Do you have any advice on going from E4 to E5?

2015-07-01T17:02:22-04:00

I'm currently a SPC trying to get my NCO's to take me seriously and put me in a team leader spot so that I can go to the P board (I guess it's some kind of requirement for this company). I'm motivated almost every day, I'm always working, and the joes listen to me and usually don't give me any lip when I inform them of a detail we need to do. Usually half way through the job, an NCO will walk up and take over and I end up getting no credit for any of the work I put into whatever we had going on. I really don't know where I stand in this company and am honestly getting tired of being overlooked. Any advice would be appreciated because I'm starting to lose faith and motivation.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Jul 1 at 2015 5:07 PM

2015-07-01T17:07:41-04:00

SPC Private RallyPoint Member, I would hope that no one in your chain of command could see this thread. I'd seriously consider rewording or removing this thread and get some advice off line.

Response by SGT Neil Chandler made Jul 1 at 2015 5:15 PM

2015-07-01T17:15:46-04:00

I would continue to to what you've been doing. Also take the problem up your chain of command. Go to your first line leader, squad leader, plt Sgt. If none of that works go to tour 1st Sgt or if all else fails if your CO has an open door policy talk to them. Don't get discouraged and lose your motivation.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 5:21 PM

2015-07-01T17:21:29-04:00

I was told by a PSG many years ago that I may perceive that nobody is paying attention, when in fact more people are watching than you realize! I know it can be frustrating, and I agree with both SSG Palmer, and LTC Curlee. Let the NCO know that you got this (be tactful & respectful). Also ask your SQD LDR what you can do that you are not already doing. I know it is said a lot of times do not volunteer for anything, but I would argue that. Volunteer and let your leadership know you are willing to do what is necessary. Most of the time when you think nobody is paying attention is the time somebody has eyes on you. Keep driving forward and with your head up, and fully motivated and you will get your due.

Response by SPC Jack Hunt, JR made Jul 1 at 2015 5:21 PM

2015-07-01T17:21:56-04:00

From my perspective when I was a young Spc. It wasn't about recognition, it should be about your conduct as a soldier for starters. Then become as highly proficient in all aspects of your MOS. Mean while you should never think that in what ever the task your doing that good enough is good enough.
Another idea is PT the minimum standard is just that the minimum to be alloed. Shoot for 300 and don't start feeling good about your score till you break 280.

Good luck, Jack

Response by SPC David Isakson made Jul 1 at 2015 5:21 PM

2015-07-01T17:21:58-04:00

Talk to your squad leader.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 5:32 PM

2015-07-01T17:32:44-04:00

I say keep doing your job to the best of your ability. Tell your supervisor, you are more than capable of doing the task at hand. I have done it when I felt people were trying to take over and it went well. Your time to shine will come. Just be a little patient

Response by SFC Joseph Bosley made Jul 1 at 2015 5:37 PM

2015-07-01T17:37:09-04:00

I would begin by telling my soldiers stop trying to impress me and focus on doing your job. I can't stand brown nosers and would rather have soldiers that were more concerned with the, in my opinion, 2 most important things: mission and men. Then comes competence, learn every aspect of you job you can. Soldiers who demonstrated the desire to learn and lead by example got promoted first in my platoon. Finally stop trying to win awards and ratings. those come automatically when you do the above.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 5:48 PM

2015-07-01T17:48:49-04:00

No worries...I felt the same way. But besides, it's your first lines responsibility to do this thing called counseling...that's where it all starts...counseling is key to success both for the subordinate and the leader...lousy keep working hard and doing what your doing...read into 6-22 and make it your life. It'll pay off in the end. But always remember, a leader who fails to counsel his subordinates, is neglegant towards his duties. The. You'll never see this problem with your joes

Response by MAJ Bryan Zeski made Jul 1 at 2015 5:51 PM

2015-07-01T17:51:06-04:00

When those NCOs come and take over your job, it might be because some Platoon Leader or Platoon Sergeant noticed that a Specialist was running the show and casually mentioned to the NCO, "Hey, why is that Specialist doing YOUR job?" Platoon and Company leadership aren't always vocal about what they see - but they do see it.

Response by SGT John Wesley made Jul 1 at 2015 5:59 PM

2015-07-01T17:59:57-04:00

Your Squad leader should be letting you know where you stand via your counseling and just your normal talks.

I had pretty good Sgts above me always looking out for me and making sure I was doing what I was supposed to do and offering concrete advise.

Keep putting yourself out there by being a team player! These guys that talk about brownnosing or cheese eating are usually the guys that are not motivated to move up.

Response by SSgt Charles Edwards made Jul 1 at 2015 6:13 PM

2015-07-01T18:13:44-04:00

One thing you can always do is seek feedback from your supervisor. His input will make it up the chain and to those who handle promotions. In the meantime, keep doing your best, stay motivated and focused.

Response by SGT James Allen made Jul 1 at 2015 6:30 PM

2015-07-01T18:30:22-04:00

Just keep a positive attitude. I went from E-1 to E-5 in 42 months, as a 19Kilo. As soon as I achieved time in grade at E-5, my unit sent me to the E-6 board and straight to BNCOC. So just stay motivated.

Response by SGT Racie Hutchens made Jul 1 at 2015 6:39 PM

2015-07-01T18:39:51-04:00

Ok,.. I know your getting advice left, right, and center. First and foremost keep your core values without them your lost. I came into the Army as a result of the death of a "brother". Years ago I was Navy, and if you were part of another branch of the military. The Army will fast track you back into active service. This program is usually for returning Army or Marines. However, I went through this two week course (after 14yrs of being out) was stamped good to go. Since I had my licensure in pharmacy on the civilian side, straight to Walter Reed. I was there 2 months when my, shall we call her a E-5 since she had recently been demoted from SSG (and in my estimation does not deserve the term SGT) sent me to the board. I had no clue, not only did she not prepare me for it. I was so lost in the sauce, I had to ask someone why they were banging on the door like that!! So long story, long lol be aware learn from the good NCO's, you know who they are! Always do the right thing even when you know it may cause others to grumble. In the end you'll get there because you want it more! Good luck, Gods speed!

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 6:40 PM

2015-07-01T18:40:10-04:00

It sounds like you have your peer group's respect. Which is good. The NCOs are doing their jobs. You sound like you need a pat on the back/recognition. Monthly counselings are your best bet. On top of your day-to-day A-game, you should be studying ADP/ADRPs, unit history, and your CoC.

