Can senior NCO’s make soldiers drive from home to a duty during harsh conditions such as frozen roads?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 18:50:50 -0500

Is there a regulation on this kind of stuff. I understand that a duty must be preformed such as CQ and Staff Duty. However in my mind it’s very dangerous to have soldiers who live 15+ minutes away from post to preform such duties when they can have someone who lives on base preform it. And have their duties switched up. Is there any regulation on this.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2021 7:43 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 19:43:30 -0500

My former.commander ordered me to come in during a snow storm, I ended up hitting black ice and rolling my truck, lucky for me. I wasn't badly injured .Even good commanders make bad decisons.

Response by SSG Dale London made Feb 14 at 2021 8:36 PM

SSG Dale London — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 20:36:21 -0500

It isn't a regulation it's the law - the UCMJ. It is an offense for you to be absent from duty without leave. The law makes no allowance for weather.
So, legally, yes. You can be required to travel through dangerous conditions to report for duty. Your authority to live off base will necessarily be conditioned on your being available on time. If you are supposed to be on duty and you fail to report without permission (regardless of the reason) you are AWOL.
Now for the reality check. What you ought to do if you are at home off post and you believe that travelling would be dangerous, call your PSG, TL or whomever you answer to. Let them know LONG BEFORE you are required to be on duty or as soon as you discover you will not be able to make it in on time. Let them know the situation with as much lead time as possible so they can sort out a replacement for you if necessary.
Any NCO worth his salt will take extenuating circumstances into account so long as you do not have a history of malingering or being a discipline problem. Adjustments can be made so long as they have time to do so especially as they need to let the COC know if they have given you permission to either miss duty or report late.
Best solution: if you see the weather turning bad and you suspect that it may interfere with your ability to report on time, grab your A & B bags and go to your unit while you can. Bed down there while weather is still permitting. It may be a pain in the ass but you should score some major brownie points for taking initiative and being reliable. You will also avoid pissing off your boss -- which is always a good thing.

Response by SPC Robert Hendrickson made Feb 14 at 2021 9:22 PM

SPC Robert Hendrickson — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 21:22:52 -0500

only in a safe situation and if an emergency arises. Otherwise don't put soldiers at risk or the leaders, either

Response by SSG Brian G. made Feb 14 at 2021 9:24 PM

SSG Brian G. — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 21:24:15 -0500

You have a duty on a specific date and time you are expected to be there. No there is no regulation to what you speak or are seeking. Command can make exceptions but we are all grownups and expected to be aware of the hazards and how to mitigate them to be where we are supposed to be.

The military did not issue us wives and families. We chose those.

Response by SPC Robert Hendrickson made Feb 14 at 2021 9:24 PM

SPC Robert Hendrickson — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 21:24:15 -0500

yes.. called common sense..think about safety,,alternate resources,,etc..

Response by MAJ Byron Oyler made Feb 14 at 2021 9:52 PM

MAJ Byron Oyler — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 21:52:05 -0500

Does the enemy stop when the weather gets scary? Is it fair to the soldier that lives closer to duty location to pull someone's duty that does not live so close? As a leader I would suggest to the soldier that is concerned about driving in weather to see if someone lives closer would be willing to switch. Each soldier made decisions on where to live and that does not change duty requirements. I drove 90 miles in snow and rain today because of my paramedic job. People still need help and I am the one that chose this profession. The only regulation that exists in regard to your question is command authority, nothing is written that automatically gets you out of duty in bad weather.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Feb 14 at 2021 10:36 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 22:36:31 -0500

Bluntly, Yes. It was their choice to live off-post, if it is their turn at duty, then its their turn. You know that they have the right to move him into the barracks unless married and even if married they can move him temporarily into the billets as punishment or to ensure that the SM is present for duty on time.

Response by SSG Greg Miech made Feb 14 at 2021 11:23 PM

SSG Greg Miech — Sun, 14 Feb 2021 23:23:06 -0500

For some living off post is required like married or single NCOs. Driving when roads are considered Red as a safety indicator the soldier should not risk it. It is a judgement call and the person might come later in the day when roads clear.

Response by GySgt Kenneth Pepper made Feb 15 at 2021 11:05 AM

GySgt Kenneth Pepper — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 11:05:35 -0500

Are you seriously asking for guidance on pawning off standing duty to the guys in the barracks because you have to drive 15 minutes? Do you not realize that is a morale killer?
If you are on the duty roster you know when and where you are supposed to be well in advance. Make the necessary arrangements, even if that includes getting up and going in earlier. Don't expect someone else to cover for you.
You made a decision that led you to living off post, whether it was marriage or something else. You must accept the responsibility that goes along with it. I bet most of the guys & gals in the barracks would kill to move off post, even if it meant driving a few miles in bad weather every now and then.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2021 11:51 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 11:51:31 -0500

It's your turn it's your turn. How much do you hate it when you get same day notice of a 24 hr duty? Now make it soley because you live in the barracks. That's messed up. That's why joe makes horrible marriage decisions to get out of the barracks. You wouldn't give those icy roads a second thought to drive 15 minutes to bang your favorite porn star, but you need to get to work and all of a sudden it's holy risk assessment batman!

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Feb 15 at 2021 12:30 PM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 12:30:50 -0500

Yes, they absolutely can. ESPECIALLY when a duty roster is pre-published. If you know you have duty on a specific day or at a specific time, it is YOUR responsibility to ensure that you are there. If that means leaving 2 hours early and driving super slow and cautious, so be it. If that means leaving before a storm and hanging out on post until your duty starts, so be it. If that means swapping with a Soldier who can get there conveniently, so be it. But it is YOUR responsibility.

That being said... Safety IS a concern for leaders at all levels, and should be taken into consideration when the mission allows. For something predictable like Staff Duty or CQ, there should be no need for anyone to adjust the duty roster - you can figure out how to get there in time (or do a swap with a battle buddy). But for last minute details, common sense should prevail. But remember, if that senior NCO tags barracks folks for that last minute area beautification detail, you have absolutely no ammo to argue when he makes all of the non-barracks folks stay late on Friday evening to do a different last minute detail - that is only balancing things out.

Response by SGT Lorenzo Nieto made Feb 15 at 2021 7:00 PM

SGT Lorenzo Nieto — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 19:00:30 -0500

It sucks but you singed up for it, look at it this way you fail you show up someone else gets stuck with extra duty not cool.

Response by SGT Lorenzo Nieto made Feb 15 at 2021 7:03 PM

SGT Lorenzo Nieto — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 19:03:01 -0500

Think about this you fail to show up for duty some one else my not be able to go home, not cool

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2021 9:00 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 21:00:14 -0500

I had duty as the BN Staff Duty Officer and I was required to come in a day earlier to avoid the bad weather. They can also do the same for you. Be cautious. Saying only those on post can perform staff duty is singling out those in barracks. You can always try to trade the shift or just go.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2021 10:10 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 22:10:14 -0500

If that was the case of switching than the hospital would only have the barracks Soldiers work during red or black road conditions every time.

Response by SGT Philip Keys made Feb 15 at 2021 10:42 PM

SGT Philip Keys — Mon, 15 Feb 2021 22:42:10 -0500

Either cover your assigned day, switch, or pay someone to cover it. Pretty weak attempt at getting out of duty.

Response by SPC Cathy Goessman made Feb 16 at 2021 8:22 AM

SPC Cathy Goessman — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 08:22:33 -0500

Given the current situation, I don’t think it’s unreasonable to have a barracks soldier cover down for a few hours while the plows get through or it lightens up enough to see ice clearly. There is some serious snow and ice where it’s unusual to see it right now.

Now if it’s in Colorado or someplace like that people should be prepared to report for duty despite bad road conditions.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 16 at 2021 10:07 AM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 10:07:48 -0500

Sorry... there are 3 rules to being successful in the military. RIGHT PLACE RIGHT TIME RIGHT UNIFORM. Instead of looking for a way to sham this you could be proactive by leaving a bit earlier or finding some temp housing on post for a few days (Mil hotel). You choose to live off post don't cry for a risk assessment now. It is a bit telling that this was put out for discussion by a SPC. Sham on solider... Sham on!

