As an officer, should you salute someone junior whom gives you the greeting of the day, but hands are full and can not render a salute?

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 13:01:20 -0500

<p>I know the anwer to this question, but I have yet to see it happen.</p><p>The same can be said for just the opposite, "Officer's hands are full (carrying a box, or whatever), and SPC, SGT, SSG Joe fail to salute because they're thinking is that the officer's hands are full so he can't return the salute, so I won't salute!"</p><p>Thoughts!?</p>

Response by SSG Andrew Dydasco made Feb 3 at 2014 1:37 PM

SSG Andrew Dydasco — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 13:37:42 -0500

I've had my hands full and given the greeting of the day to officers and they render a quick hand salute.  Some do, some don't.  And vice versa; I still always salute an officer even if their hands are full, wait for them to pass or return greeting before dropping the salute.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Feb 3 at 2014 1:38 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 13:38:34 -0500

The person who is capable of the salute does so. The person who's hands are full does not. Either way, the courtesy should be extended. Perhaps a respectful nod and verbal greeting would be appropriate if your hands are full?

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2014 2:22 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 14:22:22 -0500

Ryan, why you recycling questions from BOLC??? JK lol

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2014 3:47 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 15:47:35 -0500

AR does not require it, but If I am able to salute I do, even if the officer cant return the salute. NOT REQUIRED does not mean strictly forbidden!<div><br></div><div><div>AR 600–25<br></div><div><br></div><div>i. Salutes are not required to be rendered or returned when the senior or subordinate, or both are—</div><div>(1) In civilian attire.</div><div>(2) Engaged in routine work if the salute would interfere.</div><div>(3) Carrying articles with both hands so occupied as to make saluting impracticable.</div><div>(4) Working as a member of a detail, or engaged in sports or social functions where saluting would present a safety</div><div>hazard.</div><div>(5) In public places such as theaters, churches, and in public conveyances.</div><div>(6) In the ranks of a formation</div></div>

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 3 at 2014 4:52 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 16:52:10 -0500

The times I have been Saluted by a Soldier with keys or a smoke in their saluting hand I have refered them to an NCO for corrective action.

Response by CMC Robert Young made Feb 3 at 2014 9:54 PM

CMC Robert Young — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 21:54:06 -0500

Salutes are required of juniors regardless of the capacity of the senior to return the salute.

Response by Maj Walter Kilar made Feb 3 at 2014 10:46 PM

Maj Walter Kilar — Mon, 03 Feb 2014 22:46:45 -0500

<div>If a junior member has his/her hands full I would salute because it shows that I acknowledge the junior member's verbal greeting and I respect him/her as a fellow service member. It also sets an example for the junior member that respect between military members is unquestionable and is not conditional. Simple.</div>

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 13 at 2014 5:15 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 13 Mar 2014 17:15:04 -0400

I am big on customs, it was ingrained in me the first days as a Marine.  If your hands are full you render the greeting of the day, the other service member will salute and render the greeting.  I think a lot of these customs and traditions have gone out the window in the past ten or so years, I think it is time we get back to it.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 14 at 2014 6:04 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 14 Mar 2014 18:04:55 -0400

Every soldier has run into this problem at least once, and my solution was to salute only when both parties were capable. If I had both hands free, but an approaching officer didn't, I would not salute but I'd be damned sure to make sure he received the greeting of the day and knew I acknowledged both him and his rank. <div><br></div><div>I did this because many times when I was a brand new PV2 I rendered the salute regardless, and it clearly caused discomfort and unease on the officers part. I've never been corrected by anyone for going by my earlier mentioned solution. </div>

Response by SPC(P) Delcina Myers made Mar 15 at 2014 12:11 AM

SPC(P) Delcina Myers — Sat, 15 Mar 2014 00:11:13 -0400

Tricky question, Sir... Although when someone salutes an officer, Reg says that you can't release your hand until the salute is returned... Being an insufferable amount of time if the officer is power hungry and hates the lower enlisted... So, if an officer is carrying something, I would be polite, not salute so that way I wouldnt have to stand at the POA all day until said person renders the salute in return, but I WOULD, however, give the greeting of the day... 

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 15 at 2014 12:52 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 15 Mar 2014 00:52:58 -0400

<p>1LT Ball,</p><p>Glad you brought this up because it is one that most people tend to mess up. If you read 600-25 (the regulation covering salutes and courtesies) on the top of page two it covers when not to salute.</p><p>"A salute is not require to be rendered or returned if: </p><font face="Times New Roman" size="2"><font face="Times New Roman" size="2"><p align="LEFT">(1) In civilian attire.</p><p>
(2) Engaged in routine work if the salute would interfere.</p><p>
(3) Carrying articles with both hands so occupied as to make saluting impracticable.</p><p>
(4) Working as a member of a detail, or engaged in sports or social functions where saluting would present a safety hazard.</p><p>
(5) In public places such as theaters, churches, and in public conveyances.</p><p>
(6) In the ranks of a formation.</p></font><p><br></p><p>I don't know how many times I will be heading towards a meeting with hands full of papers and someone renders a salute. I will then return the greeting, without saluting, and then educate them on the regulation. Now you know. </p><p><br></p><p>http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r600_25.pdf</p></font><p><br></p>

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 25 at 2014 7:42 PM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 19:42:40 -0400

Anybody that gives me the greeting of the day is getting saluted, whether they can salute back or not.