Response by SGT Victor Medina made Jul 1 at 2015 6:53 PM

2015-07-01T18:53:13-04:00

NCOs are the Backbone of the Army. Without good NCOs, there could not be good and strong morale among soldiers. On my days, if you wanted to be noticed you didn't have nothing to do but your job. To be promotable you have to do your research, take schooling, and additional training. Is not all about being likeable but about knowledgeable. Every one in the ranks may likes you but in a combat situation you may not know what you must do to bring them home alive. Don't worry so much about being promoted but about acquiring knowledge. With more rank there is more responsibility.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Jul 1 at 2015 6:54 PM

2015-07-01T18:54:37-04:00

A lot of things come into play here:
1st what is your relationship with these NCO's who walk over and take over? Is it a favorable one? If so talk to them one on one and explain your situation, and present it in a manner that shows that you are freeing them up for more complicated tasks. If for some reason you don't have a good report with these individuals talk to your squad leader/section sergeant and let him/her know.

Two point wise, where would you sit right now if you put your packet together? What can you do to improve some of the areas you may not be "at your best," seek guidance form your leadership. Also ask to give classes, this gives NCO's a chance to watch and see what you did to prepare your self, your ability to handle a difficult situation. Every class a sniper or know it all in it, now a days I have learned often it is people who may actually have an emotional or personnel issue like ADHD, that compels them to speak out. The Army does not really teach us to deal with people like this directly, we have to develop our tactics and techniques.

Keep in mind to a lot of NCO's they are being rated as well, and the command climate may be one where they have to show they are doing something all the time.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 7:35 PM

2015-07-01T19:35:40-04:00

From Junior enlisted to another junior enlisted you need to find what motivates you. As a future NCO ensuring the welfare of your soldiers and battle buddies should be your priority. Go from "One Team One Fight" to "For This Team I Will Fight." If you are so gung-ho about being an NCO then the time will come But in the meantime do as you are told, take initiative and continue to do what you have being doing. Trust and believe someone is always watching and taking notes. Unless you are 6+ years TIS, you have nothing to worry about.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 7:52 PM

2015-07-01T19:52:26-04:00

I understand your frustration, but let me give you some perspective. In 2008 I joined the Tennessee National Guard after a 10-year break in service from active duty and USAR. I was a 37 year-old E-4 assigned to a signal unit, still holding a 13F MOS. I was not MOSQ for my duty position, and even if I was, in the National Guard if your unit does not have a slot, you don't get promoted. I waited two years for a school slot to reclass to 25F, and once I was done I sat at the top of the promotion list. Two months after the list came out, the 25F MOS was eliminated and I was back to square one. The next year I returned for 25N reclass, completed it and waited for the next promotion list to come out. I was the ONLY name on the list, but since there was a logjam at E-6, so the E-5 occupying my slot could not go anywhere. In November 2014, after six years TIG (a lot more if you consider I pinned on my E-4 in 1993) the pieces began to move and I pinned my E-5 that December. I was 41 years old, and had fellow E-5's who I knew as E-1's welcome me to the NCO ranks. By final formation my hand hurt from congratulatory handshakes and my chest ached from my "welcome party". :-)
My point is, through it all I did my best to keep a good attitude, did what was expected of me and didn't expect visible recognition. I am fortunate to be in a close-knit unit with NCO's and lower enlisted that encouraged me through each detour and speed bump. Keep your spirits up keep your mind on the mission. Finally, when you do get there it gets real, so be ready to step up. Anyone who might say becoming an NCO does not feel that different is either lying or got it for the wrong reasons. Those three stripes weigh heavy, and all eyes are on you.
Didn't mean to give you a life story, but I hope it helps to hear from someone who has been through a long journey to Sergeant and can tell you it's worth the wait.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 7:58 PM

2015-07-01T19:58:44-04:00

SPC O'Quinn, you're right SSG Ryan R. gave you some very solid advice. He pointed out some things that helped you realize that wanting a thing does not necessarily mean you are ready for it. He also made a great point about too many E-5s are really SPCs running around wearing SGT stripes just because the points dipped low enough.

A promotion is the Army (via your chain of command) recognizing that you have shown the ABILITY to perform at the next highest grade. Although you only have 9 months TIG, that doesn't concern me as much as you do not have a complete grasp of how your own promotion process works (how are you supposed to mentor the SPCs that come behind you if you don't know yourself?).

One of the biggest responsibilities of being an NCO is Soldier care. If you had a Soldier under you that had a financial problem, a drug/alcohol problem, PTSD, threatened suicide, etc...would you know what resources to get them to? These are things you will be expected to answer when appearing before the promotion board you mentioned.

On to points...how do you compare to your peers in the things that you have control over. The very first thing I ask when a Soldier comes to me about getting promoted is, "what do your correspondence courses look like?" These are free points (as opposed to a minimal cost to you on AD to attend college). Both show initiative (a required trait for a successful NCO) and can help you overcome areas where you may be weak (perhaps your eyesight keeps you from consistently shooting expert, maybe you have an ingrown toenail that hampers your ability to max the 2 mi run, etc.). Never underestimate the value of schools, whether NCOES (like WLC) or a course like ASIST that is a benefit to the unit as well as you...a future leader.

One thing that will benefit you is obtaining a mentor. This may not be your team leader, it may not be anyone in your chain of command, but who else to help you get to where you want to be than someone that has already done it. Approaching an NCO that you respect for career advice doesn't constitute "jumping the chain," and shows that you are invested in your own success.

Keep the faith & stay motivated!

Response by SPC Scott Weber made Jul 1 at 2015 8:21 PM

2015-07-01T20:21:27-04:00

Ok you have many ideas set forth to you here. 1 look at points needed for your mos, make sure you surpassed them. Then if you dont have points in one or more areas, get the points you need. PT is a big point. Schooling is 2nd biggest point look at what is needed for promotion to SSGT and other than BNOC PLDC or other in MOS Leadership schools look at collage needs. If you have fulfilled the basics then go farther ahead of your peers. Also look at army standing for your mos in^out criteria make sure your not in an over staffed E-5 SGT MOS. I was all good on points skills college extra points and PT near 270. But i was in an over staff MOS so i could not move up.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Jul 1 at 2015 8:42 PM

2015-07-01T20:42:12-04:00

That is how a 2LT often fells. Keep the faith. I suspect they maybe both messing with you and testing you.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 9:11 PM

2015-07-01T21:11:03-04:00

Like others have said, make sure you're getting counseling monthly and the specific reason you aren't going to the promotion board is in there. If it is not, inquire as to why yourself, and have him put it in the counseling.

Response by SGT Ronnie Warford made Jul 1 at 2015 9:19 PM

2015-07-01T21:19:32-04:00

Boards Boards Boards !!!! Max out PT, take initiative and keep on your leadership about going to WLC or other schools. You wanna fast track I can tell, I fast tracked. E-5 in 32 months. It's your career don't let anyone or anything get in your way. Lead PT and most of all win some damn boards they can't stop you if your senior leadership sees your better than your junior leadership !

