Can someone tell me what 670-1 says on the wearing of the army green Fleece in civilian clothing

2014-03-19T15:18:39-04:00

I work in a high rise building for a mortgage company. There are 13 floors and a basement. There is a EMT school in the basement. I have seen Naval, Airforce, and Army service member's in my building conducting various business.In said schooling in the basement I have notice a soldier wearing the army green fleece while wearing civilian clothing. As soldiers are we not supposed to mix and match the uniform? can said soldier wear it as long as he takes the tapes and rank off?I have been told that we can't but cant find in the 670-1 wear it says it. I want to be correct if I say something to this soldier. He is a PFC.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 19 at 2014 3:28 PM

2014-03-19T15:28:23-04:00

Yes I have always been told, as long as you have removed the name tapes you are good to go,

But with that said if you get yourself one of those green fleeces without the option to put a name tape on there whose to say it doesn't look like any other green fleece?

But I see it all the time around my unit, name tapes off after hours, makes for a pretty comfy jacket

Response by SSG Jason Hoadley made Mar 19 at 2014 3:35 PM

2014-03-19T15:35:25-04:00

This is an area that is not exactly covered in the current AR 670-1...

As long as it is "sanitized" there is not much harm being done.

But if your local command has spoke up against it, you should follow their orders..

As we all know The Regs are written in a way that they added too, but not taken from.

Good on you for wanting to make sure your Correct before correcting someone else!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 19 at 2014 3:43 PM

2014-03-19T15:43:09-04:00

Unfortunately, this is not yet covered in AR 670-1. Perhaps they address this in the new update that everyone is so eagerly awaiting...

But yes, I agree with everyone else's assessment that as long as you sanitize it and take off the name tape, US Army, and Rank, it should be good to go. Although, I will admit that I think it looks a little silly to wear it in civilian clothing. I can understand the older black fleece jacket...

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 19 at 2014 9:58 PM

2014-03-19T21:58:48-04:00

Hmmmm, I wonder if anyone would say anything about my army issued black fleece's that are no longer authorized for wear in uniform...

Response by SPC(P) Estus Hibbard made Mar 22 at 2014 1:20 AM

2014-03-22T01:20:47-04:00

The following link seems to be the closest I could find on an exact answer, but the consensus seems to be that it all depends on a post's policy and that it should be sanitized (removal of rank, name tapes, etc.).

http://community.armystudyguide.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/ [login to see] /m/ [login to see]

Green Fleece Jacket - Topic

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 22 at 2014 2:17 AM

2014-03-22T02:17:55-04:00

If it doesn't say your name or rank, I don't see a problem. I would ask your NCO support channel to see their thoughts since they would be getting the call if someone "calls you out" and reports you.. I look at it like wearing a tan t-shirt to wash your truck on sunday or wearing "PT" socks with civilian clothes.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 22 at 2014 10:01 AM

2014-03-22T10:01:15-04:00

Personally, I do not like to use my Army gear/equipment when off duty. However there's nothing wrong with what you doing regarding regs. However,ensure that your equipment is serviceable and clean and you should be good.

Response by 1SG Shane Hansen made Mar 22 at 2014 11:52 AM

2014-03-22T11:52:12-04:00

AR 670-1, para 1-10e. (pdf pg. 28)

"The wear of a combination of military and civilian clothing is prohibited...."

Stripping nametapes off of a uniform does not make it not a military clothing item. As far as old uniforms that are past their wear out date, they are no longer covered and are not active military uniforms so, in my theory, it should not be an issue wearing those worn out items (such as BDUs and the black PT cap).

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 23 at 2014 3:17 AM

2014-03-23T03:17:44-04:00

As far as I have been told by my chain of command is that the only thing you can wear out of uniform and with civilian cloths is the pt shirt but during deployment we was authorized to wear tan shirts while in pt uniform due to laundry taking multiple days

Response by SFC Daniel Faires made Mar 31 at 2014 4:46 PM

2014-03-31T16:46:20-04:00

My question to you is this, besides the fact it isnt a violation if it is sanitized( i can pick up a army issue green fleece from the goodwill or an army navy store) . what is the real reason of worrying about it, You are obviously in the reserves ( I am the UA for my guard unit) If he is working in the basement maybe its cold? maybe he does not make as much money as you , maybe he does not have the resources to buy a comfortable jacket that will keep him warm. in this day and age of REG.REG.REG , we are forgetting the most important part of leadership that is taking care of a Soldier. if anyone is willing to show me where a National guard member and or a Reserve Member cannot wear the items they are issued (santized) I will gladly back you up in this argument.  Active duty members sorry folks do not understand the issues facing some of Soldiers , Homelessness, living on the Drill Check and watching that disappear ina fast minute when the budget isnt passed. I am more worried in this day and age of unemployment, PTSD, Suicide, Sexual Assaults about Soldier care than if a underemployed SPC is wearing a sanitized Green fleece to stay warm. Rant over

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 21 at 2014 10:39 PM

2014-06-21T22:39:25-04:00

The soldier is actually allowed to wear the green fleece if the name tapes are removed. I am a PFC but in our USARAK blue book 600-2. It specifies that the fleece can be worn if name tapes removed.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Jan 24 at 2015 4:58 PM

2015-01-24T16:58:23-05:00

I have an aftermarket green fleece I purchased at a surplus store. It meets the Army's specifications but I don't wear it anymore due to it being too large on me. If I stripped off the Velcro I might get away with wearing it.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 28 at 2015 1:38 PM