Response by SFC Michael Hartwig made Mar 29 at 2014 11:48 PM

SFC Michael Hartwig — Sat, 29 Mar 2014 23:48:29 -0400

As regulation states Sir all you need to do is give the greeting of the day back.  I have had the opposite happen and felt bad that I couldn't salute but gave the greeting of the day and the Officer saluted back.<div><br></div>

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 30 at 2014 7:46 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 30 Mar 2014 07:46:48 -0400

You are never wrong when rendering a salute.  However, if someone doesn't have the ability to return the courtesy, it can prove awkward.   The greeting of the day without the salute still shows that the Soldier is respectful and trying to do the right thing, but giving consideration to the fact that their superior has his or her hands full.    Some Soldiers just feel uncomfortable not saluting their superiors and will do it anyways.   It's a non-issue for me regardless of whether they salute or use the greeting of the day.  Whether you can return the salute or respond with the greeting of the day, it doesn't matter so long as you do one of them.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2014 12:21 AM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 01 Apr 2014 00:21:41 -0400

Imagine if you were at a Navy/Army Football game and were required to salute as a player,  coach and fan.  lol    Carry the ball with one hand and salute with the other.  ha

Response by SMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2014 10:19 AM

SMSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 01 Apr 2014 10:19:56 -0400

<P style="MARGIN: 0in 0in 10pt" class=MsoNormal><FONT size=3><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Calibri>Sir, a Chief once said anything you tolerate becomes the standard.  The right thing to do is for the officer or the enlisted member is to render a salute, with hands full the verbal greeting is used in place of the salute. The two individuals rendering the greeting and salute or not doing either are setting the example for any and all that see the exchange.  Thus their actions are degrading or enhancing customs and courtesies.  In short yes the enlisted and officer in your scenario should salute.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p></FONT></FONT></FONT></P>

Response by CWO2 Shelby DuBois made Apr 2 at 2014 9:01 AM

CWO2 Shelby DuBois — Wed, 02 Apr 2014 09:01:43 -0400

As O's go... Jr O's should be held to the same standard as Enlisted... Salute when appropriate. If you are an O and don't know then you'd better get out your Basic books and do a refresher. My expectation is that Officers know these very basic tenets of being a leader.  And I agree with the 1LT.. a lot of these 'traditions' may have been set aside in the past few years but the Marines are making a concerted effort to get back to the customs and courtesies a professional military needs to ensure proper discipline. But the word "discipline" is taboo with much of todays generation of kids who feel they should be equal to all without earning their stripes. Gonna be a bumpy ride going forward. 

Response by SSG Anthony Schoepp made Apr 2 at 2014 10:44 AM

SSG Anthony Schoepp — Wed, 02 Apr 2014 10:44:05 -0400

I have always saluted officers even if they cannot return it (sometimes with amusing results). The
salute is a tradition of honor that needs to be upheld. Just because
your hands are full does not mean that you get a pass. Even worse are the personnel, enlisted AND officers alike that will purposely change their direction to avoid saluting each other. I have called out both before in a respectful manner but many young Soldiers, again enlisted and officer alike, feel they can bend the rules to make it more convenient. There needs to be more focus on respect, customs and curiosities as this will help bring discipline back into focus. <br>

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 2 at 2014 10:50 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 02 Apr 2014 10:50:16 -0400

I feel that (dare I say it) common sense pervails here Sir. As has been said the ones whose hands are not full should render the salute as normal and should give the greeting of the day. I have done this numerous times upon approaching officers who have their hands full and they always return the greeting, once they do then I drop my salute. When approaching and my hands are full I give the greeting of the day and some will still salute, and some only return the greeting of the day.

Response by Maj Tom BangKnudsen made Apr 2 at 2014 3:43 PM

Maj Tom BangKnudsen — Wed, 02 Apr 2014 15:43:45 -0400

No the actual act of raising your hand and arm to perform the salute is what should responded to not gesture of acknowledging a senior officer.  Now the junior ranking must render a salute even if he knows the senior cannot return the salute.

