Did you regret getting out of the military? What is civilian life like?

2016-03-06T15:40:24-05:00

I've been in the Navy for almost four years now. I have about 16 months left. I started off great at my first duty station, earning the title of region Bluejacket of the Year. The Navy is my first job and is what I've grown accustomed to. Within the last year of my last duty station leadership changed, the atmosphere changed and I suddenly had a change of heart. I felt like all the hard work that I did went to waste and no one had my back. Awards got lost, 1306s lost, leadership refused to help, C school package issues and problems with orders, I could go on and on. I kept doing the exact same thing I've been doing. It got so bad that I created 47 of my own reasons why I want out. I lost my motivation and was stuck in a rut I couldn't get out of. I love the military and planned on making it a career for as long as I can. I became a Corpsman because of the rich history of the rating and my passion for medicine. I also wanted to work on the deck plates so I could rise to become Surgeon General and have an idea on what to change and make better within Navy Medicine. But now I'm lost. I don't know how much I could take. My mentors don't blame me for wanting to get out, but I'm worried about civilian life. Is it as bad as people say it is? I do have a plan if I get out but I heard it is hard to get back in. Thanks for responses in advance.

Response by CPT Aaron Kletzing made Mar 6 at 2016 3:46 PM

2016-03-06T15:46:27-05:00

I get the sense that you still have a place in your heart for serving and staying in the military. Are you 100% committed to getting out?

Response by SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL made Mar 6 at 2016 3:50 PM

2016-03-06T15:50:22-05:00

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member no regrets, I gave it 110% living up to the Army Slogan of 1989, "Be all you can be". I am at peace with my duty, but the mental scars of war, I am dealing with. Moreover, lost of life. I love the freedom of knowing I retired with over 25 years of faithful and honorable service. I am adjusting in the civilian world in all aspects of transition and I am succeeding with a lot of hard work and love from family and friends to include my church family. There are moments that I do miss the military, but I am grateful to be moving on in life.

Response by PO3 David Fries made Mar 6 at 2016 3:53 PM

2016-03-06T15:53:24-05:00

I was a Corpsman for 6 years, and have been kicking myself for getting out since almost a year after. I waited too long to do anything about it. If you are passionate about what you do, fight for it.

Response by MAJ Michael Pauling made Mar 6 at 2016 3:56 PM

2016-03-06T15:56:34-05:00

Donald, over 95% of the US Population survive in Civilian Life and have no military experience. You will float in the Civvie World. As for thr SNAFUs, most common problem I saw in my career was how the situation was not dealt with. By that I mean a Paper Trail or proof of allegation alleged. In my years as an Investigator, I hardly ever saw a person knowingly fall on their own sword if they can construe a plausible deniability explanation to avoid culpability. It seems today's adage is "Not my fault" or "That's not the way I remember it" are still in use. I can't say Civilian employment is much better or much worse than military life, but if you want to stay medical, I strongly encourage you to focus on transferable schools for civilian credentialing. As for your military career, you have your foot in the door and I would say do the 20 years be it Guard, Reserves or Active. The true Golden Ticket are not the kudos or awards or the plaques it is the medical and financial security for when you will need it later in life. Civilian employment does not have the same protetction nor the same risks. Your career will be frustrating, aggravating, rewarding, and fulfilling how you remember it will focus greatly in how you perspect it. Good luck to you.

Response by SPC(P) Jay Heenan made Mar 6 at 2016 4:17 PM

2016-03-06T16:17:02-05:00

I didn't have a choice about staying in or getting out. The Army deemed me broken and sent me home. I am okay and at peace, esp. considering the poor leadership I had at my last duty station. As for your situation, if you still love what you do, stay in and try not to let poor leadership sway you. Strive to become the good leadership you desire and make a difference in other Sailors careers. Good luck brother, wishing you the best whatever you final decision will be.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2016 4:33 PM

2016-03-06T16:33:50-05:00

I served from 1968 to 1972. I loved being a Marine, but felt that the Marine Corps was not doing enough to clean up the drug problem (The Marine Corps did clean up the drug problem after I was discharged). I also loved the Space Program, so I had a plan to get a job, go to school, earn a degree and work for the Space Program. I was fortunate to find a good job and started school. I was four years older than the other students, but it seemed like twenty years. We had nothing in common. The military and veterans were not looked on with favor at that time. I found myself second guessing my decisions during those first couple of years, but kept focusing on my goal. I was very busy, so that helped keep my mind off of things. I ended up working on the Space Shuttle program for 33 years, but there were plenty of lows to go with the highs. We lost Space Shuttles Challenger and Columbia, which resulted in the fleet being grounded for a total of five years. These were terrible times, but I stayed because the Space Program was something I believed in and, loved.

It sounds like the Navy is your dream job, so maybe give it some more time for things to turn around. I know that you will make the best decision, and go on to great accomplishments.

Response by SGT Benjamin Lindsey made Mar 6 at 2016 4:33 PM

2016-03-06T16:33:58-05:00

Yes, I regret getting out everyday. But three years short of my 20 yrs it would have happened anyway. I think civilian life is over rated. These civilians are crazy.

Response by CPO Emmett (Bud) Carpenter made Mar 6 at 2016 4:38 PM

2016-03-06T16:38:04-05:00

Petty Officer Jones. I was told by my First Class Petty Officer Supervisior that I was worthless when I worked for him as a young E4 and later by my Shop Supervisior when I was a E5. I made Chief before both of them. My point is you can do anything you put your mine to,be it in civilian life or the US Navy. You still have a bright future in front of you, you just need do it despite some bumps in the road.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2016 4:46 PM

2016-03-06T16:46:27-05:00

It's not as bad as people say, especially if you are plenty prepared before you get out. As a corpman you have a transferrable skillsset that leads into well paying work. Just make sure all your certs line up because I know alot of the medical MOSs have to make up educational requirements depending on what state they live in. It will be OK. I get the feeling that you are pretty down. Perhaps look at your re-enlistment options if your window is open, see about competing for a nominative assisgnment. The thing that has kept me in the military thins long (in both active and reserve capacity) is that i always found opportunities or ways to keep it interesting or better. Good luck to you.

Response by A1C Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2016 4:56 PM

2016-03-06T16:56:21-05:00

I regret getting out. Don't do it. Find your passion and let your work be your pat on the back. If need be transfer to a different branch, but stay in.

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 6 at 2016 5:13 PM

2016-03-06T17:13:22-05:00

Problems with leadership are fleeting. PCS orders come up. People get promoted. etc. I never had the same reporting senior for two years in a row. You are a sailor, you can do two years standing on your head. But guess what, there's bad leadership on the outside too, usually for longer than two years. Don't look for your seniors to make or break the environment. They may be a challenge, but think of the sense of accomplishment you'll get from proving that you can master the situation.

I got out because: 1) I was at or near my terminal rank, (picked the right fight, with the wrong LtCol. 2) The military is hard on the family, even though they never complained, It was harder than I thought fair to ask. 3) I loved being a Lieutenant of Marines, I liked being a Captain, being a Major, not so much. I was afraid I'd be the field grade that was stealing the troop time that some lieutenant deserved. I had one of those when I was a 2ndLt.

I'd go back in a heart beat as a 2ndLt.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 6 at 2016 5:24 PM

2016-03-06T17:24:12-05:00

A new duty station, with new leadership, could change your whole perspective on things.

Response by CPO Dave Berube made Mar 6 at 2016 5:45 PM

2016-03-06T17:45:45-05:00

There are many parallels between military and civilian life. There are poor leaders in both. However, I have found that there are >10x more poor leaders in civilian life. As in civilian life, let your feet do the talking. Transfer to another command, another challenge. Keep growing your skills so you have more options both in the military and when you finally transition out someday.

Response by SGT Jerrold Pesz made Mar 6 at 2016 5:49 PM

2016-03-06T17:49:37-05:00

Never forget that horrible leadership and getting screwed over are not restricted to the military. You can find that anywhere.

Response by 1SG John Aaron made Mar 6 at 2016 6:04 PM

2016-03-06T18:04:08-05:00

Every career has its ups and downs. The good thing about the Military is that the Leadership is constantly changing. before getting out try another duty station. Ultimately the decision is your to make. If you do get out make sure you have a plan for what you are going to do.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Mar 6 at 2016 8:28 PM

2016-03-06T20:28:49-05:00

The civilian world is like the warm pools of the Pacific Ocean with jagged rocks.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Mar 6 at 2016 9:11 PM

2016-03-06T21:11:56-05:00

I left Kicking and Screaming they HYTd my ASS . LOL! 21 years, It was great while it lasted.

Response by SMSgt Thor Merich made Mar 6 at 2016 9:21 PM

2016-03-06T21:21:38-05:00

No regrets, but I am in the Reserves now. I have the best of both worlds.

When I got out I had a detailed plan. Despite some bumps along the way, I followed the plan and it worked our great.

If you have no plan or path, stay in until you can get one. The only folks I know that regretted their decision to get out, did so without a plan and found civilian life much harder than they expected.