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 1 at 2015 9:28 PM

2015-07-01T21:28:50-04:00

As somebody who has written evals for others, the process ensures you're not overlooked. Your NCOs know you, and they'll be asked to rank you against your peers. When they do that, your work will be taken into account. Then again, there may be another SPC who is charging hard, and you may not be aware of it. Just keep doing what you're doing and have faith that the system is specifically designed to not overlook good people. (That lesson was the only thing that kept me sane when I had to write, re-write, and rank 70-some people.)

Response by MSgt Brian Welch made Jul 1 at 2015 9:42 PM

2015-07-01T21:42:57-04:00

Sounds like your hearts in the right place. At an appropriate time ask to speak with your supervisor. Tell him or her you want more responsibility. Tell them you want to be challendged. Tell them you want to ease some of their burden. I don't know the Army but I believe approach is everything.

Response by SSG Robert Blair made Jul 1 at 2015 10:29 PM

2015-07-01T22:29:20-04:00

Credit:
You have every right to tactfully request the opportunity to finish what you started with any NCO, Officer or Soldier. You were given a task and place in control of that task. It is up to you to see it through and any NCO should be happy to back off if they're any good NCO. Don't be afraid to speak your peace to anyone regardless of rank. As long as you have grounds to do so and are respectful and tactful.

Promotion:
As far as the position for E-5. Let your chain know that you are prepared to make the next step and be an NCO. Ask them what you need to prepare for it. What are they looking for? Only you can control your career. Don't wait on others to notice. Put it in their faces. Example, "Hey Sergeant, I got that SSD-1 and the NCO leadership courses done what else can I do next to prepare myself to be a good NCO." Each time you complete something, ask again, that is how you get noticed. People remember when you constantly bring up what you've done to better yourself for the job.
Also find out if there is actually a slot available for E5.
This is a good start!

Response by SSG Melvin Nulph made Jul 2 at 2015 1:12 AM

2015-07-02T01:12:12-04:00

Spc. Tyler O'Quinn, first off I am not against what you are after at all, okay? I think it's great you want to be an NCO and lead soldiers. But for the love of God, what is this statement, "I guess", you should know to go to this board. You have to know your units history as well as your job in the next level the best way to prepare for your E5 is to be ready for E6.
Have you been to any company boards for (soldier of the month, of the quarter) or any of that?
Being a leader has so much more to it than telling others what to do. Are you at least a sharp shooter, max your APFT, how do you set as far as military education, civilian ed. Are you taking night classes?
You have got to be harder on yourself to be your best. Being honest with yourself, it's one of the hardest things I had to do as a leader.
How long have you been in the military?

Response by SGT William Howell made Jul 2 at 2015 6:51 AM

2015-07-02T06:51:33-04:00

Welcome to the world of Specialist. Do good and a NCO will take the pats on the back, do bad and you will get the blame.

Here is my advice for you.

NCOs need to be leaders. Leading is not about getting details done. That is about bossing. Leading is about accomplishing the mission, taking care of your troops, and your troops taking care of you. The "taking care of troops" is the hard part. There is paperwork, psychology, sociology, being able to dish out and take ass chewings among the zillion other things that go with responsibility of leading troops.

Carry a notebook for just leadership notes. Write both the good and the bad in that book. If it is bad, write what you would do different if you were that leader. You already have your first one. Giving credit were credit is due, for the details that you work.

Get and read the FM 7-22.7 NCOs Handbook. It is actually one of the best things that will help you as a young soldier. It is a great read.

Find a senior NCO that has his shit in one sack. Go to him and tell him you need a mentor. Set up a time to meet on a regular basis. Ask him questions that you have wrote down in your handy dandy notebook.

Make sure you are getting a monthly counseling statement. You have to get feedback if you are going to improve. If you are not getting them you need to make it happen. You and you alone are responsible for your promotion.

Being an NCO was one of the most satisfying things I ever did in my life. Good luck.

Response by SGT Adrian Thompson made Jul 2 at 2015 7:57 AM

2015-07-02T07:57:25-04:00

Brother, I was an E4 for a very long time before making E5. I had a 1st class PFT, expert rifle, multiple deployments, a combat meritorious promotion to E3, special schools, correspondence courses, and had NCO billets. The reason I didn't pick up for so long was due to being CLOSED OUT for promotion for my MOS. It didn't change the way I did business, I just kept doing what had to be done until it was my time. When I finally picked up, I had WAY above the score required to pick up the rank.

Basically- if all of your stuff is locked down and there is no room for "paper improvement" just have patience.

Response by SGT Ronald Minick made Jul 2 at 2015 9:06 AM

2015-07-02T09:06:41-04:00

If your leadership is " overlooking" you, you may be lacking in some things. Leading Soldiers is a big responsibility. Are you proficient in knowledge if your MOS? I have never seen a motivated, knowledgeable and responsible E4 "overlooked"....ever for promotion with those three qualities. Maybe you should check yourself?

Response by MSG Pedro Alvarez made Jul 2 at 2015 10:26 AM

2015-07-02T10:26:37-04:00

Don't give hope away. As a Senior NCO all I can tell you is that you need to go for it. Do not wait until you get notice, but instead in one of your counseling sessions be straight forward. Counseling is a two way conversation and let them know feel ready to move up and take higher responsibilities. If you have the time in grade and time in service, then let them know you would like to go to the promotion board. If they belief you are not ready yet, then you should be counsel in writing every month on the reason why you will not be attending the next promotion board.

Good Luck

MSG A (Ret)

Response by SGT Mike Rudd made Jul 2 at 2015 1:21 PM

2015-07-02T13:21:14-04:00

I know how you I was filling a E-6 slot at ft Polk I was E4 -P because shy scores were so high for 62B I couldn't make Sgt so they made me a corporal but it worked out I put most my squad through the board I finally made Sgt . It felt good that they trusted me enough to lead and got a lot of complements from col. And post Genrals for the way I ran the Engineer section , better than most E6's just hang in there you will get the recognition you deserve

Response by SFC Jeremy Stocker made Jul 3 at 2015 11:41 AM

2015-07-03T11:41:49-04:00

Have you gone to the Soldier of the month Board yet? This is good preparation and doing well will put in the spotlight of your NCO support channel.