2015-01-28T13:38:14-05:00

I am having an issue finding paragraph 1-10e in AR 670-1 as it stops at 1-7. Also in paragraph 12-3 it states “Occasions for wear a. All-purpose wear. The physical fitness uniform is authorized for wear on and off duty, on and off the installation, unless restricted by the commander. Soldiers may wear all or part of the physical fitness uniform with civilian attire off the installation, unless restricted by the commander. The physical fitness uniform is not intended for wear as an all purpose uniform when other uniforms are more appropriate. Also, it is authorized as an outer garment but not specified for civilian or military attire. Paragraph 3-7e does state wearing a combination of civilian and military clothing is prohibited unless prescribed in this regulation or directed by Secretary of the Army. So have we found more gray area in the Army as all Gen III outer garments from wind breaker to Marshmallow top are authorized to wear weather dependant. For more see 3-9g and h stating what is authorized for wear in civilian attire.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 28 at 2015 5:42 PM

2015-01-28T17:42:32-05:00

"f. No part of a prescribed uniform, except those items not exclusively military in character, may be worn with civilian clothing.

g. Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by males are restricted to the gold cuff links, studs, tie, 15bar, mourning band, footwear, socks, gloves, undergarments, black bow-tie, wool scarf, all-weather coat, fleece caps, and physical training uniforms.

h. Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by females are restricted to the white shirt without insignia of grade, undergarments, footwear, gloves, handbag, clutch purse, wool scarf, all-weather coat, fleece caps, and physical training uniforms.

i. Uniform items that have been declared obsolete may be worn with civilian clothing, provided such items contain no distinctive insignia or buttons."

[AR 670–1 • 15 September 2014, 3-9, Civilian Clothing]

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Jan 28 at 2015 11:11 PM

2015-01-28T23:11:12-05:00

In AR 670-1 one can find rules on mixing civilian attire and military uniform items in chapters 27-30.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Apr 24 at 2015 10:28 PM

2015-04-24T22:28:16-04:00

I have an old pair of FRAC ACU pants I had on deployment. I paid a tailor to convert them into some cargo shorts. I think I paid him $10. I could have went online and paid for some that cost over $30 plus shipping. So far no one has said anything to me. I wear them proudly on mandatory fun days, to the junk yard and where ever else I want.

Response by SrA Paul Pfeil made Jan 23 at 2016 1:43 PM

2016-01-23T13:43:55-05:00

Unless you wear the uniform or know the regs, mind your oun business. If they are no longer serving as long as there is no insignia, it can be worn. If still in, as long they are not identifying as military, it could be clothing bought at a army navy store. Again mind your oun business. If they are in full uniform and there is something out of place go ahead tactfully and quietly speak to them with respect. Again know own the regs, and be someone that has or is wearing a uniform.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 23 at 2016 3:15 PM

2016-01-23T15:15:03-05:00

The fact that you would call this soldier out on a sanitized fleece is ridiculous. Do you take your hat off indoors when you are wearing civilian clothes. That's in AR670-1. The ref also states that the wear of the fleece must be authorized by the commander. Know your red sergeant before you call out a troop and you better make Shute you are squared away as well if you are going to be nit picky cause it's embarrassing if a troop calls you out for a uniform violation. Set the standard

Response by PO1 Pete Sikes made Jan 23 at 2016 4:06 PM

2016-01-23T16:06:46-05:00

The Navy has a specific list of what can and cannot be worn in civilian clothes. Nothing similar for the Army?

Response by SGT Randel Pruett made Jan 23 at 2016 5:30 PM

2016-01-23T17:30:23-05:00

It only applies to those on active duty..... That's why they are called Military regulations. I'm a Veteran, I still wear a lot of the old og-107 types of clothing, and yes I mix them with civilian attire.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 14 at 2016 8:28 PM

2016-07-14T20:28:43-04:00

this answered my question

Response by SSG Jb King made Aug 4 at 2017 4:21 PM

2017-08-04T16:21:30-04:00

Honestley alot of guys from my prior units that are now ets'd civi's still wear the silky's pt shorts, still wear t shirts still use socks and even the fleece , i happen to know a ton of vets from various branches wsho use old uniforms to hunt in instead of spending big money on camo they already have, uniform never made the soldier, tab never made the man, rank never made you right DONT MISS THE BIG PICTURE

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2017 4:56 PM

2017-08-04T16:56:28-04:00

I don't really see a problem. What if he bought it on his own?

Response by CPL Jack Baker made Aug 4 at 2017 6:13 PM

2017-08-04T18:13:10-04:00

OPSEC people. If you want to wear civies, wear them, dont mix and match and mark yourself as a target for foreign or domestic (dependa)

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2017 6:38 PM

2017-08-04T18:38:00-04:00

Forst I would make sure they are in the uniformed services so I don't make an ass of urself, u don't want to a vet of something that they may not be doing

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Aug 4 at 2017 6:51 PM

2017-08-04T18:51:32-04:00

I learned something

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 4 at 2017 6:56 PM

2017-08-04T18:56:53-04:00

As always, Commanders discretion.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 5 at 2017 4:25 AM

2017-08-05T04:25:57-04:00

As long as the name tapes/rank insignia are removed it's no longer a 'uniform' item and it is authorized

Response by SPC Craig Miller made Apr 5 at 2018 5:10 PM

2018-04-05T17:10:36-04:00

I am really glad the MP's are on the case enforcing sanitized fleeces. I miss my days as a medic assigned to an MP company. You could be sure there was no dead horse left unbeaten, as the blue falcon soared and viewed from the skies.

