Atheists Want Guard to Stop Bible Handouts. What is your opinion?

2014-08-05T08:46:01-04:00

If you do not believe in the BIBLE GOD JESUS etc do not take the BIBLE. Easy answer

http://www.military.com/daily-news/2014/08/05/atheists-want-guard-to-stop-bible-handouts.html?ESRC=eb.nl

Atheists Want Guard to Stop Bible Handouts

An atheist organization is demanding the Missouri National Guard stop offering Bibles to new recruits at recruiting station.

Response by MSG Wade Huffman made Aug 5 at 2014 8:50 AM

2014-08-05T08:50:57-04:00

I agree with you Robin, just because someone is handing something out doesn't mean you have to accept it. If you don't agree with the bible, just walk away. Why take the opportunity from someone who does.

Response by 1SG Michael Blount made Aug 5 at 2014 8:59 AM

2014-08-05T08:59:58-04:00

Better be ready for handouts of the Koran and Torah, too. That doesn't mean I'm an atheist. Just trying to give everyone equal opportunity.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2014 10:10 AM

2014-08-05T10:10:04-04:00

If the bible (or any other religious document) is in a place where anyone who wants on can take it great. If anyone doesn't want it that's great too. I frequently saw stacks of bibles at the MEPS so recruits from all services could have one if they wanted to grab one and never had an issue with it. The only caveat I see to the practice is if you are going to offer one religious document then other documents should be permitted to be "passed" out as well. Put them all in one central location and call it a day

Response by SSG Trevor S. made Aug 5 at 2014 10:32 AM

2014-08-05T10:32:03-04:00

Atheist extremists lashing out to destroy others rights instead of bolstering their own again. Feeble approach in my opinion.

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Aug 5 at 2014 10:56 AM

2014-08-05T10:56:31-04:00

Is it "handing out" or "making available". Those are two different things. I would have issues if the military was issuing a bible to every soldier. But I have NEVER seen that in my 18 yrs. What I have seen is the chaplains will set up a table with religious literature available (of all kinds of flavors) and soldiers are free to take what they want. THAT should not change.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Aug 5 at 2014 10:59 AM

2014-08-05T10:59:30-04:00

"No thank you" simple, easy, non-aggressive, mom & dad taught you how to say it and what it means and you've been using the phrase for a while...

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Aug 5 at 2014 11:10 AM

2014-08-05T11:10:16-04:00

I suspect that if the Guard were handing out religious material that related to Satanism, the tenor of comments would be different...

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Aug 5 at 2014 12:28 PM

2014-08-05T12:28:16-04:00

As has been stated in so many posts, today everything is offensive. Now by definition, if any US government department/agency/affiliate, whatever, is used in the same sentence as God or any other religious terms, this constitutes the US Government supporting religion.

So when does the US start spending the tens of billions of dollars its going to cost to reprint and remint our money??? No matter what the argument against the government supporting religion is, not one person has refused to cash a paycheck on the principle that our money has the word "God" on it. Apparently being a hypocrite at that level is OK.

Response by SSG Ed Mikus made Aug 5 at 2014 12:59 PM

2014-08-05T12:59:46-04:00

who cares, keep handing them out.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2014 1:13 PM

2014-08-05T13:13:35-04:00

I think that atheists along with a lot of other knot-heads have misinterpreted the establishment clause of the first amendment. It is in place to keep one religion from being elevated above others. Simply offering someone a copy of the New Testament with Psalms and Proverbs hardly qualifies as being non-compliant with that. Now, if they are handing out ONLY Christian literature while also openly and blatantly refusing to hand out literature concerning other religions, then maybe. But unless you can prove that to be the case... shut up and color.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2014 9:25 PM

2014-08-05T21:25:46-04:00

Not to answer your question with a question, but don't you think it's funny that the only religion atheists are trying to stop is Christianity? If Muslims -- or is it Moslems? I never get that right -- were handing out the Qu'ran (Koran?) they probably wouldn't bat an eye. Ditto Buddists handing out copies of the Buddhavacana, Hindus promoting the taking of the Vedas, or Tom Cruise on a USO tour peddling paperbacks of Dianetics.

To a great extent, the people of our country have gone blind in the face of the glaring contradiction they seem to feel defines "religious freedom." Maybe they're just the un-silent minority, but they get the most press. In short, I don't think anyone should stop anyone from handing out any information on things they believe in. Our nation was founded on the belief that everyone is entitled to their own and I fail to see the justice in silencing one group to placate another. Because let's face it: Just because you're "offended" doesn't mean you're right.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2014 9:33 PM

2014-08-05T21:33:43-04:00

I was offered a Bible during in processing at reception. I declined and explained that I am Jewish. The person went away and returned with a Torah. I still have it - and use it - to this day.

I had some bad experiences with evangelical Christians who will not back off. To me that is a matter of ignorance on their part and there is no need to make some kind of universal rule that will affect everyone.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 6 at 2014 9:41 PM

2014-08-06T21:41:08-04:00

"Numerous cases have ruled that when the government offers biblical literature, even if done indirectly, it is an unconstitutional endorsement of religion,"

Pretty much it, SSG :)

Response by SSG V. Michelle Woods made Aug 6 at 2014 10:52 PM

2014-08-06T22:52:43-04:00

Well...no, no they shouldn't. At first glance I love the idea but I imagine an atheist might feel it is inappropriate. I'm sure a Muslim would feel offended just as I would feel offended if they tried handing me a Torah or Koran.

Can we all take a humble pill and at least try to get along?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 7 at 2014 12:19 AM

2014-08-07T00:19:58-04:00

I don't know if all of the focus is on a westboro baptist church type group of atheists or if atheists are just this hypocritical. I also wonder how many "atheists" know the difference between being atheist and agnostic.

It seems to me, especially in the last 5 years, that atheists have become everything that they've always accused Christians of being. Those people that force their beliefs down your throat and do nothing but persecute you for not agreeing with them while doing the exact opposite of what they tell you that you should be doing according to their beliefs.

I was born and raised in Massachusetts and didn't have a lot of religious or spiritual influence in my life growing up. Most of the people that I knew that were any sort of religious were either Jewish or Catholic.

I've travelled all over the world, I've been to every corner of the US, and I currently find myself planted smack dab in the middle of the "Bible Belt" in Alabama. So far, in my experience here, all these religious folks that the atheists are so convinced are terrible, horrible, people are actually really great and very welcoming.... especially considering I'm a "Yankee" and I'm still working on my spiritual side.

If you don't want a Bible, don't take one. I'd recommend picking one up just to read it though. It can be a tough read depending on the version and the way that it's written, but you might learn something.

Whether you believe the stories in the Bible or not, there are a lot of good moral lessons to take from it.

Response by SFC Thomas Skinner made Aug 7 at 2014 11:35 AM

2014-08-07T11:35:07-04:00

So...Atheists do not believe in God. What confuses me is why these Atheist Extremist are so threatened by a book that is basically fiction to them? I admit, I'm not the best Christian but last time I checked the Bible teaches to love each other, to help the poor and to have faith in a Savior, what is so threatening?

Response by SGT Alicia Brenneis made Aug 9 at 2014 1:39 PM

2014-08-09T13:39:08-04:00

I am a Christian and I will never understand why someone would be so offended by something they don't believe is real. The bible is just a story to people who do not believe. Do these people (the ones who are demanding no bibles) get offended when someone hands them any other "fiction" novel ?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 16 at 2014 2:03 AM

2014-09-16T02:03:54-04:00

My opinion is that Atheists need to stop being hypocrites (generalization). They sit there and cry about Christians cramming their beliefs down people's throats and then turn around and try to cram their own beliefs down people's throats.

Besides, how do you get offended by something that you don't even believe in? Isn't that kind of a paradox?

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Sep 16 at 2014 2:05 AM

2014-09-16T02:05:51-04:00

I'm with you SSG Robin Rushlo ....easy answer.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 16 at 2014 2:21 AM

2014-09-16T02:21:56-04:00

A simple, "No thanks", would be my response. I cannot blame the soldiers handing out the Bibles. From no angle, can I see they meant any harm or offense. But if these guys were in uniform, they are representing a government entity. It doesn't matter if they were handing out a Christian Bible, the Koran, the Torah, or the Wiccan or Satanic Bibles. Just...stop.
People say such harsh things about atheists, but the same folks don't understand what that they are opening trying to burst through a door that once opened, can never be closed. SMH.

Response by SFC James Barnes made Sep 16 at 2014 3:18 AM

2014-09-16T03:18:45-04:00

First off they are offering bibles. if you don't want one or don't believe in god then kindly say no thank you. People now days really need to grow thicker skins and stop looking for a mountain when its a mole hill. IMHO ok maybe not so humble lol

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 16 at 2014 10:27 AM

2014-09-16T10:27:47-04:00

Why do Atheists spend so much effort protesting that which they don't believe?

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 16 at 2014 10:33 AM

2014-09-16T10:33:18-04:00

What is so hard about not taking one? You might offend the person handing them out? Doubtful.

If Christianity offends you, then don't be a Christian. If being Muslim offends you, don't be a Muslim and don't read the Quran. No one is forcing them to stick out their hand and say 'Please sir... Can I have another?'

Im offended at the fact that it is becoming offensive for me to PRAY with my troops. It is becoming offensive to someone who doesn't even believe. Then don't pray with us. I will still pray for you, but you do not have to reciprocate. Because why? Thats not what its about.

