SGT Private RallyPoint Member 4358511 <div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>if the person who falls out during a run an that person is passing his PT test does the PLT sgt have the authority to give said counseling? 2019-02-11T10:00:34-05:00 SGT Private RallyPoint Member 4358511

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>if the person who falls out during a run an that person is passing his PT test does the PLT sgt have the authority to give said counseling?

2019-02-11T10:00:34-05:00 2019-02-11T10:00:34-05:00 MSG Private RallyPoint Member 4358519

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Sure they can. Counseling forms are for Personal/Professional and Event Oriented. I am curious as to what the counseling would say, though.

2019-02-11T10:04:05-05:00 2019-02-11T10:04:05-05:00 COL John McClellan 4358532

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Absolutely can, but I&#39;d simply check in with that Soldier and see what&#39;s going on. Maybe just a bad morning. If it were a recent trend with multiple occurrences, it might get noted in monthly performance counseling as a concern about that Soldier&#39;s fitness level. This is Team Leader / Squad Leader level stuff... If a PSG feels they need to call-out one specific fall-out... sounds like there might be more to that story? Was it a battalion or brigade or division run? Is there standing guidance about formation runs in this outfit?

2019-02-11T10:08:45-05:00 2019-02-11T10:08:45-05:00 SGT Private RallyPoint Member 4358560

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>This was a normal 4 mile run during Pt. An there was a lot of soldiers who fell out.

2019-02-11T10:20:56-05:00 2019-02-11T10:20:56-05:00 2LT Private RallyPoint Member 4358582

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Yes, a PSG can counsel any Soldier for just about anything, though usually I had team or squad leaders handle that sort of thing, and as a PSG I counseled the Squad Leader, as 1SG the PSGs, but if they have an hands on approach, it’s all good. <br />An NCO or Officer may give you any order that is legal, mortal, and ethical. They may counsel you and direct your career...and usually have good reason for doing so. <br />Generalietes asside, I have seen PSGs and PL relieved if their positions falling out of BN runs. Don’t ever quit. A counseling is not inhernatly bad, and is not punitive. It can be aggregated with other counselings to support punitive actions, but take it as a written guidance. <br />If you need help with a pt/run plan, let me or others know, and don’t get down about getting counseled. Missing the mark once is not the end of the world, and anyone can show their discipline as a Soldier and get better at any physical event by progressive training over time.

2019-02-11T10:32:32-05:00 2019-02-11T10:32:32-05:00 CSM Richard StCyr 4358597

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Yes, you failed to complete a mission. The counseling should be to inform you of the importance of maintaining your fitness and to refocus you on completing assigned tasks.. The APFT is a separate event than the PT run so it&#39;s great that you passed your APFT now keep up and complete your PT runs . <br />As for authority refer to AR 600-20,

2019-02-11T10:39:56-05:00 2019-02-11T10:39:56-05:00 LTC Jason Mackay 4358717

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Absolutely they can. 4 mile run in 36 minutes is an XVIII Airborne Corps standard. <br /><br />There is this perception that a Counseling Statement is punitive. It documents events and a way forward. It is an administrative tool. It can be used to let you know you have issues to work on. It can be used to let you know what you are doing right. It can Ben used to let you know things you don&#39;t know.

2019-02-11T11:20:30-05:00 2019-02-11T11:20:30-05:00 1SG Private RallyPoint Member 4358892

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Yes. <br />Download and read ATP 6-22.1, ADP 6-22, and ADRP 6-22. Start with 6-22-1.<br />Once you finish those, read AR 600-20.<br />These will help you understand counseling and Army leadership. You&#39;ll have the knowledge you seek.

2019-02-11T12:17:01-05:00 2019-02-11T12:17:01-05:00 SGT David T. 4359183

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>While I probably wouldn&#39;t waste the time to put that on paper, they have the right to do so. It&#39;s also possible they were told to. I have run into that a few times where I was directed to give a Soldier a counseling by higher leaders. Just try and improve and call it a day. I wouldn&#39;t really worry about it too much (unless it starts citing UCMJ articles lol).

2019-02-11T14:28:24-05:00 2019-02-11T14:28:24-05:00 SFC Private RallyPoint Member 4359227

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Anyone can counsel you for anything. It&#39;s just a written record of a conversation. A counseling statement doesn&#39;t &quot;do&quot; anything. It&#39;s not an article 15, it&#39;s not even corrective training. It&#39;s a piece of paper that says, &quot;this is what is expected of you&quot;.

2019-02-11T14:50:49-05:00 2019-02-11T14:50:49-05:00 SFC Private RallyPoint Member 4361593

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Short answer, YES!!

2019-02-12T12:01:02-05:00 2019-02-12T12:01:02-05:00 MSG Danny Mathers 4366267

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Yes, but the first question is &quot;why did you fall out?&quot; It had better been something medical! Fellow Soldiers sees someome that falls out as weak. Weak Soldiers in combat have no friends or buddies. Weak Soldiers are thought to be a traget and no one wants to be near a target. Never quit or fall out because only quitters fall out. You don&#39;t want that stigma. Opinions vary.....

2019-02-13T20:27:10-05:00 2019-02-13T20:27:10-05:00 1SG Dennis Hicks 4367335

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Sometimes its better to step back and look at the whole issue rather than pick at a small part. I have found over the years that some troops take something that in the big scheme of things is relatively small and not a big deal and turn it into something that can smack them in the head down the road. First off passing your APFT is great as long as it isn&#39;t meeting the bare minimum for pass 60 in each event. Unit runs are also important and used to determine the physical fitness of Soldiers in your command. If PVT Snuffy falls out of a run due to being ill, spraining an ankle or the damned accordion action of a large unit then once in a blue moon is no big deal and the COC will deal with it. If PVT Snuffy just doesn&#39;t feel like running and says screw it then thats a problem and needs to be documented to establish a pattern of sub standard behavior. Giving up and quitting when you feel like it is not a trait that is indicative of future leadership abilities. As for your PSG and his/her authority, you would be surprised what the SNCO in your platoon has authority to do and recommend to the leadership. This person that fell out needs to decide if he/she wants to remain in uniform and eventually become a PSG.<br />On a side note back in my day I was a young PVT/PFC that went out drinking all night, showed up at 0600 for a death run in fatigues along with many of my peers and we ran through training areas, barfing and assorted other bodily functions along with singing banned cadences and our PSG either took pity upon us and only ran us 5 miles or so. If he wanted to make sure we were good for first formation he would run us further. Any troops that fell out caused the formation to turn around and pick up the straggler. We all made it back TOGETHER and the intent of team building was understood. Those days are long gone but the intent of finishing a run as a unit still survives.

2019-02-14T07:52:04-05:00 2019-02-14T07:52:04-05:00 2019-02-11T10:00:34-05:00