Response by LCpl Richard Brennan made Apr 5 at 2018 7:19 PM

2018-04-05T19:19:12-04:00

Find something better to worry about.

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Apr 5 at 2018 9:04 PM

2018-04-05T21:04:07-04:00

Prove that he is a soldier!. Seriously, any portion of a uniform, without patches, US Army, etc., rank- is just a piece of clothing. What if they bought it and it isn't their issue item?

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2018 1:38 PM

2018-04-06T13:38:00-04:00

Except civilians can buy Army issued fleece jackets

Response by SPC Daniel Alexander made Apr 6 at 2018 2:42 PM

2018-04-06T14:42:18-04:00

The fleece is not part of any uniform. As long as he doesn't have tapes on the fleece it is allowed. You need to stay out of current standards and not try and correct people when you are not active duty. Standards change and most of 670-1 is up to that particular soldiers unit.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2018 4:06 PM

2018-04-06T16:06:59-04:00

Maybe consult AR 670-1, that seems like something within a sergeants purview.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2018 5:58 PM

2018-04-06T17:58:28-04:00

Somebody better update USARAK

Response by 1LT David Perry made Apr 6 at 2018 7:40 PM

2018-04-06T19:40:52-04:00

If he is a civilian and not a government employee he is not covered by 670-1 or any other AR for that matter. there are no civilian rule (laws) that forbid it, and the military can't enforce it.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2018 8:39 PM

2018-04-06T20:39:27-04:00

I know you want to do the right thing, but maybe he just doesn't have a jacket? Not really sure that would bother me to be honest.

Response by PO1 William Ewing made Apr 6 at 2018 9:25 PM

2018-04-06T21:25:13-04:00

Under federal law, it's not a uniform without the insignia. That's what decides whether impersonation of a servicemember can be charged or not. That's why the navy changed their regs to require petty officers to put crows on pea coats, so they could keep us from using them like that. I'd be surprised if the army regs tried to make something legal under federal law to be against instruction, rather than dancing around it the way the navy did.

Response by CPT Dave Cassalia made Apr 6 at 2018 11:00 PM

2018-04-06T23:00:34-04:00

Crap I was in so long that army changed uniforms s 5 times

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2018 1:31 AM

2018-04-07T01:31:32-04:00

Only POG mother fuckers wear the fleece any way

Response by SPC Robert DeVolld made Apr 7 at 2018 2:50 AM

2018-04-07T02:50:17-04:00

Who gives a shiy

Response by SGT Tj Casiano made Apr 7 at 2018 5:35 AM

2018-04-07T05:35:44-04:00

I'm glad I'm a civilian at this point, because I still wear parts of my ACU uniform whenever I want to.

Response by LCDR Tim McKenzie made Apr 7 at 2018 8:45 AM

2018-04-07T08:45:10-04:00

Medals of retirees have been worn on civilian suits for centuries. It is an appropriate custom. The black and brown shoes are worn by many civilian clothes, likewise, many purchase civilian boots and shoes that look very similar to the ones sold at a uniform store. This practice has long been considered satisfactory. When I was in the Navy, there were many that said a flight jacket could not be worn with civvies. The uniform regs did not address this specifically. I wore mine frequently (had a copy of the regs concerning jacket wear in the jacket pocket). I was challenged a few times as an O3 and below. Usually by a senior enlisted or other officer who did not understand the regs. I’d quote the regs and show it to them. Then I’d counter attack: you are wearing a flight jacket but are not aircrew or a flight surgeon (at the time many non flyers wore the green flight jacket— not allowed at that time for non flyers). They were worn by everyone. Once a fellow pilot I knew from a different squadron mentioned my jacket being worn with civvies. I told him that his entire squadron (as were most) was out of regs as they wore squadron colored t-shirts under their flight suits. At the time the regs called for white or green T-shirt’s. The entire Navy was out of regs concerning flight suit name tags. Most squadrons wore fabric tags that were squadron colors. The regs called for brown or black leather. There was so much hypocrisy in the Navy concerning uniform wear. My most common retort: I’m not out of uniform, however you are out of uniform as your hair is touching your ears, your gig line is off, you are overweight (lots of fat bodies in the Navy) and need to square yourself away. I always had polished boots and pressed khakis. My COs knew I was right, left me alone as my personal appearance in uniform was always immaculate.

Response by SSG Jeff Fishel made Apr 7 at 2018 9:37 AM

2018-04-07T09:37:46-04:00

I am retired try to make me not wear a mix lol

Response by LeRoss Sawin-Porter made Apr 7 at 2018 11:19 AM

2018-04-07T11:19:31-04:00

Well, I wear a boonie hat when im working outdoors, along with a pair of hot weather boots, is this wrong? I don't believe in wearing the camo blouse and trousers. However, there was a person who used to live with us who would frequently walk around town in full bdu. I believe that if you respectfully use it, and don't overdo it, then its within reason to wear at least a sweater or something like that with civilian clothes.

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2018 1:49 PM

2018-04-07T13:49:05-04:00

How bout just minding your own buisness there spotlight ranger

Response by SSG Gh Sebastian made Apr 7 at 2018 2:11 PM

2018-04-07T14:11:16-04:00

If you are now a civilian why do you care? Chill

Response by SGT Spencer Lopez made Apr 7 at 2018 2:28 PM

2018-04-07T14:28:11-04:00

You have nothing better to do with your time than to worry about a soldier not on duty wearing the fleece without name tapes, while you are in your civilian job? Lame.