Response by SGT Frank Leonardo made Jul 3 at 2015 4:00 PM

2015-07-03T16:00:05-04:00

I would say look at your fellow soldiers and see how much tig you have they have and also how stack against them also study for a board as much as you can do when it comes up you are ready and also look to leaders to see how,they got where they are

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 3 at 2015 4:35 PM

2015-07-03T16:35:29-04:00

I was feeling the same way of being overlooked in my company not too long ago. I always tried to go the extra mile in everything I did. The technical aspect is a little different for me since I am intel, but the mentality and attitude should be the same. I went out and volunteered for the harder projects. I also was able to attend courses where the minimum rank to go was MSG/CW3/CPT after proving myself and showing I had the "skill and will" to go to the next level. I continually made plans for the next 2-6 months as a PFC because I have always been eager to advance and exceed all the standards. Look at the professional development model for your MOS and start looking at some of the things you can do to set yourself apart in terms of technical certifications, schools, ASIs, and other things. Read DA PAM 600-25, ADP 6-22, and other army regulations on leadership. As mentioned before, it is important to be technically proficient, but you should also be proficient at things outside your normal duties. Correspondence courses can help familiarize with things like that. If you actually take the time and study them like you are supposed to as opposed to just clicking through for hours, then you can do pretty well on the boards and you make yourself a more well-rounded soldier. Take a look at your ERB and your PPW (formerly the 3355). Look to max every single one of those categories. This is stuff I did as a PFC. Once I got to the SPC, I turned my focus a little more on helping others get motivated and understand why the Army does things certain ways. Believe it or not, there is a method to all the madness. My points are currently maxed out at 798, but I still plan to make points. That means I have to max the PT test, weapons qual, and start fishing for awards. Taking care of your records showed my leaders that I had a real interest in my own career.

Don't always think you're going under the radar. I quietly took care of my admin affairs without bothering the NCOs too much. Apart from asking for permission to go up to BDE S1, I didn't ask them for much help. Just me asking that kind of showed initiative. Granted, there was not always much for me to put on my records, I made sure what needed to be there was actually there. Apart from the admin, technical, and leadership perspectives, there is also the education and community involvement pieces. The emphasis on community involvement unfortunately varies with every unit and commander, but the emphasis on education is always there. It speaks volumes when you go out and find military courses that can help you become a better soldier or leader. Easy ones to knock out are Combatives 1 & 2 (Note: Those courses may also knock you out.) and CLS (the real one, not the basic training one). College is becoming a bigger and bigger discriminator across the entire military. You can start using TA one year after AIT. The advice I give to my coworkers who haven't hit that mark yet is to use FAFSA. Do anything to start. I've taken almost 30 CLEP and DSST exams now which, combined with my other classes, puts me at over 130 hours on civilian ed. I actually have a document that kind of road maps the best way to max out civ ed if you are interested. Just message me.

As I was preparing for an intra-brigade reassignment, the NCOIC of my section pulled me aside and said that he had recommended me for the promotion board. Mind you, I have never even been to one Soldier of the Month board but the way I carried myself, my military bearing, appearance, and all the other things that factor into a whole-soldier concept gave him confidence that I could take of business at the board and train, lead, and mentor soldiers. I went to the promotion board yesterday (with three weeks notification) and knocked it out the park. The SGM during the AAR of the board finished by saying "Needless to say, you have my recommendation for promotion." I know have the P status.

When I walked into my new unit, I was already being included in on the emails that only “leaders” were supposed to see before I even went to the board because of highly recommended I came. Though it is good to wake up every day staying motivated, you also need to ask for harder assignments and projects. If you mess it up, use it as a learning experience. No one will expect you to be an expert at everything on your first try and best to make mistakes as a specialist. Once you get stripes (even just corporal stripes) there is next to no room for excuses. Learn the Creed of the Noncommissioned Officer early. When I went to promotion board, there were two NCOs in front of me also going for their E6 board. The first thing the board members asked for was the NCO Creed. One knew it, the other did not. Only one passed the board as a result. Learn it and live by it.

Learn tact and assertiveness when someone is trying to take learning opportunities from you.

Response by PO1 Rick Serviss made Jul 3 at 2015 10:19 PM

2015-07-03T22:19:16-04:00

SPC O'Quinn, lI don't know you and I don't know want to be harsh but why are you only motivated almost every day and not every second? Why are joes giving any lip at all? I think as an SPC in the Army and the same for a P03 in the Navy, you can make mistakes because you're learning to be a leader. If you look up to someone in your company ask them to be your mentor and take their advice. If you're not comfortable doing that maybe you could observe them and learn from that. For some, it can be hard because 1 pay grade less and you were one of those joses. If they knew you as an E3 they might still think of you as one of them. You can break out of the pack by getting more visibility in the company by asking your NCO to give you an area of responsibility and lead so the joes see you're not one of them. Good luck soldier and I hope you aren't offended by what I said...just trying to help. Take care.

Response by SPC Margaret Higgins made Jul 4 at 2015 5:16 PM

2015-07-04T17:16:44-04:00

You've got a lot going for you; Specialist. Motivation and faith will take you far- whether it be in the military; or in civilian life.
And Specialist, I doubt that you actually are being overlooked. Commissioned Officers have a lot more education than NCO's; and therefore, a lot broader view of things that are going on.

Response by SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL made Jul 5 at 2015 6:58 AM

2015-07-05T06:58:50-04:00

Try not to make same mistake twice.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 5 at 2015 3:37 PM

2015-07-05T15:37:17-04:00

SPC Private RallyPoint Member, The only advise, tip, whatever you want to call it, is something an NCO told me after I made SGT E5, "The speed of the leader is the speed of the team." In other words don't get tunnel vision. Expand your capabilities to include being, not just a SGT, but a SGT leader. Those who respect your leadership will follow you to hell. Those who don't, are your problems and you have to figure out how you can get them back in the flock. Not everyone will respect you, but if they are true Soldiers, they will respect your leadership. I know this because if they are the real deal, they want to get promoted themselves. To be written up for anything, lessons their chances.

Response by SSG Patrick Henry made Jul 5 at 2015 9:45 PM

2015-07-05T21:45:53-04:00

You should let your monthly counseling statements speak for you. If all your hard work and dedication is not being annotated, then you should address why. You can shine like Gold all day but if it is not transferred to paper, it didn't happen!

Response by David Pitt made Jul 6 at 2015 8:24 PM

2015-07-06T20:24:24-04:00

Have you tried to get an article 15 to grab their attention? It seems when I was in that it was the most logical way because usually three months after the article 15 they were promoted

Response by SPC Michael Martinez made Jul 7 at 2015 12:27 AM

2015-07-07T00:27:08-04:00

Take it up your NCO Support Channel. From experience, my issue was tact. Are you taking direction from your NCO Channel or are you giving yourself up to other NCOs or taking over other joes?
Watch your lane has a lot of meaning.

Response by SGT Aric Lier made Jul 7 at 2015 7:25 AM

2015-07-07T07:25:43-04:00

Have you been to pldc?

