Being addressed/addressing others by rank after retirement

2014-06-03T13:35:21-04:00

I fall into category 2, but was curious what others thought. From my RallyPoint experience I can see there is a lot of respect for rank among retirees and from active service members. Even locally when I run into my comrades, we all address each other by rank out of respect. Even though I tell people to call me by my first name, It still feels good to hear it.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Jun 3 at 2014 1:35 PM

2014-06-03T13:35:30-04:00

Please see my initial comment. I will always address anyone, especially former superiors by rank unless told otherwise.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 1:44 PM

2014-06-03T13:44:24-04:00

MAJ Petrarca,
I think it should be up to personal preference, but I always figure it's better to show too much respect than too little.

Response by MSG Wade Huffman made Jun 3 at 2014 1:51 PM

2014-06-03T13:51:17-04:00

Sir, I tend to agree with you in that option two most closely represents my view. After spending 23 years on active duty, addressing one by rank and showing military courtesy is second nature and I barely give it a second thought. I am not, however, bothered when someone does not address me by rank now that I am retired, but I also don't mind that they do.

Response by CPT Kyle Schembechler made Jun 3 at 2014 2:10 PM

2014-06-03T14:10:14-04:00

In my very limited military experience, I have only addressed veterans by their rank at formal evens such as balls or commissioning ceremonies. Other than that, it's just "Mr." or 'Ms." and they're fine with it.

Response by MAJ Ron Peery made Jun 3 at 2014 2:29 PM

2014-06-03T14:29:18-04:00

Rank means nothing to civilians, and may actually hinder communications. I do use my rank when I communicate with members of Congress or other government officials when discussing military matters. With other veterans, I use the other person's rank as a sign of respect, but don't insist on anyone recognizing my rank.

Response by COL Vincent Stoneking made Jun 3 at 2014 3:01 PM

2014-06-03T15:01:25-04:00

Category 2 here. It is by no means a requirement, but it often just seems right.

I'll admit that there is one guy senior to me that I look forward to addressing as "Hey, #$&@#!'

Response by GySgt Joe Strong made Jun 3 at 2014 4:45 PM

2014-06-03T16:45:43-04:00

For Official communications Rank every time, feels silly to even state that. On boards like this it just depends. Sometime the rank distinctions interefere with the discussions, or rather have the potential to cause a stilted playing field for the discussions. As a retiree, I do enjoy hearing my Rank used but more so when someone WANTS to use it rather than when they feel obligated to do so in non-official communications. For this kind of board, I, don't think it's not inappropriate to leave rank out of most discussions. But even so, Courtesy among ourselves should still remain.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 5:16 PM

2014-06-03T17:16:29-04:00

I think it is confusing at times. I heard it is the highest position that the person was in such as is it GEN Powell or Secretary Powell, GEN Petraeus or Director Petraeus? I try to go safe and say Sir or Ma'am. If enlisted by SGT if they were E-5 to E-8 or Top, SGM, etc. If personally close to me we go by first names.

Response by CPT Richard Riley made Jun 3 at 2014 5:51 PM

2014-06-03T17:51:57-04:00

Policy, politics, and politeness then to become mixed up once you're no longer serving on the active side. You are never wrong if you error on the side of using proper greeting and rank when interacting with a veteran. True, it is not required to address them with rank - but it is difficult to 'un-learn' all those years of customs & courtesy's that were apart of your life.
There is no harm done when you acknowledge another rank, so as long as you have not been instructed to respond in another fashion - stick to the familiar and respectful.

Response by COL Jason Smallfield, PMP, CFM, CM made Jun 3 at 2014 6:30 PM

2014-06-03T18:30:27-04:00

This question actually has two components. The first component is how an individual, as a retiree themselves, prefers to be addressed and the second component is how a person, either current military or retired, addresses a military retiree.
The first component is a personal preference. This personal preference can be easily advertised by how a person labels their business cards, emails, and other correspondence. Do they refer to themselves as Mr/Mrs or as rank (R)?
The second component is METT-TC in my opinion. A person, depending upon situation such as social function or private function, should address a retiree as the situation calls for but with the general "salute" rule of "when in doubt, whip it out" and refer to the retiree by their rank. The retiree will then continue the conversation (in which a person should continue to use the rank) or will say something along the lines of "call me Bob".

Response by 1SG David Niles made Jun 3 at 2014 9:00 PM

2014-06-03T21:00:03-04:00

I think it is a term of endearment for some. I kind of like being called "Top" every once in a while. I call one of my old CO's by his rank out of respect, he is retired. As a retiree I call all active by there rank.

Response by SFC Laura Whitehead made Jun 3 at 2014 9:27 PM

2014-06-03T21:27:23-04:00

I think it is important for the transition process to use first names. Most retired officers I work with do not like to be called "Sir".

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 9:28 PM

2014-06-03T21:28:01-04:00

I would not want this to be another bone of contention but I do because I care about the people who serve and served and we are still fellow patriots.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 10:11 PM

2014-06-03T22:11:17-04:00

The retiree has earned the rank, so it is never inappropriate to use it UNLESS the circumstance specifically calls for some other form of address or regulations dictate otherwise. Examples: AR 25-50 specifies that retired Soldiers serving as Government civilians only use military rank regarding their personal retirement issues (i.e., not in the workplace). Strictly speaking, while they were in their post-military government roles, Director or Doctor Petraeus or Secretary Shinseki rather than "General," though "General" would certainly have been appropriate if they were in their retired uniform and/or at a function based on their former capacity. While I (having recently retired) never plan to insist on being addressed as "Colonel," I will certainly respond to it as appropriate and (unless/until I take a government civilian or other job that requires me to do otherwise) note it where appropriate in professional and social circles. (In my own case, I could be in situations where I or others would be choosing between "Colonel" or "Doctor" as being more appropriate.)

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 3 at 2014 10:24 PM

2014-06-03T22:24:19-04:00

I use it where I feel it is appropriate to shows respect, but I don't harp on it.

I work around a lot of retirees that were in my chain before they retired. I use Mr. and their rank interchangeably.
Air Force Regs do not make the use of their rank mandatory, but optional as a sign of respect.

Response by Maj Chris Nelson made Jun 3 at 2014 10:47 PM

2014-06-03T22:47:49-04:00

Show proper respect....regardless of rank Mr. or Mrs/Ms. It is all in the dealings with people. Rank is nice, but not required as long as you are acknowledging them as worthy of respect. Personal opinion.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Jun 4 at 2014 12:01 AM

2014-06-04T00:01:08-04:00

Please address me by the first name if I am no longer subject to UCMJ.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Jun 4 at 2014 3:14 AM

2014-06-04T03:14:17-04:00

If you want to call me CT1 or CTO1 that is fine. Don't call me Petty Officer Nagel (Usually when the Chief called me that I was in deep do do) LOL! No most people called me Chip when I was in and they still call me that. The Only Title I care about anymore is Grandpa Chip!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 4 at 2014 6:52 AM

2014-06-04T06:52:30-04:00

An interesting question as I get ready to transition next month to the civilian world. I shall see how it plays out.

Response by Lt Col Skip Fleshman made Jun 4 at 2014 11:28 AM

2014-06-04T11:28:34-04:00

For me just for very senior officers (O7) or NCOs.

Response by LCDR Doug Nordman made Jun 4 at 2014 12:23 PM

2014-06-04T12:23:02-04:00

Here's my experience after 12 years of retirement:
1. I have a ponytail and usually a three-day beard. Addressing me as "Commander" just seems silly, although admittedly I frequently looked like that on day 82 of a 90-day submarine patrol.
2. When someone addresses me as "Mr. Nordman", my guilty conscience makes my sphincters clench by reflex.
Both of the above terms seem to be used most frequently by people who want to coerce me to behave in a certain way, even if it's just to comply with their wishes.

"Ma'am" or "sir" seem to be all the formality required by social interactions. For everything else I prefer "Doug" or "Nords".

Wearing one's rank in retirement is a temptation to rest on your laurels without earning a new honorific. Is your rank really the most significant accomplishment you have in your life? I think the best goals are designations like "Honey" or "Dad" or "Grandpa"...

Response by SSgt Gregory Guina made Jun 4 at 2014 12:24 PM

2014-06-04T12:24:34-04:00

I think it depends. I would be uncomfortable in most instances being called SSgt once I retire unless it is in some veterans organization (VFW, Legion).

Response by PO1 Jonathon Oakley made Jun 4 at 2014 3:14 PM

2014-06-04T15:14:20-04:00

Only if you are a flag or I worked under your command. Even if worked for you, it will depend on my level of respect for your leadership.