Response by SPC Jonathan Fretwell made Apr 7 at 2018 6:03 PM

2018-04-07T18:03:03-04:00

I really don’t know the book answer to this. However, I believe it’s dishonorable to wear any part of a military uniform along civilian clothing period. However, a lot of us worked out in the army pt shirt in the gym on post. I don’t think the pt uniform is held to such honor. BDUs, ACUs, dress, etc are all a no with civilians. However, I did wear under armor base layer when deployed, but that isn’t visible and fully covered. I would assume base layer would be counted as underwear. I also used different socks as well, but that was to prevent blisters and foot problems which were also covered by the boots and bottoms. I know there are companies like outdoor research and REI that made heatgear that was ultra light, ultra tough, and very breathable wicking like the uniform version. However, we’re talking field and deployment verses walking around on post.

Response by Maj Shawn Cape made Apr 7 at 2018 6:09 PM

2018-04-07T18:09:04-04:00

One more situation where a soldier says “fuck the regulations. I’ll do what I want, when I want” and no one in the army cares enough to do anything about it. When does a soldier have the right to decide if a law, rule, or regulation is up to their standards? When does it end? “I don’t feel like going on patrol today,” or “I don’t feel like driving these supplies to the front”...

Once you allow the cycle to begin it’s almost impossible to turn around.

Response by 1SG John Ginn made Apr 8 at 2018 1:38 AM

2018-04-08T01:38:29-04:00

I would only allow it temporarily if the weather was extremely harsh and cold and only if no other clothing was available. It would be a one time exception. That troop needs to visit the PX or surplus store.

Response by SSG Erik McKinster made Apr 8 at 2018 10:09 AM

2018-04-08T10:09:26-04:00

Thank God I got the black one and don't have to worry about pretty crap like this.

Response by SFC Everett Lunday made Apr 8 at 2018 10:11 AM

2018-04-08T10:11:05-04:00

I see, this is about military personnel wearing parts of their uniform, sans rank or emblems. Being that they’re military members one must look to the regulation(s) and follow it.

Response by SGT Timothy Strashinsky made Apr 8 at 2018 1:22 PM

2018-04-08T13:22:17-04:00

The grey fleece good with no tapes

Response by SFC Tereasa Menke made Apr 8 at 2018 6:45 PM

2018-04-08T18:45:03-04:00

Look in At 700-84. It says it there!!! I promise you!!

Response by SSG Leo Seldon made Apr 8 at 2018 7:48 PM

2018-04-08T19:48:36-04:00

Good point SFC Faires, they can also go to war at the age of 17 or 18 but can’t buy beer or cigs, people always winning about small stuff.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 8 at 2018 10:19 PM

2018-04-08T22:19:39-04:00

My understand is that if you are Active or Reserve you cannot mix and match uniform items with civilian clothes. Taking nametapes off doesn't make it ok to wear with civies.

Response by SSG Ron Raade made Apr 8 at 2018 11:51 PM

2018-04-08T23:51:51-04:00

Nice warm jacket you can buy anywhere. So who cares, loosen up and enjoy life and worry about you. It isn't a big deal.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2018 12:02 AM

2018-04-09T00:02:50-04:00

Dear god, lets worry about this monstrous issue we’re having in the military and not the mountain of others. If this is the only problem you’re having during your Army experience I am beyond jealous of you

Response by SPC Mark Schroeder made Apr 9 at 2018 2:32 AM

2018-04-09T02:32:36-04:00

Honestly if you’re no longer enlisted or commissioned. Fuck those who don’t like it. It’s clothing that’s been paid for. Use it.

Response by CW3 Robert Haffly made Apr 9 at 2018 10:39 AM

2018-04-09T10:39:51-04:00

I know I don't wear my old uniform items anymore. For some reason every time I wash them they continue to get smaller. Guess that's what happens when you retire (25 years ago next month).

Response by MSgt Edward Hayes made Apr 9 at 2018 5:08 PM

2018-04-09T17:08:12-04:00

Define military clothing. I see it as issue items. Many other items may be authorized for ware but not part of the mandatory showdown list. Now remember I retired in ‘92, but several items were authorized by AF personal. Among them was the heavy overcoat, the lite weight blue jacket, and other optional items. Some special issue items like parkas were authorized civilian wear if approved by the members command. All said, wearing of uniform items is tacky. Name tags and rank would be removed. I also have a personal objection from donating uniform it’s to good will!!!

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2018 5:13 PM

2018-04-09T17:13:53-04:00

I have a question for you. Have you checked AR 670-1 to see if this is permitted? Is the green fleece even a prescribed uniform item? You are a SGT(P). You should be schooling us on this situation, I think. Believe it or not, some items in the clothing bag in the past (I can't say currently) were authorized by regulation for wear with civilian attire. The old grey raincoat and the wool overcoat were two examples. One thing that has not changed is the commander's latitude in establishing uniform policy. Commanders, especially GOs, have a great deal of authority in this matter. That's why you see variations in uniforms at different posts.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2018 5:40 PM

2018-04-09T17:40:20-04:00

If he purchased with his own money it's not a violation. If we're talking about a fleece. Get over it. I can get a brown or green fleece from any store that makes look alike put some velcro on there & it now looks like military issue. Acu parts of course. But if it's a fleece ignore it. Get passed it.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 9 at 2018 5:55 PM

2018-04-09T17:55:16-04:00

To be technical, how do you know, that what he's wearing in an actual army issued fleece jacket? It can be a knock off. He can wear knock offs if he wants. So you would have to ask him to look for the NSN in the jacket, if there is no NSN then technically it's not an issued garment. So he can wear it. Start there first then you can worry about AR 670-1. but if I was him, and I'm in the reserves, I again technically dont have to show you the internal parts of my civilian clothes while off duty. because that would be again technically sexual harrassment or just plain harassment. So good luck bud, just let this one die. Carry on, move on.

