Do fellow combat veterans want to expatriate to another country?

SGT Shon D. Hill — Tue, 20 May 2014 22:52:23 -0400

I'm going deeper now, Doc Hill here ready for serious discussion here! I don't fit in anywhere, I'm tired of direction much in our country has taken in general, and after spending a lot of time in 3rd world or developing countries, I sincerely desire to move to a place like Belize, Costa Rica, or South America. I worked hard to learn Spanish, blonde blue eyes notwithstanding, do you feel same often? Do many of us lose our "Identity" here serving many years? Does thinking this make me unpatriotic, or worse? Not much interested in politics about this, but share your thoughts with me, I know I'm not alone. Thank you and blast me with criticism if you believe your right, I'm not soft! Curse me in Spanish if you really want ;), I'm fluent and will enjoy it! Okay, Ty and I'm curious about responses!

Response by MSG Brad Sand made May 23 at 2014 11:20 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Fri, 23 May 2014 11:20:32 -0400

SGT Hill,

For myself, I did not lose my identity, if anything, I my identity grew stronger with, and from, service to our Nation. I do feel some of your pain when I look at where are Country seems to be headed, but I do not think throwing the baby out with the bath water is the right answer. I do not think voicing your concerns makes you unpatriotic...not sure what the 'or worse'...but those who do not understand why are Nation has been, and still is, a shining beacon for freedom for the rest of the World. If you want to pull up stakes and move, I can understand your thoughts but if things were so great there, why are so many of these countries citizens flooding across our border?

Response by SSG V. Michelle Woods made May 25 at 2014 9:56 PM

SSG V. Michelle Woods — Sun, 25 May 2014 21:56:42 -0400

I don't feel I've lost my identity with this great nation but I certainly don't think less of you if you feel that way Doc.

I personally would love to live in Sweden myself if I had to choose another country to reside; however they'll have to kill me before I ever give up citizenship from my beautiful country.

Oh unless of course the Texas Revolution kicks off. Then "y'all can all go to hell, as for me, I'm going to Texas!" ;)

Response by SSG Robin Rushlo made May 26 at 2014 10:17 AM

SSG Robin Rushlo — Mon, 26 May 2014 10:17:29 -0400

I know what you mean. I was a member of a church and on a memorial day and Veterans day They asked anyone that served please stand and out of 300 plus I was the only one. DETACHED is the word.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made May 26 at 2014 10:20 AM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Mon, 26 May 2014 10:20:59 -0400

Hey Doc. I've often thought about it but with my deep family ties I couldn't move to another state, let alone another country. You can't help but wonder would I be better off somewhere else giving the state of our country today? Then you watch the news, and for me, I'm snapped back to the reality that living in any country has its pros and cons. I'm not in a business position to move to another country so for now I'll just stay here in the USA.

For those that have the opportunity and willingness to move away, I admire it and can slightly envy it.

Life takes us all over so we each go with our gut to wherever it leads us.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2014 10:34 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 26 May 2014 10:34:35 -0400

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expatriate

Expatriate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

An expatriate (often shortened to expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing in a country other than that of their citizenship. The word comes from the Latin terms ex ("out of") and patria ("country, fatherland").

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2014 10:39 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 26 May 2014 10:39:24 -0400

expatriate
noun
noun: expatriate; plural noun: expatriates
ɪksˈpatrɪət,-ˈpeɪtrɪət,ɛks-/

1.
a person who lives outside their native country.
"American expatriates in London"
archaic
an exile.
synonyms: emigrant, non-native, émigré, migrant, economic migrant, guest worker; More
displaced person, refugee, exile;
Gastarbeiter;
informalexpat, DP
"the level of salary paid to expatriates working overseas"
antonyms: national

adjective
adjective: expatriate
ɪksˈpatrɪət,-ˈpeɪtrɪət,ɛks-/

1.
denoting or relating to a person living outside their native country.
"expatriate workers"
synonyms: emigrant, living abroad, working abroad, non-native, émigré; More
displaced, refugee, exiled;
informalexpat
"expatriate workers"
antonyms: native, indigenous

verb
verb: expatriate; 3rd person present: expatriates; past tense: expatriated; past participle: expatriated; gerund or present participle: expatriating
ɪksˈpatrɪeɪt,-ˈpeɪtrɪeɪt,ɛks-/

1.
send (a person or money) abroad.
"we expatriated the prisoners of war immediately after the end of the war"
synonyms: settle abroad, live abroad, relocate abroad More
"he never visited Europe—still less was he tempted to expatriate himself"

Origin
mid 18th century (as a verb): from medieval Latin expatriat- ‘gone out from one's country’, from the verb expatriare, from ex- ‘out’ + patria ‘native country’.
Translate expatriate to
Use over time for: expatriate

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2014 10:41 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 26 May 2014 10:41:48 -0400

In May 2013, the State Department estimated that there are currently 7.6 million Americans living outside the United States

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2014 11:12 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 26 May 2014 11:12:15 -0400

It's actually not that uncommon. For one, I felt more at home with the people of Ghana than I did with the people of my hometown, Tucson, AZ.