Response by SN Steven Fast made Jun 5 at 2014 9:39 PM

2014-06-05T21:39:35-04:00

I still call my boot camp CC Chief, and if I were to find any of my other superiors that I served with, I would still address them by their rank.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 14 at 2014 1:17 PM

2014-06-14T13:17:35-04:00

Out of courtesy I always use rank or title when addressing someone who I know served. After that we can talk it out to mutual comfort ability.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 14 at 2014 6:52 PM

2014-06-14T18:52:57-04:00

I say Cat 2. If a retired officer gives me permission to call them by their first name then so be it, until then it is by rank, they earned it. I call our county veterans service officer Colonel every time I interact. Same goes for my town supervisor, a retired Merchant Marine, he gets called Captain. I understand that one may be a stretch for some, but being a Military Sealift Command Sailor, not so much for me.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 15 at 2014 11:57 PM

2014-06-15T23:57:22-04:00

Most of the time I do use Sir or Ma'am or their Rank or Rate to address them in almost every situation.
There has only been one time that I have not used Rank or Rate, because their were my neighbor in civilian house and it was kind of awkward.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2014 1:25 AM

2014-06-16T01:25:53-04:00

I've been know by my rank and last name for such a long time, sometimes I forget I have a 1st name. Once in awhile, theres still a few people of higher rank who retired and I still address them by that rank. That is only reserved for those who had an impact on my career by their leadership or mentorship and just mostly because I have that much respect for those few.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2014 7:13 AM

2014-06-16T07:13:34-04:00

I will use their rank if I knew the person. Otherwise, I will use Sir or Ma'am. Overall, as long as you show respect to that person retired.

Response by LTC Jason Strickland made Jun 16 at 2014 7:56 AM

2014-06-16T07:56:12-04:00

If I can make a retired service member feel good by calling them by their rank - I always do it! One particular retiree really appreciates hearing "Sergeant Major" (and sometimes "Command Sergeant Major") from me every time we see each other - makes me feel good, too!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2014 10:09 AM

2014-06-16T10:09:15-04:00

I work on an installation with few AD Military and hundreds of civilians. Some are retired, but most have no military affiliation in their background. The former military folk address me as SARGE, but a retired SFC and a MSG wants to get on the 2 soldiers for not addressing them with rank? There is some give and take, but how would they know?

Response by MSgt Lancia Stewart made Jun 16 at 2014 10:16 AM

2014-06-16T10:16:23-04:00

I don't mind being a citizen now, instead of a MSgt. After all, we were all just people before we joined; military rank isn't permanent.

Response by SSgt Robert Clark made Jun 16 at 2014 11:34 AM

2014-06-16T11:34:46-04:00

Sir, I'm not retired, however I do feel, as a sign of respect, it is appropriate to address those who achieved a higher grade than I with their grade. If they request I don't do it, then I won't. I don't think it should be required, but it is entirely appropriate to forward that level of respect and recognition. If I were to meet you face to face, and I knew, I would without hesitation address you as Sir or Maj, not by your name. You've earned that respect until proven otherwise.

Response by SMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2014 12:26 PM

2014-06-16T12:26:09-04:00

Believe it falls into when you knew the person, as in did you know them when there were active or have you only known them as a retiree? Then what capacity are they in, are they a former CMSAF and serving in a semi official capacity as a speaker or something to that effect. Lastly, how do they want to be addressed?

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 16 at 2014 1:21 PM

2014-06-16T13:21:37-04:00

I look at it this way active duty, reserve & retired are all subject to UCMJ. As such, a Sir or Rank acknowledgement is part and partial. As well, once retired, I believe that most individuals have earned the right to be respected by their rank. For those members who are veterans but not active/inactive reserve or retired, though I respect your service, to me we are just people. Before I am lambasted about Active/retiree/reserve not being people; those serving actively are "GODS"! Well "a" god not "the" god, to quote Bill Murray.

Response by CW2 Geoff Lachance made Jun 16 at 2014 5:20 PM

2014-06-16T17:20:21-04:00

After 18 years retired, I still love it when those I served with call me Chief! It was always used with respect. When I found out my civilian doctor was a retired navy officer I started calling him sir! I hope our forces always carry the respect and traditions on. Honor is such a great virtue! God Bless our service members!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 17 at 2014 1:15 PM

2014-06-17T13:15:33-04:00

I look at it this way, they are retired and as such, I call them sir or ma'am. (can't really go wrong that way)

Response by PO1 Walter Duncan made Jun 17 at 2014 3:19 PM

2014-06-17T15:19:12-04:00

It all depends on location and situation. If I am on my property and a retired Capt. comes over not in uniform. I guess his name is Mr. (whatever) or Bob. If I was attending a service type assembly I would be more inclined to use the proper Rank and Title. These things are always up to situational occasions.

Response by SPC Charles Brown made Jun 26 at 2014 2:29 PM

2014-06-26T14:29:27-04:00

There is one option that has been left off here:

I address retirees by rank unless or until they tell me that I can use their first name.

This would be my response to the question.

Response by Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 26 at 2014 2:39 PM

2014-06-26T14:39:25-04:00

I respect it, if it's their preferred term of address.

Response by LCpl Steve Wininger made Jun 26 at 2014 4:08 PM

2014-06-26T16:08:20-04:00

I chose the second option Major. I do not mind if anyone calls me by my first name, just don't like being called by my last name by itself. Unless I am told different I always address those above me by rank. As for active duty service members, I refer to them by rank and or sir/ma'am, as appropriate.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 26 at 2014 4:50 PM

2014-06-26T16:50:49-04:00

I shall follow Forrest Gump's example when speaking to Lt Dan.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 26 at 2014 4:52 PM

2014-06-26T16:52:20-04:00

I humbly suggest you be referred to as Maj Bob.

Response by SSgt Tim Ricci made Jun 26 at 2014 5:28 PM

2014-06-26T17:28:33-04:00

Friends I do not call by there rank, there are actually a few Officers that was Cobra Pilots in my Squadron in Desert Storm are now Wing CGs, I have not run into them Guys but I would address them as General unless asked not to do so. Some Of LDO friends made it to LtCol and we still call each other by our first names.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 26 at 2014 6:27 PM

2014-06-26T18:27:05-04:00

I think the important thing is to remember time and place. There's a time and place for adhering to military protocol and courtesies. Then there are times it's just not the right thing to do. I've had retired Admirals insist that I call them by their first name.....and though it might seem odd initially....I have and do.

However, if the retiree is just being a jackass and wants everyone to call him by his rank/title without rhyme or reason (just CUZ ain't gonna cut it).... then I'll deliberately call him by his first name, just CUZ.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2014 3:05 PM

2014-06-27T15:05:15-04:00

I fall somewhere between 1 and 2. There's little worse than a retired 1SG who's always trying to hold an inspection or a retired COL who keeps looking for his driver, aide, and expects salutes. (Shoulda stayed in, if those things are that important to you.) Likewise retirees who are always trying to fix problems they left behind. "So ... if you left a problem unsolved, did you get out too early or weren't you competent enough to fix it?"

On the other hand, if you've EARNED it, you ought to be accorded it.

Response by SSG Pete Fleming made Aug 10 at 2014 1:49 AM

2014-08-10T01:49:51-04:00

I guess it depends on the person and their rank. I do still call my friends by their last name though... and call me by mine.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 10 at 2014 11:57 AM

2014-08-10T11:57:00-04:00

I will respect the fact that one has donned the uniform and served their country. However, once you take that uniform off you take off that rank as well. I believe that in certain professional situations addressing the retiree by rank is deserved but not to be done without preceding it with the word "retired", i.e. in a professional public forum that would be a guest speaker for example. I've seen personally that once one earns a rank whether it be of a senior enlisted or commissioned they feel that their former rank holds bearing on active duty personnel. But this is just my $.02.

Response by SPC Richard White made Sep 21 at 2014 7:50 PM

2014-09-21T19:50:47-04:00

Rank is earned and sometimes there are stories that go behind them.It was only a year ago I found out about a story about my JROTC AI that makes me have a lot more respect for him and he will always be SGM. Petro

Response by SSG Tim Everett made Nov 12 at 2014 11:19 AM

2014-11-12T11:19:48-05:00

For a retiree I call them "sir" or "ma'am" if I don't know their rank. If I do know their rank, I call them by their rank if they are enlisted, as I would were they serving. For an officer, I'd call them sir/ma'am or use their rank if referring TO them.

For people with whom I served directly, who are not retired (ie, they are "Private Freakin' Civilians"), I call them by their first name. And when anyone addresses me, I ask them to call me by my first name because my rank did not carry over into civilian status.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 15 at 2014 11:25 PM

2014-11-15T23:25:45-05:00

It is only if it is known and entirely meant as a thanks for serving and honor for their service. If they demand it, it will not happen, ever

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 16 at 2014 12:05 AM

2014-11-16T00:05:41-05:00

CAT2. Clearly if an individual has retired from the military, served admirably, and continues to lead a life as a productive citizen, then there is no cost to me, nor harm than affording them the respect they have earned. In most cases, they downplay the address, but I think it is a part our military tradition that should remain.