Response by SSG Christopher Cannon made Apr 9 at 2018 11:14 PM

2018-04-09T23:14:48-04:00

Listen lieutenant I have more time than grade in Boots than you have in the Army you definitely need to know you're lame there is NCO business and there's officer business the faster you learn this the quicker you will not be a lieutenant anymore stay in your lane Know Your Role and shut your mouth have a great day

Response by TSgt Nicholas Nieves made Apr 9 at 2018 11:46 PM

2018-04-09T23:46:33-04:00

WHEN I FIRST GOT INTO THE MILITARY IN 1963, EVERYONE USED MIXED UNIFORMS AND CIVILIAN CLOTHS AS LONG AS THEY DIDNT HAVE STRIPES AND UNIT PATCHES....NO BIG DEAL

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 8:42 AM

2018-04-10T08:42:00-04:00

Like the SFC said below. I can buy it at a goodwill, thrift, OR army surplus store which are civilian ran. I bought it with my money off post I say it's civilian wear now. And really who cares, so many regs the army doesn t enforce anyways.

Response by SGT Daniel Hogan made Apr 10 at 2018 10:51 AM

2018-04-10T10:51:46-04:00

I got out in 2012. As a civilian, AR 670-1 doesn’t apply to me. If get my hands on even a current uniform fleece, I can wear it. As ling as I don’t represent myself as a soldier, which is against many local laws, I’ll do whatever I want. Are we really all that concerned over a damn fleece?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 11:33 AM

2018-04-10T11:33:58-04:00

As far as I can tell the fleece jacket with out name tapes and rank is authorized in civilians along with the black fleece cap riggers belts and combat boots. These are all items any Army Navy surplus store would carry. Funny story Fort Drum has or has a policy that the fleece isn’t to be worn as a visible outer garment, go figure it has name tapes. I would say I’d watch what you say to people when calling them out. May this Soldiers command or commander authorized it. Maybe as some one pointed might be his only jacket PFCs don’t make much in a drill status. You could for what ever reason find out his unit and talk to his leadership about it but don’t think it’s an issue with the fleece.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 11:42 AM

2018-04-10T11:42:19-04:00

The mixing of uniforms is prohibited with soldiers on military orders. AR 670-1 , 3-7. This section is entirely about the prohibitions or allowances of wearing the full uniform (or seemingly so, take it for what you will). The civilian section denotes (3-9) that items not exclusively military in character may be worn with civilian clothing. I would argue that the fleece is not strictly military in character. You can go to any outlet and find plenty of items very similar to the ugly “green” fleece. Having used to have worked at a military/law enforcement supply store, you can get many that are very similar with/without nametapes sections etc. Same with the waffle-tops, etc. I would hope he wouldn’t have rank on there, because that would be absolutely ridiculous. But if it’s worn sterile, it’s similar enough to any civilian items of the same type that it shouldn’t be in conflict with AR 670-1. Although, AR 670-1 doesn’t denote whether or not an item would have to be sterile anyways. Just not exclusively military in nature. The mixing of military and civilian clothing is much too vague in section 3-7, it’s about the wear of the uniform specifically and then refers to military clothing, yet 3-9 says you can wear what’s not exclusively military in nature. They should specify a little more.

Response by SFC Phillip Allen made Apr 10 at 2018 12:45 PM

2018-04-10T12:45:48-04:00

Please correct me if I am wrong, but isn’t the OCP pattern the current standard? ACUs are retired/obsolete now, right? The original black fleece can be worn, as well as the grey/green ACU fleece; the current standard is the brown issue fleece, right? So he should OK with wearing it as long as it’s sanitized right?

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 1:07 PM

2018-04-10T13:07:50-04:00

You can buy the same stuff from retail stores.. and I know that while I was stationed at fort hood.. there wasn't much need for buying winter clothes when it's rarely cold.. so you see ppl with fleeces and pt jackets all over.

Response by MAJ John Moran made Apr 10 at 2018 5:53 PM

2018-04-10T17:53:43-04:00

The fleece jacket isn’t a “uniform item”. It’s “cold weather equipment”.

Don’t be a reg nazi.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 7:26 PM

2018-04-10T19:26:22-04:00

Buy him a jacket then.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 8:36 PM

2018-04-10T20:36:59-04:00

It also depends on the local commanders. While I was stationed at Ft Lewis post policy was that any uniform item could be worn with civilian clothing per the post commander. Every in DA-pam 670-1 and AR 670-1 is up to the commanders discretion.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 9:21 PM

2018-04-10T21:21:46-04:00

Honestly, who gives a damn. If he’s in civies and it’s stripped; what’s the problem? There are bigger fish to fry than to worry about some dude wearing a sweater when it’s cold. SFC- Army

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 9:30 PM

2018-04-10T21:30:29-04:00

Settle down, stay in your lane, and fire gods sake, get a life...

