

Don't get scared but if she won't sign then she's not that into you.

Response by LTC David S. Chang, ChFC®, CLU® made Feb 27 at 2015 7:28 PM

LTC David S. Chang, ChFC®, CLU® — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 19:28:27 -0500

I actually think the spirit of it focuses on that we should always think twice about our actions. If this is what it takes for people to remember that, then so be it.

I remember in Sharp training there was the video where a couple were going further and their lawyers popped up. It was well done and pretty funny. Stuff like that sticks and if a guy and gal can hold their hormones to make sure their actions are ethical, then the job was done!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2015 10:00 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 Feb 2015 22:00:15 -0500

I feel this isn't real, but sadly I agree with it in principle.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2015 4:52 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Feb 2015 04:52:51 -0500

There's an app for that.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2015 6:32 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Feb 2015 06:32:34 -0500

It is ignorant and basically could be used for bad.

Response by SPC Larry Buck made Feb 28 at 2015 10:01 AM

SPC Larry Buck — Sat, 28 Feb 2015 10:01:20 -0500

I'm not there, but can say nope..not a joke in this day and age.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2015 4:35 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 28 Feb 2015 16:35:43 -0500

That better be a horrible joke.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2015 4:19 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Mar 2015 04:19:35 -0500

That's as wrong as two left shoes. And I can see some Soldier trying to use that.

'But Sarge'

Response by TSgt Aaron D. made May 27 at 2015 9:59 PM

TSgt Aaron D. — Wed, 27 May 2015 21:59:18 -0400

This is such a wonderful idea!

Response by CW5 Jim Steddum made Aug 23 at 2015 3:08 PM

CW5 Jim Steddum — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 15:08:28 -0400

Watched this video this weekend during a academic facilitation... Sex consent contracts may not be real in the Army (for now), but they are on College Campuses... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-gu6s0eGOk.

See also, http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/sex/11738202/Sex-consent-contracts-for-university-students-Would-you-sign.html

Kontraband Contract

This is really funny ;)

Response by SPC James Burkett II made Aug 23 at 2015 11:05 PM

SPC James Burkett II — Sun, 23 Aug 2015 23:05:03 -0400

Wow I'm glad that it's not real, to many soldiers I know would try to use that to get away with doing what they want. For those people who have these thinking they will save you remember if she is to drunk to consent she is to drunk for her signature to hold up.

Response by CPT Russell Pitre made Aug 24 at 2015 3:36 AM

CPT Russell Pitre — Mon, 24 Aug 2015 03:36:00 -0400

I don't see a spot for a witness signature. I you have to worry about that you shouldn't be in the ball park.

Response by MAJ Jim Steven made Aug 25 at 2015 8:41 AM

MAJ Jim Steven — Tue, 25 Aug 2015 08:41:44 -0400

I bet Bill Cosby wished he had a few signed versions of these from the ladies.
I'm not saying that to be funny, but you see where it can be useful.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Oct 5 at 2015 8:27 AM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Mon, 05 Oct 2015 08:27:00 -0400

This popped up the other day, but I will repeat what I said on that thread.

Not worth the paper it is printed on.

Consent can be withdrawn at any point, even during the act, by any partner.

Response by SGT Ben Keen made Oct 5 at 2015 8:42 AM

SGT Ben Keen — Mon, 05 Oct 2015 08:42:41 -0400

I'm siding with Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS on this one. Not worth the paper they are printed on. Not only can consent by withdrawn at any point, but really, what male do you know when "geared up and ready to go" will stop and fill this out then ask their partner to fill it out to?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2015 9:30 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Oct 2015 09:30:02 -0400

I'll be certain to give this card to my wife later. *sarcasm*

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Oct 5 at 2015 12:26 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Mon, 05 Oct 2015 12:26:41 -0400

What if she is too drunk to sign it?

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2015 5:12 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Oct 2015 17:12:28 -0400

I guess a lot of people see this as a bad thing, not legally binding, not good to use as purely consensual??? For those of you against this, what is good for consent? If not written contract, video? Seriously. I'd like a response just to know.

Response by CSM Michael J. Uhlig made Oct 6 at 2015 7:29 PM

CSM Michael J. Uhlig — Tue, 06 Oct 2015 19:29:09 -0400

Ridiculousness.

Response by 1stSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 6 at 2015 7:49 PM

1stSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 06 Oct 2015 19:49:12 -0400

Please tell me that is a joke.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Oct 6 at 2015 8:05 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Tue, 06 Oct 2015 20:05:21 -0400

This has popped up a couple times this week.

No, it's not a good idea.

Consent is a fluid concept, because consent can be revoked at any time, even during the act, by either partner. The idea that having a signature on a card is a get out of jail free card, will keep you out of jail... well that's just plain silly.

When it really boils down to it, no card will protect you, and it will probably hurt you more.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 6 at 2015 8:06 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 06 Oct 2015 20:06:45 -0400

This is actually a thing in the Univ of Cal. system. It is to ensure “affirmative consent." I think if you are in a situation where you need a card to ensure you are not charged with a sex crime you shouldn't be there in the first place. I am a bit older and married so I know I wouldn't really be one for such a thing. But when I was a single paratrooper at Fort Bragg I didn't use alcohol to seduce a women. It is bad both ways. When I was a cop I learned a valuable lesson that applies in most cases. If you have to ask to clarify if you are wrong or not then you are most likely in the wrong. Even if a card was signed and the female claimed she was raped the other party would still be charged and this card wouldn't be able to be used as a means to defend the actions.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/30/us/california-law-on-sex-consent-pleases-many-but-leaves-some-doubters.html?_r=0

To save articles or get newsletters, alerts or recommendations – all free.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 6 at 2015 8:07 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 06 Oct 2015 20:07:43 -0400

Here is a video of how it should be done.

Consent (2004)

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0402936/fullcredits#cast Daniel Dubiecki, Scott Ludden, David Tate, Jason Reitman, Michele Lee Cast: Todd Waldman, Rachel Vacca, ...

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Oct 7 at 2015 12:40 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Wed, 07 Oct 2015 12:40:56 -0400

Obviously it's not a real product, but does that really mean it's a bad idea? I'm curious what effect this would have if presented during official inquiry...

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 10 at 2015 8:31 AM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 10 Oct 2015 08:31:05 -0400

Hold on, time out!

Response by MSgt Michael Smith made Oct 22 at 2015 3:36 PM

MSgt Michael Smith — Thu, 22 Oct 2015 15:36:00 -0400

You know, as much as people want to play down the reality of sexual assault in the military, it is a HUGE problem. I served 22 years in the Air Force in a career field with a relatively high percentage of female airmen. I can personally tell you that about 4 out of 5 were sexually harassed or treated inappropriately during their careers. 4 out of 5! That is a problem, and its no joke.

Response by MAJ David Vermillion made Oct 28 at 2015 1:27 PM

MAJ David Vermillion — Wed, 28 Oct 2015 13:27:50 -0400

We have become a society of fear. The use of the Golden Rule can help in most situations.

Response by Megan Flanagan Monek made Feb 8 at 2024 9:49 AM

Megan Flanagan Monek — Thu, 08 Feb 2024 09:49:31 -0500

I recently found one in my grandfather's items - it is from the 1930's