Can leadership go through a barracks room without the SM under the guise of a "barracks check"?

2018-09-13T08:31:09-04:00

I've read a few other posts about barracks inspections, but I couldn't find what applies to the situation that was brought up to me. A SM that trusts me came up to me and told me that on several occasions their barracks room was open. Now, this barracks is a "suite" style where there is a shared common area, but the sleeping areas have separate doors/locks. On more than one occasion they have gotten off work to walk into the common area to find the door to their sleeping area wide open. Later that day they found out that their 1SG did a "barracks check" while ALL the SM were at work, with no notification to the SM's. This feels terribly wrong to me. As a junior enlisted I was always notified (even if only minutes before) that a barracks inspection was taking place. Can leadership go through a barracks room without the SM under the guise of a "barracks check"?

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2018 8:46 AM

2018-09-13T08:46:29-04:00

Having just reviewed the 1SGs Barracks Program Handbook, I could not find anything specific abut inspections being conducted with the Soldiers absent. There is mention of acceptance/termination of barracks inspections where the Soldier, Platoon Sergeant and 1SG will all be present. But that is is. But, that is not to say what the 1SG did was right. My 1SG here at my unit will NOT do any routine inspections without the occupant present. And if they cannot be present (mission, medical appt, etc.) then they are put on hold until such time as they can be present.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2018 11:06 AM

2018-09-13T11:06:43-04:00

When I was at Bragg the guidance was that JAG required the SM to be present in order for them to be held accountable for anything found. I believe the line of reasoning was that a SM could claim the contraband was placed there while the door was left open.
This isn't something I verified in writing, only the explanation a 1SG gave to me.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2018 7:34 PM

2018-09-13T19:34:11-04:00

I ran into that same situation here with one of my previous detachment sergeants. I consulted with JAG and they said the only way they can go through a SM room is for a legitimate health and welfare inspection or furniture inspection. Even the furniture inspection thing is kind of a gray line. Because like someone else mentioned earlier, that SM could mention something was missing or damaged after someone went through their room with them being present. Some leaders think that because a Soldier lives in the barracks that they can go in their room whenever they want whether the SM is there or not. A GOOD leader would already know to check with JAG before doing something like that. With that all said, there’s no reason to go through a SM room without them there unless it’s for a health and welfare check or they have some kind of warrant or probably cause to do so.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2018 7:38 PM

2018-09-13T19:38:41-04:00

Sounds like I need to direct one of the NCO’s to JAG and get this sorted out. Thank you everyone for the help!

Response by 1SG Timothy Trewin made Sep 14 at 2018 7:01 AM

2018-09-14T07:01:58-04:00

I am pretty sure they can’t go in without informing the SM and having them there. The exception would be health and welfare inspections, but that would involve MPs and they commander would need to have probable cause in order to order one of those.

Response by CPL Terra Karas made Sep 18 at 2018 6:51 PM

2018-09-18T18:51:45-04:00

Unfortunately they can. This happened several times to me, though usually I was present and informed. However, it is up to the chain of command as to the when and how.
I had a surprise inspection on a room that I did not even inhabit, unfortunately my room mate had been a complete slob and I had to go and supervise the cleaning

Response by LTC Ray B. (Ret) made Mar 5 at 2019 6:29 PM

2019-03-05T18:29:40-05:00

Barracks belong to the Commander not the spldier. If you want privacy GTF out.

Response by SFC David Hoernlen made May 11 at 2019 5:09 AM

2019-05-11T05:09:38-04:00

I understand your point however, you have to look at the situation from a different view. You are in essence government property as is your housing regardless of the type I.e. barracks or family housing. It is the leaderships responsibility to maintain said housing. Random inspections will occur when directed by the commander and are executed by the NCO's I.e. 1SG and Platoon NCO's. When properly conducted there will always be more than 1 NCO in each room for verification of the inspection findings. Generally it is designed for the purpose of identifying hazards and ensuring the safety,health and welfare of the occupants. With that being said, the room should have been secured upon departure and if done as a command directive properly you wouldn't have even known about it.