Response by PO2 Mark Saffell made Mar 7 at 2016 7:56 AM

2016-03-07T07:56:59-05:00

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member I felt like you as my enlistment was drawing to a close and I got out. Jobs where easier to find back then and I have 4 great kids and a grandson that I may or may not have had if I had stayed in, however even with a great family I regret often getting out. One thing about the Navy. If you don't like where you are now...it will change soon. You never stay in the same place longer than 3 year or so. As an ET my sea/shore rotation was 3/2 3 years at sea, 2 on land. You must be drawing close to a new duty station and jobs are hard to find out here. I'd say if you planned on the Navy as a lifer, I'd say do it. You will change duty stations, do your best job and life has a tendency of balancing out.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 7 at 2016 2:00 PM

2016-03-07T14:00:30-05:00

I retired from the military, and kinda had to leave. But i still miss many aspects of military life. I'd go back in a second and never think twice about it. All I can tell you, Don, is the grass is NOT always greener on the outside. I would sincerely admonish you to stay in at least until you get your twenty-year letter. that will provide so many KEY entitlements to you when you hit age 60. STAY IN. TOUGH IT OUT. Talk with a Chaplain or some ranking NCO or officer whom you can trust with absolute confidence. Don't let this momentary event or feeling ruin what could prove to be the most pivotal decision you'll make in your life.

Response by CPO John Dupee made Mar 8 at 2016 6:03 AM

2016-03-08T06:03:38-05:00

There's a few questions here, Shipmate.

Regret? Loss of opportunity, Loss of fellowship? There's plenty of reasons to regret getting out. Least of which being "It sucks on the outside"

What's civilian life like? WATCH THE NEWS. I imagine you've acquired some skills but none that will translate into real money on the outside. That said, I l don't like ketchup on my fries.

BIGGEST issue here for me. It's gotten tough and you don't want to hang. Suck it up, buttercup! If it was supposed to be easy ANYONE could do it. A knife doesn't achieve it's temper unless it's put to some heat. You want to bail? I see that as win/win - you probably wouldn't be able to handle REAL pressure situations and that's bad for all concerned. Stay in spite of the difficulty? ANOTHER win/win. YOU get better and the Navy continues to hold on to a quality individual that can roll with punches and adapt to shitty situations. THEN an employer on the outside can see your value and will have NO problem wanting a resilient individual like yourself; one hitch or a whole a career.

VERY few have stories with NO difficulties

16 months! You can do that standing on yer head! Negotiate some orders for something completely and different and go from there.

YOUR career is only as rewarding as YOU make it.

Turn to.

BMC(SW), Retired

Capt. John Dupee
Kings Bay Pilots

Response by SN Jason Dawson made Mar 8 at 2016 6:45 AM

2016-03-08T06:45:20-05:00

I went from one command where I was the biggest loser the Navy has ever seen to the very next command I was God's greatest gift to the Navy and they begged me to reenlist. Leadership has a lot to do with it. Maybe it's just time to move on. Put in for a transfer.

Response by LT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 8 at 2016 6:50 AM

2016-03-08T06:50:17-05:00

Donald, thank you for posting this. You are exactly the type of guy we want to keep in the Navy. I'll start by saying that regardless of rank, there will be times where leadership fails you. It's never personal, it's just humanity. If you go into the civilian sector, why would it be any different? If you were to do sales, do you think that every sales manager above you will cover for you if you did your part but the team didn't meet the minimum quota? At some point, that person is going to throw you under the bus. There will be times where you may have earned the commission, but they don't do the paperwork for it and you lose out on a monthly bonus. Unless you want to go into the civilian sector and become an entrepreneur, the fact remains that you will always have times where leadership is terrible.

That being said, you will also have times that reinvigorate your desire to serve in the Navy because of GREAT leadership. Like someone said earlier, never make decisions at the high or low points. I think if internally you still feel you have things to accomplish in the Navy, do not get out. Your internal compass is right 99.9% of the time. I am privileged to serve alongside you and other men like you. You've raised your right hand and put on a uniform, and you in particular, understanding the significance of what it means to be an HM. I hoping I catch you on a ship in a short while and I can show you why serving in the Navy is the right thing to do. "DON'T GIVE UP THE SHIP." V/R.

Response by PO3 Charles Cole Sr. made Mar 8 at 2016 6:55 AM

2016-03-08T06:55:08-05:00

Yes many time's . The only thing that would have keep me in if I would have been able to get the men under me to stop being such a fool and take orders like they were told! I had to send three of them to Captain's Mass. It really hurt to do this they were me shipmates.

Response by PO2 Jamieson Regala made Mar 8 at 2016 7:12 AM

2016-03-08T07:12:00-05:00

If you are100 percent want to get out, take as much classes as you can and knockout an associate of science degree, if MD is in the future. Save as much as you can and learn all the avenues of financial aid, fafsa and so on. Make as much connections where you going, and know what is out there and research. If you are single and in great shape, reserves is a great option. When you get out don't look back but know you friends and support group. Let the Navy be a piece of your life, but do not dwell, but do not let anything stop you in achieving your goal.

Response by PO2 Frank Inscore made Mar 8 at 2016 7:20 AM

2016-03-08T07:20:42-05:00

Stay in. Get some rank and you will be fine. Stay the course. Take some college courses online etc. You will have to start all over again if you get out. You will lose all your seniority, rank, education etc. If you get out you will have to go to college there is another 5 to 6 years lost, then another 5 or 6 years working at a job to get to the point you are now. Put that time all together and you would have had 15 years of active duty service.

Response by LT John Stevens made Mar 8 at 2016 7:30 AM

2016-03-08T07:30:19-05:00

PO3 Jones -- I am sorry to hear that you are running into problems. The military is unique in many ways and the level of power your superiors have over you is greater than on the outside. At the same time, the level of challenges you are allowed, even encouraged to face is much higher than on the outside.

Inside the military, if you are under poor leaders, it is easy to feel unappreciated and sometimes misused. Unfortunately, though, the level of leadership outside the military is far worse in general and the challenges you are allowed to pursue are far less for your age and seniority.

Leaving the navy is unlikely to make your life better unless you just plain do not like military life. But it sounds as if you do like it. What you lose or give up in leaving the navy is the fantastic camaraderie, the travel, the opportunity to challenge yourself and know that you exceeded the challenges. Only you can make this decision. Looking back at my own life, I can say that on the one hand for me leaving was the right move at the time, but it also is a move I have always to some extent regretted. I got out in 1979 and I still miss many aspects of the navy. Good luck.

Response by PO3 David Blake made Mar 8 at 2016 8:23 AM

2016-03-08T08:23:13-05:00

Stay in fo two more years. Transfer to another duty station. If you love the military and your Job within it. Just try to remove yourself from the thing that is making you frustrating. Not all duty stations are the same

Response by PO1 Ted Valarinos made Mar 8 at 2016 8:26 AM

2016-03-08T08:26:54-05:00

Look into a different aspect of your rating. I know exactly how you feel, I had nine years of sea duty and got out as a first class who was eligible for chief. It's one of the biggest mistakes of my life. One of my friend's kids joined as a corpsman and loves it. He's training to be a combat corpsman with the Marine Corps. There's also a physician assistant program you might be interested in, at least there was while I was in. How soon is your EAOS? Talk to your detailer to check your options. There are plenty of good commands but unfortunately, there are bad ones too. Good luck shipmate, I hope you find your answer. I don't think leaving is the right one but I'm not in your shoes either.

Response by LCDR Steve Brown made Mar 8 at 2016 8:36 AM

2016-03-08T08:36:54-05:00

One of the great things about the military is that one of two things will inevitably happen. Either you will move on to another command or there will be a change in leadership (again) at your command. If you want to become Surgeon General, you will have to overcome challenges bigger than this. Hang in there. It gets better.

Response by CPO George Rogers made Mar 8 at 2016 8:58 AM

2016-03-08T08:58:53-05:00

Stay in, that won't be your last duty. The saying goes your last duty station and the next one are always better. I stayed for 20 but wish I had gone for 30.

Response by PO2 Michael Anstrom made Mar 8 at 2016 9:13 AM

2016-03-08T09:13:24-05:00

Corpsmen such as you and me indeed do have a legacy to live up to. I served in 1965 through 1970 and was privileged to serve with the USMC for a couple of years. I am now 69 years of age and am still called "Doc". One thing I have learned is that when things change, you must be able to withstand and adapt. This is a function of maturation as well as a measure of toughness. The mind is an amazing thing. It can overcome virtually all obstacles. You should NOT give up your dreams for what is undoubtedly a temporary change of environment. Study our history and take from the Corpsmen who have gone before you. These are the most courageous guys you will ever meet. Good luck, Doc.

Response by PO1 Bill Adams made Mar 8 at 2016 9:21 AM

2016-03-08T09:21:45-05:00

I regret getting out every day. But I did 13 before I got out. So it's a different story for me.

And what CPT T F said is great advice.

I mostly served under good commands. The thing to remember, is that just because the present command situation sucks doesn't mean it won't get better. One or two good people transferring in (or out) can make a world of difference. Just continue to hold yourself to high standards, continue doing a good job, and wait it out.

Every job has it's suck factor, civilian or military.
Illegitimi non carborundum. Translation - Don't let the bastards grind you down.

Response by PO1 Daniel Ladd made Mar 8 at 2016 9:31 AM

2016-03-08T09:31:37-05:00

It sounds like you've made up your mind. I will say that no matter where you work, the Navy or any other service, there isn't the commraderi in the civilian sector like the military. I think if you ask Veterans, you'll find most have had periods of time during their service that were such that most if not nearly all thought that getting out was the best thing to do. I would say you should stay, set some goals and stick it out. Winners never quit and quitters never win. You'll feel better about yourself for sticking out the hard times and succeeding when you really apply yourself. Get all higher education completed while on active duty. Things that you have to work hard for are always more gratifying than things easily obtained. Good luck Shipmate!