Response by CPL Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 10 at 2018 10:04 PM

2018-04-10T22:04:01-04:00

Not in my unit, not under my command, sanitized, no "stolen valor" aspirations ------ means-------------- none of my business

Response by SFC Roberto Mollinedo made Apr 11 at 2018 12:04 AM

2018-04-11T00:04:05-04:00

1SG get a life, there more important things to be concerned about.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2018 12:54 AM

2018-04-11T00:54:01-04:00

Must be pretty lonely in the world for you if this is your biggest concern

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2018 12:59 AM

2018-04-11T00:59:56-04:00

there are many civilians that have the fleece jackets and wear them so I don't see any reason guardsmen can't.

Response by Sgt John Street made Apr 11 at 2018 1:17 AM

2018-04-11T01:17:27-04:00

I am retired I'll wear what I want to. And by the way you can take those regs and put them where the sun don't shine. I will not wear anything stupid like a beret or dress uniform, but if I'm cold I have a field jacket to wear , or if I'm in the woods who says I can't wear cammies.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2018 10:52 AM

2018-04-11T10:52:22-04:00

AR 670-1 3-9 f. states, “No part of a prescribed uniform, except those items not exclusively military in character, may be worn with civilian clothing.”

3-9 g. States, “Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by males are restricted to the gold cuff links, studs, tie bar, mourning band, footwear, socks, gloves, undergarments, black bow-tie, wool scarf, all-weather coat, fleece caps, and physical training uniforms.”

3-9 h. States, “Uniform items authorized for wear with civilian clothing by females are restricted to the white shirt without insignia of grade, footwear, gloves, handbag, clutch purse, wool scarf, all-weather coat, fleece caps, and physical training uniforms.”

So wear of tan boots with civvies is authorized. There is no mention of the fleece jacket. Hopefully this clears it up.

Response by SGT Kevin Moon made Apr 11 at 2018 4:08 PM

2018-04-11T16:08:34-04:00

As a leader i have bigger issues to worry about with my soldiers than the wearing of a stripped down fleece

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2018 4:56 PM

2018-04-11T16:56:49-04:00

This could just be Alaska, but:
USARAK Pamphlet 600-2 26 October 2015

“5.7 Mixed Uniforms
Wearing a combination of civilian and military clothing, while in uniform is prohibited, unless as prescribed in AR/DA PAM 670-1 or authorization documents approved by HQDA.
(1) The use of ECWCS items [which is where the fleece falls into, Level 3] May be used off duty during recreational activities such as skiing, snowshoeing, Etc. When wearing ECWCS for these activities, Soldiers must remove all affiliating items from the uniforms such as US Army tape, and unit patches.”

Alaska is cold, they let you store TA-50 in your car even for emergency purposes. As for the fleece, you can literally by that at any Army/Navy Surplus.

Response by CPL Jon McMillen made Apr 11 at 2018 7:06 PM

2018-04-11T19:06:28-04:00

Don't you have better shit to worry about? If you're so damn concerned, buy the kid a jacket. Otherwise let his CoC take care of the issue, and quit trying to be Super Regulation Man

Response by AN Laurie Dalton Maynard made Apr 11 at 2018 7:10 PM

2018-04-11T19:10:34-04:00

My boyfriend Dalton wears his camouflaged field jacket. Once he had a National Guard say something to him about it and his reply was that he had the right to wear that jacket anytime or anywhere he pleased.

Response by SPC William Smith made Apr 11 at 2018 7:40 PM

2018-04-11T19:40:10-04:00

When I was in the Army, lots would wear the dress oxfords while in civvies. MP's would put anyone on report for this. Some wore field jackets with civvies, too. Big time no-no.

Response by SGT Jon Creager made Apr 11 at 2018 9:01 PM

2018-04-11T21:01:51-04:00

Are you sure its Army? Maybe it is a look alike!
Here is what happened at Graf why back in the 1991 after D Storm.. My friend and I drove up from Erlangen and was fishing legally. I dont remember the lakes on the north tank trail. Anyway he had some cargo pants in woodland camouflage. They also had CABELAS tags on them. Well the post CSM drove by in his POV. He and the CSM got into a pissing contest over the trousers. The CSm told him to stay there and wait for the MPs to come and arrest him for being out of uniform. I told my friend lets go, I know the way out we will never see the MP and the CSM does not know where we are from!!
My friend refused to leave, he wanted to make a point. I told him E-4 against the CSM is not going to go well.
MP shows up arrest my friend,so down to the MP station we go. CSM was there and ask why we did not just leave. I looked him in the eyes and said He want to prove a point. CSM and I talked a bit I said look the pants have Cabelas tags on them. Still the argument had already taken place. and CSm was making a point.
CSM said your first sgt has to come get him. I looked and said from Erlangen?? Anyway a call to the 1st got my friend released to me. With the understanding Monday Morning 9Am the first and and friend and I be at the CSM office.
So we headed home, old top what went on. Top said call the 7 ATC Commander and see if he will be in. That Commander and I had been very good friends, we deer hunted and hog hunted in Germany together.

So we made the 70 mile trip to the 7ATC CSM office. with the pants from Cablelas in hand. When we arrive the Commander asked why we were there. I explained. He called the CSM and the CSm walked in the door was shut and the CSM was made to spell the Cabelas label twice.

Yes the pants were woodland camo, cargo pants, but they were in fact from Cabelas.

So make sure your fleece is not after market.

Response by AA Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 11 at 2018 9:35 PM

2018-04-11T21:35:37-04:00

As navy I know we are allowed to wear out fleece, and some other jackets issued to us, as long as rank pins and names are not present

Response by SPC Charles Batchelor made Apr 11 at 2018 11:08 PM

2018-04-11T23:08:47-04:00

How do you know he's even a soldier

Response by SFC Rob Geer made Apr 12 at 2018 2:51 AM

2018-04-12T02:51:02-04:00

Wow..... Just Wow.