Response by SCPO Albert Lee Smith made Nov 16 at 2014 12:14 PM

2014-11-16T12:14:45-05:00

It's a nice thng to do, if you know the rank, and it's in the proper setting. I gives the retiree a oment of pride, and is a great conversation opener.

I agree with CPO Private RallyPoint Member. If a retiree demands that you address them by their rank, no matter the time and place, that person wouldn't hear it come from me from that point moving forward.

Response by SFC Dr. Joseph Finck, BS, MA, DSS made Nov 23 at 2014 9:35 PM

2014-11-23T21:35:12-05:00

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca Sir, I agree. When I address persons who were / are senior to me either currently or in the past, I address them using their rank. If I know a service member who is senior to me, and with whom I have a relationship with, then privately their may be a first name basis. Respect is what sets us apart from many others.

Response by Sgt Nick Marshall made Nov 23 at 2014 10:18 PM

2014-11-23T22:18:39-05:00

I have a retired 2 star Marine General on my mail route, he insists I call him by his first name, I do and as two Marines we joke and laugh a lot over past experiences.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Nov 28 at 2014 12:35 AM

2014-11-28T00:35:05-05:00

I've been retired for a long time and I prefer first names. However, should the other person prefer to use rank, then that's fine also.

Response by SSG Peter Ludlum made Nov 28 at 2014 11:32 AM

2014-11-28T11:32:52-05:00

Having been a civilian working to the military while still in the National Guard it can be very convoluted. I was referred to by my first name a lot while in uniform by my superiors. Usually in meetings and never around my troops. I on the other hand always used rank in and out of uniform so as to not make that fatal mistake of calling a CSM or a Colonel and above by their first name or any other familiarity. A lot of the LTC and below I knew from their first day of commission and in private would be familiar. That was just me though. Like a salute when in doubt whip it out.

Response by SMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 12:01 PM

2014-11-28T12:01:29-05:00

I have about 5 more years to go until I punch and to be honest it really doesn't make a difference to me if I'm called by my rank or my first name. In my opinion my rank is my pay grade and not who I am! It is a responsibility level and yes was it earned of course, but that's my accomplishment and I done feel that it should be forced on others. Retired means just that! Go out honorably and let people that truly respect you the option to call you by your rank or first name. Too many people get wrapped around their egos! Get over yourselves!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 28 at 2014 8:22 PM

2014-11-28T20:22:37-05:00

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca , I feel that I am right there with the second category. However, I always show respect to retired officers by calling them sir/ma'am. It just doesn't/wouldn't feel right going from saluting someone to calling them Joe.

Response by CMSgt James Nolan made Nov 28 at 2014 10:57 PM

2014-11-28T22:57:09-05:00

For me it depends. If, for example, I knew you as a CMSgt, and you retired, but we were never really peers, nor friends away from Military, I would probably just call you Chief unless asked otherwise...because that is where our relationship stopped.

The same would hold for an Officer, unless we had a personal relationship (which harkens back to the Fraternization topic in another thread, so we will leave that one alone).

And for some the military never seems to leave: some guys will always be Colonel or Chief or Top, because it is so much in their DNA or personality that it just fits.

But truly at the end of the day, it is kind of like a blend between requests, respect and and personality: My name is James, I prefer to be called James, but some cannot wrap their heads around that and call me Jim, Jimbo or Jimmy, depending on what part of the country we happen to be in, although I intro as James...when I ask to be called James, after being addressed as Jimmy, should that offend you? No, because it is my preference...to some degree the same would hold with the rank title..but like most it would really fall into the respect category, because if, after you are retired, you are trying to push it, then...you may not have my respect, because if you did, it would be you asking me to call you John.....and not maintaining the formality.

Response by SPC(P) Jay Heenan made Nov 28 at 2014 11:59 PM

2014-11-28T23:59:07-05:00

I respond to most everyone by their rank (if it is known), as a sign of respect! Their are a very few whom I will look forward to greeting them with the 'your number one sign'...

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Dec 13 at 2014 12:21 AM

2014-12-13T00:21:26-05:00

Can you call me ......"Mini Me?"

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Dec 13 at 2014 12:37 AM

2014-12-13T00:37:47-05:00

I can't relate to any of the poll choices... For me... I don't ask or expect to be addressed by rank. Those that know me, may start the conversation with it and that's fine..but you can bet I'm going to ask them to call me Erik... that is after all my name... SGM was just a title I got for doing good stuff.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Jan 10 at 2015 3:44 PM

2015-01-10T15:44:17-05:00

May I call you "my liege?"

Response by SSG Timothy McCoy made Jan 11 at 2015 3:43 PM

2015-01-11T15:43:17-05:00

Sometime I do call folks b a rank that they didn't hold, out or a goading respect to my peers.
I call a fellow paratrooper COL as he calls me Sergeants Major, which we both have never attained.
Calling some by a rank not held is a backhanded complement.
And just FYI a COL does buy the beer as he make more than a SGM.

Response by COL Mike Walton made Jan 12 at 2015 12:47 PM

2015-01-12T12:47:15-05:00

There are times in which I address folks by rank, just like there are times I say "sir"
or "ma'm". There are other times whereby I address folks by nickname or first name. It is really dependent upon the situation we find ourselves in.

I have two General officer friends and formally I address them with their first name -- General. In informal situations depending on what's going on, I may address them by "sir" or by first name. As a subordinate even as a retiree, I am still greeted by several as "sir" or "Colonel" (the "telephone Colonel" greeting), "Walton", "Mike" or by "Blackeagle" or "BE".

As long as you don't address me as "asshole" I'm cool with just about anything you want to address me by -- addressing me period is a sign of respect; when you address a person by what they have attained is even better. I still call medics and physicians "Doc".

Response by GySgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 22 at 2015 9:22 AM

2015-02-22T09:22:31-05:00

Interesting dialogue here. I've been out quite some time. I guess I've become very civilianized. There are times when I've had the opportunity to go on base or talk to some troops where they address me as "Gunny" and it's a nice reminder . . . . . not expected, but given out of respect. I appreciate it. There are times that I've done the same for different folks, out of respect, but not from the inferior/superior relationship standpoint. At this point in my life and career, all of my friends and seniors (many of whom are now friends) have retired and we are in the stages of our lives where we reflect warmly on our respective careers and celebrating where we are in life.

Some of you will "need" the acknowledgement after you retire or get out as you transition back into the civilian life. Those of us who have gone on before you will welcome you with a beer and a smile. But we realize that it's not the titles that are important, but what bonds us; the camaraderie, shared experiences, and brotherhood. At this station in my life, titles are trivial. Having all of you as brothers and sisters is what's important.

Response by 1SG Tommy Griffin made Feb 22 at 2015 9:34 AM

2015-02-22T09:34:07-05:00

I use rank when appropriate. Usually I will use the first name of whom I am talking to among retirees. I will say I enjoy being addressed by rank on occasion, especially when I go through the gate at Ft Stewart or any other military installation. I have fellow Veteran's that come to my business and they out of respect address me as Top or 1SG. That is nice

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Feb 22 at 2015 9:43 AM

2015-02-22T09:43:10-05:00

Option D) If the retired individual is serving in an official capacity where their prior rank is relevant, or at an official function that requires the use of his/her uniform, then yes, addressing them by rank is appropriate.
If you're at the local Applebee's screaming at the waitress that you're a retired CSM/COL that wrote a blank check for their freedom and demanding a discount, I'd say that's an inappropriate use.

Response by SPC Mark Beard made Feb 22 at 2015 10:07 AM

2015-02-22T10:07:53-05:00

in the Legion we have no rank how ever I use it where I feel it is appropriate always I use all honor and respect we are all Brothers and sisters in arms GOD LOVE TRUST AND HONOR

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Feb 22 at 2015 12:17 PM

2015-02-22T12:17:27-05:00

This is the first time in one of these "surveys" when I found a response that I was comfortable checking: "I use it where I feel it is appropriate to shows [sic] respect, but I don't harp on it." (Well, except for the typo.)

To be honest, I enjoy hearing the voice on the telephone call me "Captain" when I call USAA for an insurance or banking matter (which is about the only time I hear it). Also, thanks to Johnny Depp, some get a kick out of calling me "Captain Jack". (A few on RallyPoint have taken advantage of this coincidence.)

Actually, I am a "captain" by virtue of my Coast Guard license as well as my military rank, so I used to here it more often before I stopped sailing.