Ugh.. Get over it. If you don't want a Bible then don't take one. If you don't want some inspirational Psalms to help you through your journey then don't read it. Or heck, take it and send it to me. I will gladly use it

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Sep 16 at 2014 2:08 PM

2014-09-16T14:08:17-04:00

Yeah it was a tradition to get the MWR Package before deployment containing the Gideon's Bible but it does kinda fly in the face of Separation of Church and State when the Military does Represent the "State". I think they have a Point. Maybe a compromise have Several "Holy Books" available and let the service member choose or not.

Response by SSG Robin Rushlo made Sep 16 at 2014 2:13 PM

2014-09-16T14:13:06-04:00

They is only a doctrine set out about separation of Church from state. All the law says is that congress will make no religion period. The rest is just the courts thinking they know best.

Response by SP5 Tom Carlson made Sep 16 at 2014 2:59 PM

2014-09-16T14:59:14-04:00

Personnaly, I think they should telll the ATHEISTs if the don't want a Bible don't take one,, as for the writings on the wall, I think it is sorta like t.v. if you don't like it... don't look or change the channel....

Response by SPC Randy Torgerson made Sep 16 at 2014 6:21 PM

2014-09-16T18:21:43-04:00

This shit is out of control....! I don't like Charmin toilet paper, I like Costco toilet paper, so guess which one is in my house? I don't advocate Charmin going out of business. (pun intended)

As tame as Christianity is today, it is mind boggling why anyone would go advocate against it..... I guess I need to fall back "again" to the fact that you can't negotiate with crazy.....

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2014 6:59 PM

2014-09-18T18:59:14-04:00

If they're giving it out to everyone unsolicited, then yes that must stop. If they have it there for the recruits to ask for, then that's cool but they should also have other religious texts (and even non-religious texts) for interested personnel to browse.

Response by COL Roxanne Arndt made Nov 6 at 2014 5:04 PM

2014-11-06T17:04:37-05:00

What ever happened to freedom of religion? Why is it that Christians are being persecuted by atheists, agnostics, Muslims? They are free to practice their faith but Christians can't practice theirs because it offends someone. We are in serious trouble.....

Response by LT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2014 8:40 PM

2014-11-17T20:40:10-05:00

My only questions are 1)Who paid for them? and 2)Who is being paid to give them to "everybody"? If my tax dollars are buying them and paying soldiers/sailors/airmen/marines to try and give them to everyone, then I expect equal billing for all religious texts. If privately funded and distributed, go to town, but no thank you, I don't need one.

Response by Sgt Packy Flickinger made Nov 20 at 2014 5:21 AM

2014-11-20T05:21:35-05:00

If your religious, bring your own bible. Easy answer.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 10:57 AM

2014-11-20T10:57:46-05:00

The humanists and atheists are starting to remind me of the scientologists on Southpark. Just a lot of shouting "we're going to sue you!"

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 11:14 AM

2014-11-20T11:14:40-05:00

I want Atheists to stop handing out nothing.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Nov 20 at 2014 12:28 PM

2014-11-20T12:28:17-05:00

While I had no problem with the Gideon's Bible they gave you in the care package before you deployed or in Boot Camp I am totally against the Proselytizing that some Fundamentalist do. In my 21 years in the Navy there was hardly any discussion of Religion and or Faith. It was considered Personal and Private and on a ship that is as it should be.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Nov 20 at 2014 3:26 PM

2014-11-20T15:26:44-05:00

I take the same approach when they come to "convert" me at the door. No thank you. I respect what you are doing but please respect my privacy.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 4:49 PM

2014-11-20T16:49:28-05:00

Just my feelings. If you want it take it, if you don't leave it. Or are we to the point were even the mere mention of something you don't believe in is illegal and must be banned. So under that thought if I was a vegetarian then the Army would have to stop serving meat at the chow hall. Because if I don't want anyone to offer me a burger, and if I don't want a burger then I don't want you to have the choose ether. Because if it is not what I would choose then make the rest illegal so so everyone has to do what i feel is correct. The freedom of religion that states you can be an atheist if YOU CHOOSE to also lets ME CHOOSE to be a man of faith. separation of church and state means that your government can not pick a religion and make you practice it. At the same time it does not stop me from practicing mine.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 4:50 PM

2014-11-20T16:50:05-05:00

SSG Robin Rushlo, I'm with you: If you don't want a Bible or a New Testament, don't take one. But that wouldn't allow these people to make their statement and jam their non-belief down the throats of everyone else. It would be grand if people could be reasonable about things like this.

Response by PO2 Corey Ferretti made Nov 20 at 2014 6:17 PM

2014-11-20T18:17:43-05:00

Where i am confused is why this is an issue. it is offered so it can be turned down. its not like they are say you have to believe so take this. I dont understand Some Atheist because they get offended by something that they dont even believe in. I have friends that dont believe and we get along fine and im not closed about my belief and he is not closed about his non belief. I dont force my belief on him and in turn he acts the same. Everyone has the right to there belief and in the military we have a a Chaplin for just about every major religious preference. I would like to know would these Atheists be up set if the Tanakh was being handed out or the Koran. What i find weird is every one seems to be ok with religious freedoms until Christianity is brought up then it becomes a filthy word.

Response by PO1 John Y. made Nov 20 at 2014 6:53 PM

2014-11-20T18:53:10-05:00

You know, as much faith as it takes for a Christian to believe in the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, Muslims in Allah, Jews in God, and all those who claim some type of deity, is the same type of faith for Atheists to believe in nothing or evolution or whatever. That being said why are you Mr. and Ms. Atheist pushing your beliefs on me? This country was founded on Christian faith and principles. The FREEDOM of religion means you don't have to be a Christian or practice Christianity to live in America, but you don't get to tell Christians or any other faith that we can't worship and practice our faith where ever we see fit.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 6:55 PM

2014-11-20T18:55:43-05:00

If I saw a book of Zen, A Koran or a Bible, I would take it if I wanted one. If not I would move on. I fear too many militant atheists are sad sacks and activists.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2014 11:59 PM

2014-11-20T23:59:30-05:00

I myself don't consider myself Christian nor do I consider myself an " Atheist" as the media likes to say. With that being said, you respect someone the same way you expect to respected. Either

A. Take the bible as a handout and see the smile on their face

B. Simply say "no thank you" and continue with your day.

Either way is respectful and maintains the professionalism we are expected to portray as soldiers.

Response by SCPO Carl Wayne Boss made Nov 21 at 2014 2:55 PM

2014-11-21T14:55:35-05:00

SCPO C.W. Boss, U.S. Coast Guard (Retired) in Arizona says:

Atheists have the right to an opinion, just like all the rest of us. No more… no less. The Constitution allows them that. But in my belief, that’s as far as it goes.

There is no two ways about it, history shows this Great Nation was founded on Christian principles and no matter how much “atheists” and others of their ilk dislike it… it’s fact.

The Constitution was crafted to ensure that the freedoms that our Fore Fathers believed in and removed themselves from their lands and homes in England and Europe for, fought and died to transplant over here so their children, their children’s children and their heirs would be allowed to continue to practice their faith and beliefs and live unfettered in peace practicing whatever that may be, in perpetuity.

The biggest reason the early inhabitants of this country braved the crossing of the Atlantic in those tiny wooden ships and all the other hardships they had to surmount was so that they could freely practice their religion and be out of reach of the Churches, the Kings and others that sought to impose their will on them. Now Atheists are trying to do the same thing all over again.

Bottom line is… Atheists may believe as they wish, but have no right to impose their will or opinions on any of us. If we that are Believers in our Lord and Savior let them get away with any more than having an opinion, well the shames on us.

Anyone is free to pick up a Bible and read its truth and decide for themselves whether or not to believe. Just as an Atheist is free to believe in "nothing"... in the Bible it is written, we will all stand before the Lord for judgment one day and will then be required to justify our beliefs or lack there of... I wonder what the atheists will say then?

Response by SPC(P) Jay Heenan made Nov 22 at 2014 10:04 PM

2014-11-22T22:04:12-05:00

The comment is exactly how I feel...if you don't want a bible then do not take one. I am about finished with anyone that wants EVERYBODY to modify their actions to appease a few. I want the atheists to stop messing with my faith, but I am not making any demands. I just chose to ignore them.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Nov 22 at 2014 11:33 PM

2014-11-22T23:33:22-05:00

It's like one of this situations where a few people do not like something so they want to ruin it for everyone else as if they were making some big executive dicision. Like CPT Wolfer said, you can decline it and that person will go away.

Response by 1LT David Moeglein made Nov 23 at 2014 1:57 AM

2014-11-23T01:57:35-05:00

I would be happy to not hand a bible to an atheist. However, I think they need to get thicker skin. We have freedom of religion in our country, and not freedom from religion. Why would we want to make atheism our state religion?

On a humorous note, I did a mental health assessment with an atheist the other day. When it came to the social history part of the assessment, he admitted that he was an atheist, and that he didn't believe in God, but that he blames God when things go wrong. I liked his authenticity.

Response by Sgt Nick Marshall made Nov 23 at 2014 10:03 AM

2014-11-23T10:03:37-05:00

Similar case here in FL with a school district, because a religious group was allowed to proselytize, all religious entities were allowed to pass out material, including a satanic temple.

Response by 1SG Nick Baker made Nov 23 at 2014 12:54 PM

2014-11-23T12:54:51-05:00

Christians, Jews, and Muslims have one important thing in common; they all can trace their roots to Abraham. Everyone has a free will to believe or not; that is their right. The same with free speech that is anti-military.

If atheists are not worried about their soul or eternal life, that is their choice. At least they are honest where they stand. Christians, Jews, and Muslims need to walk the walk and not tell everyone: do as I say and not as I do.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2014 4:01 PM

2014-11-23T16:01:02-05:00

Don not infringe on my rights to accept a Bible if I want one, if you don't want one respectfully decline. Whatever higher power an atheists believes in is their right and should be supported equally, the one great thing about our military is diversity.