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 12:27 PM

2015-07-07T12:27:06-04:00

Being a MP myself, I know the frustration of sitting as SPC while. But I also know that there are plenty of classes that you can try to get into as well as specialty jobs that you can get into. Have you tried going to SRT, MPI or TAI?

Training in these fields will help out your career and they are bit of fun once you get into everything. Just my two cents on the MP side of the house.

Response by SSG Troy Martin made Jul 7 at 2015 1:11 PM

2015-07-07T13:11:24-04:00

Well the first thing you need to do is ask to talk to him with your squad leader at the same time. Be respectful when you do this and voices what has been happening to you and about how he is stealing your thunder. You have to remember respect goes both way and tell him he is not respecting you. When I was a E-4 i commanded respect from everyone and wasn't afraid to speak my mind. When I was in charge of a project and someone tried to take credit for it I would just say I got this and continue working till completion. and then I would let the squad leader and my first line know I was do so they both would see it at the same time. That way they know that they only shine when their soldiers shine. I loved to shine

SSG Martin
US Army (retired)

Response by MSG(P) Thomas Finn made Jul 7 at 2015 2:08 PM

2015-07-07T14:08:40-04:00

The fact that you even ask this question says much about your character. Continue to follow in the steps of your good leaders, challenge yourself, education and lead from the front. Know what you are talking about but don't use it demoralize your team. Understand EO, SHARP and live it all the time. We live in a time when we are constantly scrutinized. Treat your evaluations as you would a resume and continually build on it. You may think you are being overlooked but maybe you are just building your leadership core. I am sure you have seen when soldiers have been promoted to fast and it backfires. Good Luck...your time is coming.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 2:35 PM

2015-07-07T14:35:05-04:00

Honestly these are all great answers. What I would suggest is for you to talk with you're NCO. Let him know what you want to know what it takes to get promoted. He should come up with a plan that has attainable goals and you need to show your leadership qualities. First I would say to stop referring to yourself as a pay grade but as a rank. You don't hear officers referring to each other as O2 or O3. If your NCOs are doing their job they would be very happy that you had the courage to approach them on the subject. Always challenge your leaders to lead. What I mean by this is to ask questions that you need to get an answer get your head into the regs. Knowledge is power it's all on the individual on how long it takes to make up to SSG then it's up to the boards.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 2:49 PM

2015-07-07T14:49:16-04:00

I'm sorry if you won't like what I'm about to say but I'm just going to be point blank: Everything in your post tells me you aren't ready. If you have to ask this, you aren't ready for your stripes. The single most important role of the NCO is to train troops. To mentor and develop them into leaders. if one doesn't know what they should do or can do to be promoted to a leadership role then they havent developed into a soldier that is ready, proficient and able to train others.

Another duty of the NCO is to make sure your leadership and officers have everything they need to accomplish the mission. It has nothing to do with the credit or the glory. It has to do with accomplishing the mission. The who and the how are immaterial. You mention that you are motivated almost every day. Just the verbiage of that is troublesome. I don't know you but if I was to guess, your leadership is failing you by not developing you as they should or you would know what was expected of you as a NCO and leader. That's what the Specialist/CPL rank is all about.

So here are my suggestions. ASK for more responsibility. If you see things that need to be done, step up and tell your leadership what your solution is and ask for the opportunity to implement. Look for extra duties within the unit like assisting with the training of the day, learning roles and responsibilities of the DARN, EOE rep or Ethics NCO. Ask for training on administering an APFT, EST training or the weapons qual range. Volunteer for any class they need a body for. CLS, radio training. Anything. Always be available. Be the goto guy!

ALSO, be the standard. Score high on marksmanship and APFT. BE the standard. Always be ready. Guide other younger soldiers. Don't be imperious, but share your experiences and step up for those struggling. Offer to assist fellow soldiers and buddies if they are struggling with SSD, PT or basic soldier skills. When you see a soldier lagging then lend a hand. Don't just be motivated, motivate others. Finally, read and remember the NCO creed. Knowing the duties and expectations of an NCO will help tremendously.

This is the best advice I can give you. I won't sugar coat it and it's very possible you are doing many of these things already. Don't get discouraged. I'll leave you with this nugget of wisdom: it's easy to be a soldier and a leader when things are going well. The mark of a true soldier and leader is how they carry themselves and how they act/react when things aren't going their way. I wish you luck and I hope this helps you even if it isn't exactly what you wanted to hear!

Response by 1SG Michael Blount made Jul 7 at 2015 3:27 PM

2015-07-07T15:27:54-04:00

Two questions:
1. What kind of unit are you in? eg. line, combat support, combat service, etc.
2. What do YOU do in your unit?
3. Do you have SSD and WLC out of the way?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 5:05 PM

2015-07-07T17:05:07-04:00

Look- to be brutally honest- becoming an NCO is a state of mind. You have to exercise restraint, tact and bearing. I don't see a whole lot of that here. You do need to be careful when posting this stuff online, in case your CoC sees it. We've all dealt with frustrations, waiting to get promoted, etc etc. There's a lot of good solid advice like maxing out correspondence courses, civilian education, PT, and all that good stuff. That's the first step. The second step is to be indispensable. Demonstrate leadership skills. Not getting lip isn't a foolproof indication of a good leader. Great leaders make something out of next to nothing. If you've only been an E-4 for a year or less, be easy. If you have a chance to go to WLC, take it. Look for Soldier of the Year opportunities or details (recruiting/retention help, admin support) to reinforce you are the Soldier they need to keep in the age of downsizing.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 5:10 PM

2015-07-07T17:10:09-04:00

This should be discussed with your Squad Leader during counseling.You have to set a short and long term goals and you need to ask your SL what are his/her expectations and what you need to do to be recommended to attend a promotion board. You should also work on areas that you have primary control of (civilian education, correspondence courses, PT score) while you are waiting to be recommended. With your question in regards to where you stand in your company, ask your Squad Leader, any NCO that you trust(not the one you are cool with) the same question. Just be prepared to hear the answer and work on your weaknesses and capitalize on your strengths. I hope this helps.

Response by SGT Sean Sullenger made Jul 7 at 2015 6:39 PM

2015-07-07T18:39:55-04:00

Keep pushing, don't forget to keep studying. Do your job. Understand that there are only so many NCO slots available. It'll come.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 6:48 PM

2015-07-07T18:48:20-04:00

Ask the NCO who takes over your work to annotate what it is you have already done so that you receive your recognition.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 6:58 PM

2015-07-07T18:58:18-04:00

SPC O'Quinn,
Let me start by asking you a question. Are you being counseled on where you stand when it comes to professional growth and your potential to move to the next rank? If not, then that's where the problem starts and ends. The truth is if you were being counseled correctly we wouldn't be having this discussion right now. Because all your question would be answered during that counseling session and if there not you have the right to use the open door policy to find an answer to your situation. But before you do anything like that, get with your NCO tell him or her you need to be counseled on you potential for further responsibility and promotion, its just that simple. If they brush you off let them know respectfully that you would like to talk to your 1SG.