Now, I love America. I love the Constitution. However America as a whole is not the same nation that it was 20 or even 10 years ago. We're on a dark path, socially. Now, I'm not one of those social conservatives by any means (I voted for Gary Johnson for reference). It's a societal decay that prioritizes "Oh no you didn't say that!" on TV to actual news, or the total breakdown of the moral fabric of society.

People in general have just become totally disrespectful and self centered and being in the military, I've been able to see that we really are two totally different worlds. When I'm in America, I feel like a visitor to some twisted caricature of the nation I fell in love with. I feel at home in the wilderness. I feel at home out in the boonies where everyone knows everyone and the community is really tight. The moment I step into a city though, my anxiety shoots through the roof because I find the decadence flat out revolting.

Enough of my rant. I'll just leave it that America is still the greatest nation on Earth, even if not all of it is perfect (nothing ever is). You can find a little bit of paradise if you look though. Be it upstate Utah, the mountains west of Colorado Springs, central Texas, northern Arizona, Louisiana, Florida, etc.

Though I don't mind that whole exchange rate thing in South America and Africa!

Response by SSgt Michael Hacker made May 26 at 2014 11:38 AM

SSgt Michael Hacker — Mon, 26 May 2014 11:38:23 -0400

I've been trying to get back to Japan for years, but apparently the restraining order is still in effect.

Response by SGT Keith Boettcher made May 26 at 2014 11:52 AM

SGT Keith Boettcher — Mon, 26 May 2014 11:52:34 -0400

I am a WTU soldier. I have been having the same thoughts and feelings of moving to the countries you mentioned. I have been asking around and talking to other fellow WTU vets of all ranks and they have the same thoughts and feelings. I don't feel I fit in here anymore. Everyone to include the military and VA docs telling me that I am a liar, I over exaggerate, secondary gain. They don't know me, nor do they know what I feel and dream about. I can no longer trust anyone other than my spouse.

Response by SGT Craig Northacker made May 26 at 2014 3:34 PM

SGT Craig Northacker — Mon, 26 May 2014 15:34:18 -0400

You pose an excellent question. Many of us do not fit in - but that gives us the ability to go ahead and operate on our own wave length and be good with it.

I resonate you with respect to living in New York. NY has many great attributes, however corruption in government agencies makes it impossible for me to want to live here any more. I have been to Albany, met with the Governor many times, and while I think he is trying to overcome the sloth of the Agencies, they turn turtle and do what they do anyway, including violating all kinds of laws with inept and corrupt policies of convenience that have no basis in law. After a lifetime of fighting them as a CPA, I am ready to throw in the towel here - except my daughter is in 9th grade and it is important to me to let her finish high school here. The sense of entitlement here is epidemic - teachers and cops complain about not having contracts, but the law gives them raises anyway. Teachers with not all that much time teaching, and cops on Long Island approach $100,000 per year, and I had to fight 35 years for a pittance on disability. Senior teachers and cops can have a benefit package approaching $ 200,000 and more, ensuring that real estate taxes will never be reasonable.

The rest is individual - do we want to make a difference, are we fed up, do we just truck along and ignore the status quo - no one right way. Good luck to us all!

Response by SGT Craig Northacker made May 26 at 2014 3:43 PM

SGT Craig Northacker — Mon, 26 May 2014 15:43:13 -0400

Doc-on a note or two of reality, remember that corruption is alive and well everywhere. Your goal is to minimize its' impact on you. In foreign lands you are subject to the vagaries of political winds at any given time, personal safety, etc. You can have your house, land business nationalized and have zero recourse.

Second, if you want to become a citizen in the next country, be aware that the US deems you to be a US taxpayer for at least 10 years.

I grew up overseas - there are a lot of pros and cons if you have kids that need schooling. But one can say the same about living anywhere.

Good luck!

Response by SFC Rich Carey made May 27 at 2014 2:26 PM

SFC Rich Carey — Tue, 27 May 2014 14:26:41 -0400

This is not uncommon, I know individuals that talk about moving. Heck, I own 8 hectors in the Philippines, an option.

Remember, the grass is always greener on the other side

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2014 8:37 PM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 May 2014 20:37:15 -0400

If my home state of Texas does go on its own and becomes its own, then I would join my state in a heartbeat. As far as another country, I don't think i could do it. I am loyal to my state, country, and God. All other take a backseat.

Response by MAJ Bryan Zeski made May 28 at 2014 1:05 AM

MAJ Bryan Zeski — Wed, 28 May 2014 01:05:05 -0400

Me and my family are looking at Panama. 2nd happiest country in the world. Warm sandy beaches. A house on the beach costs under $1000/mo. I'm in (after retirement)!