Response by SGT Bryon Sergent made Nov 23 at 2014 4:19 PM

2014-11-23T16:19:16-05:00

Here is what I think. The athiest say that it aginst there belifs and dont want them handed out that it is violating there civil rights.
How is it violating there civil there civil rignts. What about my civil rignts. if they stop the giving of the bible and it then infringes on my civil rights. how is there want differ from mine. Dont want the vible dont take it. dont want to it dont look. it simple. I don't go around saying that aithisim is wrong or that it's stupid. So why sould they dictate what I want or need.

Response by SFC Brian Vasquez made Nov 23 at 2014 4:36 PM

2014-11-23T16:36:08-05:00

I bet u if it was a koran or some other religious book it would not have been an issue..if u are a true atheist then it would not bother u either way

Response by SPC Darrin Tinsley made Nov 23 at 2014 6:18 PM

2014-11-23T18:18:51-05:00

I could understand why a believer of any other religion might be offended by being offered a Bible, but why would an atheist? To an atheist, the bible is just science fiction - nothing more than an elaborate novel. I am a Christian, but I try to respect the beliefs of others. Personally, I think that this is one of the things that we as a country have lost in recent years. Our founding fathers believed in freedom of religion (read that ... freedom OF. NOT freedom FROM). They had a specific religious belief shoved down their throats by a monarch, so they wanted all of us to be able to worship as we please (as a free people should). This is a conversation for atheists to avoid. They have nothing to do with religion by voicing their non-beliefs.

Response by CMSgt James Nolan made Nov 23 at 2014 8:38 PM

2014-11-23T20:38:29-05:00

I have no problem with people's religious beliefs (or lack thereof) or convictions. Just because there are atheists in the world, does not mean that Bibles should not be allowed to be offered up. I am willing to bet that the majority of Missouri Guard members are Christian (which is not a pro/neg argument for Christianity, just a observation). So..the Bible would be the right choice to offer out. Because that is what most would want.

If someone does not want one, do not take one.

End of story (for me)

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2014 9:00 PM

2014-11-23T21:00:18-05:00

My thoughts are they are generally only put out by the chaplain's office or in the chapel so how do they know if they are atheist? Just because something offends someone does not mean you should change it. I am sick of seeing this in my military. What happened to tough skin and if you do not want to read the Bible do not get one. If you do not agree with what someone puts on their marker board outside their dorm room do not read it. You will always see or hear something that you do not agree with. It is about time that we are able to stand up and tell them to deal with it. I am sick of being attacked as a Christian and having to hide anything that shows that Christ is the Lord. That is my belief. Deal with it as I have to deal with you saying you do not believe in anything. You are allowed to have your beliefs, all I ask is that you let me have mine.

Response by SGT Artiesa Woods made Nov 23 at 2014 9:00 PM

2014-11-23T21:00:31-05:00

Here's the deal...the Constitution allows for religious freedom. That includes the freedom to be religious and the freedom to abstain from religion. There has been a lot of talk on here about not wanting religious articles paid for with tax dollars, but what people are failing to realize is that religious organizations are 501(c)(3) organizations, or, tax exempt. If these organizations want to give religious materials to be handed out to Soldiers, who are we to interfere with the religious freedom of the Soldiers that wish to express it. It is only too easy for Atheists to turn their nose at the Bibles just as they have turned their noses to God.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2014 9:21 PM

2014-11-23T21:21:30-05:00

Atheist don't like it, they should be discharged for inability to adapt to military life.

Response by SGT Virgle Pitchford made Nov 23 at 2014 10:19 PM

2014-11-23T22:19:24-05:00

i heard that the isis is hiring!! maybe those athiest might need a job??

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2014 10:48 PM

2014-11-23T22:48:04-05:00

"I'd throttle the POS that complained about it."
"i heard that the isis is hiring!! maybe those athiest might need a job??"
"...they should be discharged for inability to adapt to military life."
"...they will be the one's screaming for God when they get ready to meet their Maker..."

Aside from the actual thread, what hate. Do you ever feel light-headed on your pedestals? These religions, or lack of, aren't external to the military. When you are talking about someone's worldview as slamming it, because it doesn't align with your own, you are also talking about other service-members and vets.

Handing out bibles to grown human beings? So what? It makes news because it's outrageous. Most non-religious people DON'T CARE. But you don't want to hear that, do you?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 23 at 2014 11:16 PM

2014-11-23T23:16:01-05:00

I am a Christian soldier but I do understand that there are now many faiths that make up the armed services. It is very easy to just say no thank you...on the same hand, I believe there shepuld be alternatives offered to others that want a choice.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 1:23 AM

2014-11-24T01:23:21-05:00

Personally I am an athiest. Active duty and been that way for as long as I remember. If people honestly bitch about bible handouts they are more than likely the first ones that jump for one when shit hits the fan. If you dont want one just say no thank you sir/ma' am its no biggie lol I have sat theough hundreds if not thousands of MANDATORY formations where a Chaplain has to speak and honestly when he says "let us pray" wanna know what i do? I bow my head out of the respect for that officers and my brothers and sisters around me. Although it may not mean much to you it may mean the world to your battle.

Response by SPC Richard White made Nov 24 at 2014 4:07 AM

2014-11-24T04:07:34-05:00

just do not take bible.Atheists can cry all they want

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 11:53 AM

2014-11-24T11:53:00-05:00

How about Atheists just not take a Bible when given free will to take one or not. Why should they dictate to others if they can take a Bible from thise handing them out or not?

Response by LTC Allen Crowley made Nov 24 at 2014 12:53 PM

2014-11-24T12:53:47-05:00

If you don't want a book, don't take a book. That's easy. I think the bigger question is tax funding of a specific religious credo. Taxpayers' dollars do not need to go toward publishing religious materials.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 1:15 PM

2014-11-24T13:15:55-05:00

I agree. The National Guard, or any other government organization, should not be advocating one religion above others. The First Amendment to the Constitution (you remember, that document you are sworn to defend) reads in part: "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof ..." The language contains two parts; the "establishment" clause and the "free exercise" clause. The "establishment" clause is the crux of the principle of separation of Church ans State. The fact that you are ONLY offering Christian literature is an implicit avocation of one religion above all others and a violation of the Constitution.

Now, as for the inflammatory language of the title of the article. It is irrelevant that an "atheist" group is fighting this. Any American Citizen has the right to fight this and every American citizen should be against it.

Response by LT Clint Davis made Nov 24 at 2014 1:29 PM

2014-11-24T13:29:04-05:00

As an atheist, I find this to be complete bull$h!t! Folks in the military do a tough job, so if someone comes along and tries to provide something that might add comfort or solace to the lives of others, so be it. If you don’t want it you do not have to accept it in the same way you would turn away a helping of boiled cauliflower, “No, but thanks for offering!” I will also admit that there are those [religious zealots] that I have served with that clearly needed to have some boundaries established. I can think of one that never knew quite when to stop and I almost came to blows with the fellow. There are ways of addressing issues with these individuals through your chain of command.

I also feel that we all took an oath and in that oath we swore to defend the constitution which affords certain freedoms. Speech and religion, even if the speech or religion is different than our own is a freedom that should be protected. Before folks start swinging at me about ‘separation of church and state’ comments, you should consider what the founding fathers were talking about when this idea was put to paper. The clear intent was to keep government from trying to infiltrate the church and assert pressure and persuasion by way of clergy. We have become so horribly PC that simple communication almost seems impossible anymore. We have so many incredible traditions in the military and many of them have ties to a higher power. If you are seriously offended by this and are incapable of “politely declining” when offered these materials, maybe it is time to pull the eject lever!

Just because I do not believe in a higher power does not make me right nor does it lessen the importance of protecting the rights of others to believe in one!

Response by SFC Michael Arellano made Nov 24 at 2014 1:59 PM

2014-11-24T13:59:51-05:00

Atheists are not content to be non believers. They go out of their way to interfere with those who do believe. It simply "bugs the crap out of them". It seems to me that they seek attention by spreading their "word" of non belief by being as big of a pain in the rear as they can. Have faith, or not, is an individual choice. So let them not take a Bible, but that isn't enough in the mind of an atheist. They have a need to be disruptive. The real question, is why do they have this need? Ever seen a child intentionally break something, or scream when the adults were talking? That's how I see this sad group.

Response by CAPT Gary Foster made Nov 24 at 2014 3:23 PM

2014-11-24T15:23:09-05:00

Atheists need to respect the freedom of religion guaranteed by the 1st amendment to our Constitution. Quit DEMANDING everything be changed just because it does not serve you. Like many comments, just refuse to take a free bible if that is your desire. You might decide to change your mind should you be captured or under fire. Amazing how many people will begin to pray when faced with dire circumstances. Case closed. Next!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 4:05 PM

2014-11-24T16:05:48-05:00

I agree with the post uptop ^^^^^. Don't take it if you are a non believer.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 5:33 PM

2014-11-24T17:33:27-05:00

I've done tours in Kuwait and Afghanistan and never had a bible handed to me...in fact, I had to go request one. I'm no bible thumper, nor were any of my guys in theater, but we all really appreciated the positive influence of our Chaplin corp. I agree with what some of my fellows here have said...a simple "no thank you" is should be adequate.

Response by CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 6:55 PM

2014-11-24T18:55:31-05:00

If you don't want one, don't take one. If people are offended the solution is simple. Don't take a Bible! Over sensitivity is harming the military and ruining society.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 11:56 PM

2014-11-24T23:56:20-05:00

Well ultimately we make the final decision. After all it's not TA-50 issued. I myself enjoy my bible.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 24 at 2014 11:57 PM

2014-11-24T23:57:13-05:00

Atheists need to stop worrying about any type of religion. If you truly don't believe in a god, then what other believe shouldn't bother you.