Response by LCDR W. Scott Davis made Mar 8 at 2016 9:36 AM

2016-03-08T09:36:54-05:00

I was forced to retire via TERA in 1998 after only 16 years. I got a partial retirement which is good and civilian life has been good, easier to get time off, etc., but even though I am now 65 I would still go back in if offered and finish at least my last 4 years of active duty. I fought for it the first 10 years after I retired. Yes, there are jobs out in civilian life but not near as many benefits and what few there are are expensive. And most bosses are worse than those in the military. My dad was in the Korean War and he often told me as a child that the only thing he regretted in life was that he did not stay in through retirement.

Response by SCPO Bill Milani made Mar 8 at 2016 9:56 AM

2016-03-08T09:56:53-05:00

Sorry, to hear that you have lost your motivation in the Navy. That sounds to me like a leadership problem. We always had a saying that retention is in the hands of Senior Enlisted and Officer Corps. If you have poor leadership then nobody wants to stay.

Truly, I believe you won't have any problem getting a job in civilian arena. You can put your Navy training to use as an Environmental Health Specialist. I went into that field when I retired in 1989 and I retired again in 2011. I do not know where you plan to settle but as far as I know every state has Environmental Health either at the State level or at the local level (local Board of Health). I was a Seabee when I retired and I qualified for the position due to construction experience. However, they were looking for former Hospital Corpsman. If you are interested I suggest you go on-line and check out Environmental Health Specialist and qualifications required. Now a lot positions require a four year degree with emphasis in the sciences. However, with your back ground as a Corpsman you should have no problem. Also, check out website "Home Base Iowa". The Govenor started a program throughout the State wanting veterans to settle in Iowa offering jobs, relocation etc.

Response by PO1 Kenneth Gibson made Mar 8 at 2016 10:01 AM

2016-03-08T10:01:06-05:00

Look, there going to be ups and down no matter where you work at but the keys is to not left stuff get to you. You just got to believe that you will rise above all the drama. When I was in the Navy, I was like Clark Kent and Superman. When I came threw those gates I was superman and I did my job. It did matter if others didn't do theirs. When I left the gate I became Clark Kent and didn't take the stuff home with me. I enjoy my off time and didn't let my work stress me out.

Response by CDR Rabbi Reuben Israel Abraham made Mar 8 at 2016 10:08 AM

2016-03-08T10:08:35-05:00

I was involuntarily retired from the Navy due to age. I treasure the time I served and miss being a part of a "team" that ruly respected my abilities and my contributions.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 8 at 2016 10:11 AM

2016-03-08T10:11:42-05:00

Petty Officer Jones,

I can relate to your situation! My 1st duty station back in 1989 was very similar to what you are describing. However i had a couple of very GOOD CHIEFS that gave me this awesome advice then and it still holds true today especially in the Navy. Do not judge the Navy by any one duty station! From what it sounds like you are saying, it sounds like you have a true love for the Navy and a real desire to make a difference. THAT"S AWESOME! I remember when i went through Chiefs initiation, i was asked to reflect on my worst Chief and my best Chief... You know what i then realized??? I quickly realized that even with my worst Chief that i actually did Learn something from them.... And that something learned was WHAT NOT TO DO.... And from what it sounds like your saying is that you want to make a difference... Well my advice for you is to stick it out... And your on a great track already.. BLUE JACKET of the Region is OUTSTANDING!! Imagine when you make Chief yourself! And you have the opportunity to take what you are learning now to be THAT MENTOR to all your Fellow Corpsmen!! How much of a difference do you think you can make then?? Not to mention all the other benefits that come with staying in along the way. I know several here have already mention this earlier.. Medical, Dental... Free College... etc. to name a few... Embrace it Brother!! Stick out the tough times and in the end it will only make you a better Chief someday... But will also have you better prepared when you do make that transition back to civilian life.

I got out at 9 years and quickly realized that i would be better off finishing out my 20... I just retired at 26 years.. And trust me i wouldn't have got out then had it not been for HYT... That being said I am really enjoying being retired now but i do miss being Active Duty.. ( I would be lying if i said I didn't!! )

MRC(RET) Farris, Tim

Response by PO2 Barry Padgett made Mar 8 at 2016 10:12 AM

2016-03-08T10:12:48-05:00

I went through a period at my first command where I felt I had a great CO and department head, but horrible leadership below that. But as Chaps said, be patient, nothing is forever. Given time, you or your leadership will move on. Sure enough, things flipped. We got a CO that wasn't as good, but my next set of direct leaders were great.

I did my six years and got out. There are days were I miss being haze grey and underway. But I also have really enjoyed watching my kids grow up. I've been successful out in the Civilian world, because of the things I learned and took with me from the Navy.

Response by PO2 Robert Aitchison made Mar 8 at 2016 10:14 AM

2016-03-08T10:14:37-05:00

I had a very bad attitude when I was in, couldn't see past the problems with the situation I was currently in. It affected my work performance which in-turn affected how I was treated by my chain of command. When my EAOS was approaching the command career counselor didn't even try to talk me into reenlisting even though my rate was undermanned.

Looking back now I regret not making more effort to make the best of the situation I was in and I definitely regret not transferring to the reserves.

Response by PO3 Donald Murphy made Mar 8 at 2016 10:19 AM

2016-03-08T10:19:13-05:00

Volunteer for Submarine duty.

1. You'll be your own duty head.
2. You'll get tons of training (NUMI)
3. You'll get tons of money
4. You'll get a small-town family feel when you're onboard

It'll keep you challenged.

Response by PO3 Harry Quinn made Mar 8 at 2016 10:29 AM

2016-03-08T10:29:21-05:00

It is somewhat hard to deal with any profession chosen from time to time and I know of no exceptions to that statement. I did 4 and out back in the late 60's and kicked my self numerous times over the years due to that choice. Basically both sides have advantages and drawbacks, I suggest lots of thought and prayer.
PO3 Quinn, USN, VietNam veteran

Response by PO3 John Ramirez made Mar 8 at 2016 10:30 AM

2016-03-08T10:30:37-05:00

That's a carry personal choice.
I could not possibly serve under the current conditions.
In my day, sometimes I wised I gaffe continued, but then,I would not have met my wife of 28 years and my 19 yo son and 24yo daughter would not exist.
Whatever you do will have benefits and consequences.
Only you, can make that choice.
Fair winds and following seas.

Response by PO1 James Marchetti made Mar 8 at 2016 10:43 AM

2016-03-08T10:43:44-05:00

Hey Donald - First and foremost, THANK YOU for bringing this to your Veteran Brothers and Sisters, and, kudos to you for having some passion for your work you chose.

I've been out for quite some time now, and, my situation was markedly different than what you've described. BUT... I suggest going back to the reason you went into the Navy and why you chose to be a Corpsman - let that passion and strong motivation guide you. Try to remember that just like the seas you sail on, things change. Skippers and XOs change. Duty stations change. The Navy changes, and more importantly, YOU change too. You can control how you change and what you let eat at you. You can also decide what you consider most important in your life.

To answer your question of whether civilian life is as bad as people say it is, I can only say that it has been a hard road for me, but I have managed to be happy along the way knowing that Navy life has its difficulties too. Had I decided to stay in, I am not sure I would be as happy as I am now, but, I got out in 1992, so, hard to really say.

When I joined the Navy in 1984 all I knew was that I wanted to work on advanced electronics, and, I loved airplanes. So, I did that - I was an AT (Avionics Technician) and it was awesome. Had a bad skipper middle of my first sea tour, a horrible LCDR leading the schoolhouse I was at for my shore duty, some really awful shop supervisors in my squadron, etc.

I loved the Navy, made E6 in record time and had visions of two stars above the anchor that I would someday wear on my collar. My next orders - pretty tough ones, and, a sick wife forced me to make a very hard decision and leave the Navy.

Going back to my guidance, I strongly believe that keeping your eye on the ball (your vision of you on your twilight tour and then becoming Surgeon General later) and let the tough times, rotten people and lousy leaders come along - you can't control it anyway - and stay laser focused on what HM3 Jones can control, and control it.

I wish you the best in all your endeavors and efforts in life shipmate, and please let us know what you decide.

Warmest Regards and Respect,
Jim Marchetti
USN, AT1, 1984-1992

Response by CAPT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 8 at 2016 10:44 AM

2016-03-08T10:44:53-05:00

Okay, I'm putting on my Captain hat...You can't let a bad command environment steal the joy you have(had) for your rate and your vocation. Don't let them change you. The world of the military, the civilian world, any world you want to name has the same issues. It's called leadership and there are wonderful leaders and there are bad leaders in all facets of life. Don't let them determine who you are! Rise above them and do what you love to do. If you have a service heart then you can continue to serve those in need and at some point be able to mentor those coming behind you. "Don't give up the ship" just because times have gotten hard. They're hard on the outside as well. My Army buddies would tell your to "Ranger up" and make things better for those you interact with. Contribute to building morale and not breaking it down. 30 years of Navy time speaking and it is easy to say but so hard to do, but if you can come out the other side with your integrity and honor intact then you will be a better sailor and the Navy will be better. Thanks for your service.

Response by PO3 Daryl Olthaus made Mar 8 at 2016 10:47 AM

2016-03-08T10:47:08-05:00

I was in for four years as a Corpsman. Looked at going back in after I got my RN as a civilian. The recruiter didn't follow up and I didn't push it, so, nothing came of it.

I do regret, sometimes, not staying for career. I could have retired at 37! (Not that I could live on that retirement). I still miss aspects of the Navy almost 35 years later. You know, you can have the exact same issues in a civilian job. My suggestion is to look into a transfer. Don't know how that works nowadays. I assume its a possibility.