I tend to refer to retired veterans I know by their rank if they were senior: General, Colonel, Sergeant Major, Gunny. They seem to enjoy it. Of course, being senior, they refer to me less kindly (especially if they are Marines inasmuch as I was in the Army).

Response by MSgt Jim Pollock made Feb 22 at 2015 12:46 PM

2015-02-22T12:46:35-05:00

It's all about context. During a military function, absolutely. During ordinary life (non-military) situations, it's a little much.

I think most retirees cherish their heritage, but understand life moves on. The telling moment for me was when it first felt strange that USAA prefaced my name with MSgt on an insurance bill.

Response by 1SG Cameron M. Wesson made Mar 2 at 2015 6:38 PM

2015-03-02T18:38:03-05:00

As a Army retiree and now as a DA Civilian... I lean toward option B. With that said... I also find myself, and many of you may also, in a different position at work. While we are all familiar with "our collective" backgrounds... That is all that it is... A background. Why? Well we are DA Civilians.... Minus the active duty team members and using former titles and ranks simply aren't appropriate.

This is especially true now when, I being a retired 1SG, am the Deputy Director of an organization that is made up of civilians and retired officers... Normally LTCs; however, I do have one retired COL. In the absence of my COL... I'm it! Regardless if he is there or not I handle the day-to-day operations of the organization. Most of my peers are also retired officers.

This doesn't mean I want people to bow and grovel... I'm just Cam! Everyone knows my title and that's all. I have been complimented by many as being a servant leader.

Now... Out of habit.. And as a southern boy... I adddress almost everyone by Sir/Ma'am/Ms.... Young or old ... Those are just my manners. That and I would prefer that I not be visited by the ghost of my momma and dad to remind me, "I didn't raise you like that!"

I do find it humerous to be addressed as "Top" or "1SG" when I'm needed for KSAs of my former life... It is done so on each occasion very respectfully... It normally begins, "Cam... I need you to put your SNCO hat on.... We have a question".

Response by COL Charles Williams made Mar 3 at 2015 1:01 AM

2015-03-03T01:01:52-05:00

This is an interesting one. I will tell you why, and try to illustrate my point.

1. I could/would never call one of my former bosses by their first name, especially those who were GOs. And when I hear other other retirees do that, I see it as disrespectful. It is almost like the wait to retire so they can use first names. Heck, I have a hard time calling retired Colonels, who were my bosses before I was a Colonel, by their first names.

2. I also have a hard time calling former Command Sergeants Major by their first name... It just does not seem right. I eventually got there with a few, as several are also now my close friends.

3. I very much dislike when former subordinates quickly call me "Chuck" in retirement... I see it as disrespectful, which is probably tied to number 1 and 2 above. I see it as now they don't have to show respect, as if to say they never had any respect, but they to act like it.

4. The last is probably because I was a MP and am a retired MP Colonel... When I enter my local military post, Fort Leonard Wood, I hate when an random MP doesn't have the common courtesy to call me Sir; most are very respectful and many even salute. I learned as young MP you can never go wrong with Sir, and I believe as retired Colonel, I have earned that. I always refer to seniors, retired or active as Sir.

I am sure to some I sound anal and self absorbed, but that is hardly the case. I suspect my opinions are based on my view of the world. I just don't think things change immediately the day you take off your uniform, or the respect you had was perhaps not really real respect.

Response by SPC David Shaffer made Mar 3 at 2015 2:24 PM

2015-03-03T14:24:35-05:00

I don't like anyone to refer to me as SPC Shaffer. I like to be called Shaffer because that is the name everyone has used my whole life. When anyone addresses me as David, I often don't realize they are even talking to me. I always use rank to be respectful, unless told otherwise.

Response by CWO4 Ray Fairman made Mar 11 at 2015 3:56 PM

2015-03-11T15:56:47-04:00

I would say that when I am aware that a person is retired with rank, I use it unless I have strong feelings that the respect is not due based on specific knowledge.

Rarely have I felt that a person has fallen into that latter category, but there have been a few in both my law enforcement and military worlds.

Response by CWO4 Ray Fairman made Mar 11 at 2015 4:03 PM

2015-03-11T16:03:34-04:00

I almost always use rank when I am aware of the individual's rank and the setting is appropriate.
On rare occasions I have intentionally failed to use rank when I am personally aware of circumstances that lead me to believe that the individual specifically has a background that has caused them to lose my total respect for them and their "service". On very few instances, in both my Military and Law Enforcement careers has this happened, but it has happened.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Apr 2 at 2015 12:39 AM

2015-04-02T00:39:27-04:00

If people want to call em IT1 or Petty Officer I don't sweat it. I do tell them that I prefer to be called John.

Likewise I generally call other retirees by their first name as well though once in a while I will call one by their rank.

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Apr 4 at 2015 11:25 AM

2015-04-04T11:25:51-04:00

First let me say it is not improper to use some one's retired rank in most circumstances; however, there are civil service rules that prohibit it in the workplace. I'm generally uncomfortable with it because I believe the rank address should be reserved for those currently serving. I've been there done that, now I'm retired and my name or "Mister Coe" will do just fine.

Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Apr 6 at 2015 10:34 PM

2015-04-06T22:34:22-04:00

I will use rank amongst retirees when it's appropriate to the situation. Some of my former Airmen I'm still in contact with call me by first name when we're one-on-one. Some still use my rank especially in a group setting. I don't feel any disrespect in either case.

I'll use rank/name for retired officers just because I can't get past 21+ years of addressing them by rank. I've had several tell me to use their first name but it just doesn't seem proper to me.

Well, except for one particular asshat I enjoy calling by his first name just because I know it irritates him.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 22 at 2015 2:33 PM

2015-04-22T14:33:49-04:00

I don't harp on it, but I firmly believe that once you've earned the rank/title of leadership; that is yours forever. No man can take that from you, once you have earned it. I think, anytime I meet an old veteran (or someone I served with that ETS'd) that it is essential to let them know that they still earned/have my respect. Branch does not matter either. Though I may not have served in their branch, A Navy Captain (Ret) still deserves the respect I would show a COL; A Marine SSG has earned the right to for it to be known that they were a leader not to be trifled with then....and from then on, because they had to work hard to get there and earn it (some having been tried by fire) and they will never loose that character once they've performed the duties of that office. The Militarty would have us recognize them for what they are by issuing them a corresponding rank, so I say that you do well to honor those who have served by letting them know that the respect they earned goes beyond the moment in time they donned the rank. So I say to you,Sir; to me, if I ever meet you -you will forever be Major Petrarca....even though I know you would tell me to call you Bob (assumng we knew one another on such terms Sir).

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 23 at 2015 9:41 PM

2015-06-23T21:41:04-04:00

Old habits die hard.

Response by SPC Margaret Higgins made Oct 19 at 2015 4:37 PM

2015-10-19T16:37:25-04:00

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca, I believe that rank should always be used as a sign of respect. But there are of course exceptions; depending on how well one knows the person that is being addressed.

Response by Col Joseph Lenertz made Mar 31 at 2016 2:08 PM

2016-03-31T14:08:19-04:00

Yeah, it's a rare thing...depends on circumstances. As a contractor now, some of my friends that knew me while in uniform will introduce me including rank, just to be kind and maybe give me some credibility.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2016 4:10 PM

2016-08-24T16:10:37-04:00

Well, as a Major (or any officer), you should be addressed by rank for the rest of your life, since Officers retain their Commission until they die.

Response by PO1 Norm Burns made Sep 1 at 2016 8:11 PM

2016-09-01T20:11:57-04:00

With me, it varies. With most of those I fellowship, first names, or Brother works. There are some though, that "Chief", or "Gunny", or "Commander" just seems more appropriate, because it just "fits them" better.

Response by CPT Karen Nichols McAbee made Sep 22 at 2016 12:24 PM

2016-09-22T12:24:06-04:00

I've seen it both ways - if its someone I served with, I usually default to sir/ma'am and/or rank, because that's the frame of reference of how I know that individual. More often than not, once retired, I'll get the response of, "please call me Dave..." Those are the officers I respect. However, there is one individual I flat out REFUSE to call by rank or with 'sir' because he DEMANDS it. Yes, he was a high ranking officer prior to retirement, but he's been retired for quite a long time and is someone I don't respect, regardless of his prior rank, based upon his actions.