Response by SGT Gabriel G. made Nov 25 at 2014 12:21 PM

2014-11-25T12:21:38-05:00

I think sometimes atheists are the biggest most butthurt group of people. There's nothing wrong with believing in whatever you want, but if a faith is so important to someone that they are giving away a free book, simply decline it without being a douche about it. You don't need to raise a stink over every little thing.

Response by LTC Scott O'Neil made Nov 25 at 2014 3:48 PM

2014-11-25T15:48:14-05:00

If you don't want one don't accept one.

Response by SrA Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 25 at 2014 5:45 PM

2014-11-25T17:45:03-05:00

it is purely voluntary to pick up the bible being handed out. it is not like they are shoving it to your face. i understand they're just trying to reach out.

with that being said, we can always declinie politely if we do not wish to be handed out a bible.

Response by LTC Richard Wasserman made Nov 25 at 2014 8:04 PM

2014-11-25T20:04:47-05:00

Easy---Don't pick it up. But, don't force me to take or try to convert me. We WILL have issues.

Response by PO1 Michael Fullmer made Nov 25 at 2014 9:02 PM

2014-11-25T21:02:57-05:00

If they dont believe in it they can politely decline. Nothing says they have to accept one.

Response by SPC(P) Samantha Moore made Nov 25 at 2014 9:11 PM

2014-11-25T21:11:26-05:00

A simple 'no thank you" is enough, I do it all of the time when people try to hand me things that I don't want. An offering is not "pushing my beliefs on you."
This person is giving Athiests a bad name by just being an as*hole.

Response by LCpl Steve Wininger made Nov 25 at 2014 11:57 PM

2014-11-25T23:57:07-05:00

My opinion... this should not be an issue. The bibles are not required, they do not add one cent to the guard units budget, and they hurt no one, in fact, they will most likely help someone.

For someone that doesn't believe in God, (The recruit, and Organization representing him) they sure spend a lot of time fighting him. I am still trying to figure out their shadow boxing routine. If God does not exist, as they claim, then why are they fighting shadows? Whether he felt pressured or not, he had the free will to throw it in the trash, or simply say no. There was no UCMJ for not accepting it.

The underlying goal here isn't that one person got upset about feeling compelled to take the bible, the atheists want no one to have it. we teach diversity for everything, why not religion.

I guess tolerance is a good thing as long as it does not have the name Jesus anywhere. As for it being government property n(the building where the bibles are), that does not imply it is government sanctioned.

The day I entered boot camp in San Diego, part of the issue was a little green bible. Not once were we told we had to read it study it, look at it, or even keep it. It was offered, and those who wished to keep it did so. Of course, in the eighties there was not a holy war raging against Christianity either.

Just my two cents! I have rambled on enough... for now!!!

Response by SGT Suraj Dave made Nov 26 at 2014 12:25 AM

2014-11-26T00:25:25-05:00

This is why I left the U.S. Army. Its become a joke. Things like this are so incredibly un-american it baffles me. If you are offended by it, don't take the bible.... but don't take away everyone else CHOICE to accept the bible or not.

People of various different religion's come to Penn State to hand out bibles and literature. Groups like Jehovas Witness, Mormon's, Menonites, etc... I dont believe in what those people believe in, but when they try and talk to me or hand me something, I politely tell them I don't want it. They then turn around and try and hand it to the guy behind me.....

Evangelizing or door to door ministry is something that Mormon's, JW's and Adventists tend to do in my Area. When they come to my door, I tell them I am Catholic and am really happy with what I believe in. They smile and they go away afterwards.

Even though these people believe in something different then me, I don't make a scene or start problems with them. I move on, and kind of admire them for having the courage to go door to door every day and get rejected all day long, but having the perseverance to wake up tomorrow and do it again.

Response by PFC Eric Bridgewater made Nov 26 at 2014 8:34 AM

2014-11-26T08:34:19-05:00

It started out under the "tolerance" moniker but has now evolved into pure hatred by such groups as the American Humanist Association and the LGBT. These groups began by saying "you believe what you believe and we will do the same. But now, it has become an all out war on peoples beliefs if you don't believe what these groups say. An "atheist" says "There is no God, and you have to believe what I believe no matter what or else." The gay community or LGBT has basically stated the same thing. I wonder what changed for these people? I will say I am a Christian, I love God and Jesus and if it is a fight you are looking for, you came to the right person!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 26 at 2014 11:39 AM

2014-11-26T11:39:48-05:00

Atheists have the same opportunity to create literature to be pased out to Soldiers. Soldiers who are Atheists can accept them and those who are not can refuse them just like any other literature.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Nov 26 at 2014 1:28 PM

2014-11-26T13:28:41-05:00

If you are truly Atheists, why would you care? As Shakespeare so aptly put it, 'Thy doth protest too much.'

Response by LTJG Robert M. made Nov 26 at 2014 2:48 PM

2014-11-26T14:48:30-05:00

I am always amazed that a group of individuals will expend extraordinary time & efforts to stop something, they say doesn't exist.

Response by SPC Thomas Lema made Nov 26 at 2014 4:52 PM

2014-11-26T16:52:50-05:00

True if you dont beleive in God dont take the bible' But i sugjest you do because when and if you are unfortunate enough to come under fire you may rapidly change your mind'

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 26 at 2014 4:56 PM

2014-11-26T16:56:20-05:00

Why are they focused only on Bibles?
My Chaplin also had Jewish prayer books, the book of Mormon, and Koran's to had out if that was your bent. This is a no brainier folks leave religion to the Chaplin corps and allow a recruit who may need the comfort a new testament/bible, or other religious text to have it available if they want it.
It has been my experience in a LIFETIME (40 plus years as both a brat and a member) of military culture that the Chaplin corps is awesome at serving ALL those of faith.

Response by SGT Philip Popa made Nov 26 at 2014 7:47 PM

2014-11-26T19:47:02-05:00

I in a sense understand what they are saying. I wouldn't want a Koran handed to me every time I went someplace. But wouldn't ask for people to stop handing them out to those who may want one. I am not atheist nor would I actually consider myself a christian either. But think about it. I do not want to hear about the thoughts of either group. As long as people want the bibles they should have them. If you don't want one for any reason be a man (or woman) and say " No, thank you" and go about your life.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2014 2:48 AM

2014-11-27T02:48:23-05:00

Why do we spend so much time debating this? Take or don't take whatever religious/spiritual book you want or don't want. Quit worrying about which book the Soldier next to you takes or doesn't take, and worry about the doing your job and getting the both of you back home.

Response by PO1 Walter Duncan made Nov 27 at 2014 10:49 AM

2014-11-27T10:49:50-05:00

I am a Christian and there is no problem with them handing out Bibles , but if you are Jewish they should get the opportunity for a Torah, Muslim get should get a Koran, etc. But just because someone does not want a Bible , don't take it. Is that so hard? Sometimes Christians take it a little overboard , but they are just spreading the Gospel. But, after they tell you about Jesus they should let it go. Sorry (CPT Ann Wolfer, Austin, TX). We all should care and love one another enough, because Jesus taught all at times in His ministry and did not discriminate. We should not either.

Response by CPT Jason Torpy made Nov 27 at 2014 12:04 PM

2014-11-27T12:04:03-05:00

Humanists also take advantage of the MEPS policy which is actually secular and egalitarian. Gideons could be said to be preying on impressionable young troops with a nationwide effort to push Christianity. But that wouldn't really be fair because the policy allows any 'non-federal entity' to place literature for use by trainees. When humanists or satanists or wiccans choose to do so as well, they will (assuming no discrimination) be welcomed, and they have been in the past.
http://militaryatheists.org/news/2012/02/humanist-literature-now-available-for-new-enlistees-2/

Humanist literature now available for new enlistees - Military Association of Atheists &...

New enlistees are exposed to an imposing new culture as they enter the military. For decades, the Gideons have been treating them to a good Christian introduction. Good for the Gideons for taking care of their people. For the first … Continue reading

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2014 3:31 PM

2014-11-27T15:31:54-05:00

It's not difficult. To ask that the bible stop being handed out is ridiculous. If you are an atheist, and don't believe in or want the bible, don't take one. We people of faith don't trample on your rights, so stop trying to mess with ours.

Response by GySgt William Hardy made Nov 27 at 2014 3:53 PM

2014-11-27T15:53:34-05:00

It's real simple. Some atheists need to understand that the word is "tolerance" not censorship. If Bibles (Usually a New Testament) are being handed out, you simple do not get one. If you are something other than Christian or an Atheist, you allow others to believe as they wish. No one is forcing you to take a Bible. I get very offended by people who try to tell other that what they believe should be censored.

As for this organization, they need to learn the same thing; however, if they practice tolerance it would take the wind right out of their sails. These types of organization can turn into homegrown left wing cells that will take every opportunity to tear our country apart. This is the United States of America where everyone may believe as they wish as long as they are not causing harm to others. This atheist group needs to find a life and get out of mine.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2014 9:47 PM

2014-11-27T21:47:54-05:00

I believe that the services should continue to offer materials for the various religions. My chaplain had a stack of Bibles, Holy Books, Torah Books, and Qurans on a desk outside of his office. The conventional books that are available are not a size that is compatible with travel. Also, many of these books are provided by outside organizations, from what I have seen. The books commonly have a bit in the front saying that it was provided by xxxxxx for the military.