Military isn't great for family life if you're looking at going that route. If you're single, I'd say you won't find better friends than those you have in the military. Not sure this helps but that's my take on it. Good luck and thanks for serving!

Response by PO3 Terry Miller made Mar 8 at 2016 10:51 AM

2016-03-08T10:51:16-05:00

I have often wished that I had stayed in but I have had a rewarding civilian life, too. I suggest you might want to look at becoming a paramedic as a possible civilian profession. They have great respect and decent pay/benefits.

Response by PO2 Alan Frankel made Mar 8 at 2016 11:20 AM

2016-03-08T11:20:06-05:00

After spending five yeas in the Navy during Viet Nam, I still regret leaving military service. Life in the military is all about changes, both good and bad. My advise is, stay where you are, make the best of it. Your next duty station may turn out to be similar to your first. I really wanted to come back in, but I waited to long and my age would not allow it. Civilian life is no bowl of cherries, again my advice is stay in and learn. Good luck my man.

Response by PO2 Jason Wulff made Mar 8 at 2016 11:20 AM

2016-03-08T11:20:52-05:00

I was in your position when I i was due to re-enlist. I was going to re-enlist and thought that i would have retired, but as i got closer to the date things had changed. I made my decision on the events of the time and decided that i didn't want to stay in if this was the way things were going to be. I enjoyed my time in, but the job i took when i got out was just as good. You have times where the leadership is difficult, both in and out of the military. There are also good leadership times.
I look back on occasion, i have been out for 16 years now. I could have been retired at this point in my life. I see my previous coworkers and how far they have made it in the military. But in the end i made my decision and stuck with it.

Response by SCPO Mark Godsey made Mar 8 at 2016 11:34 AM

2016-03-08T11:34:53-05:00

Yes only because I miss the comradely I left because of the political BS.

Response by PO1 Kevin Risner made Mar 8 at 2016 11:56 AM

2016-03-08T11:56:11-05:00

I would say that 4 years isn't very long to really know what you want to do. Particularly with only having the experience of one command. My advice would be to change commands and give it a few more years. After another command and a few more years you still don't feel it is for you then prepare to make the transition to civilian life.
As for my decision to leave the Navy - it was a good decision for me. I did 6 years. On my last day my division officer told me that he personally thought I would be better off leaving the Navy and that I would do well in the civilian world (I had an exemplary record - sailor of the month for 2 months - good conduct medal - and several other commendations) but it just wasn't for me. Since then I fell into the wireless communications world and make a really good living.
I am still in constant communication with my old shipmates - some of which stayed for 20. The bonds you form in the military will last a lifetime. My closest friends in this world (and always will be) are the people i served with.

Response by SGT Dave Tracy made Mar 8 at 2016 12:18 PM

2016-03-08T12:18:41-05:00

I think most people who get out have some regrets, and for a subset of that group, they return to the military; whether its a different service or a Reserve or Guard component.

I have "what ifs" about leaving Active Duty, but I haven't completely left as I transitioned to the Army Reserve immediately after I ETSed. In the end, regardless of regrets, I wouldn't have done it differently. I suspect the same dynamic will hold true a little over a year from now when I allow my contract to expire and I hang up my dog tags for good. My course is set, the decision is final; I am sure my few regrets and "what ifs" will not be enough to pressure me to return, and I'll be OK with that.

It's hard to rise to the occasion when you're weighed down by low motivation. Dig deep at those times. Just remember, while you're making your decision, the bad don't last forever. That may not change your ultimate decision, but to echo other's thoughts, don't let the environment you are in today be the sole variable in determining what your tomorrow will be.

Good luck in the choices you make Sailor, and remember, you have done more for your community, country and yourself than 90% of Americans ever will; and its just as true if you stay in or leave tomorrow.

Response by PO2 Tyler Sanada made Mar 8 at 2016 12:33 PM

2016-03-08T12:33:25-05:00

"Never judge the Navy by your experiences at your first command" is the advice I was always given... and its true. I went from an F/A-18C squadron in Lemoore and thought the Navy was a mistake two back-to-back deployments later. But then transferred here to San Diego and it was a totally different experience with new highs and lows. I am very grateful for my time spent here. But don't give up now. Do what you can to change up your career movement and get some new life experiences. I came to San Diego and got introduced to a new type of Navy in the Expeditionary Warfare community and learned that if I was to stay in, this is where I would want to stay. Once you get into a community, it is easier to stay there for longer periods of time. I could have done just that but I had different goals for my life and family. I ended up getting out of the military nearly two years ago and its definitely been a journey to say the least. I tried to get back in and they said no. So I am now working a job using my experience but I am still chasing that dream career. If you have goals in life, and the Navy will help you get there, then use the Navy... because they will most definitely use you. Take advantage of the stability and benefits while you have them. But also, don't be afraid to move on if that's what you feel is best for you. The longer you stay in, the harder it is to get out. Civilian life is just as great if you prepare yourself for it. Really think about what will be best for you and move on that decision without looking back.

Response by PO2 Gil Kaelin made Mar 8 at 2016 12:45 PM

2016-03-08T12:45:04-05:00

Where ever you work, there is a good chance that there will be good days, and bad days- good weeks and bad weeks- good months and bad months...you need to only consider: 1- does the core of your job make you happy? 2- Are you able to do it better? and 3- will it reward you if you do.
having been out for the past 28 years- I can say that I over-reacted to a situation and got out- I do essentially the same work- with a higher salary - there is a LOT I miss about the military- the Cap's remarks above are well stated. hang in there, things always change- sometimes for the better, but they always change.

Response by PO1 Donald Hammond made Mar 8 at 2016 1:00 PM

2016-03-08T13:00:37-05:00

No, I did not regret getting out. I regret that the Navy was inflexible and refused to give even an inch to a PO1 with 13 years to keep me in. Did the command I was at suck? Yes. But I was part of the leadership and did my best to keep the command on an even keel. I had more time in the Navy and at sea than all the CPOs and below. Only a SCPO and MCPO had more time. I was qualified as high as I could go and was Leading Petty Officer for my division. BUT I had just done 3 WestPacs in 3 years including back to backs (30 days in between) plus a 4 month special op. When I asked about orders I was told I'd be going to a boat, as LPO, on WestPac. The current LPO had just been relieved for lack of confidence or whatever. He was a 10 year CPO. They wanted me to kick butt and get E-Div on that boat squared away. I asked for a boat in the yards so I could have a breather (sorta). They said no. They needed me out on WestPac. So I said "NO". My family came before the Navy finally. It was sad because I had so much invested but I just couldn't turn around and do a 3rd WestPac in a row.

The point is tho, that you have to stick to your guns and realize that no matter how good or bad a command is, it will change. You can change commands and can get a crap one or a stellar one. The Navy is so fluid that nothing stays the same for long. We used to say "It won't be like this at the next [fill in the blank]" And yet is overall, the same.

And if you decide to get out, there are plenty of jobs in the medical field that a Corpsman can get into.

Response by PO2 Lawrence Imamura made Mar 8 at 2016 1:00 PM

2016-03-08T13:00:58-05:00

Do you know what field you want to go into outside the Navy? Have you taken college courses towards meeting your goals? One of my regrets was not about getting out, it was about not utilizing Tuition Assistance, even for General Ed classes. I spent 8 years in the Navy. going back to school after such a long time was difficult for me. I am nearing the end of my Post 9/11 GI Bill and nowhere near my end goal.
Not all commands are the same. you should be up for rotation, take some time give it a chance. Also, i would suggest see if the navy will offer reenlistment to you. if you are approved for reenlistment you have the option to choose. If you are not approved you will receive an Involuntary Separation Pay. Chances are you will have the ability to choose later down the line. Don't close the door for yourself just yet. you have plenty of time to decide.
good luck with whatever you choose.

Response by PO1 Donald Hammond made Mar 8 at 2016 1:08 PM

2016-03-08T13:08:19-05:00

I'm going to separate my answers. Now from the beginning of my career things I learned and might help you. After all my nuke type schools I got to my first command. It was the worst of the worst. Every man woman and child for themselves. We were failing major inspections and I was low man on the totem pole. I will admit I was a wet behind the ears smart mouth nublet. I rapidly learned to keep my mouth shut. Life at that first command was the worst time of my life. But what I did was watch what others were doing. If I saw something bad in a leader I would note it mentally as "I'll never do that" and the flip side was true. Something good "I'll do that". So as I worked my way up I applied what I learned and when I was finally at the top of the heap I was making a positive contribution and my Division was recognized by outside organizations as one of the best with a high morale. So you can give up or be determined to be a positive influence and don't let the bastards get you down. Even in the civilian world you will run into crap jobs with crap supervisors.

Response by PO3 Bill ONeill made Mar 8 at 2016 1:20 PM

2016-03-08T13:20:45-05:00

I got out many many years ago and as I look back now I do have regrets about not staying in. I enjoyed what I was doing and I could have had choice of duty stations or schools if I had reenlisted. I also could most likely have made Chief by the end of my second enlistment. I am retired so I cannot speak much about the civilian job market but if I were you I would continue my education if you decide to get out. I know things must be better in the Navy now than when I was in. Good luck

Response by PO3 Scott Austill made Mar 8 at 2016 1:28 PM

2016-03-08T13:28:52-05:00

I would recommend staying in, I got out due to personal/medical issues with my father. I didnt miss at first, but 10 years later I really started to miss the brotherhood. And now i would have had 23 years in and retired, it is a matter of choice on what you want to do. If you do decide to leave always remember that their is the reserve option and my recommendation for that go directly and sign up with them. Do not wait because as you stated it is harder to get back in (through the reserve route). When you do decide what your future will be make it with the correct choices and do not base it on the low points or high points of your time in. If it was me personally and I still enjoyed what the Navy has offered to you I would re-enlist. Always remember duty stations and commands and LPO's etc always change and you will have to adapt and overcome to those situations. It will be the same as in the civilian world but the titles will change.
GOOD LUCK on what ever decision you will make!!!!