As long as you have had no disciplinary issues, do your job, pass your APFT, HT and WT you should be good. Now if there are others more squared away than you and they go to and win boards regularly, 300 APFT Score, Expert at the range etc... then obviously, they will get promoted first because there doing more than just their JOB. But in the long run its your career take control of it. Start by letting your NCOs know that they owe you an explanation officially for why your not a team leader, so a road map can be drawn up from start to finish of everything you need to do to have that team leader position and P status.
Good luck!

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 7:45 PM

2015-07-07T19:45:26-04:00

First of all learn and live by the NCO creed... Read and understand all the leadership FMs you can. All those E 4 buddies you had they are not your friends any more ... Grow your soldiers to take your place always remember you can be replace ... Since your an E5 now you need to learn how to be and grow into an E6... Grow your Soldiers to take the NCO Corps back with tradition honor and respect... By all means make sure you and everyone that is in your squad fire team or section knows there job one level down and two levels up... Other than that have fun and enjoy the moments, never take things personal it is business

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 7:51 PM

2015-07-07T19:51:02-04:00

First and foremost, during your quarterly counseling sessions, ask what you could do to improve. Then do those things. Also, as pointed out before, you need to be motivated ALL the time. Most of the time isn't good enough. Whether or not you are truly motivated for the task at hand, it needs to appear that you are. Beyond this, take as much responsibility as your position allows, just be sure not to step on a leader's toes. Moreover, ask your team/squad leader to assign you more responsibility, if you are absolutely sure you are ready for it. Taking on more responsibility than your grade allows is a sink or swim scenario, it either allows you to shine if you are doing the job correctly or fail miserably. If you fail there is a good chance that you will not be promoted while with that company. If you are excelling in your newfound responsibilities, given that you are allowed to take them, and are not allowed to board within a year, AND there are positions available, you need to talk to your senior leadership.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 7:58 PM

2015-07-07T19:58:48-04:00

HEY!!! Being a leader isnt about who sees what, or who listens to who cause I have rank. HELL NO it aint about that, its about care and concern. Thats why we are the Chain of Concern and not the Chain of Command. If you are doing the right things (from what you say here), yet what do your Soldier/ Leader Counseling say? Are your leaders doing their job in counseling you? Are you asking that you be counseled? Guidence, etc.

Look leadership will come with time, but what’s the real reason you want to lead; just to tell Soldiers what to do. Do you actually care for their wellbeing? Are you displaying the heart of a leader or do you just wish to make that next grade?

Can you actually train those Soldiers to fire a weapon, PMCS a vehicle, zero a M68, an ACOG and a M249 or what ver your job needs are? Know the right places to take a newly married Soldier that’s 19 years old, with an 18 year old wife and preganat. Set them up with the right Army programs sd that they can eat, have a roof, wear clothes, whom to call when you all train so and so forth.
What does the BOSS program do/provide?
Is your own PT up to par, meaning that you are at least 270 or above? Can you lead a PRT session? If you can truly look yourself in the face, in a mirror and BE BRUTALLY honest with yourself and say YES or NO too yourself. Any one of those things will become clear to your leaders and then you POP amongst your peers, therefore an easy pick for ANY promotion board. Possibly from the advice from the company first sergeant to your platoon sergeant. If you are that good even he’ll notice. If not then get off your ass and get that way. Next thing you know. Your standing in front of the CSM and all the Co 1SG answering questions and well on your way.

Good Luck!!

SFC B

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 8:52 PM

2015-07-07T20:52:48-04:00

Army uses a system known as Time in Service, TIS, and Time in Grade, or TIG, to determine when promotions should occur. Provided that the soldier routinely performs his/her assigned tasks competently and without the need for continuous supervision, the time in service an E-4 needs to move to E-5 is 36 months, with at least eight months time in grade as an E-4. Additionally, E-5 candidates meet before a promotion board at 34 months, with six months TIG.Sergeants, or E-5s, are directly accountable for the soldiers beneath them in ways fundamental to Army life.

E-5s counsel and mentor privates, specialists and corporals, instructing them on the finer points of appearance, career development and personal accountability. Sergeants are professional NCOs, typically placed in squad or team leader positions. E-5 is the stepping stone to staff sergeant, a rank that takes on increasing responsibilities for the NCOs beneath it. At this point, the personal conduct and career development of those beneath her/his is considered a direct reflection upon his/her leadership abilities. You really should let your C/O in on the NCO's habit otherwise its only going to continue till they get busted out of shear luck, or let the chaplain know- they are known for pulling strings all the way up the ladder.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 9:21 PM

2015-07-07T21:21:07-04:00

Make a list of details that needs to happen then ask the platoon sergeant if it's ok for you to take charge of that task/detail and when it's complete go to the platoon sergeant and advise it done and ask him/her to inspect. Advise them that you would like more responsibility.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 9:24 PM

2015-07-07T21:24:47-04:00

Number one way to get recognized... go above and beyond every day, number two volunteer for soldier of the month boards (and win) number three, never give up.... you want them to notice you, make it to where it is impossible to not be noticed... and always be willing to admit that you don't know something, the best way to learn, is by admitting that you don't know and asking for help or finding the answer

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 9:39 PM

2015-07-07T21:39:27-04:00

Sorry stud, your complaining and rush to make it to be an NCO to me is an indicator that you are not ready for it yet, seek responsibility and take responsibility for your actions and it will come to you!

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 10:00 PM

2015-07-07T22:00:40-04:00

Find good mentors from all backgound. Work on the
"buy in" if folks believe in what they are doing they will do it and improve on it.

Built youself up and education yourself and your peers and subs.

This is a life long process to improve and be better. All Soldiers require different leadership styles so figure out the best approach for each.