If you don't want a specific book, or any, then don't take one. My leadership has done a pretty good job providing opportunities to obtain material for self-study for religious freedom. The only issue I have encountered is being able to get off to go to participate in holy days. The best about that was TRADOC at FLW for CBOLC. The worst was Knox working for Cadet Command - offering no resources or materials. My current assignment helps get information and materials, but is not so helpful for getting me to be able to go worship.

Overall, I'm happy with the status of the current Army policies. They could be better, but they could be a lot worse, too.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2014 10:07 PM

2014-11-27T22:07:22-05:00

Response by SFC Mark Hoover made Nov 28 at 2014 1:50 AM

2014-11-28T01:50:37-05:00

If they do not want a Bible, they should not be required to take one or have one with them.
Does not mean that i can not carry/read a bible if i would like to.

Response by SFC Mark Hoover made Nov 28 at 2014 1:53 AM

2014-11-28T01:53:07-05:00

As a leader they might want to take one-so that they can provide it to their subordinates, if needed. Just another way to look at it.

I was told at one time that i should follow sports more closely, for my Soldiers and Marines sake. Kind of the same thing.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 7:39 AM

2014-11-28T07:39:57-05:00

In the name of believing what they are permitted to believe, that is completely fine.

To say, you can't offer a Bible or religious book at all seems insane. I would understand not wanting one but to disallow another from receiving something that may actually help them or that they may actually want is, in my opinion, wrong.

The irony I found is the soldier felt pressured to take a Bible but yet is supposed to be a "free thinker". Couldn't he have freely thought his way to politely declining?

Response by SrA Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 2:36 PM

2014-11-28T14:36:49-05:00

I have no religious affiliation so your proposed option of just not taking it makes sense to me. A simple no thank you doesn't hurt. This is a very sensitive topic so to avoid drama or a heated debate I usually keep anything extra to myself and respectfully decline their offer. To each his own.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 6:07 PM

2014-11-28T18:07:53-05:00

It's completely voluntary to take a bible. Why are we changing the way we do things to "satisfy" everyone. If you want a bible take one, if not then pass it by.

Response by SSG Philip Evans made Nov 28 at 2014 9:17 PM

2014-11-28T21:17:10-05:00

I would like to pass on a very good question for everyone to think about. What roll does the Atheist play in the history of America? Where do they fit in historically? I am attaching an article that was posted on GodFather Politics.com for ThanksGiving that looks at the actual history of the proclamation of Thanksgiving Day and Atheism. It is something that each of us should think about and consider in our evaluation of American History and Civic Responsibilities.

Re. Phil

You Can’t Be an American and be an Atheist

Posted on GodfatherPolitics.com by on November 27th by Gary DeMar

The folks at the Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF) want to rid the country of every vestige of religion from every facet of society and make the nation officially atheistic. They contend that the Constitution requires it based on a tortured reading of the First Amendment and a rewriting of our nation’s history.You don’t have to have a PhD in history to know that not one of our founders would have supported the exploits of the FFRF and Americans United for Separation of Church and State for the simple reason that history is against them.
Of course, atheists are Americans because they were born or have become citizens in accordance with specific constitutional requirements.

But in terms of how our founders understood what it meant to be an American, and the role they believed that God played in its founding, they are fundamentally un-American.
As singular proof of this claim is President George Washington’s 1789 “Thanksgiving Proclamation,” which was issued soon after the passage of the Bill of Rights which included the First Amendment which states that “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; . . .”
If there had been a FFRF in 1789, Dan Barker, co-president of the FFRF, would have sued the President and Congress. Of course, the men who drafted the First Amendment would have been called as witnesses and would have testified that separating God from government, and that religion was ever an impediment to the development of science, was never the intention of the First Amendment.
Note the first line of the Proclamation and other references to God.

Issued by President George Washington, at the request of Congress, on October 3, 1789. By the President of the United States of America, a Proclamation.

Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey His will, to be grateful for His benefits, and humbly to implore His protection and favor; and—Whereas both Houses of Congress have, by their joint committee, requested me “to recommend to the people of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer, to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many and signal favors of Almighty God, especially by affording them an opportunity peaceably to establish a form of government for their safety and happiness:”

Now, therefore, I do recommend and assign Thursday, the 26th day of November next, to be devoted by the people of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being who is the beneficent author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be; that we may then all unite in rendering unto Him our sincere and humble thanks for His kind care and protection of the people of this country previous to their becoming a nation; for the signal and manifold mercies and the favor, able interpositions of His providence in the course and conclusion of the late war; for the great degree of tranquility, union, and plenty which we have since enjoyed; for the peaceable and rational manner in which we have been enabled to establish constitutions of government for our safety and happiness, and particularly the national one now lately instituted; for the civil and religious liberty with which we are blessed, and the means we have of acquiring and diffusing useful knowledge; and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us.

And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations, and beseech Him to pardon our national and other trangressions; to enable us all, whether in public or private stations, to perform our several and relative duties properly and punctually; to render our National Government a blessing to all the people by constantly being a Government of wise, just, and constitutional laws, discreetly and faithfully executed and obeyed; to protect and guide all sovereigns and nations (especially such as have shown kindness to us), and to bless them with good governments, peace, and concord; to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue, and the increase of science among them and us; and, generally, to grant unto all mankind such a degree of temporal prosperity as He alone knows to be best.

Given under my hand at the City of New York the third day of October in the year of our Lord 1789.
Go. Washington

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 9:56 PM

2014-11-28T21:56:32-05:00

I see a lot of great points and I do notice most atheist do try and debate you why you believe in God, it's like I don't debate you on why you don't. Which does seem a bit aggressive, but the proper thing to do is just say no thank you no explanation needed of why your decline, just a simple no thank you....

Response by SGT Gregory Reilly made Nov 29 at 2014 12:16 AM

2014-11-29T00:16:36-05:00

As long as it's not being forced on a soldier there's nothing wrong with offering it. If you want it, it should be made available. If you don't want it, don't take it. Isn't there a freedom of religion clause somewhere in our constitution? It's your CHOICE. Next thing they'll want to do is eliminate the Chaplain Corp. Makes you wonder if these knuckleheads ever served. I don't practice my religion as I should but I've never been without a bible. It's a comfort thing. How many soldiers have comforted by the clergy over the years. LEAVE IT ALONE!!!

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 29 at 2014 1:08 AM

2014-11-29T01:08:42-05:00

I agree just dont take the Bible. I may not like cigarette smoke but am I going to not go into stores that sell cigarettes?? Then there would be no where to shopp!!

Response by LTC David S. Chang, ChFC®, CLU® made Nov 29 at 2014 4:10 AM

2014-11-29T04:10:45-05:00

I agree, people don't have to take it if they don't want. I understand that some can be pushy, but I think it can go the other way too. My faith is important to me but won't push it on people.

Being deployed and seeing that many look towards their spiritual life I will gladly explain my faith if asked. I believe that if some of the atheists that don't want the bible handed out have ever faced deployment, some may understand that handing out the Bible isn't a bad thing and can help morale for those serving in harms way.

Response by MSgt Dennis Dudley made Nov 29 at 2014 4:43 PM

2014-11-29T16:43:21-05:00

Not No but Hell No! The military, like anyone else should not be kowtowing to any one group or organization. What about the rights of others who would not mind being offered a Bible or Torah.

There is nothing wrong with a holy book of anyone's faith being available for the taking. If a book or publication is offered the person has the right to say no, and have that wish respected. Why does any one group (in this case Atheists) think they have the right so set standards that I as a Catholic have to follow?

Response by PV2 Abbott Shaull made Nov 29 at 2014 5:03 PM

2014-11-29T17:03:38-05:00

Well if you don't believe don't accept it, they give out other books as well.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 29 at 2014 6:35 PM

2014-11-29T18:35:50-05:00

If the atheists don't want a Bible, then they don't have to take one.

Response by SGT Mark Sullivan made Nov 29 at 2014 9:49 PM

2014-11-29T21:49:57-05:00

Just because they are being handed out, doesn't mean anyone has to accept one, it's not like anyone is going to lop off their head

Response by MSgt Keith Hebert made Nov 29 at 2014 10:08 PM

2014-11-29T22:08:46-05:00

Sorry just say no thank you and leave it at that.
Could start a rant but will decide against it

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 30 at 2014 11:59 AM

2014-11-30T11:59:55-05:00

As an atheist AND a RP3 I would like to throw my two cents in here...

Many atheists feel pressured when a handout like this is offered. Sometimes it is met with hostility and sometimes its a simple "no thank you". BUT A lot of it has to do with the tact of the person giving out the Bible and a lot of it has to do with the past experiences of the atheist. Chances are this is going to be a negative experience BECAUSE of one of those two factors.

However, Proselytizing is never ok in the military. The Religious Ministries Teams are here to facilitate, not convert. Much of the time when there is a backlash against a particular Chaplain or a particular event it is because it crosses this line.

This is not a cut and dry situation and the topic here really isn't fair. Not every atheist wants to stop the military from making religious literature available to those who want it, not every atheist is an asshole, and not every atheist wants to end religion.

Best case scenario for something like this? Equal time and equal space for every faith group. If MEPS or the Chapel (or wherever) has bibles out and available then, AT THE VERY LEAST, they should also cover each of the other faith groups that are covered by the Chaplain Corps. Christian, Jewish, Islam, Hindu, and Buddhist... and if they are feeling particularly awesome that day then they can put out secular and other minority religious books.

Otherwise... if you can't facilitate equally then they should not provide anything to anybody. Just my two cents.

Response by PO1 Ron Clark made Nov 30 at 2014 3:46 PM

2014-11-30T15:46:29-05:00

Each individual has the opportunity to practice or not practice whatever religion which is their faith! Atheist do not have the right to dictate to anyone who wish to receive a Bible from whomever.