Response by CDR William Kempner made Mar 8 at 2016 1:29 PM

2016-03-08T13:29:33-05:00

Young man(person), I sympathize with you-you will find a lot of self-servers/self promoters in the military. And the problem is that it's a stacked deck-especially when you are in the lower ranks/grades. Also, I don't think now is a very good time to be in the Navy.(The current administration.) Much will hinge on who the next President is. (My first active duty period was during the Carter Administration. In a word, It STUNK! The Reagan administration was like a breath of fresh air!) We'll have to wait and see. Civilian life has its ups and downs. The good thing is that the stigma about changing jobs often is LONG gone! I see young people coming and going, and it seems that lots of organizations DON'T WANT people staying for 20 years! PREPARE YOURSELF for a life outside of USN BEFORE you decide to bail. Make sure you can DO SOMETHING to pay your bills. Are you a certified EMT? Become ONE!! You may not LOVE it, but you can live on that salary while going to college-day or night. Plenty of a@@holes in civilian life too, and there are NO rules they have to follow!! Not that everyone does in the military, but they're supposed to. I've seen plenty ignore them, but if they did it long enough, it usually caught up to them!!. (It is AWESOME to watch it happen!!) Goes in civ. world too. My last boss was a real bitch-and ultimately was told to "find something else". She's now working at a place where MY COUSIN is a VP, and Dep Gen Counsel!! I told my cousin right away.(The ex-boss is not aware, but I've heard she is back to her old crap. Some people just don't learn.) You should also look into the Reserves. One last thing-I commend your wanting to be Surgeon General-but if you're finding it rough at this level, you haven't seen anything yet!!

Response by PO3 Robert Smith made Mar 8 at 2016 1:47 PM

2016-03-08T13:47:25-05:00

I had been to Vietnam twice and did not want to go back to constant training until called upon again so got out. Many times i wished I had stayed but I used the GI Bill and got a college education and finished my career working for the DOD designing training ranges for Army Reserve Units going to the Middle East.

Response by PO2 Raymond Seward made Mar 8 at 2016 2:01 PM

2016-03-08T14:01:03-05:00

When I went in I to had the plan to stay a full 30. Everything was going great and then we had a divisional change of command. For some reason our divisional chief and I could not get along no matter what I did. I had my reenlistment papers ready to sign and I walked in and told them to forget it and I ripped them up in front of him. Needless to say I got out. This was back in the 70's and finding work back then was almost as hard as it is today. No matter what job I held, I worked my way up to management and something would happen. My first company went out of business after I was there for 9 years and every job after that there were cut backs, layoffs or closures. I'm 62 now on Social Security Disability working part time just to pay for food. I never no matter how hard I tried or no matter what I did found a company that stayed open long enough to retire. The lesson that I learned is a very important one. The outside much like in the military always has management changes and you will never get along with everyone at the top. Virtually the only job left in this country were you have a chance to retire from is in fact in the military. Corporations today are all about greed and profit and very seldom care about their employees. They all talk a good game, always claim that they are family but don't you believe it. What you are experiencing in the military now you will experience on the outside as well. I wish I had stayed, a friend of mine stayed and when I got out I was an E-5. Operations Specialist 2nd Class, he stayed in and retired a Senior Chief and is very happy he did. Now I know the future is promised to no one and no one can predict your future, but you will in fact experience the same problems on the outside that you are experiencing now on the inside. Weigh everything before you make your decision, especially family. That should be your most determining factor with retirement your second. Then follow your heart.

Response by PO2 Michael Stinar made Mar 8 at 2016 2:01 PM

2016-03-08T14:01:37-05:00

Yes it is, and YES I regretted leaving the military. Although I eventually made a civilian career for myself, it took a few years and some schooling & $$$ on my part to achieve my ultimate goals. I would have to say "Think this situation through VERY HARD" !! The military isn't ALL Peaches and Roses, it has it's BUMPS and DOWNFALLS, if your TRULY Committed you can ride those storms out and maintain your Career in the military in the rate your doing. Another option is, perhaps Change Rates. Perhaps you can find a rate that challenges your mind and abilities that you might enjoy. However if your focused on what your doing now ( which isn't a Bad Thing ) and want to "Better Navy Medicine" then just button down the hatches and ride out the periodic UPS & DOWNS, and you should be OK. On the other hand, if you want to leave the military ( which isn't a bad thing either ) perhaps your 4 years as a Corpsman, might get you some credits in some Medical School that could be a bonus. Of course there's a third option; going to school WHILE in the Military, get the military to pay a partial portion of it, and Go from there.... I hope that helps ya..

Response by CPO Anthony Picciano made Mar 8 at 2016 2:30 PM

2016-03-08T14:30:03-05:00

My first 4 years I was over it. Then came the day to decide leave or stay for at least 20. I believe I picked the right choice did 24. Got out "retired" at what 42. Yes one gets the retirement pay medical ect. But their is one thing you received over your piers or soon to be piers. Stories and adventures good bad or indifferent I will put money on the fact that in 20 years you will see and do shit the most of them can not even comprehend. That's one reason to stay duty stations change so will the drama. remember the higher rank you achieve better the adventure.

Response by CDR James Shannon made Mar 8 at 2016 2:46 PM

2016-03-08T14:46:00-05:00

I cannot speak to your exact situation, but I can tell you that 3 of the sailors that worked for me retired at higher ranks than me. Duty stations come and go and they will always cycle between great and terrible. You cannot select your superiors, but you can determine how you do your job. It will be about the same in civilian life, except for the fact that the Navy tends to have a better cross section of humanity than does the civilian sector. Many studies have shown that to be the case. Therefore, you will actually run across more geniuses and more idiots out there. I wrote out my resignation letter at least 3 times in my career and slept on each before discarding them. Now I can look back at a successful and rewarding Navy career and a second career in a field for which the Navy prepared me very well. Retirement from both provides our retirement income. You must make the decision, but weigh ALL the parameters before doing so ... then sleep on it. Good luck!

Response by FN Bruce Brown made Mar 8 at 2016 3:29 PM

2016-03-08T15:29:19-05:00

Civilian life isn't bad, especially if you continue on in a medical field. I am now a Paramedic and love my job, (most days). If you continue in that type field, especially with a fire department you have a regimented structure, with a chain of command and so forth. Good luck in your endeavors, it's been 39 years since my service, and I miss it.

Response by CAPT Walter Price made Mar 8 at 2016 3:34 PM

2016-03-08T15:34:40-05:00

I agree with the preponderance of the comments. I can add little. Good leaders can be found in both the military and the civilian side. One important difference, however. is that military leaders are evaluated on their leadership, schooled in leadership, fired and promoted on the basis of their leadership. For the civilian managers you can generally substitute "profit" or "sales" for leadership. Civilian leaders care about retaining the best employees - those that greatly help profit or sales. Military leaders (and you may know an exception) seek to retain all but a few. I have contemporaries who regret their early departure for civilian life. Having spent 9 years in HS education after the Navy, I know many young men who left the service years ago who have still not found a job of similar stature and responsibility to their last positions in the military. I agree with those who advise you to stick it out at least through the next duty station.

Response by CPO Michael Callegri made Mar 8 at 2016 3:39 PM

2016-03-08T15:39:37-05:00

Your situation is something you need to get used to in the Navy, change. There will always be a change in philosophy and direction with each new CO, Dept Head, Div Officer, LCPO., etc., so, I would suggest not to throw in the towel. Once you know that things are not always going to be the same, the easier it is to deal with that change. Before I retired, I went from being the top E-7 in my Department with one department head, to just one of the regular E-7's with my next, all because of the change in personalities. On one ship, we went to from a CO, that was all business and didn't have much concern for his enlisted people, to a CO that loved his enlisted people and roamed around the ship to get to know them. I would advise you to realize, that just as those people above you change, there will be a time for you also to leave and go else where, where you will have to figure out their culture. Change is inevitable, and realizing that will make it easier to deal with.

Response by SSG Jesse Cheadle made Mar 8 at 2016 3:47 PM

2016-03-08T15:47:10-05:00

I will say this. Many people regret the decision to get out. My neighbor got out last March. He picked up a job with the city. He hates it. He says its a dog eat dog world. He has almost zero chance at getting back in. He is at the point of enlisting the help of his congressman. If that tells you how hard it is.

Know this 1 thing though, in the military you have options to move to a different duty station and things may get back to where you foind happiness. Maybe not. But in the civillian life, you are stuck with that supervisor and job until you have another job landed and quit. If you quit you will have a harder time gaining employment.

Lastly, he was an E-3 in the army. Ne now has a family of 4 on $1200/mo income with no allowances.

Stick with the reason you joined and keep your head up. It gets better from here.

Response by PO3 Brian Whiting made Mar 8 at 2016 3:47 PM

2016-03-08T15:47:59-05:00

I'm coming from the same situation. I was a corpsman for 6 years. The last command I was in was terrible. So I decided to take control of my life. I got out in 2014 and never looked back. It's not scary at all but just know that it's a little difficult adjusting to civilian life. One example is I had trouble connecting with people. Life experiences vary differ from person to person. talking to a civilian is different than talking to a fellow veteran with similar experiences. But to further answer you question no its not scary a bit they're many opportunities to vertrans just do research before you get out and pay attention in your taps class and you'll be fine. But if you just wait it out in your current situation you'll be fine as well. Dont drop your pack!!!