Response by SPC Ben Harris made Apr 25 at 2017 8:35 AM

2017-04-25T08:35:39-04:00

According to the person and amount of respect I have for them I will use rank or I won't. Respect is earned not given. Now that I have a choice that is lol

Response by SGT Jim Ramge, MBA made Jul 10 at 2017 11:35 AM

2017-07-10T11:35:38-04:00

Having been around the Military my entire life, this one has always been an interesting ordeal for some... I believe that once a troop retires, they have removed themselves from the chair they once sat. It is like the old wife tossing her husbands rank around wherever they went. I have full respect while one serves, however, when you retire, you passed the torch to the younger generation to lead our troops - doesn't mean I no longer respect you! I fully respect your honorable service to this great nation of ours, but if you are still wearing your rank after you retire, you shouldn't have retired until you were truly ready! There are organizations that want to offer respect, but even our leading VA doesn't call you by your rank, just your social. Just speaking my personal beliefs here. Not being disrespectful, just pointing out what I have seen and how it relates to being retired and obtaining the new rank of Sir/Ma'am or Mr./Ms., and being welcomed back to society as being a civilian... One can still be respectful, it is simply how it is received! This further leads to why the 5-yr mark upon retirement is such a questionable ordeal. Many cannot handle the transition back to civilian life, and they die from not being whom they once were and not being able to slide right back into that same chair in the civilian life, having to start at the bottom and working their way back to the top. Things have changed over the years to reflect how much has been done for the service members, which is reducing that affliction many once had - meaning "Damnit, I deserve respect". Yes, you do, it is just provided in a different way now and some have often had a problem with how it was offered. It is simply called transition!

Response by GySgt Thomas Lieb made Jul 31 at 2017 10:51 PM

2017-07-31T22:51:26-04:00

It should be used by a junior to a senior, but never require outside of active duty. Likewise respect should be shown for the junior, especially retired. Most Marines I know (NOLOAD or no longer on active duty) use certain enlisted ranks as a nickname......e.g. Many people still cal me Gunny and I know a retired First Sergeant we all call Top (and a Master Gunnery Sgt who will always be MasterGuns). I think we generally follow the advice handed us from the Royal Marines. "A senior officer, if he is a gentleman, will never bring it to mind, and the junior, if he is a gentleman, never forgets it". And this courtesy continues life long (unless the receiver says to knock it off)

Response by LtCol Robert Quinter made Oct 31 at 2017 12:05 AM

2017-10-31T00:05:33-04:00

I generally refer to my seniors as Sir, or their rank, Juniors by their name if invited, or their rank if I we're talking with another person and I want them to realize the accomplishments of my friend. I'm Bob to all, but often get the Colonel informal promotion from people I worked with.

Response by SSG James Behnke made Oct 31 at 2017 12:09 AM

2017-10-31T00:09:43-04:00

It is a sign of respect. If you earned my respect when you were in you still have it once you retire. If you didn't, then there will be a "sup dude/man/child/tiger".

Response by CPO Ed Hoover made Dec 13 at 2017 1:44 PM

2017-12-13T13:44:57-05:00

I retired as a CPO, from the Navy Reserve side. Occasionally a group of us will get together, both officer and enlisted. 90% of the time I will refer to the officers as either Sir, or by their rank. Most times, they may not know or remember my first name, so they refer to me as Chief. As far as enlisted go, I might refer to them as ,Chief, Senior Chief, or Master Chief, as necessary. But as far as E6 and below , I've never referred to them as Petty Officer, so and so.

Response by SPC David Willis made Dec 13 at 2017 2:04 PM

2017-12-13T14:04:57-05:00

I find I use sir/maam mostly when disagreeing with people so it doesn't feel like Im disrespectful in disagreement. Casual titles like top and gunny I use more often as well.

Response by SFC Dennis A. made Dec 13 at 2017 3:12 PM

2017-12-13T15:12:43-05:00

I live in a rural area where 99.9% of people are addressed by their first names. I very seldom make it to a Military Installation but when I do I have to admit that it feels good to be addressed as Sergeant again.

Response by CSM Richard StCyr made Dec 13 at 2017 3:20 PM

2017-12-13T15:20:15-05:00

I refer to older retired Sergeants Major as such out of respect, I feel odd calling guys Bill or Ed when they have always been "Sergeant Major" to me. Same with officers I worked for or with even though none would be offended if I called them by name.
I run into it myself and what I am called pretty much tells what time frame I knew people. To Guys who I had in my Squads and Platoons; I'm Sergeant Saint, Folks who were in the company I'm "Top" and those from the Battalions it's Sergeant Major. I gave up telling them to call me Richard or Rick long ago and am just happy they remember me and take a moment to stop and say hi.

Response by Lt Col Charlie Brown made Jan 19 at 2019 6:38 AM

2019-01-19T06:38:47-05:00

It depends on the person and the situation

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 19 at 2019 9:01 AM

2019-01-19T09:01:41-05:00

When introducing myself, it is always first and last name. I only say my rank if asked. When I talk or correspond to Sergeant Majors or Officers that I used to serve with, I use sir (SGM) and their rank as a courtesy.

Response by CPL Chris Palmberg made Jan 19 at 2019 9:39 AM

2019-01-19T09:39:49-05:00

Not exactly the answer to your question, but as a line medic whose uniform has been in a duffel bag for a dozen years or so, nothing makes me more... ok, giddy... than when someone yells "Hey, Doc!" at me... most recently it was a fellow vet whose service didn't overlap my own, but I'm not sure if she just couldn't remember my name, or if it was a sign of respect... I like to pretend it was the latter.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2019 2:42 PM

2019-02-28T14:42:51-05:00

I use it when appropriate just as Major Petrarca stated, I have subordinates peers and former supervisor s that still refer to me as CSM at least the ones who respected me and my leadership styles. I do know a few that have other choice words for me but either way I think it used by those who respected you as a Soldier, leader, and or friend.

Response by TSgt Andrew Harper made Feb 28 at 2019 6:49 PM

2019-02-28T18:49:42-05:00

..in the 78% range.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Feb 28 at 2019 7:03 PM

2019-02-28T19:03:15-05:00

I address pretty much everyone as Sir/Ma'am, except coworkers, who are all addressed by first name (civilian job) as am I. When I wander on post, I address the rank because it is on display, and because that is what Soldiers are conditioned to respond to. However if you are in civilian clothes, you're going to get a Sir/Ma'am, regardless of rank. But that's just me.

Response by SFC Luis Serrano made Mar 1 at 2019 5:41 PM

2019-03-01T17:41:18-05:00

Both. I do admit that it feels right. When I went into the private sector, there was a maintenance employee that use to greet me everyday with a salute and addressed me as "Sargento" as if it was my first name. He'd never been in the military, but recognized my time in service. I enjoyed every instance.

Response by CPL Jeremy Glenn made Mar 2 at 2019 9:26 AM

2019-03-02T09:26:07-05:00

While in the military rank exists for a purpose, and fraternization is frowned upon. As a retiree that purpose no longer exists. While the time spent is respected I think it’s a vanity thing to hold onto it. I’ll use it when I deeply respect someone or in a professional setting if they insist upon it, but other than that we all wake up a civilian and put our pants on the same way.

Response by MAJ Montgomery Granger made Mar 3 at 2019 6:00 AM

2019-03-03T06:00:37-05:00

Cat 2 all the way! First name basis is fine, if that's what folks prefer, but heck, I even called my high school coaches, "Sir!" It just feels good to give and receive respect. Ranks were EARNED not given. Hooah!

Response by CPO Charles Helms made Mar 3 at 2019 11:02 AM

2019-03-03T11:02:28-05:00

I have always addressed retired personnel by their rank, unless they inform differently!!

Response by PO1 Michael Brouty made Mar 3 at 2019 5:32 PM

2019-03-03T17:32:00-05:00

I usually call my old shipmates by their first name. Sometimes, I'll still say Chief. There is one Master Chief Petty Officer that I respect so much. He is and always will be addressed as Master Chief by me.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 4 at 2019 6:30 PM

2019-03-04T18:30:35-05:00

Somehow this 5 year old question popped up in my feed but to the original posters question, I do use rank for those retired. In most cases with me as an officer its me referring to retired enlisted far more so than other O's..I guess I know more enlisted these days. But why shouldn't I use their title? It doesn't hurt, harm, or bother me in the least. They earned their title after years of service to their country. Me using it is a very easy way to show respect to someone who dedicated that much of their life to protecting the freedoms of others.

Would I insist on anyone using my title once I'm retired, certainly not but I wouldn't mind if they did. :)

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 7 at 2019 6:46 AM

2019-03-07T06:46:52-05:00

I fall into Cat 2 also...I mostly try to be respectfull and use rank but those that have known me or read my posts now thatI will not back down from someone that tries to pull rank and have been known to call them out to the community

As a Military Civilian it was wierd answering the phone as Mr. instead of SSG. I still slip sometimes.