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Feb 16 at 2021 2:00 PM

Lt Col Jim Coe — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 14:00:34 -0500

There's several things to consider.
-First, it's your choice to live off base. You're expected to show up for duty at the appointed time with the correct uniform and equipment. Leave early!
-A fifteen minute commute doesn't seem very long.
-The Base might be closed except to mission essential personnel due to weather. The essentiality of your duty is up to your supervisor. Be sure to check the installation web page where closure information is often posted. Also check with your supervisor.
-Scheduling people for duty based on their marital status, age, rank (in some cases), residence location, and many other things is a rabbit hole most supervisors don't want to go down. There's no bottom and they could end up with an EO complaint.
-If you sincerely believe it is unsafe for you to attempt to travel to the base, or if law enforcement has closed roads between your home and the base, you should contact your supervisor immediately.

Response by TSgt Denise Moody made Feb 16 at 2021 2:23 PM

TSgt Denise Moody — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 14:23:27 -0500

Another reason to not allow military members to live off base. Your choice to live off base. Getting permission used to include the understanding that you would still be responsible to be at your duty station on time. When I lived off base, as a single airman, I still had to come in early for a week of dorm duty. I didn't live there, but I was still responsible for that week.

If the weather is looking bad your best choices would be to leave early, or get in touch with someone who is willing to swap duty with you. Then get permission for that swap. Or move back on base.

Response by CMSgt John Reeves made Feb 16 at 2021 2:28 PM

CMSgt John Reeves — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 14:28:31 -0500

If you are considered key and essential personnel yes they can. You leave early and do it safely.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Feb 16 at 2021 7:28 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 19:28:01 -0500

No one made you live off base

Response by Cpl Vic Burk made Feb 16 at 2021 8:00 PM

Cpl Vic Burk — Tue, 16 Feb 2021 20:00:03 -0500

There are two sides to a coin. Yes, you can be expected to report for duty as assigned. I got stuck with plenty of duties when other someone didn't show up just because I happen to be in the barracks and not drunk. It sucked be singled out to do this. The "no show" would get office hours (article 15) and a couple times part of the sentence was not only the fine but also having to stand my next two duties (the company commander was enlisted at one time, that helped, he understood).

The other side of the coin is find someone, anyone to swap duties with you (with approval of course) or pay them to take it for you (I never paid anyone to take mine but I let them pay me to take theirs!). Even offer to do an extra duty. If you can't find anyone, unless you want to violate and be AWOL, find a way to get in there even if you have to walk.

Response by SFC Melvin Brandenburg made Feb 17 at 2021 10:23 PM

SFC Melvin Brandenburg — Wed, 17 Feb 2021 22:23:00 -0500

If roads are red, no. If roads are green or yellow, yes. Also, if you know weather conditions ahead of time, the responsible thing to do is to request quarters on post/in barracks/temporary lodging through your CoC so that you can be present for duty. It isn't fair to others to not be there. If you can be there, and you make a small sacrifice to do that, all the better for taking care of your buddies and your commitment to your duties.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 17 at 2021 10:55 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 17 Feb 2021 22:55:23 -0500

Yes. Yes they can.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made Feb 17 at 2021 11:07 PM

LTC Jason Mackay — Wed, 17 Feb 2021 23:07:29 -0500

You report for duty. Also, if someone no shows for duty the next person on the roster pulls it. Unless they were injured, involuntarily incapacitated, or stuck in a serial killer’s pit putting lotion on its skin otherwise it gets the hose again, the assigned person should be considered for UCMJ.

Regulation on duty rosters is AR220-45, roster should be on a DA6.

If you were called in without notice they have to work with you on arrival. Outgoing person stays until relieved.

Substitute “duty” with “alert” or “muster” and the result is the same. Weather is only a consideration. It will not prevent duty. Ft Carson occasionally has weather where non essential personnel stay home. Commanders decide who is essential. Shift and duty personnel are always essential.

Response by SFC David Xanten made Feb 20 at 2021 12:41 PM

SFC David Xanten — Sat, 20 Feb 2021 12:41:10 -0500

I had an E-4 that would always go home to Maine from Fort Devens each weekend if he had no duty that weekend. In the winter, however, he sometimes didn't return until mid-week because he got snowed in and would call the 1SGT to tell him he couldn't make it back to base because of the weather. That went on for about 3 Weeks until I told him he couldn't go home unless he could get back by 7 AM on Monday. He went to the CO and was told the same thing. End of story. He started getting back Sunday night. Strange how things change when you HAVE to do something.

Response by 1SG Harold Piet made Feb 23 at 2021 10:55 AM

1SG Harold Piet — Tue, 23 Feb 2021 10:55:24 -0500

Sr NCO's are required to make tough decisions, most of them consider all aspects before making it. If you are told to go to work, go to work. This is the army, not the YMCA. we are expected to operate in bad conditions.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Feb 23 at 2021 11:07 AM

CW3 Kevin Storm — Tue, 23 Feb 2021 11:07:04 -0500

Road conditions suck, it is your day for the duty, get up earlier, or call to let them know you are heading slow as the road conditions are poor. Thinking some one who lives closer should pull your duty...be thankful you are in now and not 20-40 years ago, your team mates would have had a conex counseling session with you.

Response by Cpl Tyler Therrien made Feb 23 at 2021 12:42 PM

Cpl Tyler Therrien — Tue, 23 Feb 2021 12:42:38 -0500

if someone was shooting at your ass would you worry about road conditions? Look at everything through that lens and it will answer much

Response by SMSgt Bob Wilson made Feb 23 at 2021 8:45 PM

SMSgt Bob Wilson — Tue, 23 Feb 2021 20:45:04 -0500

The magic words are: "Are you mission essential"? The regulations will be local; written and signed by the installation commander. At your grade, there is an option--move you into the barracks.

Response by A1C Stanley Kolakowski made Feb 24 at 2021 6:19 AM

A1C Stanley Kolakowski — Wed, 24 Feb 2021 06:19:24 -0500

1. Last I checked, most storms aren't discriminatory - they affect the base areas (post) and surrounding areas (ie, off-post) equally.

And, when I was in, my dorm room (AF favored "barracks billet") was considered my "home".

Therefore, my first counter question is: If it's "so unsafe" for the off-post SM to travel from "home" to "duty station", what's going to make it so much safer for the on-post SM to travel from "home" to "duty station"?

2. Again, last I checked, most Officers and NCOs (senior or not) expect their SMs to take "any means necessary" to both be in position to and to perform their duties. And aren't you Army types actually conditioned / trained to perform "long" (as in 15+ minutes of driving "long") marches in adverse weather conditions - and issued to gear to do so?

Therefore, second counter question: Why aren't you marching to your duty if usage of your POV is "unsafe"? (oh, for the record, the reason I said "all NCOs" is that my E5 SSGT told me that I was expected to use any and all methods to traverse the 2+ desert miles from my dorm room to my duty station on a "daily" basis - and if my POV was unavailable and I did not wish to use the unit-provided courtesy transportation, I was always able to walk ("march") to the building - in any weather condition.)

3. Apply the infamous "how would I feel" rule to the situation. If a SM 30+ minutes of driving time away was to "pull" the unsafe travel card, and TPTB decided that it was safe enough for you (and your 15+ minutes of travel time) to go in on short/no notice and tabbed you for the replacement duty, what would you expect to happen?

Response by SSG Russell Busicchia made Mar 6 at 2021 10:48 AM

SSG Russell Busicchia — Sat, 06 Mar 2021 10:48:02 -0500

I must admit that this never happened to me in 20 of years of active service. However, I was assgned to the Garrison S1 in Virginia when we had what the locals a bad snow storm (about 6 inches of snow and ice. I went to the HQ, I was the only one who came in. I received a call from the LT who was schedule to be the SDO that the roads were iced over and that he would be late. I ran the duty roster and told him to get there as soon as he could. I relied the SDO and SDNCO and continued on with my day. Until the LT came in that afternoon I was the only one in the command group. I laughed about it because I'm from NY and am used to much more snow that we got. Yo answer your question, this is the Army we do our job regardless of weather conditions.

Response by MSgt Allen Chandler made Mar 14 at 2021 10:29 AM

MSgt Allen Chandler — Sun, 14 Mar 2021 10:29:09 -0400

It's called leadership And taking responsibility. In the military Whenever there's a job to be done Has to say to him or herself, "Is this mission worth dying over?" It's not just combat, His training, And every day jobs. Safety is a big part of every military mission. The senior NCO In this scenario house to make the decision. If he or she is wrong Then the Higher ups will have to deal with it. But you better damn well make sure you're in the right Before you disobey in order.