Response by PO3 Earl Wilson made Mar 8 at 2016 5:20 PM

2016-03-08T17:20:36-05:00

keep in mind, that Navy corpsman from what I have read do not get automatic credit as medics in the civilian world. I would encourage you to consider staying in but you immediately need to start on college while still active duty, With the number of on line colleges now, you can complete many courses from remote locales. I also encourage you to stay in the reserves. Who knows, get a nursinf degree and put on khaki

Response by CWO3 Bryan Luciani made Mar 8 at 2016 5:47 PM

2016-03-08T17:47:21-05:00

Doc, I had some great commands and some sorry ones. This is the nature of things in the military. If you like the Navy, you owe it to yourself to give it a chance. In the civilian world you'll see mediocrity at its best, and a world where accountability is non-existent. So, you'll easily make a difference as a civilian. The question is whether or not you can tolerate it. I'd go back in a heartbeat if they'd take my busted up old ass. I know choosing to be a Corpsman comes with an enormous amount of difficulty getting promoted. Civilian life is even worse. No one gets pay raises anymore unless you have a government job with step increases. You selected the toughest of ratings. If that is what's got you down you need to start looking at ways to get a commission or ways to convert out of that rating. I plugged along up to E8, then went Warrant and kicked myself for not doing it years earlier. Stay true to yourself and help others the way you'd want to be helped. Cheers!

Response by LT Don Jaffa made Mar 8 at 2016 5:55 PM

2016-03-08T17:55:32-05:00

After 42 years of public service, 21 in the military and 21 in the federal civil service, it is what you make of each opportunity that deterrmines your own self image. And inn the end it is what you think of your own accomplishments that matter. If you connsider self improvement to be the goal, get out stay in the reserves and go to college to become a physiician assistant or doctor, and then go back to finish a military career or stay in the reserves and get in the federal civil service to continue working with the military. There are locations that need civil service as well, as in the Naval Hospitals overseas or Army hospitals overseas.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 8 at 2016 6:04 PM

2016-03-08T18:04:48-05:00

Hey HM3,
All the responses should be telling you something. Please read them all carefully. Most of all, DO NOT get out right this minute. There is plenty of time for that in the future. As a recruiter I told applicants that the Navy was a cross-sectional slice of Americana. So the good leadership and bad leadership is very concentrated in the Silly-vilian sector. So let me tell you what to expect:
1. Anxiety: am I making the right decision getting out (in-progress so it seems)
2. Is this a one only situation (Command): won't know if you get out, might be able to tolerate it if you stay in.
3. Growing in leadership can sometimes be difficult, painful and frustrating. To me, the more you are exposed to it and figure out how to make it better will make you part of the solution to other shipmates and civilians in your work area.

I retired when I was a Chief (STILL AM A CHIEF). What I learned, what I was exposed to, how I used it to succeed allowed me to be an effective leader in the Navy and now in the civilian world (retired some 15.5 years ago). I do not think it would be this way for me if I got out earlier than when I did. What it bopoils down to is the Navy will instill and fortify excellent leadership traits in you if you put in the time and let them. But please accept only the good and learn from the bad. You will need this skill when you eventually get out and be part of the leadership in companies you work for and affect. And affect you will, in the Navy Way.

When it is all said and done though, it will be YOUR decision and no one else. I wish you luck HM3, looks like many people are wishing you the same.

R/
BUC(SCW)

Response by PO2 Christopher Taggart made Mar 8 at 2016 6:56 PM

2016-03-08T18:56:02-05:00

Yes and No? Yes wish I had stayed in for all those tremendous places to go and benefits... but No. I would have never enjoyed history and all the Heavy metal adventures across USA and Europe in 1980s along with traveling USA to visit all my family while it was cheap and super safe to do this. Today it would cost a fortune to do what I did right after leaving the Navy and also; I really could not benefit much from the Job I had in the Navy unless I went into scuba diving for paramedic rescue operations. However I did get the GI BILL and put that to the best use possible and today manufacture Body Armor as well as vehicle armor to save the younger guys? Mission accomplished!

Response by PO2 Nick Burke made Mar 8 at 2016 7:09 PM

2016-03-08T19:09:41-05:00

Just like you saw a change for the worse. A new duty station may very well be a change for the better.
I got out at 10 years. For me it was the right thing. Just be aware that there is a lot of uncertainty on your own. Jobs, living place ect.
Good luck!
BTW start checking USA Jobs and state local hiring. You're a vet it helps.

Response by AN Sean Berry made Mar 8 at 2016 7:21 PM

2016-03-08T19:21:36-05:00

I got out early and really wish I would of stuck it out, I was with an A-6 squadron VA-34 the Blue Blasters and we were the first battle group to get called to duty when Iraq invaded Kuwait! I had a great time on my first Med Cruise and I was also very young only 19 years old at the time, my brother was on the same carrier but he was with VAW-121! Anyways long story short after being called to general quarters and the whole thought of war hit me with reality and made me have regrets! But take time to reflect and ask yourself what you truly want, I wish I would of talked to someone or made better choices about staying enlisted! Good luck to you and remember that a military career isn't for everyone but it is a great path if you have the drive!!!

Response by CPO Paul Niehaus made Mar 8 at 2016 10:12 PM

2016-03-08T22:12:01-05:00

I did 32 years both active and reserve. I retired in 2005 and I miss it more each year. The advice of doing 20 and getting the medical is worth its weight in gold. Most cant retire now, not because of monthly income but because of the high cost of health insurance, that I don't have to be concerned with. That is a great feeling when it comes to my family. Another wise tidbit is in the military, either you or your leadership will move on in a year or two. in the civilian world that is not a given and to leave may require a move out of your city and or state to get the same or better environment and you will have to pay for it both in money and in family adjustment.
Stay the course and the pay and benefits will pay double what you can get in the "real world". Once you have 20 in, it gets even better, most of the time.
I would have stayed until I was sixty had I known.
Stay the course, learn from the experience, and think of you as a 40 something man trying to take his family through life with what you did in your 20s.
Always get and keep copies of every thing you do and achieve. It is your career not the YN, PN or leadership, it is yours as you have learned. Down the road you may be able to get a commend that can help get back the lost items.
God speed shipmate, HMC Niehaus, Retired and Proud

Response by PO1 Tracy Rainey made Mar 8 at 2016 11:02 PM

2016-03-08T23:02:07-05:00

I am a 20 year veteran but can share in some of your pain. I was fortunate to have been in the work force for 5 years before joining the navy at age 22. Because I lost a lot of my math skills I was only a striker when I joined. I struck SK but the first time I took the test and passed to PO3, only to be told 4 weeks later SK was no longer a rate that could be struck. It was heart breaking and I was at an all time low. Then six weeks later was told I could strike SK again but would have to take the test all over. I took it next cycle and passed again. A week before I was going to be Frocked they sent me to A school. I was not frocked until I returned to my ship.sub. I am a bubblehead. Need less to say it screwed up my cycle for taking the PO2 exam. The only reason I was able to over come is I knew what a dog eat dog life is like in the civilian world. You piss off your boss or supervisor outside military and they can fire you on the spot. You do the same thing in the military, yes they can make it hard on you but they have to have a paper trail and good reason to take you to captains mast. As a corpsman you might do better as a civilian EMT or become a nurse. Just keep in mind supervisors there can be just like the ones in the navy. The grass is not always greener on the other side. I loved my first nine years love hate the last eleven years of my career. I hope my own experience helps you with your dissension.

Response by CAPT Ben Barrow made Mar 9 at 2016 1:43 AM

2016-03-09T01:43:32-05:00

PO Jones, thank you for the courage to open up and expressing the questions you are pondering to this forum. I, like many others, have personally experienced versions of your situation all along our career paths (enlisted, officer and civilian in my case) and here are some reflections from my experience. I don't have any answers for you... as those can only come from you. Just offering my experiences ... not to be taken as instruction.... just to pick up what may fit and disregard what doesn't.

1) I’ve found regret to be a waste of energy. It detracts from your ability to give your 100% to your current endeavors without providing any benefit at all to the present day. It detracts from appreciating where you are standing now and envisioning the possibilities ahead.

2) Consider the possibility that you may be faced with two (or more) "right" choices and not just a single "right" one and the remainder as "wrong" ones. While each choice will certainly yield different experiences, your courage (heart), attitude and passion will guide you through the waves associated with any choice made, ultimately creating your own personal experience of it. This accounts for why you will find many fine folks, which will tell you that they never had a bad assignment, duty station, or job throughout their entire careers (military and civilian).

3) Its far better to focus on moving towards your intentions/desires, than to focus on moving away from your dislikes. (One is visionary while the other is reactionary). Said another way... pain pushes until vision pulls. I would invite you to explore your personal life vision (keep updating it as it will likely adjust) and be drawn (pulled) by it and rather than placing a lot of attention on avoiding a temporary present day discomfort.

4) “It’s not about avoiding the waves, but about learning how to surf them.” It seems to me that just like when working muscles out, growth carries (maybe requires?) measures of discomfort and accepting this allows us to better weather the inevitable storms and start becoming "comfortable with discomfort." Life suddenly becomes lighter.

Thank you for your service and best wishes and fun along your personal journey!

