Corrective training after 2 weeks of the incident?

2014-05-05T20:45:58-04:00

Scenario: SGT Joe Snuffy verbally disrespected a senior NCO and failed to obey direct orders in front of his peers and junior enlisted personnel. That Soldier has never been initially counseled, never received had a derogatory 4856, neither has been quarterly counseled. Can that senior NCO recommend SGT Joe Snuffy for UCMJ action after 2 weeks of the incident? Does that Soldier have every right to an IG complaint? What do you think the outcome would be?

Response by CPT Jacob Swartout made May 5 at 2014 8:54 PM

2014-05-05T20:54:24-04:00

First of all why was the Soldier not initially counseled by a NCO? As much as he/she has failed to maintain military bearing and professionalism by disrespecting a senior NCO, he/she was not given proper counseling either. No its not right that the Soldier did this to begin with, but at the same time the chain of command is going to want to see the counseling packet. If nothing is in it, then I foresee a 1SG taking come correction action first. Reason I say this because it happened in one of my former units.

Response by SFC Douglas Eshenbaugh made May 6 at 2014 4:28 AM

2014-05-06T04:28:54-04:00

There is too many ways this could have gone down to know. If it was a matter of a misunderstanding of an order then the ship has sailed on that one. If its along the lines of sedition then it won't matter what counseling he had or not had. It would be equivalent to trying to say well I wasn't counseled that I'm not suppose to steal from the PX so you can't give me an ART 15 for stealing.

Can the Sr NCO recommend the Jr NCO for UCMJ action? Yea, but no guarantee that anything but a counseling from the 1SG for both the Jr and Sr NCO for not getting the prescribed counselings done in a timely matter would happen. Remember it's not just the rater, Sr. rater, and reviewers responsibility to make sure the counselings happen but also the rated individuals as well.

Does the Jr NCO have the right to talk to IG about it? Yes, every Soldier has a right to talk to IG about things they think are wrong in their unit but that doesn't mean he can hide behind IG especially if the acts are severe enough.

What's the outcome, I have no idea. If I'm going to write someone up for disrespect it will happen within 24 hours and it would have to very severe for me to recommend UCMJ action on a single event. So if it's severe enough I would imagine that the Jr NCO would get an ART 15 regardless of the lack of counseling. The Sr NCO would probably as well receive a counseling from the commander about his lack of doing his counselings on time. My take is that it wasn't severe enough to warrant an ART 15 off the bat so a late counseling with corrective action for the Jr. NCO followed up with an initial and quarterly counseling to complete the packet. Then if it happens again I have full documentation of a repeated issue and gave the Jr NCO every opportunity to fix the issue.

Response by SSG Robert Eshbaugh made Feb 3 at 2015 1:30 AM

2015-02-03T01:30:21-05:00

Yes he is subject to UCMJ. As long as rights of the accused are followed.

Response by CW2 Joseph Evans made Feb 3 at 2015 1:55 AM

2015-02-03T01:55:49-05:00

There is a good chance that JAG is going to tell his first line and the command to tighten their shot group.
This will go to JAG and Trial Defense Services before IG gets a hold of it.