Response by Sgt Matthew O'Donnell made Apr 7 at 2014 8:12 AM

Sgt Matthew O'Donnell — Mon, 07 Apr 2014 08:12:56 -0400

If the hands of either service member are full, no salute is rendered, it is actually inappropriate to salute someone or expect a salute from someone with their hands full. The proper greeting of the day is fine.<br>

Response by CW2 Jonathan Kantor made Apr 8 at 2014 10:46 AM

CW2 Jonathan Kantor — Tue, 08 Apr 2014 10:46:03 -0400

This has never happened to me.  I don't think I would because that would technically be me saluting someone junior to me and that could only be an enlisted Soldier.  That being said, I think that since you are capable of saluting, you should do so.  I will need to consult the reg to be sure... or just ask an NCO.<br>

Response by SGT Michael Smith made Apr 12 at 2014 6:45 PM

SGT Michael Smith — Sat, 12 Apr 2014 18:45:43 -0400

Yes. AR600-25 Chapter 1, paragraph 5.b.   http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r600_25.pdf

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 15 at 2014 4:41 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 15 Apr 2014 04:41:33 -0400

Or like I'm my case a 2LT tried to chew me because I didn't salute him, even though I said good morning Sr, since I had my hand full. So I told him "I'm really sorry Sr could you hold this bags for me?" So I gave him part of my stuff, saluted him, he looked at me confused saluted back I got my bags and walked away.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 23 at 2014 2:47 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 23 Apr 2014 14:47:38 -0400

<p>Sir,</p><p> </p><p>No matter what traditions and courtesies are in place for a reason.  Not too long ago (2000-2006) I was assigned to 4-1FA.  The command policy was regardless of the activity or current mission in the field(at base) or garrison we as Soldiers, NCO's, and Leaders will address one another in a matter befitting professionalism and discipline.  Bedrock of any tight knit unit is th erespect of one another if your hands are full drop or place what you have at your feet and accept my salute just as if I were busy and concede to you.  It is not a matter of what is convenient it is a matter of right and wrong; their is no grey area on this although a majority may disagree.  As long as the environment allows and doesnt cause dmage to property or personnel is it really that hard to stop, pause for a few moments, and render or return a salute.  I guess I would ask you this?  As an officer with all this in your hands either at morning or evening would you salute the flag during the reveille?  If youi answer yes then the same mentality and courtesy should be applied anywhere anytime a Servicemember respects you and renders you a salute.</p>

Response by SSG Kevin McCulley made May 3 at 2014 3:35 PM

SSG Kevin McCulley — Sat, 03 May 2014 15:35:26 -0400

Return the physical salute with a verbal one.

Response by Cpl Michael Mosley made Dec 21 at 2014 1:51 PM

Cpl Michael Mosley — Sun, 21 Dec 2014 13:51:18 -0500

You are required to salute an Officer doesn't matter if their hands are full. A salute to an officer also requires a return salute the the greeter. That's the way it was when I was in the Marine Corps in the early 90's.

Response by SSG Tim Everett made Dec 29 at 2014 5:10 AM

SSG Tim Everett — Mon, 29 Dec 2014 05:10:08 -0500

Irrelevant tangent to this conversation: I was walking behind battalion headquarters on my way to the motor pool with a heavy load in both hands. Headquarters Company Commander comes out of Battalion. I give him the greeting of the day. He stops dead in his tracks, says "where's my salute?"

I let the silence hang just long enough to be questionable, said "I guess you can't hold this for me," dropped the heavy stuff on the ground, saluted, and got the eff out of dodge before he could read my nametape.

Response by MSG David Gagnon made Dec 29 at 2014 5:34 AM

MSG David Gagnon — Mon, 29 Dec 2014 05:34:47 -0500

Its like when you think you need a haircut, you do, salute show respect.

Response by SA Harold Hansmann made Jan 6 at 2015 11:36 AM

SA Harold Hansmann — Tue, 06 Jan 2015 11:36:43 -0500

Yes, regardless if the officer has their hands full or not.

Response by CPL J Sannizzaro made Feb 22 at 2021 6:38 PM

CPL J Sannizzaro — Mon, 22 Feb 2021 18:38:03 -0500

Still show the proper respect and salute. Officers are never required to return a salute to the beat of my understating. I was taught to hold the salute until it was returned, acknowledged, or the officer or you completely passed by. But that was in the 1980’s.

Response by CPO Jeffrey Bohemier made Mar 10 at 2021 7:34 PM

CPO Jeffrey Bohemier — Wed, 10 Mar 2021 19:34:28 -0500

YES...YOU SHOULD SALUTE IF AT ALL POSSIBLE. Senior officers are supposed to be setting the example for junior officers, etc... Just because someone else’s hands are full doesn’t give you a “GET OUT OF SALUTING” pass.

Response by CPT William Jones made Mar 15 at 2021 5:16 PM

CPT William Jones — Mon, 15 Mar 2021 17:16:25 -0400

A salute is the standard greeting between military people and comes from ancient times. If other member approaching has full loaded hands does not stop the other from rendering the proper greeting. The hands fool person simply renders verbal greeting. No problem at all

Response by CSM Tony Blair made Jan 17 at 2022 4:35 AM

CSM Tony Blair — Mon, 17 Jan 2022 04:35:23 -0500

Short and sweet, you salute no matter what, if the officer can’t return it continue on, you did what you were suppose to do!!!!

Response by CPT Leo Coleman made May 1 at 2023 11:41 AM

CPT Leo Coleman — Mon, 01 May 2023 11:41:02 -0400

I always did. He'd have saluted if he could have.