Response by SGT Jon Henri Matteau made Nov 30 at 2014 4:03 PM

2014-11-30T16:03:59-05:00

I think the money can be spent on important items and issues. The Military is not a publishing house nor should they contract for books for entertainment.

Response by SSG Gordon Hill made Nov 30 at 2014 5:30 PM

2014-11-30T17:30:16-05:00

The Armed services of the United States of America is here to defend the country not pass out bibles and should stay out of it, because not everybody is christain. The person they are handing the bible to my be of another faith and feel offend and that the army is taking sides in religion and should not.

Response by 1SG Frank Boynton made Nov 30 at 2014 5:36 PM

2014-11-30T17:36:21-05:00

Personally, I just don't understand their objection to it. Iive lived most my life agnostic and I have no problem with people who believe in God. It's a personal thing, and why someone would want to deny someone their own belief is beyond me. There is nothing forcing them to pray or believe in any other way then what their conscience dictates. For many in the military away from home for the very first time in their lives, they need the comfort it seems to provide. We are asking our soldiers to do things no one else would ever ask of them and I say if the bible helps them get through the rough times, then more power to them.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 30 at 2014 6:36 PM

2014-11-30T18:36:21-05:00

Bottom line...if an Athiest doesn't want a bible when offered, don't take it, however, the person stainding behind him has the same right to either accept or decline the same offer.

Our nation has allowed itself to be so overcome by religious political correctness and at the same time, has bega to tug at the religious rights of the Christian Faith. Some schools now allow time for childrenof the Islamic Faith to pray in school, while at the same time, will not allow clothing, bibles, references to God/Jesus, etc., that represent Christianity to be allowed. The rant of the day is "we don't want to offend the Muslims, Atheists, etc. If you can practice your faith, then I can practice mine....a principle our country founded on....Freedom of Religion.

Atheists want a Cross removed in CA! Why, because it offends them....well, take a different road next time. That cross has a special meaning to many others. Your choosing to be offended, does not take away their right to pay respect to it and the reason it was errected there.

Now how do these things cause offense? Beats the hell out me. I don't believe in what ever an Atheist believes, but I am not offended by it, as it's their choice to believe what ever they want. They do not believe in God/Christianity, but what offense does it cause them....in reality NONE! I have asked several that I have known over the years....none spoke of how they "or" their "faith, non-faith, belief, non-belief" was offended. I've asked many times, " How are you offended by something you do not believe in? To you, it doesn't exist, it's not real, so what is so offensive?" Now if it's my belief that offends you....that's just tough S#%^, as it's my right to believe the same as it's their's to believe other wise.

So just say "no thanks to the offer of the bible", and oh by the way, the same group that is passing out the bible, has provided the coffee, sodas, donuts and sandwiches that your ass is chowing down on! They didn't deny you of any of it, even with your beliefs..... So shut up and move out!

Response by Cpl Brett Wagner made Nov 30 at 2014 6:39 PM

2014-11-30T18:39:34-05:00

Why can't they just not take one? That's what did at the chow hall when they served liver.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 30 at 2014 6:48 PM

2014-11-30T18:48:31-05:00

The length of this conversation is the explanation as to why handing out any religious texts is a sub optimal course of action.

No free bibles, no issue. If you believe then you probably have a few of your own, if you do not, you may also have one or two.

So why hand one out? What purpose does it serve? The only one I can think of is the hope that a person will read it and come to believe. If that is the case then it is attempting conversion.

Then I think of the funds put into it, the number of holy books left behind or found years later in bags and tossed.

I support the atheist on this issue on purely fiscal grounds.

Response by SSG Gordon Hill made Nov 30 at 2014 7:47 PM

2014-11-30T19:47:51-05:00

I want to put this out, if you have been given a bible have you actually read it, it is full of contradictions and violence how is it about peace. I am an Atheist because i read the bible.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 30 at 2014 10:34 PM

2014-11-30T22:34:14-05:00

Is it the Guard that is handing them out or the Chaplain Corps? Just as they should have a right to offer holy denominational books, Soldiers have every right to decline them. Freedom OF religion is NOT freedom FROM religion.

Response by MSgt David Mata made Nov 30 at 2014 11:31 PM

2014-11-30T23:31:04-05:00

In the spirit of "Separation between Church and State," I believe it should be either all the way or not at all. If Taxpayer Funds are used to buy and Distribute Bibles throughout the World, then Everything from the Book of Mormon to a Satan Worshiper's Guide should be as well.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 1 at 2014 10:36 AM

2014-12-01T10:36:31-05:00

Freedom of Religion, not freedom from religion.
One of the same principles our great Republic was founded upon.
The freedom to choose or not, to freely worship and serve God with out interference from the
Government, or anyone else. Isn't ensuring we protect all our freedoms one of the reasons we joined?
Whether you currently exercise all of your freedoms now, doesn't mean you won't later.
Here is a minuscule group who are offended, because someone cares enough about them to offer everyone the same comfort of the written Word.
Simple, don't want it, don't take it. Be professional, be courteous, be respectful.

Response by COL Jean (John) F. B. made Dec 1 at 2014 5:35 PM

2014-12-01T17:35:00-05:00

I think we should stop caring what atheists think... If they don't want a Bible, don't take it. Simply offering it to them should not be offensive.

Should we outlaw meat in the dining facility because some people are vegetarians (or vegans, now, I guess)? If you don't want it, don't take it, but your preferences are no more important than those who do want meat.

Allowing the minority views to disproportionately impact the majority views is a load of BS.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 1 at 2014 8:27 PM

2014-12-01T20:27:33-05:00

I am religious but I respect others beliefs. I have several friends who are atheists and many other religions. I do not force my beliefs on them and the only time we talk about religion is when someone has a question about it. We keep the discussion brief so no drama arises. If you don't believe in it or have a different religion just politely decline it. You have a right to not take it no one should force it upon you. If they are forcing you to take the bible despite saying no thank you then that's an entirely different matter.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 2 at 2014 12:49 AM

2014-12-02T00:49:43-05:00

I still have my bible that was handed to me during reception in Ft. Benning and I used it to help me get through a lot. As the Captain above said, they brought a Tora for her to read. The tolerance we hear so much about does not mean we have to destroy others believes and faiths in order to obtained true tolerance. A Christain should be offered a Christian bible. The Jews should be offered a Torah and the Muslims should be offered the Koran. For those who choose not to believe the offer is there not forced upon you. It isn't right to take away the rights to practice ones fath just because it bothers someone else. It's offensive to me that they considered taking away the books from the new recruits!

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 2 at 2014 12:59 AM

2014-12-02T00:59:17-05:00

If you don't want it, don't take it. Somebody else will want it.

Response by Cpl Christopher Bishop made Dec 2 at 2014 6:41 AM

2014-12-02T06:41:27-05:00

In the interest of consistency, if there has been any effort towards "Separation of Church and State", then I would think it would stop. Those who are truly such great religious practitioners of their religion should already have their religious materials.

By the way, if the Guard is supplying them...who is paying for them? Is this really somehow attached to the FedGov military budget? SMH.

Response by SSG Ted R. made Dec 2 at 2014 9:50 AM

2014-12-02T09:50:40-05:00

As a Christain you should never push it on anyone. People as a whole have a choice on what they believe. Bibles have been handed out I know since ww1 to troops. America was based on Christian principles, that is why Bibles are handed out to this day,though Obama tells the world that America is not a Christain nation. People from other nations have come to America from day one. We are a people from around the world,but our foundation as a whole is Christainity. Bibles are offered to troops not forced. I do not see the problem.

Response by SPC Kamie Chavez made Dec 2 at 2014 10:02 AM

2014-12-02T10:02:56-05:00

Religion can be a huge moral boost for military personnel. No one should stop bible handouts. There are tactful ways to decline a bible. On the flip side, there are also tactful ways to hand out bibles. I'm thankful that during my service, the chaplain's assistant and chaplain were extremely open and tolerant of my different beliefs. As a matter of fact, the chaplain's assistant turned out to be a great mentor for me. I have heard of other chaplains that are very "pushy" and that's not okay either. Anyways, let's not prevent other service members from having access to religious materials. Besides, doesn't the military always say that part of being fit is being "spiritually fit" as well?

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 2 at 2014 10:51 AM

2014-12-02T10:51:58-05:00

It is always curious to me when issues such as this come up -- SSG Rushlo nails it: if you don't want it, don't take. Don't over think the problem. If you are an atheist, live your life and let others (Muslim, Christian, Mormon, Jewish etc.) live theirs.

"Activist" soldiers and "activist" people in general puzzle me -- is it about what they want to do, or what they DON'T want others to do?

Response by PFC Aaron Knapp made Dec 3 at 2014 1:26 AM

2014-12-03T01:26:18-05:00

I still have my Army Issue Bible. If they don't like it then don't take it....

Response by SGT Fred Tafflock made Dec 3 at 2014 9:43 AM

2014-12-03T09:43:54-05:00

there is a saying that will some this up, a conservative wants to stop eating meat he or she simply stops eating meat. a liberal wants to stop eating meat they demand all the meat to be removed from the from the store shelves!!

Response by LCpl James Robertson made Dec 3 at 2014 12:05 PM

2014-12-03T12:05:50-05:00

Do not stop the Bible Handouts, that is a unrighteous thought from the pit of hell to blind your souls into thinking that there's no God, read that Bible and know the truth, to the solutions of your problems from a earthly point of view. As God says, My people are destroyed for a lack of knowledge.