Response by SSgt Robert Aarnes made Apr 12 at 2018 5:37 AM

2018-04-12T05:37:25-04:00

I think I’ll wear what ever I want with what ever I want. They don’t seem to give a damn about my disability. They just use you up and spit you out. I love my country and would proudly serve again, but they can kiss my ass, given the way they treat veterans. Pretty bad when illegal immigrants are treated better than veterans.

Response by SFC Wayne T made Apr 12 at 2018 7:17 AM

2018-04-12T07:17:27-04:00

I wear a currently issued fleece. Come get it. Ridiculous. What happens if that PFC knocks the crap out of you. What happens in that basement may stay in that basement.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 7:28 AM

2018-04-12T07:28:48-04:00

It's not an issue until somebody makes it one is the way that I look at this. I personally do not care because civilians can get these fleeces and those transitioning out keep them too and still wear them.

Response by SPC John Decker made Apr 12 at 2018 11:41 AM

2018-04-12T11:41:40-04:00

Was it issued or did he have to purchase it? I was issued khaki's when I was in. They were discontinued as a wearable uniform. There was never an issue with wearing them off-duty. If I had to purchase an item (I was issued OD green fatigues, had to purchase BDU's), I could wear them off-duty, as long as they had no identifying tags.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 1:09 PM

2018-04-12T13:09:26-04:00

SFC Land, I have had to wear it in the rain and yes it sucks; however, it doesn’t change the nomenclature of the item, which is actually written on the tag, or that it may be worn with civilians, which was my point...

Response by SSG Ronald Rollins made Apr 12 at 2018 4:47 PM

2018-04-12T16:47:20-04:00

It is stupid to worry about the petty stuff that does not matter. I am thankful I am retired. I had senior NCO'S want to give office hours for stuff like this. Meanwhile there are soldiers (NCO s) doing same things or worse and nothing is said. I got sick of being told to stay in my lane. Not to worry about it. I called out a 1SG for yelling at a SPEC for not having a haircut at pt but a SFC shows up no hair cut and unshaven. Nothing said. Selective enforcement. I was then singled out as a trouble maker. As was said soldier care is more important that silly rules that do not matter!

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 8:49 PM

2018-04-12T20:49:47-04:00

The old grey PT is obsolete as of October 2017, btw, if anyone wants to mix it

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 9:26 PM

2018-04-12T21:26:30-04:00

I am active duty soldier wear my fleece jacket with my civis all the time. its so comfortable, I love it so much.

Response by Sgt Patrick Mulcahy made Apr 12 at 2018 9:45 PM

2018-04-12T21:45:54-04:00

Is it wrong to wear military clothing to keep warm if you are homeless? I give clothing to people who need to keep warm. What are the penalties for helping others with military cold weather gear?

Response by MSG Scott McBride made Apr 12 at 2018 10:50 PM

2018-04-12T22:50:15-04:00

I'm retired. I wear my fleece when camping. I fish and hunt in my multicams that I bought. I cut the grass and home improvement in my ACUs. Get over it.

Response by SSgt Ryan Jensen made Apr 13 at 2018 1:09 AM

2018-04-13T01:09:28-04:00

If it's sanitized, I wouldn't worry about it. I would also utilize your own judgment on it as well, in the grand scheme...it's a blip, too many variables about interpretation...what if said individual is a vet, out..said and done with term of service. Those fuckers are comfy, I still wear mine.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 13 at 2018 4:07 PM

2018-04-13T16:07:13-04:00

I think someone became a MP to have an excuse to mess with people. I can only imagine how you act once in uniform...

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 4 at 2018 4:00 AM

2018-05-04T04:00:33-04:00

The fleece is not listed as part of the Combat Uniform Ensemble (AR 670-1, 4-2). Nor is it listed as a Combat Uniform Accessory (AR 670-1, 4-3). Indeed, it does not appear anywhere in AR 670-1. Neither does it appear in Pamphlet 670-1 as part of the Combat Uniform Ensemble (Camp 670-1, 4-2) or as an Accessory (Pamphlet 670-1, 4-3, Chapter 18). Hence, it is not technically part of the "uniform" subject to restriction. I wear mine in civilian attire after stripping off the rank, branch and name tag. It's a functional piece of outdoors clothing. In short, there does not appear to be any regulation governing the wearing of the fleece while in civilian attire.
In contrast, the black cardigan sweater is listed as a Uniform Accessory, but I still cannot imagine anyone complaining about someone wearing a pullover, provided it is stripped of rank, branch and name tag. It looks no different from the civilian or British versions you can buy in surplus stores.
Interestingly, the ECWCS is not listed in the ARs either, so presumably one can go duck hunting in it. No branch name. No name tape. Not part of the uniform according to the regulations. I wear mine when it rains, as it provides excellent rain protection, and don't worry that it's going to cause a ruckus. Of course, I wear my black fleece cap (which is listed as Uniform Accessory) to bed when it's cold, so I suppose I am in technical violation of the regulations since I don't sleep in my PT gear....

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 10 at 2018 1:44 AM

2018-12-10T01:44:26-05:00

This discussion is, I would venture say, much ado about nothing and reminds me of the saying, "I went to war and a garrison broke out." Last time I checked, we had more important things to do - like fight several counterinsurgencies around the world and train for conflict with near peer nation states.