Response by SSG Ray Elliott made Mar 14 at 2021 12:36 PM

SSG Ray Elliott — Sun, 14 Mar 2021 12:36:19 -0400

In my civilian job in Western NY stuck in the path of lake effect snow between Lake Erie, and Lake Ontario I worked for the County DOT. I got called out at all hours of the night to work out on the road, it didn't matter what the road conditions were, we were essential personnel and had to get there. We were the ones responsible for making the roads safe for everyone else. Keep good tires on your vehicle, and leave early so you can drive slowly. Unless the local government declares the roads closed to all traffic you are probably going to have to show up for your assigned duty.

Response by SGT Jon Goldsberry made Mar 18 at 2021 7:18 PM

SGT Jon Goldsberry — Thu, 18 Mar 2021 19:18:21 -0400

Do you call off the war because of bad weather? This may be old school thinking but, suck it up! Living off base is a priveledge that can be pulled any time. Commands can "pull the pass " for many reasons. I have driven through some really bad stuff just to get to morning formation only to be told go home. In upstate new York, I shoveled to get to my car and had to shovel to get back to my house. Weather happens. In today's world it is rarely a surprise. I had a guy working for me once (civilian time) who called me to tell me he wouldn't be able to come to work the next day. Not a snowflake had fallen yet despite the forcast for the next day. I didn't accept it. He tried to call in sick the next morning so I asked for a DR. note. He was pissed. I ended up getting behind him in traffic and followed him to the store. Roads weren't as bad as predicted. (I fired him later that day for the extremely nasty voicemail he left me. Lol)

Bottom line is, the Armed services don't stop because of weather. Dress accordingly and do your duty.

Response by CPT William Jones made Mar 21 at 2021 4:14 PM

CPT William Jones — Sun, 21 Mar 2021 16:14:03 -0400

Another case off poor planning. Seldom in the States do es the weatherman miss reall bad weather coming in. So being alert, cunning, and sly drive in ahead of weather and sleep on post. I had OD one cold snowy nigh in Germany snowed all day and night. (6 inches on top of mycar between midnight and 0600 measured)

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 27 at 2021 1:29 PM

Maj John Bell — Sat, 27 Mar 2021 13:29:56 -0400

Yes. Are their weather forecasts for your duty station? Be proactive and do what is necessary.
_Go in before the weather hits.
_Leave early so you can drive in at a safe speed.
_Un-ass your pack and hump in

If you are supposed be there, be there.

P.S. The word is performed, not preformed.

Response by CPT William Jones made Mar 29 at 2021 2:26 PM

CPT William Jones — Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:26:32 -0400

Actually senior NCO's dont make anyone do anything. They simply follow the Comanding Officers orders. Some or standing some are issued verbally or in writing throughout the day. No the CO doesnttell the 1st SGT to hold routine formations before each one but it is the COs wishes being carried out.

Response by SGT Juan Robledo made Apr 3 at 2021 7:19 PM

SGT Juan Robledo — Sat, 03 Apr 2021 19:19:11 -0400

During inclement weather the Command has protocols it follows for the safety of the soldiers, your still responsible for calling in and giving them your status

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 4 at 2021 8:14 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 04 Apr 2021 08:14:45 -0400

I'm a little late to the party here but I had say this idea simply isn't fair and equitable. Many units have abused the idea of grabbing up someone who lives in the barracks for a "quick" task simply because they live closer. When we get stationed somewhere as a married Soldier, or if you have enough rank, we make the decision on where to live, either on or off base, and even how far from base. None of that should be a factor in distribution of duty, whether it be regular duty days or additional task such as CQ/ staff duty.

If it was to become a unit policy that during bad weather someone who resided off post would be swapped off duty for someone who lived in the barracks what do you think would begin to happen? Those in the barracks would marry the first person they found willing, often resulting a whole other host of issues.

Response by Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis made Apr 5 at 2021 12:12 PM

Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis — Mon, 05 Apr 2021 12:12:06 -0400

Sometimes it sucks to be the Sr. NCO. There you are; you need to get a facility staffed and not a lot of either time or personnel to do it. The CO wants it and it needs to get done. On top of that, you cannot do it yourself (for very practical reasons). Moreover, this is the regular duty. Nothing special, just per the position descriptions. Nobody's getting a medal for doing this, it's the expectation. Finally, the weather sucks; it sucks hard rocks! What are you going to do?

The reason that somebody on the post cannot do this might be related to would be best to do this duty. Don't forget, living off post is a something you asked for. It's Not to use as an excuse to be exempted from these duties.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Apr 5 at 2021 1:24 PM

CW3 Kevin Storm — Mon, 05 Apr 2021 13:24:41 -0400

So you are proposing, indirectly, that the troop in the barracks gets screwed, because you can't drive? Nice guy...not!

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Apr 5 at 2021 1:44 PM

SMSgt Lawrence McCarter — Mon, 05 Apr 2021 13:44:31 -0400

Give me a break ! Its not up to others to work Your shifts and its Your responsibility to show up for duty. Between both the Military Police and a civilian Police Department and after retirement Security I still had to go to work and and work even drive in those conditions while at work. The weather is bad, leave earlier for work. There isn't even an excuse for late arrival. I.ve had short commutes and in Security longer, never missed a shift due to weather in over 50 years and still don't. Everyone has to carry their own weight and to do otherwise shows no respect for Your fellow workers. Don't show up and You will be subject to punishment under the UCMJ and if I have any sympathy its for the person that had to cover Your shift because You found an excuse not to.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 5 at 2021 2:02 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 05 Apr 2021 14:02:14 -0400

That's an easy question with an easy answer. If the soldier can't make it to duty because of how bad the weather is, ask for a volunteer to take his place and give the replacement an incentive (3 day weekend, etc.) for volunteering. The soldier that can't make it will just pull the replacement's duty next time he or she has it.

Response by 1SG Ken Bedwell made Apr 5 at 2021 4:57 PM

1SG Ken Bedwell — Mon, 05 Apr 2021 16:57:13 -0400

It's called a DA-6. If it's your turn, then it's your turn. Put on your big kid pants. You joined the Army! Be a Soldier and do your job!

Response by SMSgt Kevin Townsend made Apr 7 at 2021 4:01 PM

SMSgt Kevin Townsend — Wed, 07 Apr 2021 16:01:49 -0400

Where are these questions coming from? Next they'll ask, "Can senior NCO’s make soldiers do their duty during harsh conditions that exist in a war?" It may well be that the Girl Scouts would be more suited to the delicate sensibilities of those who think this way. Just a thought.

Response by SSG(P) Danielle Birtha made Apr 8 at 2021 3:11 PM

SSG(P) Danielle Birtha — Thu, 08 Apr 2021 15:11:50 -0400

simplest answer is:
YOU are a soldier who is EXPECTED to be ready for duty 24/7/365.
IF you live off post... it is with the permission of your chain of command...
--> that is NOT a Right.

IF you are unable to report to duty because the weather is hazardous...
THAT IS AN EXCUSE...
Maximum effective range of an excuse? ZERO METERS.
Would you use that same excuse if an alert were called... to excuse your absence, as your unit rolls out to fight an enemy... while you laze at home... "it's raining too hard... waaah..I can't go to war"??

IF you are unable to report for duty, living off post... then your permission to live off post can very easily be denied... so you WILL be ready for duty... 24/7/365 ;)
If your postal worker can deliver the mail in inclement weather... you can report for duty too.

NO... you cannot trade or sell duty... unless Unit Policy allows.
You signed up. You raised your hand and swore to obey.
YOU are Government Issue... to be deployed as directed by your superiors.
Got a problem with that?
Then you should probably try to find a job where your boss will let you do as you wish...
That is NOT going to happen in the U.S. Military.
The Military is NOT a Democracy.
It is a Dictatorship that you agreed to...

--> "I, _____, do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the Officers appointed over me, according to Regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. (so help me God)." <--

accept... and stop whining.

btw... jobs are scare outside the Military... unless you are a "non-legal alien".
You can be a soldier... or you can be homeless to support the Invaders... and the Enemies of the U.S. who now own our Manufactured Products by Dictated Law ... By Dictated Democratic Laws that give aid and comfort to China... and Invaders called Immigrants.. who are taking over our Nation, while you are protecting the Saudi Arabian Kings who attacked U.S. on 9/11/2001.