Response by SPC Matthew Farnsworth made Dec 3 at 2014 3:11 PM

2014-12-03T15:11:41-05:00

This great nation has given up to much in the pursuit of "political correctness". Here is my view:

If you don't want a Bible don't take one
If you don't want to marry a man then don't
If you don't believe in abortion don't get one
If you don't like the military don't join

The truest statement I have ever read and I quote "You telling someone they can't have a gay marriage because of your religion is like me telling you that you cannot eat a cookie because I am on a diet."

People as a whole need to step back and quit worrying if they are going to piss off someone based off of what they say or what they believe. I am sure this post will piss some people off but hey what can I say it is what it is.

Always remember "It's better to be pissed off than pissed on."

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 4 at 2014 10:40 AM

2014-12-04T10:40:09-05:00

Too easy, Next question!!

Response by TSgt Tim (lj) Littlejohn made Dec 4 at 2014 7:06 PM

2014-12-04T19:06:23-05:00

Why are they so scared of something they don't believe in!

Response by MSG Daniel Talley made Dec 4 at 2014 7:08 PM

2014-12-04T19:08:10-05:00

The athiest working for me in Afghanistan was professional, focussed and dependable. He and I agreed it's fine for him to go to the truck during platoon prayer before mission. End of discussion, we respected each othrr enough to discuss and settle it. End of issue.

Response by TSgt Tim (lj) Littlejohn made Dec 4 at 2014 7:15 PM

2014-12-04T19:15:42-05:00

The old saying goes something like, there are no atheist in the fox hole when all hell is breaking loose all around you!

Response by Sgt Timothy Sigafoos made Dec 5 at 2014 1:05 AM

2014-12-05T01:05:00-05:00

Atheists should worry about what they can do to promote a strong moral code in their own home and stop worrying about everyone else. I do not understand why they should be actively Anti-Theist. To each their own as long as it is not detrimental to another persons freedoms.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 5 at 2014 1:28 AM

2014-12-05T01:28:30-05:00

Atheists want no bible...
ISIS wants Quran...
if this offends any of them, tell them dont take the bible or dont join...
i know some atheists that are in that dont complain.

Response by MSG Greg Kelly made Dec 5 at 2014 2:22 AM

2014-12-05T02:22:46-05:00

I think its tradition for the military to handout Bibles, they are not forced on soldiers and they placed in locations were soldiers can pick them up in private. I do not hear the Atheists bitching and crying about condoms being available for soldiers at TMCs being placed were soldiers can pick them up in privacy. Besides anything that pisses off the Atheists is a good thing I personally get tired of their constant crying about how there is no god they way they go on about it you would think they are scared they are wrong or at least have serious hidden concerns they are going to answer for their something so they may as well try and drag as many as they can with them.

Response by SGT Jon Henri Matteau made Dec 5 at 2014 2:24 PM

2014-12-05T14:24:44-05:00

T0 Address the Majority of People on this theread,
It is not about distributing fancilful literarature it is about the the US government agency appearing to endorse this particular publication by having it openingly produced and distributed with governemnt funds. I should not have to pay for your entertainment literature that I don't want or need. And no higher ranking NCO or officer should be allowed to consider such a publication mandatory training and/or inventory. THAT is the Crux of the issue. The holiday "issue" is manufactured by some "right"wing leaning media. Atheist only object to nativiity scenes erected on government property.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Dec 7 at 2014 1:14 AM

2014-12-07T01:14:22-05:00

I don't think its very nice to make fun or mock overly sensitive athiests, but sometimes they really bring it down on themselves. Some of them are so unhappy and offended from anything that has to do with Christianity they want to take it away from everyone. What they don't realize is that when a fundamental right is taken away that leads to more rights to be taken away later down the road. I am really laughing at the demand for the Gaurd to stop handing out bibles.

Response by 1LT Keith Gannon made Dec 7 at 2014 6:06 PM

2014-12-07T18:06:32-05:00

The government should steer clear of influencing anyone on how they deal with their mortality. There are plenty of well established (tax free) institutions that can provide religious texts to their constituency and the curious. The taxpayer certainly should not be subsidizing this.

Response by SMSgt Judy Hickman made Dec 7 at 2014 10:19 PM

2014-12-07T22:19:08-05:00

I think atheists need to stop worry about something that doesn't influence them. The bibles are there for those that want them or need them. A simple "No, thank you" is good enough.

I've never understood people that feel their way is the only way, so you are an atheist...don't take the bible, but why do you feel you need to demand that they shouldn't be available for anyone else? Another example is a Christian group saying we should only give out bibles, not Torahs...it wouldn't be allowed then, so why would we allow Atheist to dictate this?

Response by TSgt Kristin Parsons made Dec 7 at 2014 10:39 PM

2014-12-07T22:39:55-05:00

I'm tired of hearing about these organizations trampling on our rights. If they don't believe in the Bible, nobody is forcing them to take it. However, they are forcing their religion, or lack of it, on others. So who is right? Freedom of religion or freedom from religion. One word completely changes everything.

Response by SSgt James Stanley made Dec 8 at 2014 11:51 PM

2014-12-08T23:51:43-05:00

Atheists in hell want ice water, but they're not going to get that either!

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 9 at 2014 2:14 AM

2014-12-09T02:14:49-05:00

I say keep it rolling. Freedom of relegion!!!

Response by SSG Ronald Limbaugh made Dec 16 at 2014 12:20 PM

2014-12-16T12:20:19-05:00

I have to agree with the difference in handing out and making available. By handing out literature that is predominately of a single religion, then it gives the impression that the religion is backed by those handing it out. If literature for each different religion is made available and troops are able to choose that which is more appropriate to their beliefs, then I see no problem, however, handing out bibles, only, rather than also handing out Qurans, Torahs, etc, is unacceptable. If we wish religious tolerance in the military, then we can't choose one religion over another (or non-religion, for that matter, either). Religious literature should be made available at all times, but should only be handed out at appropriate services. By handing out bibles when not related to a specific chaplains service, it should fall under the category of proselytizing, which is prejudicial to good order and conduct. At least in my humble opinion.

Response by CW2 Ernest Krutzsch made Dec 16 at 2014 6:52 PM

2014-12-16T18:52:19-05:00

Based on their logic, They believe in nothing, so nothing should be banned

Response by SSG Dwight Amey MSA, MSL, BS, AS made Jan 9 at 2015 7:45 AM

2015-01-09T07:45:04-05:00

SSG Robin Rushlo, Absolutely NOT!! This request is more of a statement. Atheists is just like any other political group. They have agendas hidden behind their actions. Someone somewhere along their life cycle has irritated them with respect to religion and the concept of God. Now, this is strictly my opinion.

I am a christian and am totally secure in my salvation. I don't need to speak out against any evil thing especially in our type of democracy. I would be a Hypocrite to demand my beliefs overshadowing someone else beliefs. Now understand, we all need to get along peacefully not interfering with others right to live as they believe. Only when those beliefs cause harm to all others is when it should be considered illegal.

Handing out religion materials of any kind does not violate any Constitutional interference when the service member do not have to take the literature. No. I believe that the request is one small subtle step in trying to get rid of religion in our society. Some want to live without religion and I understand. Just because they want to for them. They will never decide if I have religion. As for me and my house we will serve the Lord.

If atheists think the Lord is a joke or a silly superstition fine. No skin off my back. Makes me think though, if just a silly thing they are sure irritated with bibles being offered, not forced mind you, but merely offered.

Cogito ergo sum (French: Je pense donc je suis; English: I think, therefore I am), often mistakenly stated as Dubito ergo cogito ergo sum (English: "I doubt, therefore I think, therefore I am"), is a philosophical Latin statement used by René Descartes, which became a fundamental element of Western philosophy. "I think therefore I am"?

If something irritates me it pretty much exists.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2015 12:04 PM

2015-04-13T12:04:35-04:00

Are the atheists in the Missouri National Guard? Were they forced to take a bible? No? Then they can shut up and color.

Response by SA Harold Hansmann made Apr 13 at 2015 12:23 PM

2015-04-13T12:23:18-04:00

While I am not an atheist, I am also not a Christian nor a Muslim, or Hebrew. My religious preference is Shamanism/Druidic.
If you don't want a religious reference book of a different religion, then a simple, " No thank you." Should suffice. If the person who is offering said religious text is pushy then tell them " I said no." or even "What books do you have in my religion?"
Easy enough? No need to come to blows.
And the atheists whom doth protest too much, "Get a life!" You are just as bad as the religious zealots.

Signed Harold Hansmann

Response by SPC Angel Guma made Apr 18 at 2015 7:59 PM

2015-04-18T19:59:17-04:00

They can always join another military. I heard the old Soviet Union came down pretty hard on distribution of religious literature. Perhaps the Russian Army would be a healthier environment for a committed Atheist. I'm sure the CCCP is still alive and kicking in some parts of eastern Europe and central Asia.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Apr 21 at 2015 12:15 AM

2015-04-21T00:15:12-04:00

Bibles and other religions materials should always be available to Soldiers who want it.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2015 12:21 AM

2015-04-21T00:21:02-04:00

I am sick of whiners.

Response by SSG Stephen Arnold made Apr 29 at 2015 11:12 PM

2015-04-29T23:12:08-04:00

Atheists sure invest a great deal of time worrying about a God in whom they don't believe, and trying to prevent others from experiencing a God that they say does not exist.

Response by MSgt Rob Weston made Apr 29 at 2015 11:13 PM

2015-04-29T23:13:05-04:00

I put it this way... When one right violates another then it is void... However in this case it is easy to just decline the bible if presented. But taking it away altogether violates the rights who would want the religious material or need it. It is alright to just say no.

