Can someone tell me the proper guidance on the guidon?

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 12:18:14 -0400

Myself and other soldiers were under the impression that the guide on gets moved back inside when the commander leaves for the day.

Also, the last person besides the commander , can ask the commander if they would like the guide on placed inside of the commander is still inside after everyone leaves.

Well yesterday, there was mass punishment against soldiers because the guide On was left outside over night. The thing is, the soldiers got released and there were still Jr NCOS, Senior NCOS, and LTs after the soldiers had gotten released.

Was it right to punish the soldiers conduct corrective training in this scenario?

We are dealing with toxic leadership. There are many other things happening within our company and NCOs aren’t speaking up for the wrong doings and us soldiers feel unheard, mistreated, uncared for.

About 6 of us are planning on using the open door policy with the CDR and the next will be IG.

What do you all think? The other day they made every single soldier who was a meal card holder miss out on dinner because they wanted 2875s done.

Instead of utilizing every NCO to ensure their soldiers have completed the forms. They kept us all there until 640 pm.

As I stated, there are a lot of things that are going on and the morale of the soldiers is nearly 2 out of 10. Sensing sessions don’t solve any issues.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Oct 23 at 2021 12:47 PM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 12:47:12 -0400

There is a lot here. And I can't give you a lot of advice when you are not specific. Who is they? TL? SL? PSG? 1SG? All of the above?

As far as the guidon, specifically, there are three people responsible. Guidon bearer, under the supervision and direction of the 1SG, who receives guidance from Commander, who is ultimately responsible. Anyone other than those three should NOT be being held to account.

Also... Was it punishment or corrective training? The two are different?

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Oct 23 at 2021 1:01 PM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 13:01:50 -0400

There is one person to blame here. The guidon bearer. That is, quite literally, their job.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 23 at 2021 1:27 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 13:27:23 -0400

Three people are responsible for the Guidon: Guidon Bearer, the 1SG, and the Commander.

Define Mass Punishment. Was it punishment or corrective training? What exactly was done?

Meal Card Holders were held in place and missed dinner chow? That right there alone is enough to run this up the flag pole to the BN CSM with their open door policy.

Response by MAJ Ronnie Reams made Oct 23 at 2021 1:48 PM

MAJ Ronnie Reams — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 13:48:35 -0400

The CQ was there all night, he should have brought it in, if it was out after duty hours. He is COs rep and in charge of the company area during his tour.

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made Oct 23 at 2021 7:43 PM

SFC Ralph E Kelley — Sat, 23 Oct 2021 19:43:22 -0400

I lump all the above - with the exception of missing dinner as iffy to go to the IG bout. You are correct that those should be handled within the unit through the CO. I often had to do things the 'finsh the day', so completng 2875's is par for the course. What should have happened with chow - at a minimum - is to draw MREs from supply and giving the soldiers each a meal. We used to keep 'Bat-Rats' in our Conex, and my junior NCOs knew they could draw them anytime they wanted and I would simply replace them on being told they had been used.
However going as a group to 'complain' is a very bad idea. It could be called "Prejudicial to Good Order and Discipline." under the UCMJs Article 134.
Your NCOs? Something is wrong there.
However I once heard a solder that prevented a major meltdown in my unit (over a BN CO who wanted to 'censor' the INCOMING mail of the soldiers to prevent their familes from sending them 'contraband') by simply calling the IG and asking for 'advice'. He told the IG representative the situation and asked what he could do since the BN CO wasn't listening to ... well ... everyone involved.
The IG had a conversation with the BN CO about his 'limits'.
A couple of months later the MDs at the local hospital found he had a tumor in his brain the sized of a golf ball.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 24 at 2021 12:48 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 24 Oct 2021 12:48:08 -0400

If meal card holders were forced to miss chow, then yes take that up the chain because you should be able to submit a missed meal voucher.

The guide on staying out is not everyone else's fault though as stated.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 24 at 2021 6:49 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 24 Oct 2021 18:49:30 -0400

We're going to need specifics on the other stuff, as for the guidon. Story time.

When I was with my last unit and we were deployed, some pranksters who got off light in my opinion, thought it would be fun to go around stealing the various state, morale, and unit flags of the units in the AO. As many units had a day shift and a night shift and would leave their flags flying well into the evening. One flag that was stolen was apparently the last American Flag to be flown at Taji, as you can imagine people were pissed.

My unit, a maintenance unit, went around creating lock boxes and improving or creating better flag poles from materials they were able to create, order, or scrounge. The battalion flag wasn't even able to come down, you get to get on a cherry picker and unlock it from the pole. BN really didn't want anyone touching their colors. I digress though.

A young Soldier was out and about with his 1SG from another unit, and they spotted a guy stuffing our State Flag given to us by our State CSM, which like the equivalent of a Division CSM, down his pants. The flag was to be flown overseas and returned home to be honorably displayed. A tradition held by every unit that deploys, they take the flag, fly it for the duration, and then return it. So the 1SG and the young troop sprint after this guy, because who the hell stuffs a flag in their pants?

Any who, young troop catches this guy and his buddy who were caught red handed taking flags from units poles. Our young hero gets a company level challenge coin, and I think a COA from BN, and of course a personal thank you from the command team. Their CSM proceeded to destroy them with PT, they were stuck doing PT on CSM's time and it wasn't fun. Kept them clear of paperwork, but I think it was too light as one of them was a CPL and the other a SPC. I'd have given them an article 15 and dropped them to PFC and put them on every flag and ceremonial detail for the rest of the deployment myself, but hey I'm not in charge.

So fast forward, my unit created these poles and lock boxes that made it difficult or near impossible to steal flags from our AO. The flags were also taken in before dark. What wasn't taken in one night? Our guidon. I suspect it was those two loser E4's, or at least friends of theirs, but the MP's and the mass search never found it and no one fessed up even with a final amnesty offer. Our guidon that had been with us for the whole deployment and for awhile before that, gone. 1SG wasn't happy, but they didn't punish the whole unit for it, or anyone for it. The commander decided to stay late one day with some of his staff and get some extra work done, the commander always wanted the guidon out while he was in the CP to let others know he was home so to speak.

So in short it was the commanders fault the guidon was out later than usual, as no lower enlisted and most of the NCO's and officers were gone for the day. The commander was a hard worker and stayed late often enough, but this was the first time he stayed as late as he did. It wasn't anyone in the formations fault, just some loser with too much time on their hands. So our command saw no reason to punish or re-train anyone on it. The maintenance shop did come up with a locking device for guidon's after that though, so prepped for the future I guess.

That said, command teams taking it seriously should be expected. There are douche bags in our formations.

Response by SFC Don Ward made Oct 30 at 2021 12:10 AM

SFC Don Ward — Sat, 30 Oct 2021 00:10:49 -0400

When the Guidon Bearer left for the day, he/she should have secured their charge (the Guidon) for the day.