I'm curious... should I thank you for serving to protect our enemies??
I can't thank our current Military for their service ... as they die to protect our enemies FROM U.S.!

All I can do is cry at the sad state of this Nation... that willingly protects and bows to our enemies.

Response by SSG Richard Hackwith made Apr 11 at 2021 10:10 PM

SSG Richard Hackwith — Sun, 11 Apr 2021 22:10:15 -0400

If the good old DA Form-6 says it's your turn, then it's your turn.

Response by SGT Jacob McInnes made Apr 18 at 2021 5:30 AM

SGT Jacob McInnes — Sun, 18 Apr 2021 05:30:04 -0400

You do what you have to do. This corporate attitude that as infected the military has to go. It’s culturally poisonous. If your SL, TL, PSG says to do something suck it up and do it.

That said.

The attitude of always looking out for oneself has developed out of self preservation from the junior enlisted ranks. Many NCOs and Officers today only think about completing a task, and how it makes them look and they treat their Junior soldiers as if they are expendable. It’s incumbent on your Squad Leader or Team Leader to take into consideration the risks to the members of his unit, vs the rewards for the mission and issue direction accordingly, and be prepared to take the heat round from higher if he has to oppose what they want for the good of his subordinates.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Apr 18 at 2021 2:57 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Sun, 18 Apr 2021 14:57:29 -0400

If your duty was Sunday and it snowed Saturday you needed to be where you could get there Sunday. Don’t punish the one who lives on base. Period

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Apr 18 at 2021 5:50 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Sun, 18 Apr 2021 17:50:36 -0400

I thought the Army closed if the weather was inclement

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 24 at 2021 4:06 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 24 Apr 2021 16:06:40 -0400

There was a 10 day ice storm during November 2017 in Fort Riley. Everyone in 1-63rd BN still had to come to formation in the maintenance bay at 0615.

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made Apr 29 at 2021 7:21 AM

SSG Robert Perrotto — Thu, 29 Apr 2021 07:21:40 -0400

SPC Diaz - if your name is on the duty roster, then yes, your responsibility is to report for duty. We are not a "Fair weather" army. Unless the Garrison Commander issues a "red" order for roads, then you will report. You, and not the Army, Chose to live 15+ minutes away. You, and only you, chose to go home instead of sleeping in the barracks prior to your duty shift, and it is on you to leave your home at an appropriate time to report for duty. Very very rarely do conditions like you describe occur unpredicted. Likely you knew 5 days in advance what the weather conditions would be like.

Passing your duty off because it is "unsafe" for you to report. What makes it safe for them to report and assume your duty?

Response by CPL Joseph Elinger made May 4 at 2021 9:02 AM

CPL Joseph Elinger — Tue, 04 May 2021 09:02:24 -0400

If there is a hazardous road - weather condition, The Post is usually closed. That means ALL Civilian Employees are off. I was stationed in Germany & we had a few closures.

Response by SSG Ronald Ralph made May 4 at 2021 4:52 PM

SSG Ronald Ralph — Tue, 04 May 2021 16:52:37 -0400

SPC Jesus Diaz,

I don’t know how long you were in the Army, or if you still are. I can tell you one thing for certain. I spent a few weeks shy of 11 years on active duty, and I lived off base, or on base housing for my entire time with my wife and kids. I pulled Assistant CQ, guard duty, fire detail, courtesy van driver, CQ, Sergeant of the Guard, and SDNCO without regards for any type of weather. As a married soldier living off base, or on base housing, I was expected to pull duty just like any other soldier living in the barracks. I was expected to arrive on duty early during inclement weather, pull duty, and fill out the duty log just like Pvt. Joe Snuffy that lived on the 3rd floor in the barracks. It was my ass if I didn’t make it. Standing in front of the 1SG’s desk, or the CSM’s desk, on the yellow feet at attention, didn’t sound like much fun, so I was always early for duty.

Let’s go one step further. I was in tanks, and stationed at Ft. Carson, Panzer Kaserne in Germany, Ft. Knox twice, and Conn Barracks in Schweinfurt. During the winter, we would have to rotate to do cold weather starts on our platoon’s tanks. No matter where I was stationed, our PSG made up a cold weather start roster, and each one of them didn’t give a rat’s ass if you lived in the barracks, or off base. We all had our share of cold weather starts...no matter if it was bite ass freezing with a blizzard. We were expected to do our duty without bitching about it. So, carry on soldier, and suck it up!

Response by SSG John Lasseigne made May 4 at 2021 5:18 PM

SSG John Lasseigne — Tue, 04 May 2021 17:18:18 -0400

If the duty roster is kept properly, other than short notice there is no harm in being tapped for duty early. This would move you to the bottom of the list leaving the SM who missed duty at the top. The real suck of living on post in the barracks are the "hey you" detail's!

Response by LTC Lance Headrick made May 4 at 2021 8:55 PM

LTC Lance Headrick — Tue, 04 May 2021 20:55:54 -0400

Hopefully not a scheduled duty because we all know that the DA6 would have it planned out and you would know you have duty ;)

It is a matter of policy on whether you drive or not. Did the roads or the Post close? If Yes, can't go. If No, then you go.

If it is in the gray area, Go. Then bitch to your PSG.

Regardless of what 1SG Luke Bradshaw says below; stay away from Pornstars.

Response by PO3 John Jeter made May 5 at 2021 11:42 AM

PO3 John Jeter — Wed, 05 May 2021 11:42:44 -0400

I'm not familiar with shoreside so much, but on ship we had a duty section while in port with a different duty section while at sea. Once the initial duty section was established upon entering port or getting under weigh we knew about when our duty was coming up. It was rare that something occurred where the nearest available man was required to fill in without notice. You were allowed to exchange duty with another sailor as long as they were qualified to hold the watch/duty AND you got approval ahead of time. I will say however that I really had to laugh at the idea that you should be excused duty because of "harsh conditions". Really? Think about that one just a little bit, please? When is the last time you were not aware of impending bad weather well ahead of time? Perhaps in the field, but in barracks or on base? I cannot conceive of a military family that doesn't understand the concept of Dad or Mom having to spend an extra night/day on base because of duty requirements. Forgive me also for thinking that a soldier/sailor that doesn't plan ahead for this kind of thing is either brand spanking new (ie Boot camp) to the service or just isn't too good at what they're doing. No disrespect intended.

Response by SPC(P) Brandon Jenkins made May 6 at 2021 7:27 AM

SPC(P) Brandon Jenkins — Thu, 06 May 2021 07:27:30 -0400

I guess it would depend on what you mean by "a duty." It's not your duty to drive over to your platoon sgt's house in frozen conditions to help them cut firewood. However, if it's regular duty, then it has probably already been authorized by your commander.

Response by SMSgt Billy Cesarano made May 6 at 2021 7:12 PM

SMSgt Billy Cesarano — Thu, 06 May 2021 19:12:41 -0400

AS A SPC you should be preparing for NCO responsibilities. This should never be a question asked by an NCO prospect. It seems you have have been promoted beyond your KSA's. Maybe going back to PVT is in order.

Response by SGT Jimmy Russo made May 6 at 2021 9:55 PM

SGT Jimmy Russo — Thu, 06 May 2021 21:55:58 -0400

I had a E-4 Sp/4 Slacker pull this , told him it wouldn't fly , 20 min later He calls an says car won't start , No Problem I told him I would be there in 20 minutes to pick him up , In the meanwhile I contacted my B-Team Leader who lived in the Barracks an he offered to sit in as Runner till I got Joe Slacker there .

Response by MSG Edward Flint made May 6 at 2021 10:31 PM

MSG Edward Flint — Thu, 06 May 2021 22:31:27 -0400

It should be clearly spelled out in Unit SOG's/SOP's specific to Base geographic location. My legal opinion is that it would be foolish on the part of any NCO or Ranking Officer to endanger a lower ranking soldiers life or limb. Those of us that have spent any time stationed abroad know well the local policy covers this exact situation.