Response by SSG Vincent Watkins made Jul 7 at 2015 10:15 PM

2015-07-07T22:15:19-04:00

Secondary zone for promotion with at least 17 months TIS, 5 months TIG. Once you have 8 months TIG and 36 months TIS. You are in the primary zone for promotion. One you are in the primary zone your Command will have to explain on a monthly basis why you aren't appearing before the promotion board. You have every reason to be upset about not appearing before the board as long as your doing what your suppose to do. Have you received an enitial counseling? Has the proper guidelines for promotion in accordance with AR 600-8-19 been covered? Have you received your monthly counseling explaining to you by Army doctrine what you need to do to get promoted? If the answer is yes to all of the questions I asked you, don't get discouraged continue to do what your doing and get your civilian as well as military education!! And stay out of trouble!!! Your time will come. If the answer is no, your NCO Support channel and Chain of Command need to be held accountable!! Your in/out calls for your MOS don't justify you being failed or not allowing you to progress, when your doing what your supposed to do. Big Army will just raise the cutoff to 798 to try to slow promotions! Research, Research and Research some more!! The Army is changing and your NCO's failing you won't be looked upon too well by our new SGMA!! I will send you any supporting documents you need, as long as you are in the rite!! [login to see]

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 10:43 PM

2015-07-07T22:43:57-04:00

Who is currently assigned as team leaders? What is there TIG? Looking at your profile you have less than a year TIG. Maybe they are waiting until you are eligible to apply for promotion without a waiver. It's not just a free handout game, you actually have meet requirements for TIG/TIS and have no flags against you.

Response by SSG Randy D. made Jul 7 at 2015 10:55 PM

2015-07-07T22:55:28-04:00

This line right here "I'm currently a SPC trying to get my NCO's to take me seriously and put me in a team leader spot so that I can go to the P board (I guess it's some kind of requirement for this company)." tells me you're not ready for promotion as you apparently have no idea how the Army's promotion system to SGT works. Second thing is just because you are motivated (sometimes) and your peers listen to you doesn't mean you're ready for some stripes. If you are having a problem getting them to take you serious then maybe you should stop screwing around (Sorry but you just admitted you are doing something wrong). Also how well do you know YOUR job? How well do you know the job you want? There are many things NCO's must do that are far from their jobs, in addition to their job. There are many days where my guys absolutely hate me, then other days they will say, and I quote, "I wish there were more NCO's like you" or "I wish we could clone you". As with every Soldier (myself when I was in your boots) there is more to the story of why you are not getting promoted.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 11:09 PM

2015-07-07T23:09:00-04:00

honestly,I would be looking for another unit that has an E-5/SGT slot open and try for that. It sounds like the current unit likes and intends to keep you right where you are.Its a big jump from enlisted to NCO, and unfortunately becomes very political with a lot of in fighting/back stabbing and who knows who. Sad but true.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 11:58 PM

2015-07-07T23:58:36-04:00

I recommend you find a mentor, so you can have an idea of what some else has done to get where you want to be. I would also suggest that you to learn to be patience, because patience is a virtue and I believe everyone should exercise a little patience. I would also suggest that you learn what it means to be a Noncommission Officer and what is expected of a Sergeant (E-5) in the US Army. FINALLY, in sure that your supervisor is giving you your professional development counselings. These counseling should be personal to you and you should walk away feeling that your supervisor knows you, has been watching you, and cares about you and your development. This will allow you to know where you stand professional and how to make yourself better.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 12:35 AM

2015-07-08T00:35:41-04:00

I know the feeling, as I have a SNCO(E9) told y 1st Line Supv that he was going to make sure I didnt get promoted because I have a profile. He had his favorites and it was known. Needless to say, he got QMP/QSP, which ever was and before that happened I got promoted. He failed me in the board, gave 105 when I only failed one answer. This because he kept asking to repeat my answer because he couldn't understand me because of my accent. A female SGT that was before me got a 140 and didnt even knew the NCO creed. How I beat this?
I exceed by maxing out Civilian Ed and Correspondence Courses. I also mentored other peers and even NCO's (SGT/SSG/SFC) on how to start looking at ACT, as I was looking at it since 2010-2011 when it was just a beta version rumor. I helped my supervisors enroll in college and convert their MOS to civilian education. I made as much effort to do any additional duties or classes that would count for promotion points, so there was no excuses for not sending me to the board. I was lucky to have a 1st Line Supv, PSG, OPS NCO and 1SG that really cared about soldiers and burocrat politicians looking to b-nose and like everyone.
I got to tell you that time rank back then didn't matter and people got promoted left and right just by going to boards every month and didn't even knew their MOS. Just because of the buddy-buddy thing
We had a guy that left PFC and returned SGT just by going to boards every month, didn't even let him work through the whole deployment. He got exhausted but he got it. Im not a board guy, but that might help you too.
A lot of people might vote me down and really don't care. Honest opinions are the ones people don't like to hear.
Just an advise if you want to take it: Mentor your peers. Help everyone succeed around you. Learn your job. Sign up for other duties no one wants, i.e. Bus Driver(which actually counts as primary promotion points), Building Manager, Fire Marshall(College Credits), Key Custodian, Armorer, Ammo Handler etc. All those will benefit you in the long run, plus you will have the experience and no one will be able to tell you anything because they haven't done it and you have.
Success always brother, as Good Luck is for mediocre people and keep your head up. If you need any help, send me a request and I got no problems on helping you.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 12:51 AM

2015-07-08T00:51:27-04:00

Always remember from whence you came. Remember what it's like to be an E2 or an E4, and remember that every time you're promoted, no matter how high you rise. In my day, E5s and rarely ever did grunt work. But, I had an E5 who refused to sit around and drink coffee with his feet up on the desk while we lesser human beings slaved away. He got right down there with us. He didn't have to...he chose to not do what other E5s and up did. I never forgot that example he set. Guess whose work detail all the men chose to work on??? Lead by example always. You will go far that way.

Response by SPC Emmanuel Zuniga made Jul 8 at 2015 1:59 AM

2015-07-08T01:59:51-04:00

Have you even tried teaching classes about your mos to the rest of E4 or Lower. Like that It will show your first line that you do have the potential of being a Leader because you can teach what you know

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 5:41 AM

2015-07-08T05:41:57-04:00

Be knowledgeable on everything. Your Soldiers will expect you to know everything.

