Can a NCO get in trouble for telling a soldier not to be themselves? And can a soldier get in trouble for disrespecting an NCO?

2022-03-05T10:43:11-05:00

For talking back due to the soldier hearing they can’t be themselves at work?

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Mar 5 at 2022 11:32 AM

2022-03-05T11:32:36-05:00

What does "being themselves" entail? I would expect you to act like a soldier while you are on duty.

Response by SGM Jeff Mccloud made Mar 5 at 2022 11:53 AM

2022-03-05T11:53:48-05:00

To answer your second question first; yes UCMJ Article 91.

As to your first question, does being "themselves" include unprofessional or disrespectful behavior and/or language?

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2022 12:33 PM

2022-03-05T12:33:43-05:00

As mentioned by CPT Lawrence Cable what do you mean by your vague "Not to be Themselves"? From your training, you should know that you can get in trouble for disrespecting a NCO.

Response by SSgt Christophe Murphy made Mar 5 at 2022 1:53 PM

2022-03-05T13:53:20-05:00

Context is needed.

What does “being yourself” entail?

If being yourself includes being belligerent or bad at your job there could be issues.

If a Solider is talking back and being disrespectful to an NCO they are open to be addressed about that behavior.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Mar 5 at 2022 1:58 PM

2022-03-05T13:58:43-05:00

If the Soldiers conduct is not in concert with good order and discipline the leadership can order that the conduct or behavior that is not in concert with good order and discipline change their behavior.

As for talking back and or disrespect is definatley unauthorized. It sounds as if the military is not for you, you should look to your future somewhere that has no standards of conduct or behavior. I don’t think you will find anything short of maybe behind a computer working from home with no interaction with others. Or you check yourself and come to sone realization that every aspect of life has sone General guidelines or rules associated with personal conduct.

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2022 4:22 PM

2022-03-05T16:22:21-05:00

A no brainer getting in trouble disrespecting an NCO. Your other question is to vague and needs more explanation.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2022 5:27 PM

2022-03-05T17:27:57-05:00

So, basically you didn't answer anyone who asked for details.

If "being yourself" means not being a professional soldier, then your NCOis legally obligated to inform you to be less you.

Can you get in trouble for...... "blah blah blah" what I said to an NCO?

Hell yes. There's multiple court martials you can research if you don't believe me. You can test it out and say hello to your colleagues while you're in jail, once convicted. God knows there's only a handful of military prisons left open

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Mar 5 at 2022 5:56 PM

2022-03-05T17:56:30-05:00

Yes, yes, yes, and absolutely yes.

Soldiers are not *supposed* to be themselves. They are supposed to be SOLDIERS.

If the Soldier's "normal self" includes disrespect, laziness, unprofessional conduct, doing things "your own way," violating laws / UCMJ, or other conduct deemed not in line with good order and discipline, not only CAN an NCO tell the Soldier not to "be themself," that NCO is EXPECTED to tell the Soldier to get right.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2022 10:10 PM

2022-03-05T22:10:26-05:00

A Soldier can get in trouble for disrespecting their superiors whether an NCO or an officer. That said, any leader worth their salt will evaluate a moment of disrespect before bringing down the hammer. Is the Soldier being disrespectful or is there something going on to make them act out or behave out of the norm?

In this case according to you it looks like the NCO initiated the incident so that evaluation is not likely. The Soldier should still work on controlling themselves, you're going to have assholes for leadership. Learn to deal with that early on, be better than they are.

I can not comment on "being themselves", I would need more context. If this falls into the area of harassment or bullying then yes, an NCO can get in trouble. However, if young boots definition of being themself is being an ass-hat... Well, on the spot corrections may be warranted.

I've done umpteenth after umpteenth of NJP's and LOR's/LOC's on NCO's and Junior Enlisted for both categories. The question you need to ask yourself, or whoever this scenario is about is this, "Am I the one causing the problem?".

You didn't elaborate on "being themselves" so until you do, I in my experience know which way my thought process is leaning.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2022 9:42 PM

2022-03-06T21:42:03-05:00

Nothing additional to really contribute here.

No, the NCO in no way will get in trouble for telling a soldier to not be themselves if doing so is in line with making the soldier conduct themselves like a soldier. Even it not the case, I imagine the left right limits of an NCO to reign in the personality of a frictional PVT is going to be pretty broad, and even still if not the case the corrective action is going to be at the whims of the 1SG and Company CO.

So........... if the NCO telling the PVT to not be themselves doesn't fall in the bounds of an EO complaint then I highly suggest the PVT not be themselves while in the presence of soldiers they are not personal friends with.

If TRADOC NCO's would cite the regs more they plan to destroy PVT's with then perhaps PVT's will look up the reg on their phones the moment they get and reinforce that knowledge base.

It used to be disrespect would result in lashings, or spending every waking moment peeling potatoes. Today it's now taking away phones or weekends off post or the ability to wear civilian clothes while off duty (and it takes a judicial process and a counseling statement to execute as such).

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Mar 7 at 2022 12:10 PM

2022-03-07T12:10:10-05:00

SPC Private RallyPoint Member, it's time to get a perspective on who you are from the Army viewpoint and what you need to be doing. Based on your rank, I'm guessing you've been in the Army for a fairly short time. As a private first class, your job is to learn. Learn your MOS technical skills and knowledge. Learn your required capabilities based on your job in your assigned unit. Become proficient in all the training events necessary for your MOS. Learn about leadership from your Sergeants and Officers. Be physically fit and learn to be resilient. In short, you need to learn to be a Soldier--the best Soldier you can be.

Off hand and even disrespectful remarks by Sergeants or Officers happen. They are as human as you are and subject to pressures and frustrations you can only imagine very slightly. Best thing you can do is ignore any emotionally charged remarks and look to the substance behind what your Sergeant may have said. Under no circumstances I can think of should you show disrespect to an NCO or Officer. That's a guaranteed pathway to more trouble and potentially being forced out of the Army or court martialed.

There is a "however" attached to my opinion statement: if an NCO or Officer displays repeated disrespectful behaviors toward you based on your race, religion, national origin, sexual preference/orientation, or age then you must report this behavior to your EO NCO or Officer. There's probably notices about these types of behaviors posted on unit bulletin boards, web sites, etc. If you choose to make such a report, it's wise to have documented proof of such behaviors including witness statements.

Let me make it real simple: do your job, be a Soldier, treat everybody with respect.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 7 at 2022 12:26 PM

2022-03-07T12:26:25-05:00

Question #1:

If the Soldier in question...if their normal self is acting in a disrespectful manner....acting in a manner that violates good order and discipline....making disparaging comments, crass comments, racial comments, sexist comments....then NO the NCO will not get in trouble for telling the Soldier to stop acting "like themselves."

Question #2:

YES the Soldier can get in trouble for disrespecting an NCO. Read the Uniform Code of Military Justice, specifically Article 91.

Response by GySgt Kenneth Pepper made Mar 7 at 2022 1:16 PM

2022-03-07T13:16:27-05:00

If this question is an indication of what you mean by "being yourself", it should absolutely be squashed immediately. And "disrespect" is not a verb. "Being disrespectful" is what you meant.
Go troll somewhere else. Troll.