Response by MSgt Eric Roseberry made May 7 at 2021 7:31 AM

MSgt Eric Roseberry — Fri, 07 May 2021 07:31:29 -0400

I believe the oath of enlistment is what you are looking for.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made May 7 at 2021 10:48 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 07 May 2021 10:48:53 -0400

This is common sense. Ask yourself these questions: Would you drive in these conditions? How experienced is the soldier at driving in these conditions (ie; is he/she from Florida or Minnesota?) How’s the soldier’s driving record? Can you complete the mission without the soldier’s presence?

Response by SGT Ben Bearden made May 7 at 2021 1:14 PM

SGT Ben Bearden — Fri, 07 May 2021 13:14:47 -0400

Last I recall Military service was voluntary, maybe this generation and future generations need to be reminded of such. how much of a Blue Falcon are you that you can't do duty, besides the fact that you are using "HARSH CONDITIONS" as an excuse while serving in the military, where NEWS FLASH HIGH SPEED! YOUR JOB IS TO BE IN HARSH CONDITIONS DURING A DEPLOYMEN, weather that is a peacekeeping mission or during war.

Response by SMSgt James Rorie made May 7 at 2021 5:04 PM

SMSgt James Rorie — Fri, 07 May 2021 17:04:49 -0400

I cannot say for certainty there is a regulation on this subject but I think most units have some sort of "Inclement Weather" policy that should address such situations.

Response by MSgt Walter Thomason made May 7 at 2021 7:07 PM

MSgt Walter Thomason — Fri, 07 May 2021 19:07:50 -0400

I'm really disgusted to see this question. Unless excused from duty, you show up for duty. It's as simple as that. I'm frightened because I'm seeing questions like this more and more. As a US member of the US Armed Forces, it is and should duty first. Fine if you want to gripe, I always saw it as part of the job BUT, understand where your responsibilities lay and take pride in it.

Response by SGT Allen Treviranus made May 8 at 2021 10:26 AM

SGT Allen Treviranus — Sat, 08 May 2021 10:26:11 -0400

It is the Soldier's choice to live off base at the end of the day. Yes, they still need to perform duties like everyone else.

Response by Cpl Bill Johnson made May 8 at 2021 6:45 PM

Cpl Bill Johnson — Sat, 08 May 2021 18:45:21 -0400

Any NCO or Staff NCO would tell you to be prepared. Then that same staff NCO, of he was worth a damn would have a look around to see if there was anyone available to switch with. If so, Great. If not, leave early and drive carefully.

Response by TSgt Leigh Nichols made May 10 at 2021 7:52 AM

TSgt Leigh Nichols — Mon, 10 May 2021 07:52:39 -0400

Oh Sweet Baby Jesus!!! Give me a break cupcake, it's the damn military!! Get your dead a** up and go report for duty! This is as bad as asking if there is a regulation that says your supervisor can force you to fight the enemy even though bullets may hit you!!

Response by SPC Luis Gonzalez made May 10 at 2021 12:16 PM

SPC Luis Gonzalez — Mon, 10 May 2021 12:16:29 -0400

I can't believe this is even a current topic for conversation. I did ALL of my eight years in service overseas, form mid eighties to early nineties (Germany and several deployments from there and back.) Back then it was the soldier's duty to be at his post on time, every time, regardless of distance and conditions. If you're quartered 30 minutes away from post, and you need to be there in five, it's your fucking problem. Blizzard, floods, hazardous conditions for your POV? YOUR problem. Alert or no alert. You have to be where your unit needs you to be. On time. At least that's the way it was in my time. I don't know how it is since all these candy asses took over my Army.

Response by CW3 Joseph Lawrence made May 10 at 2021 3:08 PM

CW3 Joseph Lawrence — Mon, 10 May 2021 15:08:40 -0400

We had a Battalion Commander once who would bury his car in a snow drift trying to get to work, and he demanded his men do the same thing. How many times I left to only two tire tracks on the road going to my duty station. I could have called and taken leave, but dedication to duty has to enter into the picture here. I realize bad roads create a hazardous situation, but your job can place you into a hazardous situation at any time. Are you going to tell the First Shirt, no, when he tells you to take that ammo to the LP. It's all about being a soldier. Civilians can be a pansy about roads and work, we soldiers can't.

Response by CPT Larry Hudson made May 11 at 2021 8:32 AM

CPT Larry Hudson — Tue, 11 May 2021 08:32:25 -0400

Certainly they can. Your service obligation is readiness. Living off base is your choice and responsibilities to be on post when ordered can to be ignored duëk to weather. The NCO received report ordered but who knows, in todays military you May be allowed to use your need personal time card. I Would consider you AWOL asyourcommander.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made May 11 at 2021 1:49 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 11 May 2021 13:49:01 -0400

I understand how you feel Diaz. Lack of planning or some unforeseen emergency calls for you to get a call to pull duty. It's BS but it happens. There's a regulation on duty rosters and how to construct one. It doesn't mention anything about selecting soldiers last minute to pull duty. That is a leader's call. When I served as a 1SG and CSM I prepared for the unforeseen. If my leaders gave me a troop that was on leave, pass, TDY, or special duty to pull duty and their name were on a duty roster that leader pulled the duty. They hated it but I didn't have the mistakes going forward on the duty roster. Furthermore, in Germany, we always had this issue in the winter. The priority was safety. There were times as a 1SG when I would keep an eye on the desk and answer the phone until the soldier/leader showed up. I was working late so it wasn't an issue for me. I didn't want to lose a soldier. I can replace someone on a roster but I can't replace a parent's child. No one can. Good leaders know this and they adjust on the move to accommodate this type of mishap. My recommendation to you is to utilize your good judgment to get where you're going in a safe manner. You get there when you get there. You're not going to lose rank for it and if you were my soldier you would get an extra day off for having to come in last minute. Hope this helps.

Response by PO2 S.J. Carroll made May 12 at 2021 9:49 PM

PO2 S.J. Carroll — Wed, 12 May 2021 21:49:46 -0400

I ws supposed to stand duty at the Pentagon, but there was a strong ice storm the night before. I called in stating even the heavy buses couldn't make it down my street. I was told to stay in place that day. Is there a rule, I don't know. I only know my safety was important to my LPO.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 13 at 2021 2:30 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 13 May 2021 14:30:42 -0400

This isn't a question that you want to pursue. If you are having difficulty attending duty due to distance from base and possible hazardous conditions, your supervisors can compel you to move closer to base. If you are not married or have a child with you to support, at the rank of E-4, you can be compelled to live on base.

Response by 1SG Ernest Stull made May 14 at 2021 3:52 PM

1SG Ernest Stull — Fri, 14 May 2021 15:52:43 -0400

DA Form 6. Duty Roster. If the Base is closed due to bad weather then common sense should apply. In upstate NY the police close the roads during bad weather and if caught driving on the road you will be fined.

Response by SGT James Taylor made May 23 at 2021 11:47 AM

SGT James Taylor — Sun, 23 May 2021 11:47:42 -0400

Funny you should ask. I ran into this same problem stationed in Germany. I lived in military housing that was around 45 minutes away from the base and I was called in for some 24 hour duty over the weekend. I was called because the person that should have had the duty was involved in a car accident and was still in the hospital, they were not at fault and were not seriously injured but were required to stay in the hospital under observation for 24 hours. I had no problem being called in but I did let the Senior NCO that called me know that because it was after the time that I should report I would be late and we were in the middle of a snow storm that they please be patient as I was not going to try and hurry to get to post. Yes, the NCO that called me had every right to require me to report regardless of the road conditions. They did understand that where I was housed had much more snow and ice compared to where they were and that I was not going to risk an accident trying to hurry to the base. I ended up needing almost 3 and half hours to arrive, some of that time to get my stuff organized and most of the time needed to drive at a whopping top speed of 40 kph simply because I couldn't get my car driving any faster due to conditions. For those of you that have never driven in Europe 40 kph is really slow, like under 25 mph
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if a senior NCO tells you that you need to be somewhere they have a few things going for them, first is that they are an NCO and what they are giving you is a lawful order to report for a duty, second is that they probably have checked on the regulations or have dealt with a similar situation before and they are not going to set themselves up for failure or trouble by breaking regulations. Just because you live off base does not exempt you from duties, just the same as living on base does not mean that you should have more duty. You are a member of that unit and if your name is on a duty roster it is YOUR responsibility to make sure that you are able to make it to your duty location on time even if you need to drive earlier and slower so you came make it.