Response by GySgt Kenneth Pepper made Jun 21 at 2019 4:37 PM

2019-06-21T16:37:51-04:00

I'm trying to understand what "under the guise of" means. If the 1SGT did a unaccompanied inspection how is that hiding anything? There should be no expectation of privacy. If they have something that needs to be under lock and key they should have a locker or similar to house those types of things. Other than that they shouldn't have anything they aren't willing to own up to.
Next question would be is there a reason this might be happening? Have there been a high number of discipline problems, drug test failures, etc.,?
That being said, I never conducted these type of inspections. I would rather have the SM present to answer directly for anything found.

Response by SGT M. C. made Aug 21 at 2019 9:18 PM

2019-08-21T21:18:33-04:00

Isn't this a physical security problem?

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 1 at 2019 11:26 PM

2019-12-01T23:26:01-05:00

Leadership can perform a "Health and Welfare'" inspection to ensure the room/living space is kept at a minimum level of cleanliness and order. This is for the safety of the Soldier and those who share the common living areas with the Soldier. Typically a "disinterested party", such as MP or other person accompanies the leadership team. The "disinterested party" is there to ensure that nothing is taken from the room, that nothing is placed into the room, and that the basic tenants of what is and is not authorized in the room, such as hot plates, toaster ovens, illegal drug paraphernalia, etc, IAW posted guidance and regulation.

Questions regarding this type of inspection should be vetted and coordinated through the IG or post legal offices by the leadership team to ensure the inspection is properly conducted.

Response by SPC(P) Brandon Jenkins made Apr 24 at 2020 6:17 PM

2020-04-24T18:17:21-04:00

I thought that was just the way it was.

Response by MSgt Neil Greenfield made Apr 24 at 2020 11:13 PM

2020-04-24T23:13:06-04:00

I remember when I was in the Army, stationed in West Berlin at Andrews Barracks in the early 1980's. In the middle of the night, the MPs would come in unannounced with sniffer dogs looking for drugs. I just took a look at the dogs and the handlers and rolled over and went back to sleep.

Response by SFC Herve Abrams made Apr 24 at 2020 11:29 PM

2020-04-24T23:29:11-04:00

Check installation commander’s policies. There may be something covering that situation.

Response by MAJ Ronnie Reams made May 21 at 2020 11:06 AM

2020-05-21T11:06:51-04:00

I should think the barracks guard would report to any inspectors and accompany them and secure any doors after inspection. That why they are there!

Response by MAJ Damajah Arnold made Jun 22 at 2020 7:30 PM

2020-06-22T19:30:27-04:00

There’s a difference between a search and an inspection. A search is looking for something and an inspection is looking at something. Unless the rules have changed in the last 100 years, the 4th Amendment protects us from UNREASONABLE search without probable cause or reasonable suspicion, or a warrant. However, government property, and soldiers are subject to inspection at any time by anyone in their chain-of-command, or people appointed to conduct inspections, such as the Staff Duty Officer, Field Officer of the Day, Charge of Quarters, Sergeant of the Guard, and the list goes on. Searches are for evidence, and inspections are for readiness, health, and welfare.

Response by SGT Dennis Bolin made Jul 3 at 2021 9:34 PM

2021-07-03T21:34:55-04:00

We had a situation we’re we did a barracks check and the soldier who later was convicted of check cashing fraud and AWOL had a 9mm in his locker. With theses knuckle heads coming in today it’s for the safety of all soldiers. 3 /69 AR 1992

Response by SGT Thomas Carter made Aug 4 at 2021 1:58 AM

2021-08-04T01:58:14-04:00

Yes. When I was in AIT we new that there was a barracks every week at a specific time and we were not to be in are rooms when the barracks were being inspected.
Also when I was in under the regulations a barracks by command as long as the "inspection" was done the same for all the individuals that were being "inspected". I will also say that when I was stationed at Fort Meade, someone took a VCR that was used extensively by the CQ at night. They did a barracks check but did no inspection for those soldiers that lived in base housing and off base.

Response by SP5 Ronald Gerhart made Aug 21 at 2021 4:58 PM

2021-08-21T16:58:50-04:00

“Your in the Army now, your not behind a plow” etc… Military duty has never been a democracy.

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made Jun 21 at 2023 12:00 AM

2023-06-21T00:00:26-04:00

It is an Army barracks, not a Motel 6

Response by PO1 Robert Ryan made Jul 31 at 2023 9:54 AM

2023-07-31T09:54:26-04:00

is there still signs at entrances to military installations that anyone enter this base is subject to inspection and search and seizure.