Response by Sgt Tom Cunnally made Mar 9 at 2016 2:26 AM

2016-03-09T02:26:21-05:00

At that time I was ecstatic to leave the Marines on a Saturday & the following Monday be a Freshman at Boston College but was still in the Marine Reserves . So I became a student but still a Marine which I think is the best of both worlds. But when I finally left the Marines I had mixed emotion wondering was this the right decision to make because back in the day the pay was not very good and I jumped at the chance to make big bucks in the Aerospace Industry..But years later realized money is NOT everything.

Response by MCPO Kurt Stauff made Mar 9 at 2016 3:40 AM

2016-03-09T03:40:56-05:00

As a Master Chief with almost 30 years before retiring, I can speak on both sides--Navy and civilian--with some experience. I was in the civilian job force for 12 years before joining and for 4 years since retiring, and I can tell you that there will be highs and lows wherever you are. I have had bad bosses and good bosses, but the main thing I learned was how to temper my responses to these differing forms of leadership; you must take firm responsibility for your reactions to various stimuli. In the civilian world, you can quit if the situation seems intolerable and you feel that you cannot have a positive effect, regardless of what you do; in the military, you have to suck it up until the command climate changes, and make the best of all your experiences and challenges--these can make you a stronger leader later on in your career. The good news is, in the military, everything is temporary, and in 3-5 years you can find yourself in a totally different climate with a change of command or duty stations. In the civilian world, you are pretty much stuck with the structure until someone dies or moves on in some other way; comparing the two, I have found that it is easier to be heard in a junior position in the Navy than it is in civilian life, and it is harder to get fired in the Navy than it is as a civilian. Plus, it is easier to recover from your mistakes, if you are a junior, in the Navy than it would be if you could never get a good recommendation from a previous civilian employer at a similar age/experience level.

I would suggest that there is a good Chief, Senior Chief, or Master Chief that you could talk to at your command, frankly and openly, at your command, and that you tell them exactly what you expressed here. It is easy to get disappointed when you are young and don't have a large range of experience, but never let disappointment of the temporary situation get you down if you have a broader goal. Remember, the officers and other leaders that are in your way now are only temporary aberrations, and you could rotate into a greater command than had had on your first tour. Good luck, and if I can help with my network of HM Chiefs, let me know.

Response by CDR Guy Thomas made Mar 9 at 2016 7:47 AM

2016-03-09T07:47:12-05:00

Stick it out! Had my share of bumps along the way, especially in the first and last 2 years of my career of 23 years, but I would not trade the middle 19 for anything and, looking back, I was sorry I got out when I did. Should have weathered that last rough patch and stayed for 30. I find huge respect for RETIRED military people on the outside. Wish I had a dollar for every time someone has told me "I should have stayed in. Getting out was a big mistake."

Response by SN Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 9 at 2016 10:24 AM

2016-03-09T10:24:39-05:00

I enlisted in the Navy at 32 years old, in that time I was able to get my degree and I had a fulfilling career. I wanted to try something different because I started getting bored with my career. I have zero regrets about joining, but the lack of leadership is why I will not be reenlisting; and I have been to 4 commands, and only enjoyed one. I say all of this to say, if you want to make a huge contribution to the Navy then stay in. Don't make one command the deciding factor. If you don't have an education or job skills you will not make it out in the "civilian world"....GUARENTEED

Response by PO3 Daniel Shannon made Mar 9 at 2016 11:00 AM

2016-03-09T11:00:16-05:00

Sometimes but mostly for financial reasons which are the wrong reasons. When I got home from my Vietnam tour (1968-1969) I became a very angry young man. My uniforms had been lost in Vietnam so when I showed up after 30 days of leave with no uniforms they punished me with 30 days of KP! Made me very sour towards the Navy. Did receive one promotion but after getting permission from my E5 supervisor to go down to the mess decks (while on watch) and collect the weekly football pool money I was accused of being derelict in my duties and was busted! My attitude obviously did not improve much after that. In fact I was asked NOT to reenlist! Did well in my civilian life, eventually moved up to become the Department Head of a purchasing department of a division of a fortune 500 company. Now please do not misunderstand me, I am proud of the fact I served and even that I served in a very unpopular "war." Will never regret that. Just that as a very young man, a teenager, I did not deal with things very well at the time.

Now any "successes" I had were because of the discipline I learned both from my parents AND from my time in the service. Don't look back, ALWAYS looked forward. We cannot change our past, only what lies ahead by the choices we make.

Response by PO1 Jimmie Husselman made Mar 9 at 2016 11:52 AM

2016-03-09T11:52:57-05:00

I am a retiree from the Navy, also, an HM. Just the benefits alone is worth some of the harassment. But like you I had problems with getting a C school and the good ol' boy group called Chiefs. I retired as an HM1 with broken service, but the medical benefits alone was worth the trip. I retired early because I knew that I would never pass the Chief Boards. The only ones that wanted me to rise above HM1 was HMCS and HMCM's. HM is the best rate in the Nav and very rewarding.
Fair winds and following seas.

Response by AN Anita Feerer made Mar 9 at 2016 12:04 PM

2016-03-09T12:04:03-05:00

I wasn't given a decision. The navy deemed me unfit for medical issues. If I could I would go back in a heartbeat. There are good commands and bad commands in both civilian and military life. The one thing you have with the military is job security. In the civilian world the company can decide that your position isn't needed anymore and let you go the next day. At least with the military as long as you do your job and pass the pft/prt then you will have a job until you retire.

Response by PO2 John Weidenfeller made Mar 9 at 2016 1:06 PM

2016-03-09T13:06:15-05:00

Well, just like you I eventually found myself in a similar situation. Came back from an IA tour, majority of my leadership turned over including my Chief and OIC. LPO picked up khaki and they took 1/2 of our man power and put us into separate divisions. So I can relate too you. There's always life after the Navy. I completed 9 years of it. Now I do my job I did in the Navy as a LS, but now as a civilian for the Department of the Army. At the end of the day, you have to do what's best for you and your career. If you want some great information and feedback in the route I chose, I'd be happy to pass it up forward shipmate.

V/r,

John Weidenfeller
Prior: LS2 (EXW) Weidenfeller
Shoot me an email:
[login to see]

Response by PO3 Scotty Bee made Mar 9 at 2016 4:45 PM

2016-03-09T16:45:55-05:00

Stay in. The original reasons for joining don't change because you get a new, incompetent boss. Ask for a duty transfer, there are always people who want to get out of sea duty if you're willing to take their place. Some bosses are jerks, some are not, don't let someone else influence you to hating a job you love.

Response by CPO Gene Gysin made Mar 9 at 2016 7:57 PM

2016-03-09T19:57:20-05:00

Sounds like you're still a superstar, but leadership is failing you.
The nice thing about the Navy is that you can become the leadership. The first four years of a Navy career is actually the longest.

If you felt the call of the Navy earlier, it's still there. Learn from the low points, avoid them in your leadership style and move on. You can't make things better in our Navy by walking away.

Response by CPO Steve Jackson made Mar 10 at 2016 9:41 AM

2016-03-10T09:41:04-05:00

If you are not happy, do not force yourself to stay in. there are those that will say "if the command is bad, either they will transfer, or you will." that is the wrong answer, however.

I did 11 years and some change active duty, joined the reserves to finish my time. What did I miss about active duty? having everything done for me, and the close friends I had made. Being active duty, you will always have a meal, a bed, and medical and dental.

Do I regret leaving? No. NO. Nope. NOPE. that about sums up my feelings about leaving. Being civilian, you can actually not worry about shaving, let your hair grow out a bit and be 'yourself'. Being in the military, if you were tasked with doing something that would require you to stay late, hey, it got done....or else! being civilian, if something needs to get done, you are getting paid overtime or some other form of compensation. Where I am at, there are quite a few who left the military and did not retire. Honestly, I am very happy with being a civilian. I do not have to worry about a toxic chain of command, like what you are describing, anymore. I had to suffer through two minor toxic commands when I was active duty. Hated command PT with a passion. But, I work out on my own at least 3 - 4 times a week now and am fairly active. Command PT would just irritate me to no end due to the routines they would do. My wrists hurt when doing push ups. What is the standard military response? "are you medically cleared?" Yet, if I do them using a 'perfect push-up' tool, or using barbells so I can form a fist, it feels fine.

Civilian life is not the end of the world, just be prepared. The thing you will to do though is have a plan, just do not leave without getting things in order. Where do you want to live? will you get a degree? do you have a job lined up? how about any medical certifications that you can obtain before you leave, if you so choose?

Do some research before you make that last step so things go easier.

http://www.stripes.com/news/veterans/former-medics-find-themselves-on-bottom-rung-in-civilian-field-1.344392

Former medics find themselves on bottom rung in civilian field

In four deployments as an Army combat medic to some of the most dangerous corners of Iraq and Afghanistan, Joe Carney had seen the worst of war — bullet wounds, severed limbs, shrapnel. He saved lives amid bombs and gunfire, his emergency room often a patch of dirt in the desert or a rocky mountainside. None of that mattered when he left the Army three years ago.