Response by MSG Chuck Pewsey made Jun 1 at 2021 4:08 AM

MSG Chuck Pewsey — Tue, 01 Jun 2021 04:08:00 -0400

I was battalion operation sergeant at home for lunch. S3 calls - "Your greens are set up" "Yessir) "OK, your on survivor assistance, go to (whatever the office was) and pick up the paperwork and car keys."
So I did, got a 30 second brief and went to meet the survivors 70 miles away.
Learned later the S4 NCO was the one who was assigned the detail and had gone through the training but they were having an inspection and didn't want to lose him.
In the end I got even. Survivor assistance takes precedence over all other duties so I missed the most miserable field exercise in the three years I was there.

Response by SFC Charles Kauffman made Jun 2 at 2021 3:13 AM

SFC Charles Kauffman — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 03:13:01 -0400

Well, young soldier, living off post is a PRIVILEGE, and is granted at the discretion of your Commander. What makes you so special that you shouldn't be required to perform the same duties as your contemporaries? If you're so worried about your personal safety, then move back into the barracks.

Response by SFC Charles Kauffman made Jun 2 at 2021 3:16 AM

SFC Charles Kauffman — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 03:16:43 -0400

Well, young soldier, living off post is a PRIVILIGE and is granted at the discretion of the Commander. What makes you so special that you don't feel you should perform the same duties as your contemporaries? If you're so concerned about your personal safety, then move back into the barracks.

Response by SP6 Micah Brown made Jun 2 at 2021 6:11 AM

SP6 Micah Brown — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 06:11:05 -0400

There isn't a particular regulation to my knowledge that deals with this. Like the PT uniform, it is up to the Chain of Command to make a reasonable decision at that point. Now this can be a double edged sword. If it is UNREASONABLE CONDITIONS and the Soilder in question was injured based on said conditions, then in such an extreme circumstance the Chain Of Command COULD BE, held liable, (though doubtful).
So, short story, YES. As a Soilder, it is your Responsibility to be at your place of duty (like the US Postal Service, in rain, sleet, or snow), rather that is in Garrison or Deployed.

Response by PO1 Sanford Snyder made Jun 2 at 2021 10:22 AM

PO1 Sanford Snyder — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 10:22:03 -0400

I guess the Navy is different. We have Duty Sections, depending on the size and scope of the unit. My time in we had 4 Duty Sections, the Squadron divided mostly equally. When your section had the duty, one day each, Monday thru Friday, you mustered end of day, then stood your duty if you had a watch. Weekends were you stood both Saturday and Sunday with musters daily. It was your responsibility to make muster and stand your duty, failure to do so was a Capt. mast offense. We didn't scour the barracks for bodies, never had occasion to do so. And yes, we had inclement weather, but if you couldn't make your watch, swapping with some one authorized as long as the watch stander was qualified for that position.

Response by SN Joel Penhallegon made Jun 2 at 2021 2:23 PM

SN Joel Penhallegon — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 14:23:23 -0400

*performed* not preformed

Response by SSG Randall Speck made Jun 2 at 2021 6:20 PM

SSG Randall Speck — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 18:20:59 -0400

Personally I've stayed in the barracks on nights we were expecting bad weather overnight. That being said I've been caught off base in bad weather. Best advice I can give would be to contact your section, or platoon Sargent and let them know the situation. They should either excuse you, or tell you to find your way in safely if possible. No one should command you to be unsafe.

Response by PO1 Mike Pulju made Jun 2 at 2021 9:59 PM

PO1 Mike Pulju — Wed, 02 Jun 2021 21:59:01 -0400

If you can deal with the idea of people purposely shooting at you and volunteer anyways 15+ minutes on a snow and ice covered road should be no problem.

Response by SGT Kaye Fiorello made Jun 3 at 2021 10:24 AM

SGT Kaye Fiorello — Thu, 03 Jun 2021 10:24:08 -0400

Here's the deal. You are a soldier 24/7/365. You are paid a "salary" not an hourly rate for work. You are ever on call, 24/7/365. You are part of a TEAM. You are not an individual, you do not have the option to choose to let someone else do your job. Its your turn.
If your sorry ass cannot drive in when you are called up for special duty, then perhaps you need to move back to the barracks.
Would you prefer your platoon Sgt can come get your ass, and bring you in, if you are afraid to drive? That way, since you have no car and cannot drive home until the weather clears and someone can drive you... you are on post, and can be tapped for a second duty.
Ruck up dude. You signed up for this.

Response by SPC Jerry McEntire made Jun 3 at 2021 11:42 AM

SPC Jerry McEntire — Thu, 03 Jun 2021 11:42:05 -0400

Here’s an ideal, if you live in areas that get frozen roads, learn to drive on ice! Stop making your problems someone else’s!

Response by CWO4 Frank Kirtley made Jun 4 at 2021 9:16 AM

CWO4 Frank Kirtley — Fri, 04 Jun 2021 09:16:03 -0400

Depends. The order should address situations of exigent circumstances.

Response by SFC Joe Ortega made Jun 4 at 2021 9:17 AM

SFC Joe Ortega — Fri, 04 Jun 2021 09:17:15 -0400

Response by SFC Joe Ortega made Jun 4 at 2021 9:34 AM

SFC Joe Ortega — Fri, 04 Jun 2021 09:34:33 -0400

Yes. Is your duty to show up for work call and duties such as CQ, Staff duty etc. The army give the single troops a place to live on post in the barracks, living quarters etc. Is your choice to move off post. The command doesn't have to allow you to live off post if you are single. Only married troops should and live off post. That is why all branches of the armed forces give married troops living quarters on post. If you choose to stay with someone off post, visit someone off post is your responsibility to be at your place of duty period.

Response by MSG Jim Totten made Jun 5 at 2021 10:17 AM

MSG Jim Totten — Sat, 05 Jun 2021 10:17:59 -0400

Without knowing the entire situation, my first thought is no. We are all focused on mission accomplishment but need to practice force protection to retain the soldiers we have under our charge. Situation will dictate the answer and doing the right thing is what we get paid for. Ask yourself if the mission is worth $500k to make happen? If the answer is no, then act appropriately.

Response by MSgt Mason Manner made Jun 5 at 2021 4:44 PM

MSgt Mason Manner — Sat, 05 Jun 2021 16:44:15 -0400

YOU'RE an ASSHOLE all you have to do is give your self an extra half hour(45min)to get there I worked for the NYC DEPT of SANITATION and worked/drove ALL over the city of NY during snow storms even w/my own POV STOP BEING A SPOILED WUSS YOU DON'T LIKE IT GET OUT OF THE MILITARY PUT UP W/MORE B.S. AND ALOT LESS MONEY

Response by CAPT Rick "Spike" Martin made Jun 5 at 2021 5:02 PM

CAPT Rick "Spike" Martin — Sat, 05 Jun 2021 17:02:57 -0400

Safety first unless the enemy is shooting at you. Common sense always applies.

Response by MSgt Wayne Owens made Jun 6 at 2021 12:08 AM

MSgt Wayne Owens — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 00:08:13 -0400

Is it not possible that the Senior NCO also lives off base, post or whatever and already knows the conditions. I was stationed in Michigan, Nebraska and North Dakota. If I didn't go to my job when the weather or conditions are bad, I would have been absent a lot. Also dont most bases have abn "Essential Personnel Only" policy. That usually means the Senior NCOs. If they can get there so can you.

Response by PO3 Jake Lucid made Jun 6 at 2021 1:40 PM

PO3 Jake Lucid — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 13:40:02 -0400

Let's flips this around. If you are worried about the weather and coming in for your duty day...why didn't you make your concerns known prior so you could stay on base for the night. And be ready for duty in the morning. You did after all sign up for the military - so it's acceptable to be told to be on duty at the prescribed time. Forcing some one who simply doesn't live off base to stand in is not exactly the purpose.

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Jun 6 at 2021 3:47 PM

1SG James Kelly — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 15:47:59 -0400

Poor baby; how about the 1SG moves you back in the barracks so you don't have that problem?

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Jun 6 at 2021 4:12 PM

1SG James Kelly — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 16:12:05 -0400

Yes.

Or the 1SG can move you back in the barracks so you don;'t have that problem.

Response by Maj Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 6 at 2021 4:22 PM

Maj Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 16:22:13 -0400

Let me call a Wahmbulance for the coddled generation. Your mission takes you through a minefield or enemy occupied jungles or skies - do you defer your duty to someone closer? Suck it up buttercup at least you have a heated vehicle and you're not being shot at!