Response by LTC Gary Earls made Mar 7 at 2019 6:40 PM

2019-03-07T18:40:43-05:00

Reminds me of a story a friend of mine told me. Gary was on the 101st Airborne Division Association with Major General James Smith who we both had served under. At the first meeting, Gary kept calling General Smith, " General" etc. General Smith finally told Gary, "Gary, my name is Jim, I'm retired now". :-)

Response by SSG Brian Edwards made Mar 8 at 2019 8:16 AM

2019-03-08T08:16:23-05:00

I'm like this, my name is Brian. If you new me in the army I don't care what you call me that's up to you. I will address any body as Mr or Mrs or sir or man. If I did know someone in the military and I respected them I will call them by their rank, if I thought you were a dirt bag it's hard to say what I will call you .

Response by SFC Domingo M. made Mar 9 at 2019 8:21 PM

2019-03-09T20:21:08-05:00

I met several trainees from my time on the trail and their greeting after several years was "Drill Sargeant Martinez" Me being a retiree and in civilian cloths had no effect on them at all.

Response by SSgt Daniel d'Errico made Mar 14 at 2019 12:13 AM

2019-03-14T00:13:04-04:00

People, who were close to me in service I'll call by their first name. Others I call by their last name. But those officers I served under, whom I have a deep redpect, I call them by their rank, unless they prefer I use their frist name. I personally know three generals that rather I use their first names. There are a lot of senior NCOs I will to their faces I'll call lying sacks of shit, cock bites and several other names if this space would last for a couple of months.

Response by SSG Brian Wilber made Mar 15 at 2019 10:57 PM

2019-03-15T22:57:13-04:00

I regularly converse with a former section sergeant from 20 years ago. She was a SFC at the time and went on to be a 1SG before retiring. Even after 20 years, I find it difficult to call her by her first name. It just doesn't feel right to me. When I signed up, I thought I was getting in the Army. Little did I know that the Army would get in me too.

Response by SPC Vonnie Jones made Mar 17 at 2019 1:00 PM

2019-03-17T13:00:46-04:00

Its funny when I call USAA and the call me specialist, for them it is a sign of respect. I call a person what ever they are more comfortable with

Response by SPC Ruben Marin made Mar 31 at 2019 2:02 PM

2019-03-31T14:02:53-04:00

I find rank is not that big of a deal as a veteran. I refer to most veterans as brother or sister anyway. Unless you were in my direct chain of command or were senior ldrship (1sg, CSM, Col), you will be addressed by last name or first name. That's the civilian way, which we are all apart of now. Don't be the veteran demanding to be Sgt Snuffy or CPT Hero. Not cool.

Response by TSgt Jim Brown made Mar 31 at 2019 5:04 PM

2019-03-31T17:04:11-04:00

I do use their rank if I know what their rank is. Being a civilian you don't always wear your rank. So even if you know they are a veteran it isn't always clear so I will call them Brother or Sister.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2019 8:35 PM

2019-03-31T20:35:16-04:00

In my time we had:
Major Fuckup
Captain Obvious
and
Sergeant Schultz

Response by PO3 Lynn Spalding made Mar 31 at 2019 9:56 PM

2019-03-31T21:56:59-04:00

I figure that is our past. Just call me by my name, we are all equal now as far as I'm concerned.

Response by SSG Glenn Morse made Apr 1 at 2019 1:43 AM

2019-04-01T01:43:34-04:00

If you are retired you are still member of the military. You are subject to recall, you are subject to the UCMJ 24/7 as up held by the Supreme Court. If you look at the military definition of retirement pay it is referred to as retainer pay. If you resign your commission or leave service after your enlistment period you are no longer a part of the military therefore none of this applies. If you retire have some class, the courtesys still apply

Response by LTC Mark Overberg made Apr 1 at 2019 6:04 AM

2019-04-01T06:04:03-04:00

Army policy is in AR 600-8-7, par. 1-9a, “Retired Soldiers will be treated with the same courtesy as their active duty counterparts. They will be addressed by their retired rank, if known; otherwise, they will be addressed as “Sir” or “Ma’am.”.” That being said, in my experience as Director, outside formal meetings or organizations where it is pertinent (e.g. a retiree council) I have seen respect shown (in both directions), but actual rank seldom voiced. When I talk to other Retired Soldiers (and retirees of other Servces), I use their rank, if I know it, to convey my appreciation for their service and to recognize that they are still serving - in another capacity. For the Army, we follow the Soldier for Life mindset.

Response by SFC Brian Gillum made Apr 1 at 2019 9:15 AM

2019-04-01T09:15:57-04:00

I believe there are times and/or places where it would be appropriate, assuming the rank was known.

However, since my business cards don’t say SFC(R) Brian Gillum MSCJA, BSCJ, EMT-B, I don’t expect people to know my rank, let alone use it in any setting unless it is some formal occasion where it would be appropriate, or if I see a member of the military acting a fool/needing on the spot correction and I identify myself with my rank to lend credence to my putting them at parade rest and counseling them on their wayward ways.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2019 12:58 PM

2019-04-01T12:58:24-04:00

Well, im from northeast rural Georgia and teach in upstate rural SC. Sir and Ma'am are SOP to elders, and unless specifically directed, rank is used for retirees (much like Professors, physicians, ministers, etc.). Maybe its just my family, but everyone around here does it too.

Response by SGT Mark Hasch made Apr 1 at 2019 9:34 PM

2019-04-01T21:34:59-04:00

I will always address my favorite Staff Sargent by saying "Huff my Staff Sargent" and he will always say "FRONT LENNING REST!!!/:0)"

Response by CW5 Dennis Stewart made Apr 2 at 2019 12:50 PM

2019-04-02T12:50:06-04:00

I am in group 2. Where I work now, we have a lot of retired folks. We joke with each other sometimes by using rank, but most it is a sign of respect. We have some people who have never been in call me Chief and one supervisor Sergeant Major. We have two many colonels around to keep that straight ! LOL

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 3 at 2019 1:32 AM

2019-04-03T01:32:43-04:00

I still address my former 1st Sgt, as Top from time to time. I still call a Sgt. Major that I know as his former service rank when I see him.

Response by PO3 Brad Phillips made Apr 3 at 2019 10:30 AM

2019-04-03T10:30:38-04:00

For me it's respect and habit. At our reunions I still refer to all the chiefs as chief. Plus I feel these reunions me and the men and wemon I served with is mentally helpful.

Response by PO2 Lee Norris made Apr 3 at 2019 1:36 PM

2019-04-03T13:36:14-04:00

I feel off about using rank as a civilian now. Especially if I knew someone as a chief and they retired as a senior or master. Or if they were a first class or junior now they are retired as a chief or higher

Response by SSG Timothy Lanham made Apr 3 at 2019 11:32 PM

2019-04-03T23:32:22-04:00

I have been called Sergeant a few times after I retired but it is not something I would ask or expect any body to do. All of my military correspondence still addresses me by rank.

Response by TSgt Carl Johnson made Apr 4 at 2019 3:17 AM

2019-04-04T03:17:16-04:00

If I am talking to someone that I served with that had a senior rank, I will address them as such until told otherwise. If I meet someone new, I have no way of knowing their rank unless they inform me. In that case I address them in the manner in which they have introduced themselves to me. As for myself, I'm comfortable with first names, but the first year or so after I retired if I ran into an airman who knew me and they called me Sergeant Johnson I took it as a sign of respect and returned that respect.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 4 at 2019 6:54 AM

2019-04-04T06:54:16-04:00

I also am in category 2. That being said, many people are not aware of title 10 USC chapter 45 p772: a retired officer “may bear the title and wear the uniform of his retired grade”.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 4 at 2019 5:49 PM

2019-04-04T17:49:59-04:00

Simple answer tbh. It's a title, and the rules are similar to the title of a doctor in my opinion. If a vet insists, then sure, they've earned it, but in my experience, there's very few that would insist.

There's a couple folks that insist on addressing me by title, but I've never asked anyone to and never will, and the use of the title doesn't bother me in the least.

It's a courtesy :)

Response by GySgt Mike Swisher made Apr 6 at 2019 1:06 AM

2019-04-06T01:06:09-04:00

Addressing by rank after retirement is a professional courtesy I extend until invited to do otherwise. In a structured, formal environment I always opt for showing someone the respect of addressing them by the rank they've earned.

Response by SGT Beth Day made Apr 6 at 2019 2:21 PM

2019-04-06T14:21:47-04:00

I was an E5, I have a retired major who freelances for me. Nope ... no rank

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2019 7:45 PM

2019-04-06T19:45:57-04:00

When I retired, I truly retired. I don’t expect people to use my rank and vice versa. That is just my preference. I work with a retired 2 star and he goes by Dave and the same for a retired CMsgt I also work with who is Ron. To me that was my past chapter in life and is part of the full military transition.

