Posted on Sep 2, 2020
PV2 Unit Supply Specialist
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What’s up everybody I’m pv2 jones and I been in the army a little over 9 months, I love serving until it comes to shaving. I’ve tried everything and my face bumps up terrible man I’m talking about it looks disgusting, plenty of my Drill Sgts in AIT tried teaching me how to shave but it doesn’t work. So I just got to my new unit about 2 and a half months ago and I was still shaving even though it was painful and it looked Terrible, one day an NCO From another unit told me that I NEED to go get a shaving profile because my face just looks terrible and she can tell I was in pain so I promised her I will go get one and have them check it out . After my first appointment the dermatologist gave me a permanent shaving profile and told me that I don’t need to shave atleast until my bumps are clear. So a few weeks go by and I have a little beard (still in regulation 1/4 of an inch) so After pt my squad leader pulls me to The side and starts cursing me out at the top of his lungs saying I need to shave , I told him respectfully I have a shaving profile and it hurts for me to shave he stares at me and replied Under his breath “like every other black person in the army that can’t use razors” I didn’t say anything but it kind of hurt because I don’t want to be a odd ball in my company (I’m in a infantry company btw) so later that day we go into work to clean weapons and he calls me over and apologizes about this morning and I told him it was ok he then said that I need to shave still if I want to make it in the military and I replied and told him I’m not shaving so he can F’ing forget about it he then told me since I cursed him my punishment will be to shave or receive a article for disrespecting a NCO so later I went to my barracks room and shaved during lunch and came back in he then told me that no matter what my profile says I need to listen to him and shave I told my platoon sgt about this whole Situation and he told me I need to listen to my squad leader and shave because the army just gives shaving profiles to anyone. Is this right?
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SFC Intelligence Analyst
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I'm going to address this part:

"I told him respectfully I have a shaving profile and it hurts for me to shave he stares at me and replied Under his breath “like every other black person in the army that can’t use razors” I didn’t say anything but it kind of hurt because I don’t want to be a odd ball in my company (I’m in a infantry company btw)...
---- THAT is a damn EO complaint right there. That's racist as crap I don't care what unit you're in. That was not only racist but unprofessional as hell.

...so later that day we go into work to clean weapons and he calls me over and apologizes about this morning and I told him it was ok he then said that I need to shave still if I want to make it in the military and I replied and told him I’m not shaving so he can F’ing forget about it he then told me since I cursed him my punishment will be to shave or receive a article for disrespecting a NCO so later I went to my barracks room and shaved during lunch and came back in he then told me that no matter what my profile says I need to listen to him and shave I told my platoon sgt about this whole Situation and he told me I need to listen to my squad leader and shave because the army just gives shaving profiles to anyone."
---- You shouldn't have cursed at him but I can understand the frustration. I would have taken the counseling (he can't give you UCMJ). The most he could do is a counseling and even if he tried to recommend UCMJ, no one in JAG is processing that on one counseling statement.
---- It does matter what your profile says. If I was you, I'd go to the next person higher than your squad leader so your PSG. Let them know what your squad leader is up to. If I had a punk ass squad leader like that I'd want to know. The Army doesn't give anyone profiles - medical personnel give them and no, they don't just hand them out to anyone.