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Jun 6 at 2021 5:54 PM

1SG James Kelly — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 17:54:16 -0400

I have lost who i am talking to.
But for what it's worth I stand by them.

Response by SGT Lance LeBerte made Jun 6 at 2021 8:06 PM

SGT Lance LeBerte — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 20:06:14 -0400

no regulation I have ever heard of, but, that soldier, airmen, sailor or marine chose to marry and live off base, still has the same responsibilities and duty requirements

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2021 6:51 AM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 06:51:12 -0400

Yes, yes they can.
Guardsmen have had to travel through emergency weather situations (blizzards, firestorms and hurricanes), sometimes a several hours drive (myself included) to perform their duty.
I live 2 hours from my duty location and have had to kick it into 4wd up and down 2 mountains in the middle of a Noreaster to make it to duty on time. Its your responsibility to plan accordingly.

Response by SGT David Schrader made Jun 7 at 2021 7:08 AM

SGT David Schrader — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 07:08:06 -0400

You are ultimately responsible to show up for your duty assignment. If you feel that you have a legitimate excuse for not being able to be at your duty station as ordered, you should use your chain of command to explain your dilemma. It is not right for you to assume that because soldier that may live on post

Response by Sgt Gary Childs made Jun 7 at 2021 7:34 AM

Sgt Gary Childs — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 07:34:31 -0400

I was stationed at Keesler Air Force Base in Biloxi (Right on the Gulf Coast). We had a guy home on leave in Michigan that had to come back and report to duty during a Hurricane Alert. Biloxi was directly in the eye path, Michigan was in absolutely no danger. Still he reported back. That was his obligation. You shouldn't need a reg to perform your duty. The military (all Branches including the Air Force) doesn't issue tissue.

Response by SN Jeffrey White made Jun 7 at 2021 1:32 PM

SN Jeffrey White — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 13:32:20 -0400

Watch the weather and go early .

Response by SN Jeffrey White made Jun 7 at 2021 1:57 PM

SN Jeffrey White — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 13:57:27 -0400

You joined the military , not the cub scouts ,... This question proves you joined the wrong one .

Response by SGT Robert Hawks made Jun 7 at 2021 7:20 PM

SGT Robert Hawks — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 19:20:16 -0400

Unless Post has been closed and nonessential personal ordered to stay home then you must follow orders. Also do not assume that you are nonessential either, I did once while stationed at Fort Knox we had 18 inches of snow Post was closed all nonessential personnel where ordered to shelter in place. 0900 I get a phone call from the Battalion CSM, who then ask me why I was not at work? I told him the General put out post closed nonessential personal shelter in place. He then chewed me out for not being there I was the person responsible for all NCOER and OER being completed for turn in. I told the CSM the snow was up over the bumper on my car and I couldn’t get out of the parking lot if I wanted too. He then said SGT you live base put some cold weather gear on and get over here. I told yes CSM I would there as soon as possibly could. He then told to get ready his driver would pick me up in the HUMVEE he had chains on it and picked me up. Post was closed 3 days and I was at work for all 3 of them. So don’t assume you’re nonessential and don’t punish the guy who lives on post for you not coming I either.

Response by HA Jace Gallagher made Jun 7 at 2021 9:19 PM

HA Jace Gallagher — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 21:19:13 -0400

The UCMJ makes it to where you can face punishment for not showing up, regardless of reason. As a specialist, living off base is a privilege, NOT A RIGHT! You signed an agreement saying you would be responsible and show up for your duties under ANY circumstance, which implies you have a plan for doing so. Army regs may be different from Navy regs, but in general only NCOs are guaranteed housing. That is to prevent NCOs from getting involved in the crap that goes on in barracks and because they have earned that privilege. Also, even being married does not turn this privilege into a right. Why do you think, in a domestic situation, it is the servicemember who gets sent to the barracks while the dependents stay in the house? It is because YOU, not THEM, signed up for the military. At my last command, there was a married Army Specialist and a Navy Petty Officer Third Class (AN NCO) who were denied housing. Housing was provided for their dependents, ALL servicemembers below E7 were required to stay in barracks due to preparing for deployment. Sorry for the rant, but be grateful you even have housing in the military instead of the barracks. Those who have to endure the barracks have to endure a LOT MORE BS than simply driving in inclement weather.

Response by CPO Kurt Baschab made Jun 8 at 2021 12:23 AM

CPO Kurt Baschab — Tue, 08 Jun 2021 00:23:39 -0400

when you have Duty, you Know this well in advance. so you should make preparation in advance of the Storm.
this can be as simple as talking to a fellow shipmate or Battle buddy to see if the storm hits and prevents you from being able to come in, you will call that person, who will then take your duty, and you will switch and take one of his at a later date.
this of course shall be approved by your watch commander, in advance .

or you know there a possibility of the roads being unsafe to drive on in the AM, so you sleep on base, so you are there when the storm hits, and you do not have to drive in, so you are able to stand your duty.

what to many members forget we are on duty 24-7
any time off we are given is a Privilege Given to us by the Command . this is why any Injuries we Receive while playing, Is Consider a Active Duty INJURY .

I Remember when I was on Active Duty, It was my RESPONSIBILITY to make it in to the BASE FOR DUTY! If for any Reason I could Not make it In, it was still My Responsibility to find someone to cover my duty.

the Way I See it We all Know we have Duty well In ADVANCE , there is very little Excuse to to have found a Stand by or made other Arrangements .

the only time I would let a member slide was if they had a Last Min medical emergency.

Other Wise you have plenty of time to find some one to cover your duty.

Response by SN Trevor Sanchez made Jun 9 at 2021 9:33 AM

SN Trevor Sanchez — Wed, 09 Jun 2021 09:33:52 -0400

You are required when living off base to have a transportation vehicle that can get you to base no matter what the weather. No excuses. The Military is not grade school. You are the one people depend upon when shit gets real. Buck up and quit complaining and buy a 4X4 vehicle if you don't have one.

Response by MSgt Janice Trojan made Jun 12 at 2021 1:44 AM

MSgt Janice Trojan — Sat, 12 Jun 2021 01:44:18 -0400

I think so. I was a Buck and there was ice on road. I did a 360 on road at McChord. Called in but if I had to walk in I would. I was excused for the day. But again if they said come in I would have walked.

Response by MSgt Janice Trojan made Jun 12 at 2021 1:46 AM

MSgt Janice Trojan — Sat, 12 Jun 2021 01:46:31 -0400

I would have. I did a 360 getting onto the street. I grew up in Vegas not lots of snow or ice. I was excused. I could have walked to east gate McChord and bummed a ride to the clinic. if I was necessary. Think an officer would order and NCO to make me come in.

Response by SP5 Charles Gould made Jun 12 at 2021 12:15 PM

SP5 Charles Gould — Sat, 12 Jun 2021 12:15:44 -0400

Kid, EVERYONE in the Army is considered “Mission Essential”, as the Army (at least when I served) was to be ready and able to meet any potential threat - anywhere, anytime, period!

When I was in Vietnam, every breathing service member was armed. And if you were a clerk or a cook, had to be ready to fight just as much as my Recon Team. Sometimes we even took others with us when necessary. You repair tracked vehicles? What if you are ordered to accompany one across totally free-fire hostile territory in case of a breakdown? Or go with my Team through a hot zone to repair a tracked vehicle at an SF base so we can get wounded to a viable LZ for extraction? Yes, it is certainly dangerous, but it is YOUR JOB!
What did you think you were joining anyway? A YMCA hot rod club?
I don’t know what happened to the Army since I served, but this “gentrification”, lack of commitment to mission, and pandering to the weak-willed seems to have severely eroded not only morale, but basic operational readiness. If you are afraid to support your unit (whatever that might be) you should be either retrained or let go.
Start where you are, use what you have, do what you can.

Response by SFC Jim Freshour made Jun 12 at 2021 3:38 PM

SFC Jim Freshour — Sat, 12 Jun 2021 15:38:40 -0400

So the alternative is to screw some Joe who lives in the barracks because you determined the roads were too dangerous? Sounds like you've already pulled this stunt and are grabbing at straws to get out of trouble.