Response by SGT Shon D. Hill made May 28 at 2014 3:00 AM

SGT Shon D. Hill — Wed, 28 May 2014 03:00:29 -0400

Thank you very much to all of you who have responded and shared your opinions, facts, thoughts and life challenges for this very difficult question. I've been rather lost in civilian life and it's a hard pill to swallow. Some of that is of my own doing or lack thereof, but a lot is just the way it is and I appreciate all of you for taking the time to be a part of this important discussion. Please continue to jump in if something new comes to mind or you know of someone who can assist or share.
Doc

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2014 9:06 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 May 2014 09:06:27 -0400

Hola Doc Hill,

I spent my 20s travelling outside the US, learning Spanish (3 months in LATAM), and enjoying life. The moment your passport is stamped and the moment you see foreign flags hoisted above government buildings , you will feel your identity (and your patriotism) stronger, not weaker. Something about being in a foreign land that makes you realize who you truly are. Even if you spend time in countries with anti-US propaganda posted on the streets, you will feel your identity stronger as you clench your passport while studying Spanish and enjoying the culture.

If you wish to learn Spanish, and need destinations to get started, connect with me.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 28 at 2014 9:25 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 May 2014 09:25:40 -0400

Hey, the Australian Army was looking to recruit former American service members as of a year and a half ago, they may still be at it...

http://www.stripes.com/news/serving-down-under-australia-offers-military-jobs-to-us-troops-facing-separation-1.176622

Serving Down Under: Australia offers military jobs to US troops facing separation

U.S. servicemembers looking at career options in this era of shrinking military budgets and force drawdowns might want to take a look Down Under.

Response by SFC William Swartz Jr made May 28 at 2014 10:52 AM

SFC William Swartz Jr — Wed, 28 May 2014 10:52:08 -0400

Pendejo.....j/k....I have no problem with an individual wishing to move elsewhere and live, it is to that persons happiness that they should be looking for. I for one wouldn't do it unless I had a good job opportunity as I am happy here, even with the direction we are heading, I can only hope to assist in changing this by being here. Great post though, as I know a lot of Disgruntled Vets who feel as you do and choose to move away....

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 29 at 2014 7:49 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 29 May 2014 07:49:07 -0400

Personally,
I have also considered moving to Thailand when I retire from the Army. I have spent some time there, and I love the place. I like the Idea of actually retiring when I retire. There are a lot of American and European Expatriates in Thailand, and they all seem to be enjoying themselves. Unfortunately we are accustomed to a certain degree of political and social stability that just doesn't exist throughout much of the the developing world. That isn't to say that it wouldn't be worth the adventure, as long as you have an escpape plan. South and Central America would be good choices too. You hit on a great point, and it should not be taken lightly, and that is the absolute necessity of learning the language of the place you spend your time and money. It will not only make the difference in your cost of living by not paying inflated prices charged to unsuspecting tourists, but it also helps you make new friends who can tell you about a "friend of friend" who has a furnished apartment for rent on the cheap. I would reccommend going to the country of your choice and stay for two or three months, just to see if it is for you. You can do this most places on a tourist visa, without any problems. If you decide to stay you can begin the process for a longer stay visa.

Sounds like fun

Do it.

Response by PO2 Erik Swanson made Jun 4 at 2014 3:14 PM

PO2 Erik Swanson — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 15:14:08 -0400

I'm married to a citizen of Macedonia. We're moving there after I retire. I'll NEVER give up my US citizenship, but it makes financial sense. Not only that, but people of other countries appreciate what we've done, unlike many people here in the states that call us baby killers, or gun toting inbreeds.

Response by SGT Thomas Lucken made Jun 22 at 2014 11:51 AM

SGT Thomas Lucken — Sun, 22 Jun 2014 11:51:32 -0400

Shon, not saying that is the right thing to do. But many have done it, including me!!!! There are a lot of veterans who live in the P.I., many I know. Enough of them, there is a VA Hospital there!!!!

Korea, many of us were there. But even when I left the last time in 2000, dollar was crap and Korean economy was booming and still is 14 years later!

After 14 years, of being back in the world! I keep making that threat to leave! So you are far from being alone my brother!!!!!!

Response by Sgt Packy Flickinger made Oct 20 at 2014 3:58 AM

Sgt Packy Flickinger — Mon, 20 Oct 2014 03:58:38 -0400

I can understand how you feel that way. I have no desire to leave but if I did it would be more for an exotic retirement than because of issues here. Who wouldn't want to spend out their golden years on a beach in the Bahamas or New Zealand?

