Can refusing to sign an NCOER hurt a NCOs career?

Fri, 03 Dec 2021 14:29:45 -0500

If an NCO doesn't agree with their rating and bullets for their NCOER and refuses to sign, what can the possible outcomes be for that NCOs and their career?

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2021 2:33 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Dec 2021 14:33:36 -0500

CSM Charles Hayden SGM Steve Wettstein let us ask an E-9.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2021 2:51 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Dec 2021 14:51:29 -0500

Can't speak for Army, and I never refused to sign. The guidance from above with USMC Sr. Enlisted was to sign, but always file a rebuttal. At least your side of it all is in your record. It was the Reviewing Officer's job to amplify comments and markings of the Reporting Senior. The Boards consider all things that matter.

Response by SFC Stephen King made Dec 3 at 2021 2:54 PM

SFC Stephen King — Fri, 03 Dec 2021 14:54:24 -0500

https://asktop.net/q-and-a/what-does-my-signature-mean-on-the-ncoer/

Here is my take refusal to sign will be documented and it could show a pattern. I rated numerous NCOs throughout my career, one SGT refused to sign. The BLUF is my rater a CSM instilled some knowledge and it was signed. So do what your career can handle. You always have the opportunity to submit a rebuttal to the board if you feel it has a negative effect on your promotion or professional growth.

Q&a | AskTOP.net - Leader Development for Army Professionals

AR 623-3paragraph 2-10b(5) Review and sign the evaluation report after it has been completed by the senior rater before departing from aunit of assignment

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2021 3:50 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Dec 2021 15:50:19 -0500

1. Signing has nothing to do with the ratings, it’s verifying the admin data
2. If you disagree with the ratings, I’d ask if there are counselings that go with those ratings
3. If you have evidence that you outperformed those bullets, consider a rebuttal
4. Have you tried having a conversation with your rater to gain clarity on the issues?

My advice- sign it. If you have substantiating evidence to back up a rebuttal, rebuttal. Either way, engage in the dialogue and listen to understand not defend. You may hear something you need to in order to grow.

I just had one of these conversations. They aren’t fun, they aren’t comfortable, but they’re necessary on the path to self-improvement.

Stay humble, stay hungry.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Dec 3 at 2021 9:33 PM

SGM Erik Marquez — Fri, 03 Dec 2021 21:33:31 -0500

"NCOER and refuses to sign"
The rated SM can do anything they want.
They can not however justify the refusal and prevent negative consequences for their action.

If one of my NCO's refused to sign his NCOER, Id take the time to review further, research, speak to the rater and senior rater. Then speak to the NCO, Id lay out what the regulation states, explain that signing it is like signing a speeding ticket. Your not agreeing to what it said you did (or did not do)
You agree you got it and that the admin data is correct. Id give said NCO 24 hours to consider the issue and information presented, then have the rater meet with the NCO again. If he still refused to sign, Id process the NCOER as required and then work on that NCO's administrative punishment and separation packet personally in an effort to rid the Army of a NCO who is unable to use even basic logical reasoning, listening skills and basic research skills to understand why they are in the wrong.

Response by SFC Don Lawrence made Dec 4 at 2021 4:50 PM

SFC Don Lawrence — Sat, 04 Dec 2021 16:50:10 -0500

It shows the NCO is stupid. Signing the NCOER is verification of admin data only. It is not an agreement with the rating. People seem to forget this. Not signing shows the NCO is a dumbass.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 8 at 2021 10:52 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Dec 2021 22:52:03 -0500

This goes in line with a Soldier not signing a counseling. Before a Soldier refuses to sign they should
1. Ask for the counselings to back up the rating. To clarify the bullets.
2. You have a senior rater, nothing wrong with engaging them about it.
3. A supplementary reviewer is there as well. Speak with them if you feel the need is warranted.
4. A rater and rated Soldier shouldn’t take anything above personally, a NCOER/OER shouldn’t be a vendetta.
There are many ways to address a grievance with a rating that’s appropriate. Also make sure you understand the rating scheme before you roll up half cocked on people. Regulations exist for a reason. If a Soldier has a real issue don’t just give them the “just sign it and we will address it.” Set time aside to address it.