Response by CPT Gurinder (Gene) Rana made Jun 18 at 2021 10:17 AM

CPT Gurinder (Gene) Rana — Fri, 18 Jun 2021 10:17:22 -0400

The bottomline SPC Private RallyPoint Member is that the duty rosters are made and approved. Any changes in the duty rosters must be sanctioned by the CoC. You are not the only soldier residing off-base and the others accept and perform their duties without incident then, why should you be treated differently? The 1SG is absolutely correct in saying that you should stop thinking selfishly and start practicing selfless service. Further discussion on this topic will be futile.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 18 at 2021 10:13 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Fri, 18 Jun 2021 22:13:26 -0400

It is my experience that some army posts do not do a good job of reporting dangerous road conditions on a timely basis. I don't know why. It is not rocket science.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 19 at 2021 2:02 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 19 Jun 2021 14:02:26 -0400

My God has the military gone soft. I had to drive on roads a mountain goat would not venture on.

Response by TSgt Frank Csorba made Jun 28 at 2021 2:40 PM

TSgt Frank Csorba — Mon, 28 Jun 2021 14:40:05 -0400

I was stationed in Loring AFB Maine 40 years ago. We had a duty to get to work no matter what. Even if you had to keep your car in creeping speed. The decision is not yours. The Base Commander had however been known to call a "down day" when the temperature dropped to -65°. Or, authorize a few hours delay when the snowplows were losing the battle with the snow. What you could do is to call your superiors and advise them of the conditions you find yourself in. They in turn will contact their Unit Commander, and they will contact.... etc. If a Commander finds himself flooded by calls of issues and reports of accidents, they would probably reassess the risks in your favor. They decide whether to risk it, or not. A decent NCO could also pick you up and take you to your work place, but be warned that there will be repercussions if he does not have the slightest bit of trouble making the trip you are shirking. If it was really bad, we would send someone with a vehicle which had the best ice handling to work, and they would return with a deuce and a half with tire chains to get everyone else. Point is there are always alternatives to try before troubling your superiors. Meanwhile invest in a set of studded snow tires. I guarantee your weather issues will be rendered moot.

Response by SSG Gregg Mourizen made Jul 6 at 2021 4:56 PM

SSG Gregg Mourizen — Tue, 06 Jul 2021 16:56:39 -0400

I can't count how many times I drove 30-60 minutes in blizzard conditions or fog, and toughed it out.

I would always ask, "do you have space in the barracks should I get snowed in?". Usually got them to change their minds.
However abusing conditions, such as weather, and the sympathy will go away.

Of course the not answering the phone or door things sucks when you are the guy trying to get released. I don't know how many times even the "On-Call" did that, forcing me to go through the battle roster, for an emergency (Hospitals don't shut down). Time wasted at the worst times. I have tons of examples, but when you have to call the NCOIC or another department, to get a body, it can really suck.

Response by CPL John McCulley made Jul 7 at 2021 7:34 PM

CPL John McCulley — Wed, 07 Jul 2021 19:34:35 -0400

The shortest answer is YES!! Go ahead & miss duty or a formation because you were scared of the weather. Your chain of command will make it easy on you, move you back into the Barracks and tell you you can't live off post with your spouse. An old saying to remember is, "If you needed a wife, you would have been issued one." Make no mistake, living off post with your family is a privilege, not a right. You're a soldier (or Marine, Airman, Sailor or Gaurdian) everything you do, including living with your spouse, is at the convenience of the service, not the other way around!

Response by MCPO Robert Cornish made Jul 9 at 2021 12:59 PM

MCPO Robert Cornish — Fri, 09 Jul 2021 12:59:13 -0400

You have the duty, stand your duty! If you're expecting inclement weather leave your quarters earlier than normal and drive slowly. Suck it up buttercup.

Response by SGT Chuck Freiman made Jul 25 at 2021 6:20 AM

SGT Chuck Freiman — Sun, 25 Jul 2021 06:20:12 -0400

In the civilian world, as employees, we are often required to come to work in bad weather. So look upon it as a test of your driving skills, and excuse the pun, drive on.

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Jul 25 at 2021 3:20 PM

SPC Chris Ison — Sun, 25 Jul 2021 15:20:33 -0400

I am not sure I can say yes to this.

However what I do know they can, and will do, is make your ass stay in the barracks until the safety issue is cleared up. So you need to make a decision do you want to fight this? Or do you want to shack up with some dudes in the barracks?

You have been granted permission to live off post that permission can be withdrawn at any time.

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Jul 27 at 2021 11:11 AM

1SG James Kelly — Tue, 27 Jul 2021 11:11:44 -0400

You would have been great amongst The Frozen Chosen.

Response by SPC Steven Nihipali made Jul 27 at 2021 4:13 PM

SPC Steven Nihipali — Tue, 27 Jul 2021 16:13:13 -0400

Damn man, if you can't drive in harsh conditions, sounds like a pussy way to get out of anything. Learn to! Get your ass up, walk in it, pt in it, live the fuck outta life in it... then, go home and repeat. You think people who climb mountains or retire as wildcard ff's don't train? They just get up one day and think they can climb K2?

Driving, you're in a car, if you don't have proper tires, that's your fault. Not properly pmcs'd, your fault. Can't drive in the rain, ice or snow, get your ass out there and learn!

Response by PO1 Steven Lipe made Aug 4 at 2021 11:36 PM

PO1 Steven Lipe — Wed, 04 Aug 2021 23:36:17 -0400

Inclement weather doesn't just "happen". Forecasts provide plenty of opportunity for you to plan for your duties during the weather. If you can't travel than make arrangements to stay on base in a barracks or BEQ. You have ways to perform your duties.

Response by SSgt Paul Millard made Aug 5 at 2021 6:43 PM

SSgt Paul Millard — Thu, 05 Aug 2021 18:43:05 -0400

Oh my, we should not ever out our soldiers in dangerous situations. By that mindset how dare we send soldiers out to combat, it might be dangerous. Love the WOKE military:(

Response by SPC George Edwards made Aug 9 at 2021 3:49 PM

SPC George Edwards — Mon, 09 Aug 2021 15:49:19 -0400

Well, I can't speak for our modern Army, but in my day (1961-64), living off post was a privilege and a person had to be on post for reville, alerts and other formations regardless of the weather. Perhaps you might consider moving back to the barracks.

Response by SPC George Edwards made Aug 9 at 2021 3:52 PM

SPC George Edwards — Mon, 09 Aug 2021 15:52:04 -0400

Well, I don't know about the modern Army but in my day (1961-64), living off post was a privilege and not a right. Perhaps you might reconsider moving back on post where you can be available for any further assignments.

Response by CAPT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 30 at 2021 12:43 PM

CAPT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 30 Aug 2021 12:43:42 -0400

Your duty day is your duty day. Barring the zombie apocalypse you show up for duty. Even then you should still be able to make it… just drive fast and don’t stop.

Response by SN Dale "CG" Veach made Sep 4 at 2021 7:18 PM

SN Dale "CG" Veach — Sat, 04 Sep 2021 19:18:51 -0400

In the coast Guard...you have to go out...you don't have to come back. I've been out in sonm really bad stuff, because it was part of the job. If I had been civilian, never would have ventured out. One thing that the CG instilled in me was that I'm to go...to put myself there to help. And I still do it.

Response by SGT Charles Bartell made Sep 6 at 2021 5:56 PM

SGT Charles Bartell — Mon, 06 Sep 2021 17:56:47 -0400

There are regulations for road conditions. Put in place set by the Post commander.
However it is funny who follows then and who does not. If the roads are in a Black out condition's Soldier's are suppose to stay off the road's or face UCMJ.
My advice is get a currant copy of of the Post commander's regulations on this.
You must be smart on how you present this info to your leadership.
Some NCO's and Commanders get BUTT HURT real easy.

This sounds like a FT. Drum thing.

Response by SGT Charles Bartell made Sep 6 at 2021 6:14 PM

SGT Charles Bartell — Mon, 06 Sep 2021 18:14:30 -0400

It seems funny to me. That is some of you seem to think that. People have to risk there lives due to road conditions.
Especially those that are in position that requires no to every little real duty shifts.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Jul 25 at 2023 5:34 PM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Tue, 25 Jul 2023 17:34:59 -0400

I have on many occasions walked to work, or had to walk home. It is your responsibility. If a Soldier cannot pull there duty it would be up to them to find a replacement with the 1SGs approval.