Response by CWO4 Tim Hecht made Apr 7 at 2019 3:03 PM

2019-04-07T15:03:09-04:00

Another comment, related to this topic. I was assigned to Coast Guard Headquarters from 1988-1991. I was on a small 4 man staff; a LCDR, LT, a retired Army O-6 ( Current GS-12), and myself - SK1, Chief Storekeeper, and finally a CWO2; all in 3 years. The civilian, introduced himself to me as “Ed”. Out of respect I would call him Colonel but he preferred that I called him Ed. He was a member of TROA (The Retired Officer’s Association) now known as MOA. Ed shared a TROA Article with us entitled: “THE COLONEL IS GREEN” about lessons learned, pitfalls to avoid, when making the transition from Colonel to Civilian Employe. It recommended not decorating one’s office to resemble your last active duty office, and included advice on proper protocol on everything from managing people, office etiquette, and not wearing one’s former rank on one’s sleeve. It was a great article, written to help one transition to the civilian workforce. A great article, well worth reading if it can be found!

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2019 3:00 PM

2019-04-09T15:00:58-04:00

I only use it for people I respect, but I also dont run into people from my Army life too often. I still use last names all the time, though!

Response by SGT Robert Martin made Apr 9 at 2019 8:56 PM

2019-04-09T20:56:47-04:00

I was just discussing this subject with a brother that I deployed with. It seems with few exceptions the platoon we deployed with still call each other by rank. One exception is our former platoon leader. Since the LT just retired last year with two stars ( no surprise to anyone) aside from the occasional slip it's sir or General. To his credit when one of us does slips, and call him LT he just smiles. As for the rest of us when one of the wife's ask why I called her husband Sargeant Smith ( not his name) My response was, I thought Sargeant was his first name. While that got some laughs it seems to be the consensus of our group. We call each other by rank because that what we've always called each other.

Response by CPO Lee Reese made Apr 10 at 2019 11:33 PM

2019-04-10T23:33:17-04:00

I wear a cover that lets people know that I retired as a Chief, but there are only a couple that address me as Chief. I don’t encourage it and I take it as respect.

Response by SGT Mark Rhodes made Apr 14 at 2019 5:21 PM

2019-04-14T17:21:52-04:00

I use two as well especially with my officers friends. It’s hard not to call a General or Colonel anything less

Response by PO1 Richard Nyberg made Apr 24 at 2019 10:20 PM

2019-04-24T22:20:38-04:00

I mostly address senior Officers and senior enlisted by their rank even though we are retired just out of respect and if we get to know each other better than they usually tell me their first name.

Response by GySgt Thomas Vick made May 6 at 2019 9:31 AM

2019-05-06T09:31:07-04:00

I fall into category 2, you earned it you deserve the respect.

Response by SSG Marlin Dammarell made May 6 at 2019 7:41 PM

2019-05-06T19:41:07-04:00

In my opinion, once you retire, your rank is retired and you become Mr. and/ or Mrs. If you want to be called or addressed by the rank when you retired, well then you shouldn't of retired and stay in the Military. Bottom Line!! Ya it's ok to address us folks by our retired rank from time to time, but it kills me when some of these retired folks demand to be addressed by there retired rank and use it everyday as if they were still in the Military. C'mon Man, I understand it's in our blood, but we choose to hang up our rank and service to our Country, and move on to Mr. and/ Mrs. respectively.. Just my opinion. Thanks.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 8 at 2019 8:17 AM

2019-05-08T08:17:05-04:00

Here are my thoughts, when I hang out with my old troops most just call me brother and I them. When I would go back to my old unit for paperwork or just to hang some of the younger guys still call me sergeant and then I say I’m just Chris now so they say ok sir and then I threaten to kill them. Best advise I was ever given was by a buddy of mine that just remember you are a was nobody cares anymore so don’t let it run your life. I don’t expect to be called by my rank that chapter is over. I quite enjoy being called by my first name now.

Response by SPC Casey Ashfield made May 8 at 2019 11:30 PM

2019-05-08T23:30:57-04:00

In general, no. I think this is pretty stupid to do after someone retires. But when I am addressing someone respectable like a retired E-8 I used to work with, COLs, Generals etc then yes. It is appropriate, to me at least.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made May 9 at 2019 5:32 PM

2019-05-09T17:32:49-04:00

Majority of people on here are senior soldiers. Iin my biased opinion, I believe most seniors should be addressed by their rank. It's simply endearment and respect for all that you have done for the U.S. Military. By that point not a lot of people will choose to continue to the point of where y'all are at.

Response by CW3 Harvey K. made May 9 at 2019 11:47 PM

2019-05-09T23:47:15-04:00

Once discharged, rank should be a memory unless a combat veteran. If a career guy who retires with 20 or more years of service, fine, your buddies might call you by your rank when you meet up with them, and others who learn of your rank might flatter you by the honor of your old form of address.
For the most part, I think we take off our insignia of rank when we are "out" and should treat each other as the fellow citizens (with an important common experience) that we were before we took the oath.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 12 at 2019 5:52 PM

2019-05-12T17:52:41-04:00

It should be preference of the individuals involved, UNLESS they are contractors.

A retiree cannot use, or be addressed by, thier rank if they are a contractor, and performing work as such. Even if they are still "in" and on terminal.

Response by SFC Michael Arabian made May 13 at 2019 11:36 AM

2019-05-13T11:36:57-04:00

Some habits are hard to break even after you retire. Me, treat me with the same respect you want me to treat you with and we’re good

Response by SFC Michael W. made May 14 at 2019 4:37 PM

2019-05-14T16:37:58-04:00

I know some would say No to it, but I still do out of respect...especially if it's someone I've served or deployed with.

...and I'm still NOT used to someone calling me by my first name after all these years! LOL

Response by PO1 Chad Alcock made May 14 at 2019 4:39 PM

2019-05-14T16:39:30-04:00

Funny thing is I've had people come into my office and try to pull rank on me because they out ranked me in the military. It's my job to teach people how to act in the civilian world and explain that rank no longer has any bearing on your future endeavors (in most cases). Also in most cases I refuse to call anyone by what rank they held in the service for that exact reason. I found that quite a few people have a tendency to cling to the past to the point that it's a detriment to their future. Now if the situation calls for it, I will do so. I actually live in the town where I was a recruiter an still have people call me AT1 or Petty Officer, even though they were never in the military and I knew them as high school students. I think they do it just because they don't remember my first name

Response by CW4 William Kessinger made May 14 at 2019 4:46 PM

2019-05-14T16:46:48-04:00

But not in a purely civil environment. And only in and around other military or military retires.

Response by SSG John Lasseigne made May 19 at 2019 6:34 PM

2019-05-19T18:34:36-04:00

I think it depends on the relationship of the individuals. If I have a personal relationship with the other before and or after retirement it will be first names...just as it was off duty prior to retirement. If our relationship was strictly professional I would brobably address them as i did prior to retirement...by rank.

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made Jun 2 at 2019 7:49 PM

2019-06-02T19:49:17-04:00

Everyone still calls me chief

Response by SSgt Michael Cox made Jun 8 at 2019 12:14 AM

2019-06-08T00:14:37-04:00

There are a few people I call by rank. When I worked as an AmeriCorps contractor for the Washington Department of Veterans Affaires I met an old crusty Sgt. Maj. who was also a Master Guns before he switched from Marines to Army. Another is the founder of our local veterans court and a retired Army Col. and judge. If I ever run into my old commander on the street I will call Gen Web general also.

Response by CPL Joseph Elinger made Jun 9 at 2019 10:47 PM

2019-06-09T22:47:52-04:00

On many occasions, including friend Vets, I don't know their rank. We've discussed deployments & duty stations. For the most part, neither I nor my friends are all caught up in rank, awards, badges, etc. It was an experience.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 22 at 2019 5:37 AM

2019-06-22T05:37:46-04:00

I ran into a former 1st Sgt of mine recently and out of respect I still called him "top." I had a retired Colonel in my Anger Management group at the VA and everyone called him "sir" until he reiterated his name was Chris. It's a show of respect. I know it always makes an old timers day when I valet park for them at the VA and I address them by their old rank. It's part of the fraternitas we all share as Veterans.

Response by 1LT David Webster made Jun 30 at 2019 5:28 PM

2019-06-30T17:28:03-04:00

USAA always addresses me with my retirement rank even after 50 years of membership.

Response by SGT Robert Junior made Jul 2 at 2019 7:38 PM

2019-07-02T19:38:03-04:00

Problem is political pull with non service experienced supervisors. It means be silent and transfer or you might be slapped with a form 8, Title 18 202, or change shift every week. I have to be told every day how the military ruined my7 life and why non veterans are more important. Defense logistics agency has a lot of these people. Even with SUPPLY FORWARD a non Veteran said he was more qualified as a GS 15 and military service was a hinderance.