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Jan 1 at 2015 8:49 PM

LTC Stephen C. — Thu, 01 Jan 2015 20:49:30 -0500

SGT Shon D. Hill, I'm certainly not ready to give up on the U.S. yet, despite the fact that it feels like we're upside down. However, if you decide to go somewhere else, give it a trial first. You may not feel like you "fit in" there once you get to your dream location. I don't think you're unpatriotic. There are U.S. expatriates all over the world. I would hope you wouldn't give up that U.S. passport though. If you do go, "Vaya con Dios."

Response by SGT Alicia Brenneis made Jan 2 at 2015 12:37 AM

SGT Alicia Brenneis — Fri, 02 Jan 2015 00:37:29 -0500

I think about it all the time. For me, I think it is that our country is politically overly complicated. I think of finding a place where I can have a home, work my land(garden, vegetables, maybe some small animals. I am not a farmer) and raise a family without worrying about what city is burning or when the next vote is. When you have to vote for a politician by who lies the least.. something is wrong. I get overwhelmed by how much we have or are expected to have. During deployment you know you have less than back home but you don't realize when the less becomes enough and more becomes too much.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Jan 4 at 2015 12:47 PM

CPT Jack Durish — Sun, 04 Jan 2015 12:47:04 -0500

You can run, but you can't hide...

The truth is that there is no place that I would rather live than as an American in America. Sadly, while I remain true to the concept, the nation has drifted away. I know there are others who feel as I do, but we failed to fight for our country.

Yeah, sure, many of us think we fought for our country, but did we? Or, were we fighting for someone else's country? Were we fighting for some cause other than to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution, while it was attacked from within? After all, what is America without its Constitution? It seems it's becoming just another third world, banana republic...

So, which is more likely? That we can go somewhere else and rebuild America or rebuild it here? Or, do we simply submit and kiss it all goodbye? That is the question?

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 4 at 2015 1:16 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 04 Jan 2015 13:16:32 -0500

I know exactly how you feel. I am moving to germany (stationed there first duty station) and actually have orders to go back for 4 years this December. Once I move there I am never moving back to the states. It really sucks that I won't be able to stay in Germany and in the US army for the next 15 years so I could retire but when the time comes down to choose the army or germany in means of where I am going to live it will be an easy answer... Germany :) I love the way their govt is set up, yeah there is a lot of tax... But they use that tax a lot better then America so it's not that bad to me. Don't feel unpatriotic, I sometimes goes through the same thoughts.

Response by SPC William Weedman made Nov 26 at 2017 4:53 PM

SPC William Weedman — Sun, 26 Nov 2017 16:53:11 -0500

I’m currently living in the Netherlands with my Dutch wife who I met long after I left the military. I joke with my coworkers (I’m the only US citizen outside the US here) that all Americans including me are crazy. Sometimes I’m more serious than others. Eventually we will move to the US, but likely not to my hometown. Nothing wrong with it but it isn’t “home” anymore. “Home” is a few centimeters inside her chest, not an address on a map.

Response by SSG Antoinette Azevedo Toscano made Nov 26 at 2017 6:47 PM

SSG Antoinette Azevedo Toscano — Sun, 26 Nov 2017 18:47:06 -0500

First, thank you for this question. I don't think it makes you unpatriotic at all. It just makes you someone who is AWAKE! A deep thinker. Tengo un premio para ti por apprendio Espanol--manito. Spanish is not my first language either so I hope I got that right. I completely understand what you mean. I have considered moving to another country too. I would not give up my U.S. citizenship either. The one drawback is finding a country where we would have similar freedoms and levels of corruption as the U.S.--levels that are reasonably tolerable I mean. Because there is corruption in the U.S. too. And is safe from the possibility of kidnapping. I say find your peace where you can.

Response by SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter made Nov 26 at 2017 8:08 PM

SSgt Harvey "Skip" Porter — Sun, 26 Nov 2017 20:08:32 -0500

It's definitely not unpatriotic many ex military people have move to other countries. I have met a many expats while traveling in Europe, Caribbean, Philippines. I was reading an article earlier in the year about guys that actually fought in Vietnam some have moved back there and formed an expat community. It's all about what one wants to do which will give them a piece of mind and make them happy. Life is too short not to enjoy it as one chooses.

Peace!

Response by SMSgt Michael Laskowski made Mar 18 at 2022 7:59 AM

SMSgt Michael Laskowski — Fri, 18 Mar 2022 07:59:10 -0400

I retired and moved to Australia. Having deployed for 4.5 years and posted overseas for 10, I've only been in the US for about 13 or so years. After being in the middle east and Europe so long, time in the states came to feel like a disruption to the normal routines. And interactions with the public were less fulfilling. As great as it is to be an American, the time away from the states made it feel less like home. To be an expat doesn't mean you should feel bad or shame...rather it shows you've learned about the world. You're only unpatriotic if you decide to hide or bury your allegiance.