Response by SGT Michael Touchet made Apr 30 at 2015 12:10 AM

2015-04-30T00:10:44-04:00

If you don't believe, then why do you care, Atheists do not speak for everyone, they only speak for themselves, so then if you don't want one just say no thanks and keep moving nobody is forcing you to take anything.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 6 at 2015 12:49 PM

2015-05-06T12:49:27-04:00

Perhaps a trolling question.....

Should Atheists, based on their separation of church and state argument (though I interpret it differently) actually be advocating for the removal of chaplains from service and simply targeting the hand out of bibles is nothing more than low hanging fruit?

If the State (federal) or states (actual states) are paying chaplains, would that not constitute the government paying for religion? Further, since you don't have "one of each" type of chaplain assigned to a singular unit, and chaplains usually have a faith specific affiliation (yes, they are supposed to be able to be a chaplain to all faiths or lack there of) is that not favoring a specific religion over another? Just looking for consistency.

Response by SGT Curtis Earl made May 6 at 2015 12:52 PM

2015-05-06T12:52:22-04:00

No paid government service should be handing out religious material. And having civilians do it is really solicitation. Stack the bibles somewhere and allow soldiers to take them if they wish. Maybe include the Satanist bible, the Torah and a couple other books of faith. But no tax dollars should be spent doing this because they can't reasonably provide equal coverage to every possible religion. Just my 2 cents

Response by CH (MAJ) William Beaver made May 6 at 2015 12:53 PM

2015-05-06T12:53:08-04:00

It's simple. If you don't want a Bible, decline the offer. As a Chaplain I carry around various different religious books in the field and ask 'Would you like any reading material? ' I also offer playing cards and puzzle books. In garrison, Bibles and other books of faith sit on a table outside Chaplain's office. If a Soldier doesn 't want, don't take. In the field, Chaplains should use tact when offering.

Response by CH (MAJ) William Beaver made May 6 at 2015 1:00 PM

2015-05-06T13:00:53-04:00

I have never understood why 'ministry of presence' as odered in AR 165-1 somehow is not good enough for some Chaplains who suposedly believe in the Holy Spirit. Do they somehow think that they have power to 'save a soul?' Can't save our own souls , the way I believe. But also, there is nothing clearly stated in AR 165-1 that says "The Chaplain or Chaplain Assistant will distribute Bibles or other religious material to the Soldiers." If we do this we must have sensitivity and wisdom in our approach. If, as Chaplains, out intent is to evangelize 'lost' Soldiers in the formation - outside the chapel, then in my opinion we need to hang up the uniform. Become a missionary or

Response by CH (MAJ) William Beaver made May 6 at 2015 1:25 PM

2015-05-06T13:25:49-04:00

Mikey Weinstien. God bless him.

Response by CH (MAJ) William Beaver made May 6 at 2015 1:32 PM

2015-05-06T13:32:38-04:00

I got offended when someone offered me "Fifty Shades of Grey." Calling IG

Response by SCPO David Lockwood made May 6 at 2015 2:26 PM

2015-05-06T14:26:04-04:00

Don't accept them, the atheists that is.

Response by SrA Edward Vong made May 6 at 2015 2:56 PM

2015-05-06T14:56:56-04:00

The issue is, if you want to hand out the bible, why not the Torah, Quran, and every other holy book. All or nothing.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 6 at 2015 4:07 PM

2015-05-06T16:07:07-04:00

If you don't want one, don't take one. I was never pressured to ever take a bible, when I was in. I'm Catholic. I attended mass on Post, still never forced to take a bible.

I think this story is blown out of proportion, as most articles are these days.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made May 20 at 2015 6:52 PM

2015-05-20T18:52:37-04:00

Atheist have the right to hand out what ever they profess too, I hope its a bottle of rum, which I will gladly take and slowly, and fondly appreciate in fact I am willing to share it with others.

Response by Sgt Nick Marshall made Jun 9 at 2015 8:08 AM

2015-06-09T08:08:27-04:00

It's not a question of stopping bible handouts, it's a question of stopping proselytizing of all religions, I'm pretty sure you'd object if the Koran were to be distributed, or literature of satanists. Equality for all means not allowing others special preferences.

Response by Cpl Patrick Reade made Jun 9 at 2015 9:00 AM

2015-06-09T09:00:31-04:00

Obviously these "atheists" have some real will power. It's like the super chubby kid who asks his friends mom to stop giving carrots as snacks. When the time comes you will need what you dislike more than you know. Until then don't screw with other people's religion.

Response by TSgt Kenneth Ellis made Jun 9 at 2015 4:26 PM

2015-06-09T16:26:44-04:00

Is it me or have groups like the ACLU, separation of church and state and freedom from religion. Have gone out of there way to make Christianity s crime. They send there minions to hunt town crosses on public land. And threaten to take schools to court for having a post of the 10 commandments.
Not to mention to remove 10 commandments monuments. Atheism has become a religion to them.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 10 at 2015 11:35 AM

2015-06-10T11:35:29-04:00

Why can't atheists leave us alone we don't infringe on you stop infringing on us.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 10 at 2015 11:54 AM

2015-06-10T11:54:22-04:00

To an Atheist it is just a book. So, what's the problem?

Atheist's are allowed to hand out anything (within good taste) to the troops as well. Get over it and move on.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 10 at 2015 9:19 PM

2015-06-10T21:19:25-04:00

I think recruiting stations should be allowed to hand out bibles.
I am non-religious, but I still read the bible at MEPS to pass time.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jun 11 at 2015 1:32 AM

2015-06-11T01:32:46-04:00

They don't like Bibles? They don't have to take them!

Response by SGT Kristjan Rahe made Jun 11 at 2015 1:44 AM

2015-06-11T01:44:05-04:00

Atheists have be:ome professional complainers wishing everyone to give up their beliefs for them. Firstly, I defy anyone to find the words separation of church and state in the Constitution. You cannot.as it was an opinion of Jefferson voiced in a letter which has become sacrosanct. I have been offered the book of Mormon, I declined. I have been offered books by Hare Krishna,again I drclined. I live in the South and receive a multitude of invites to services to churches other than our own, again I decline. The moral of the story is politely decline and move on without filing a million lawsuits to impose you lack of faith upon those of faith.

Response by SSG John Jensen made Jun 11 at 2015 2:07 AM

2015-06-11T02:07:34-04:00

American PWs in Japanese PW camps used their bible for rolling cigarettes, other religious brochures were useful in the latrine, because there was never enough toilet paper

Response by SPC Nathan Freeman made Jun 11 at 2015 8:26 AM

2015-06-11T08:26:25-04:00

They don't have to read it. Ahh, but the Truth is a scary thing. This is why cockroaches hide in the darkness.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 17 at 2015 6:06 PM

2015-08-17T18:06:51-04:00

I agree. if you want a Bible take one if not, don't. we are catering to everyone based on the slightest little offense. as a country if not the world we need to stop trying to make everything better for just ourselves and start thinking of how it will affect everyone else if what we don't like goes away. I think they should always offer a bible/Torah/Quran to everyone they have the freedom to offer and you have the freedom to turn it down, as long as you aren't chastised for turning it down it doesn't matter And this is coming from an Atheist.

Response by SSG Paul Forel made Aug 24 at 2015 4:54 PM

2015-08-24T16:54:24-04:00

withdrawn

Response by SSG Paul Forel made Sep 3 at 2015 3:55 PM

2015-09-03T15:55:04-04:00

While in 'Nam, I carried one in my aid bag.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Sep 10 at 2015 12:26 PM

2015-09-10T12:26:49-04:00

Is growing thicker skin for atheist groups an option?

Response by LCpl James Robertson made Sep 10 at 2015 3:40 PM

2015-09-10T15:40:18-04:00

Being a Christian you must live your life 24/7 with the Word of God, how are you going to learn the Word of God without a Bible, this world is passing away. Everyone need to be born under the Blood of Jesus, meaning born anew. Every creation of mankind has some type of Diety, that they believe in, as Christians you must put on the whole armor of God.

Response by SSG Phil Rios Co founder Charter member made Oct 2 at 2015 3:47 AM

2015-10-02T03:47:40-04:00

This is a great opportunity for every atheist to not accept or take an item offerred to them that is entirely of their own individual choi e to take or not to take, to accept or not to accept, to KMA or not KMA,

WHEN I WENT INTO COMBAT I HAD PSALM 91 written on my left side of my helmet during the Vietnam ERA, on same helmet when l deployed to DMZ, KOREA 1986, on my Kevlar helmet when l deployed again DMZ, KOREA 1989...then deployed to Persian Gulf war 1990-992 ...then still on my Kevlar for shooting war in L A RIOTS Rodney King 1992..finally on my 3rd deployment DMZ KOREA 1993...and l accepted a variety of Bibles during each tour of duty but l dont recall any Atheists on those battlefields with the incoming screaming in...
So Atheists... KMA..left to right or in a circle... your choice..
US ARMY MP SSG PHIL RIOS (ret)

Response by Cpl Lawrence Lavictoire made Nov 29 at 2015 12:09 PM

2015-11-29T12:09:55-05:00

The question is answered by the; when and where God readies an touches you!

Response by LTC Jeff Shearer made Apr 7 at 2017 6:24 PM

2017-04-07T18:24:56-04:00

My response is simple, NO! He might be an atheist but I guarantee the majority of the unit is not. He does not have to read, listen to anyone else read and when the shit hits the fan he can continue to pretend he did not pray at all.

As a former BC my answer is what I said earlier, no, if he does not like it he can find another unit or get out. But he is now interfering with the religious rights of all the others in the unit.

Response by Capt Dwayne Conyers made Jun 4 at 2017 7:48 PM

2017-06-04T19:48:23-04:00

What’s next? Vegetarians stop everyone else from eating meat?