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Jan 11 at 2019 8:32 AM

2019-01-11T08:32:18-05:00

If You wearing those items with civilian clothing and they don't even have insignia on them who cares in the first place. That's not an impersonation of a military member. I gave one of My old woodland camouflage BDU jackets to My oldest son, first the style was now obsolete anyway and the patches were all removed except the sewn on name tag. His last name was the same as mine and how would You impersonate Yourself ? wearing them with blue jeans is hardly a uniform and He also has a beard. Same with BDU pants, who cares ? I don't wear the stuff Myself, I don't want to but it was a warm coat and He is a building contractor that often works outside in all sorts of weather. Myself unless I have the complete uniform, proper haircut and meet all the groom standards I won't wear My uniform at all. and it would have to be an occasion where it would be appropriate although I I've haven't even worn it at all after the day I retired. That however is a complete uniform to which the regulations do apply and the more items You have to try and simulate wearing an actual uniform, then it may be a problem. Don't try to overreach on what is and isn't proper. A jacket even with the insignia still on worn with civilian clothes, again who cares ? Its not a uniform and not being worn to look like it is.

One possible exception on pretty much what is a uniform and they are available in kids sizes, when My son was early elementary school age, I bought Hi a complete set of woodland Camouflage BDU's, child size with all the insignia including rank. I had ordered it was the US Cavalry catalog. No one is going to mistake a 3rd grade kid for a military Member. When He got older that was different and I never provided anything like that nor did He want to wear them. Imagine also He and His friends even had toy guns and went out and played Army ! Guess what ? so did I and My bother when We were kids !

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 20 at 2019 11:34 PM

2019-02-20T23:34:03-05:00

So can I wear my green fleece with rank and name tag on ?... I am in USAR and I wear my fleece mix with civilian clothes to go to school in whole year and no body talked to me about it even Major who in his uniform walked in the Mall... it just doesn't mean I want to show off, I just want to proud myself and stay warm in winter.

Response by Cpl Joseph Roberts made Jan 19 at 2020 4:08 PM

2020-01-19T16:08:49-05:00

I know this is old, but for anyone looking at this today, don't you have more important things to worry about?

Response by SSG Chad Cargill made Jan 19 at 2020 4:10 PM

2020-01-19T16:10:32-05:00

Why do you even care?

Response by SSG Darrell Peters made Jan 19 at 2020 5:17 PM

2020-01-19T17:17:46-05:00

Here is how I look at it. If the soldier is low ranking PVT PFC for example. Does he have enough money to purchase a civilian jacket? The ROTC department at a Kentucky College issued Field Jackets with no name tape or US ARMY. Knowing some students could not afford a winter coat. As far as I know, if there is no insignia on the fleece then he is okay. However, at some point in his military career, it is my opinion he should purchase a civilian equivalent of the fleece if that is his jacket of choice.

Response by SSG Robert Peterson made Jan 19 at 2020 8:47 PM

2020-01-19T20:47:25-05:00

Again I ask, why does this issue keep coming up? Who gives a shit

Response by SPC Leo Van Groll made Jan 20 at 2020 6:05 AM

2020-01-20T06:05:55-05:00

IMO the "fleece" is un-military looking to begin with.

Response by COL William Oseles made Jan 10 at 2021 4:54 PM

2021-01-10T16:54:34-05:00

I tend to look at it this way, when I left the military what the Army did not have me turn is is MINE.
The only time I might wear a FULL uniform would be at an event for which it is appropriate for me to wear Uniform.
And if it is forbidden to wear parts of the uniform then it would be illegal for civilian surplus stores to sell parts of the uniform.

Response by SP5 Hank Vandenburgh PhD made Jan 10 at 2021 9:43 PM

2021-01-10T21:43:20-05:00

My M-65 field jacket is my go-to jacket in the winter. I've been out for 62 years, and I actually wore a predecessor to this model. I don't have any military insignia on it. Just my take.

Response by Cpl Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 11 at 2021 2:42 PM

2021-01-11T14:42:23-05:00

I am in USMC, not Army, so I don't know if the green fleece is a uniform item or organizational gear, which, if the latter, may be the reason it is not in 670-1. With recruiting numbers down, though, I would ignore it unless he is doing things contrary to good order and discipline or that reflect poorly on the armed forces. Also, as a general rule, if you have to look up the reg to see if you are right, it is probably not worth risking a bad first impression. If you do choose to correct, I would do so by getting him to look into it, that way he will get his commands policy, and you can approach it as a concerned friend instead of a regulation thumping NCO. While obedience should be expected regardless, a friendly word is received best. These are my observations from the bottom, take them for what you will.

Response by SGM Stephen Villalpando made Jan 11 at 2021 3:15 PM

2021-01-11T15:15:55-05:00

If he isn't wearing any insignia of rank and is not representing himself as a military member, I don't see what the problem is. I still wear my field jacket (without rank insignia) when it is cold. I don't remember ever seeing anything that prohibits that. It is my jacket, I paid for it, so who is going to tell me that I can't wear it. Steve Villalpando, SGM, USA, Ret.

Response by SGM Stephen Villalpando made Jan 11 at 2021 3:25 PM

2021-01-11T15:25:02-05:00

I would say that if he has removed the rank and other official insignia, it is fine for him to wear it. I still wear my field jacket (without insignia) when it gets really cold. It is mine, I paid for it, and I no longer represent myself as a military member, so I don't see how it would violate any regulations.
Steve Villalpando, SGM, USA (Ret.)

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 12 at 2021 5:49 PM

2021-01-12T17:49:20-05:00

The fleece is not part of any prescribed uniform. The prescribed uniforms are spelled out in AR 670-1.