Response by PO3 William Fusick made Mar 10 at 2016 10:10 AM

2016-03-10T10:10:27-05:00

I spent 4 years in the Navy, the last 2 where with the Seabees as a heavy equipment operator. I ended up getting out for family reasons but regret it to this day. I think back now and wished I stayed in. I'm retired now from Farmers Insurance as a auto damage appraiser and could be getting military retirement and social security. Now I receive social security 20% disability because of agent orange and still have to work to maintain my wife and I life style, which I would not have to had I stayed in. Think really hard about leaving. Your current duty station will change along with your leaders.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 10 at 2016 10:45 AM

2016-03-10T10:45:24-05:00

i also started in the navy 8404, got out and went to army with 31 years total service, just retired 2 years ago, so what i'm saying is if you love the military and service, look to other venues

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 10 at 2016 11:40 AM

2016-03-10T11:40:39-05:00

If being in the military is what you want to do then do it. Everyone experiences bad leadership some time in their career. I was once in your shoes with the decision almost just like yours. I decided to get off of active duty and reenlist into the reserves. I regret getting off of active duty bit I'm so grateful that I decided to stay in. I'm now a PO1 and about to reenlist for the final time before my retirement. Your career is how you make it, sometimes others make the road bumpy but learn from every experience you encounter. Do yourself a favor and look at this decision as a very important decision and do not take this decision lightly. I've seen too many people throw away years of service on a whim. I was deployed with an ABH1 that decided to get out right after deployment and he had 19 yrs in just because he didn't want to be deployed again.

Response by PO2 Jason Gray made Mar 10 at 2016 2:25 PM

2016-03-10T14:25:44-05:00

You said you created 47 reasons to get out. Did you make a list of all the reasons to stay in? Duty stations change, leadership changes. The only deciding factor that should matter is YOU. There are good and bad in both military and civilian work forces, the difference is that you know one, and apparently fear the other. The biggest difference is the lack of camaraderie in the civilian world. I would recommend getting your degree before you go to civilian life. There are ample opportunities out there to help you get your degree while still serving. I regret not taking advantage of more of those opportunities.

Response by PO2 Jeffery Berg made Mar 10 at 2016 5:09 PM

2016-03-10T17:09:52-05:00

Yes miss it badly even though I was medically discharged, I wish I could have stayed. I think civilian life is nothing short of a disaster I would give it up in a heart beat.

Response by PO2 Mark Chambers made Mar 11 at 2016 1:55 PM

2016-03-11T13:55:25-05:00

I was an Aviation Structural Mechanic 2nd Class when I was hurt. That injury led to a medical discharge in 1981, so I wasn't given a choice. However, because I truly loved my job, it was especially frustrating. It took me a year of nasty, (very) low paying jobs before I decided to go to college. The transition to civilian life was definitely the hardest thing, and there have always been days when I wonder "what if". But after 35 years, a great career, and a wonderful wife (whom I met in college), everything has worked out. My best advice, be ready for the major lifestyle changes, and have a career plan in mind.

Response by PO3 Thomas Ptasnik made Mar 12 at 2016 7:52 PM

2016-03-12T19:52:37-05:00

I was a PO3 and in communications. I loved it and went from ship to shore duty and out. I went in while the MA - Master at Arms, was being created. I knew I wanted to be a Police Officer when I get out. I ended up getting out after 5 years in June 1991. I joined a Police Department and advanced up to Chief of Police in 19 years. I loved the Navy for the man it made me become. I am proud to say that I SERVED! when others complain. While I was Chief I made it my personal goal to only hire Military personnel. Stay in right now, there nothing out here. The LE scene is nothing but lawsuits and more policies that the US Navy could think of. Get your 20 brother. You are my brother in arms. Tom Ptasnik Ret. Chief/SWAT officer.

Response by PO2 Tracy Taylor made Mar 12 at 2016 8:20 PM

2016-03-12T20:20:54-05:00

28 years ago I was going thru the same questions and I choose to stay in. I end up getting out after that enlistment. I have since work at a factory for 28 years and go thru the same leadership changes you are talking about now. What am I saying , if you like being a corpsman keep doing it.

Response by LTC Kevin B. made Mar 13 at 2016 8:11 AM

2016-03-13T08:11:39-04:00

I left the military twice, and easily transitioned into civilian life both times. After my initial 3-year enlistment (I was also a medic), I got out and moved back to my hometown to attend college. The transition was easy since I had a specific plan to execute upon my ETS (to include having already been admitted into college). I wouldn't recommend simply getting out without a clear plan of action; you need the groundwork to have already been laid. Once I went to college, I joined ROTC and subsequently came back in as an officer. I stayed in for 20 more years before retiring into my current job. I had the job lined up before I even submitted my retirement paperwork, so again the transition was easy because I had a specific plan to execute.

I wouldn't make a decision without weighing your options carefully. Should you decide to make a change, have a plan already in place. And remember, a plan is different than having goals. A goal means "I'll go to school." or "I'll get a job in the health industry." A plan means "I have already been admitted to school and I will attend University of XYZ." or "I already have a job lined up, and will be working at XYZ." Also keep in mind that your military experience will change over time based on the organization to which you are assigned and the people who surround you. Don't significantly alter your future based on your temporary environment. My first assignment as an officer was a horrible, HORRIBLE leadership climate, and I almost pulled the trigger and got out again. Luckily, that was the worst environment that I would ever experience. It only got better from there.

Whichever path you decide, best of luck to you. Let me know if I can be of any help.

Response by PO1 Alan Gray made Apr 11 at 2016 1:41 PM

2016-04-11T13:41:46-04:00

If you stay in be mindful of current events. Right now our oil based economy is not conducive to jobs. On the other hand, you are in a field that is always seeking people. Have you considered becoming an officer in the Nurse Corp? More money and the job more challenging. Also for career intentions, be mindful that all of those above you are a fearin for their position. Find and seek out those that are comfortable in their own skin. And be careful about suggestions to change over someone more senior's suggestions.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 9 at 2017 1:37 PM

2017-01-09T13:37:02-05:00

Go green side... unless that's where the problem occurred!

Response by PO1 Francis Coarr made Jan 9 at 2017 3:23 PM

2017-01-09T15:23:56-05:00

I was in several situations like yours. I started in the Navy as a drilling Reservist, three years later I decided I liked it enough to go on Active duty. As I progressed up the ranks I was encouraged to broaden my experiences by serving in different types of duty, as an Aviation Electronics Tech I varied the aircraft platforms I was assigned. This helped me Score High on my Advancement exams and advance quickly. I also worked command level collateral duties and out of rate assignments within my unit. I found out however that when I was in , it wasn't about your wide span of experience and varied duties but how well you served the command you were assigned and at the second enlistment after 4 years you should stay in the same command as long as possible in order to move up on the evaluation scale. There can only be so many Early Promotes and if you are doing your best, and there was someone there longer than you then you have to wait it out long enough to move up the list as those on the top are promoted or transfer. When you Transfer Commands you start at the bottom of the recommendation list and have to earn your way back up. When at the E-5/e-6 level the only way to make Chief is to get that Must Promote recommendation, So you need to stay put long enough to be considered valuable by your Chain of Command. So it's really about continued excellent service to the same command as long as possible till those at the top of the recommendation list are promoted or transferred out. Also, Education is a must, you Must have some degree to be considered worthy of leadership, so you might as well work on your civilian credentials while you are on active duty, so you will be prepared to leave if you are not recognized or are transferred before you are. Lastly, It's really the same game game as a civilian, without a degree you will never be a respected professional, so put your degree efforts above everything else. Sadly this is the system, the system sucks, but if you just enjoy your job and ignore the assholes, try to do it with a smile and respect and just treat others as you would want to be treated. it will serve you well

Response by MCPO Kurt Stauff made Feb 23 at 2017 10:49 PM

2017-02-23T22:49:20-05:00

I was in the Navy for 29 1/2 years; I have had commands that I enjoyed and others not so much. My advice is to give it a chance because there will always be new commands and leadership changes on the commands you are in; everyone in the Navy is temporary help, especially officers. If you haven't taken advantage of the educational opportunities, do it before you get out; get as many credentials and qualifications as you can. Being a PO2 is looked at as a leadership qual, but get LPO/ALPO on your resume if you can. If you like your rate, get at least an associates that pertains to it before you leave; it may get you advanced faster in the Navy and will give you some street credibility in the civilian world. I decided to stay because I advanced to PO1 at 4 1/2 years, but it took me until 17 years to make Chief; however, I had to change careers at my 11 year point, so I had a steep learning curve in my new rate--I went from an STS1 to a MN1--but after that, I made Senior the first time up and Master Chief after my second look, and there are only 5 Mineman Master Chiefs on active duty at any time). I hung in there and left with a decent pension, which someone who leaves before retirement doesn't have. So get what training you can, take advantage of the educational benefits, and good luck to you!

Response by PO3 Robert Smith made Feb 24 at 2017 1:47 AM

2017-02-24T01:47:53-05:00

I had 11 years of military service but physically not able to continue. Went to college got a degree and retired at 62. Would have been nice to have over 20 years active duty but was not in the cards so no complaints.

Response by PO3 Daniel Stone made Feb 24 at 2017 5:40 AM

2017-02-24T05:40:42-05:00

I can honestly say that when I departed my final command in 1997, the USS Valley Forge (CG-50) homeported in San Diego, CA, I did not look back. Furthermore, when I was working my way through college those initial four years after the Navy were harder than the four years of sea service. Yet, I never regretted being out. Even in recent years when the Great Recession of 2008 decimated the local economy forcing Vets to move in with their parents or to move to towns that they never considered because that was where the opportunity was at, I never regretted not having the safety and protection of the institutionalized life that the military offers. Quite simply, days in civilian life are like snowflakes. No two are the same. Civilian life is what you make of it. Having the honorable discharge and distinguished service in the military will prepare you for the uncertainty that comes with civilian life. My advice to anyone transitioning out of the military is to 1) have a plan, 2) have realistic expectations, 3) be flexible, and 4) don't leave things to luck.