Response by Alfred Perdue made Jul 13 at 2019 9:09 AM

2019-07-13T09:09:18-04:00

Had an Army retiree used to come in where I worked. Nice guy, clearly (rightfully) proud of his service. When he was leaving after I helped him I just said, "Thanks for coming in today Top". Old fellow, and his wife's faces, just lit up.

Response by PO1 Jerome Newland made Jul 14 at 2019 6:45 AM

2019-07-14T06:45:42-04:00

Especially in Soldier, Sailor, Airman, Marine watering holes such as the Legion or VFW. BUT, for some reason, I don't care enough to find out about, when somebody from the VA says, it's like fingernails on a chalkboard. It seems derogatory sometimes.

Response by MAJ Philip Crabtree made Jul 14 at 2019 7:45 PM

2019-07-14T19:45:08-04:00

If you have made it to retirement, it is a privilege to continue using your rank. It is my privilege and honor to recognize you by the rank you achieved. I have a lot of respect for those who achieved that milestone and gave that much to our country. My father, for example, is a retired U.S. Navy Chief Petty Officer. He will always be Chief Crabtree to me (as well as Dad). Some people have a hangup about it, but it seems they either did not serve until they were retirement eligible or feel inadequate. If you feel like you did not give it your all, I can understand your reluctance to use your rank. I don't have that problem.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 2 at 2019 2:50 PM

2019-08-02T14:50:02-04:00

All on a case by case basis/situational.

If I respect you and you like to be called by your rank, then I call you by rank.

If I don't respect you, then its Bob.

If i really don't like you then it's Mr/Mrs whatever.

Response by SSgt Gerald Davis Jr made Nov 13 at 2019 8:42 PM

2019-11-13T20:42:30-05:00

My CO is still Capt. Even though he retired ad a Col.

Response by PO1 Mike Wallace made Nov 14 at 2019 9:02 PM

2019-11-14T21:02:42-05:00

Sorry but when you get out whether it is 4 years or 34 years you are no longer serving. No one uses my title I help at retirement from the FAA.

Response by Sgt Cam Giannetti made Nov 19 at 2019 10:13 AM

2019-11-19T10:13:59-05:00

I'm somewhere between 1 and 2. If a person leaves the military and embarks on another career, it can be awkward to call that person by rank, especially for civilians. Acknowledging and respecting rank is not only a military courtesy, but it's a functional discipline while actively serving (like wearing a uniform). In my opinion, it's optional and situational when retired as it serves no functional purpose except to stroke egos and/or to show respect (feelings), as is mostly the case with all titles.

Response by CPT Terry Lewis made Nov 21 at 2019 4:36 PM

2019-11-21T16:36:35-05:00

I usually go with category 2, myself. It depends on the circumstances and how well I know the individual.

Response by Sgt Steve Williams made Nov 22 at 2019 4:44 PM

2019-11-22T16:44:21-05:00

I remember in the 1960s some people would call my grandfather Colonel (he served in WWI and WWII). I know he appreciated the recognition but was not bothered one bit when addressed as Mister (or first name by friends). I never was sure of the relationship he had with that called him Colonel. At that point I figured he was a civilian and Mister was right.

Response by SGT Greg Gold made Nov 25 at 2019 9:08 PM

2019-11-25T21:08:53-05:00

I shoot with a retired officer, (06 type), from my USAR days. He calls me sergeant, I still call him sir. I've been at SAFS clinics where we were addressing each other by rank, and some of the new shooters were wondering why? I told them since we already had the working relationship why try and change it? Also, as a Green Knight, (military motorcycle club), I still rub elbows with commissioned types, and addressing them as sir\mam is just second nature.

Response by PO1 John Wypyszinski made Nov 30 at 2019 11:51 AM

2019-11-30T11:51:20-05:00

I call retirees senior to me by rank unless they tell me otherwise, and to be honest it feels strange not to use their rank - you can retire me from the military but I guess you can't retire the military from me.

Response by CPT Jim Chatman made Nov 30 at 2019 8:16 PM

2019-11-30T20:16:32-05:00

I now work in Veterans services. One of the key points I make with my team regularly is that there is one rank among Veterans: Veteran

Response by SSG Raymond Gaither made Dec 9 at 2019 9:21 AM

2019-12-09T09:21:57-05:00

Well as an E6 when I got out if I encounter any service member whether or not they are active or retired depends on their rank. If lower enlist it would be rank or their name if I knew it. For senior enlisted would be by rank unless they direct me otherwise. Same thing for jr commissioned. Senior offers would be by rank only. I still find it hard to call a senior officer by name out of respect for the rank.

Response by Col Jonathan Brazee made Dec 15 at 2019 3:31 AM

2019-12-15T03:31:33-05:00

I have no set rule, so-to-speak. In the classroom, I am "Dr. Brazee." All other times, I introduce myself as "Jonathan Brazee." Some people call me "Colonel," others do not. My feeling is that the Marine part of my service supercedes my rank.

As far as what I call people, if they are active duty, it is almost always by their rank. If they are retired, it depends on what they want to be called. The one weird one is one of my lieutenants who made flag. He still calls me sir, and in the end, I settled on his first name. which he seems to prefer.

Response by Sgt Peter Schlesiona made Dec 18 at 2019 12:37 PM

2019-12-18T12:37:59-05:00

I’m on the fence about it, largely because I’ve met too many senior officer retirees who think it’s their due and take umbrage if they are not addressed as “General” or whatever. I think the choice is mine. I’ve had a doctorate for longer than some of those folks served and could care less if I’m addressed as “Doctor” or not.
Where I am NOT on the fence is with, for example, still addressing Madeleine Albright as “Madam Secretary” more than 30 years after she served as Sec’y of State. No reflection on her - just an example.

Response by SFC Bob Arnold made Dec 22 at 2019 4:53 PM

2019-12-22T16:53:50-05:00

I even call my former commanders by their first name. Even the CW5 mafia guys.

Response by PO1 Mac MacIntyre made Dec 23 at 2019 7:14 PM

2019-12-23T19:14:14-05:00

However there are not many situations where I find it appropriate, I live in a small town with not much opportunity to be at functions with retirees or active duty. I have never really liked being called "Petty Officer" even while active duty. I had lunch with a friend just last Saturday, he is a retired E-8, but I have known him and his family since he was an E-5, so it was first names.

Response by SPC(P) Estus Hibbard made Jan 17 at 2020 2:30 AM

2020-01-17T02:30:18-05:00

Category 2 as well, it should only be done when appropriate. At a unit reunion or at say a Veteran's Day ceremony by all means you can address them by rank. That might not work very well at a place of civilian employment especially if it's full of people who aren't familiar with a military rank structure, at the minimum you might get some puzzled looks from the others if you addressed someone by their rank.

Response by PO2 Tom Saldana made Jan 18 at 2020 11:59 AM

2020-01-18T11:59:50-05:00

My thought is that a veteran who served in the military long enough to retire has earned the right to be address by their rank. But if the retiree wants to be addressed by his first name who am I to contradict his wishes.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 21 at 2020 1:31 PM

2020-01-21T13:31:42-05:00

Nope!

Please don't introduce yourself to me in either your former rank, position or add on your rank (retired).

It will be the last time I speak with you if you do that.

I'm John and you are??

Response by PO2 John Driskill made Jan 22 at 2020 3:26 PM

2020-01-22T15:26:41-05:00

When I was a police officer, I arrested an old drunk retired Navy Commander for assault on his wife. The old sot demanded that I call him by his rank. "Well, Commander So & So, your under arrest for Domestic Violence." Read him his rights and told him, "Enjoy your stay in the the Harris County Jail."

Response by MSgt Thomas Gray made Jan 27 at 2020 11:17 AM

2020-01-27T11:17:15-05:00

I became a civilian employee of another agency., not DOD, after retirement. We were all hired at the same GS rate but a few of the retired officers always thought they were better than the retired enlisted even when they were sometimes less capable and did not take “advice” from technically superior people. Others were as down to earth as could be. They saw the actions of the few and seemed to de ashamed of it.

Response by TSgt Doreen Clark-Blake made Feb 4 at 2020 10:18 PM

2020-02-04T22:18:53-05:00

My boyfriend and I are retired. He was a MSgt in my unit. He retired first and then we started dating. I still call him Sergent out of respect. I use his first name sometimes, when I introduce him, for instance. That's when I feel uncomfortable. I showed him respect for 15 years, it seems wrong to stop. Also, my troops still call me by my rank. I don't demand it, they just do it.