You have an obvious medical issue that you're taking care of. Do NOT let any NCO ever bully you like that. Ever. If they do, you go up the next level in the chain and if it doesn't resolve you go as high as you need to until it does. I don't care what anyone else thinks. We are supposed to be professional - not treat people like they're sub-human.
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GySgt Gary Cordeiro
GySgt Gary Cordeiro
4 d
Sounds like an IG complaint to me
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PO1 David Shepardson
PO1 David Shepardson
23 h
CPO Mike Castro - Would it be proper to file a medical discharge?
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Sgt Ed Beal
Sgt Ed Beal
18 h
I would disagree a shaving profile or waver will allow you to not scrape your skin with a razor but 1/4” is well beyond what most any trimmer will do and the blades do not come in contact with the skin.
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CPO Mike Castro
CPO Mike Castro
17 h
Not sure if Pseudofolliculitis Barbae meets current medical discharge requirements. I tell you this if I was in your shoe and the squad leader didn’t write me up I’d request mast. Keep Going to medical every time your face bothers you. It will support your VA claim when you do get out.
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1SG First Sergeant
52
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Thats called an EO violation!
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CPT Carolyn Andrews
CPT Carolyn Andrews
1 mo
Also harrassment.
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CPT Carolyn Andrews
CPT Carolyn Andrews
1 mo
SSG Paul Headlee
Yes, because a profile comes from the CMDR of the Medical Unit.
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SSG Paul Headlee
SSG Paul Headlee
1 mo
CPT Carolyn Andrews I agree with you in spirit Ma'am but see the comments of COL Victor H Harris below. I wasn't versed in the actual mechanics of the process.
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SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
SMSgt Lawrence McCarter
1 mo
The shaving waiver IS medical Treatment and NOT optional but an order from the Medical unit. The Doctor can and often does have a piece of anyone that tries to interfere with Hi orders, I have seen that happen. As long s standard are met and by the Patient, (Yes patient as I said this is a medical Treatment) The person that thinks they can counter a Military Doctors advice may find themselves with a penalty for their own poor approach and themselves be subject to the UCMJ. In addition the Equal Opportunity people as well as the IG, Inspector General should be capable of stressing the point to them if it even get that far. Some of this is lack of understanding why the waiver was need and the PATIENT should NOT have to pay for the ignorance of another. It also seems the response from His Supervisor wasn't in any way proper and He doesn't have to like it, these are ORDERS from the Doctor and He isn't qualified to make medical judgements.
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COL Commander
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You have a profile you need to follow it. But you need to make sure you keep it within the regulations of the profile (1/4 inch). Only your commander can override the doctor’s “recommendation” for the profile. Has your commander signed/approved the profile? If you haven’t, you need to get that done. When he/she signs it you can mention the problem you have with your NCOs. Good luck.
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SFC Wilfredo Ramos
SFC Wilfredo Ramos
1 mo
COL (Join to see) - AR are clear (Request reviews and reconsiderations of physical profiles). You request a review and reconsideration Commanders do not change a medical profile. I've been there and CPTs look like PVTs when a Medical Facility Commander a COL breaks them to pieces.
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SGT Tim. Wilson
SGT Tim. Wilson
1 mo
COL (Join to see) Sir, I agree Command needs to be notified of all things. That is a given, plain and simple!
As to your “No work before lunch,” that’s funny! But my question is what of actual “medical” profiles? That are legitimate, do those service members still have a place to serve?
Just curious on your thoughts.
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SSG Elyzabeth Cromer
SSG Elyzabeth Cromer
1 mo
SGT Tim. Wilson I am addressing Army profiles here as they are the only ones I have experience with; when a service member receives a permanent profile (as opposed to a temporary profile 90 days or less renewable up to three times, total 360 days) limiting their ability to perform their duty, it requires the signature of two medical providers, one of which must be at least an O4. Additionally the SM is required to be referred to the MOS Administrative Retention Review (MAR2) the process that replaced the MMRB. To determine if the SM is capable of performing their current MOS, should be reclassed, or referred to the Medical Evaluation Board for probable discharge. Many SM's with legitimate profiles continue to serve, and even deploy. I say this with certainty as a former MMRB Coordinator, and the person who developed the initial MAR2 program for the National Guard in my State, in other words not just a barracks lawyer.
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SGT Tim. Wilson
SGT Tim. Wilson
1 mo
SSG Elyzabeth Cromer Thank you for the information, but what does that do for the Soldier that still wants to Serve his Country but because he has a legitimate medical reason he can’t perform his current MOS?
Back in my day, I saw guys who were still able to serve in some way, willing to change their MOS, but pushed to a MMRB and unceremoniously dropped from the military! Of course this was long before 9/11 which changed a lot of things. IMO!
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