Response by SSG John Jensen made Jul 8 at 2015 6:32 AM

2015-07-08T06:32:44-04:00

become an expert in something, like hanging out with the mechanics to learn the little tricks of the vehicles, or commo, or armorers, or something, when you can get the equipment up again without having to call for support, you will be noticed in a good way

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 7:18 AM

2015-07-08T07:18:11-04:00

Read the NCO Creed and heed its words. Develop your subordinates and lead them. Dont just manage them. True leadership is influencing and motivating. Every sentence in the NCO Creed is there for a reason. Go to the Soldier of the Month board and help your peers and subordinates to go and win. Discuss this with whoever does your counseling. Track your tig and tis and know exactly when you are eligible either primary or secondary. Most of all stay motivatdd and be patient.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 8:00 AM

2015-07-08T08:00:53-04:00

Make sure that you have completed your SSD 1 for your level. See if you can get any other school (i.e. Ranger, Airborne, Air Assault). Read up on your Skill Level 1 and 2 tasks. This will put you in a better position for when you do get promoted, and it may put you above the other Sergeants that have been in the position for a while. Lastly, go to Soldier of the Month boards. That will prepare you for the promotion board itself.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 9:36 AM

2015-07-08T09:36:57-04:00

Specialist.
You have to remember the most important thing now you're an NCO. And this was told to me when I made E-5. Everyone under you is more important than you.
Treat people with respect, and they'll respect you. Treat people like shit, and you won't be a good NCO. Don't be condescending towards people, remember these are the same soldiers who want to make their way to being an NCO as well. Show them what a good NCO does

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 11:06 AM

2015-07-08T11:06:36-04:00

Stay motivated and volunteer for soldier of the quarter, year, etc. work on maxing out you PT, fill out a 4187 to go to Airborne School, Air Assault... These schools in combination with knowledge about Army policies will look good on paper the command will see you're serious more than other to better yourself. Oh and a key one is make sure you complete your SSD1, without it you can't go to WLC or even be considered for advancement.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 12:28 PM

2015-07-08T12:28:00-04:00

That's the price you pay for being a E4 but if you're motivated and you are a good leader it is seen that E5 that is stealing your thunder well thats part of his job and if he's evaluating you then what you don't see is still shining because good leaders give good soldiers good evaluation so be patient and wait for your day

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 3:58 PM

2015-07-08T15:58:11-04:00

Keep pushing to go to the board but you have to understand they don't just promote because your good at your job. You have to show that you have the potential to hold the next level of responsibility as well. I was in the same situation a couple months ago

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 6:04 PM

2015-07-08T18:04:51-04:00

There have so many answers to your question I can hardly add to them. In fact it took me from 1976 to 2002 to make it to the rank of Sergeant and the pay grade E-5.
While have no secrets to being promoted quickly I do have a few others. One of which is that life is a journey, not a destination. Try not to let yourself get so wrapped up in the destination (fast promotions) that you miss the journey.
Just be yourself, be a good soldier, be proud that you you did your duty, regardless of what rank you happen to be. Above all make sure you never put your own personal advancement above taking time to help a junior soldier who might be looking to you for proper guidance. Good luck and thank you for your service to our great Nation.

Response by SSG Eric Trace made Jul 9 at 2015 10:18 AM

2015-07-09T10:18:49-04:00

Remember where you came from and Stripes do not make it right. Read books from great leaders, take your SSD classes, get a great mentor that is going places and follow your mentors example, go to your Ncoes schools with the frame of mind of graduating first in your class and make it happen! Go to NCO of the month boards, continue to grow and learn, never be satisfied with just doing your job always look for more to do and OWN your mistakes. Always challenge yourself as well as those assigned to you, then you're going to be fine.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 11:56 AM

2015-07-09T11:56:41-04:00

My advice would be ask to be sent to WLC. Every E-4 needs WLC. The way I got recognition as an E-4 was maxing my PT test. When you score extremely high even if your squad leader or platoon sergeant do not recognize it your 1sg will. Continue to be a leader. If you are in the reserves it's harder to be noticed because NCO's stay pretty busy. Put together your promotion packet yourself. It is easy because you have all the documents you need for it.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 1:27 PM

2015-07-09T13:27:08-04:00

First thing is that you have to understand, being an NCO is going to, at first, piss off all of your buds that have no hope of ever making it. You need to be able to accept a new world of responsibilities and it's not all about just being in charge. Congratulations on making it to this step. Make sure that you are squared away on all of your online classes, and workshops. If you have no college credits, now is the time to sign up for some classes. Show up early to formations, stay late when needed, learn how to correctly fill out all forms, and sign up for NCOES. WLC, ALC, SLC. etc.
A decent APFT score is a must, as well as M-16 range score. Volunteer to assist in manning the range. Anywhere you can make yourself stand out above the rest, do it. You don't have to be up on all regs, and equipment, but a knowledge of your MOS is a plus. Always train down to the next soldier. You can't move up if theres nobody to take your place. Always train subordinates. Never need asked to shave, or get your hair cut. Be the one who is always a soldier in mind, and in body. That should be a good start

Response by SPC Sean Barney made Jul 9 at 2015 5:47 PM

2015-07-09T17:47:23-04:00

It sucks that some monkey is walking up to you and taking credit man I'd advise tactfully stating your confidence in completeing the job without help and if they keep hijacking your detail take it up with your first line

Response by SGT(P) Kenneth Jones made Jul 10 at 2015 1:46 AM

2015-07-10T01:46:12-04:00

ty station but it was my platoon Sgt that held me back my NCOs knew I could do the job was always first in last out at work. If it took working through lunch its what I did or if I had an Appt I would work through lunch or stay late to catch up work that I missed. I know it gets frustrating but believe me it will pay off. You should be motivated all the time false is Better then none. Trust me been there and done that. At least you aren't in my shoes I got picked up on by name list for may got a flag thrown on the play fought got the flag lifted and now waiting for paper work to catch back up. So I know how you feel just don't push where you shouldn't push. Always ask about going to board though and use your COC to see where you stand. Asking is better then telling them you are ready for board. Keep head up and don't let the game beat you.

Response by SGT(P) Kenneth Jones made Jul 10 at 2015 2:11 AM

2015-07-10T02:11:32-04:00

Do you know if you are truly ready for e5? You talk about getting p status what about going to WLC? I would push to go there first if you haven't gone yet before worrying about the p status. Team leader is one thing but do you think your ready for squad leader that's the NCOs position. If your ready to take the heat for your squad hey by all means jump and show your ready for the position. Until you have invested the time and the work to be an NCO I would relax do what you and observe how your NCOs are. Have an idea of what they may be doing right and wrong and what you would do as an NCO to not fall in the same error or what to improve on. Always a rank is earned not owed. Granted there are this that get the auto e5 but its up to COC to say ya or ney. And some do good job when it happens others get it let it go to their head and fall on their face. Don't be that guy. Been SPC 3 years now mostly cause of 798 so long and no deployments but it didn't stop me from chasing the dream. I fought through a lot of stuff to get where I am and had to prove my self over and over but it didn't stop me. Just be patient it will come and others are watching just give it and yourself time. Go to WLC get commandants list or honor grad show them you are ready for board don't tell them.

Response by SPC Paul Delgado made Jul 11 at 2015 4:11 PM

2015-07-11T16:11:23-04:00

I recommend you take something you enjoy, say learning a foreign language, and see if it's possible to earn promotion points.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 11 at 2015 7:30 PM

2015-07-11T19:30:56-04:00

No matter what rank you are you'll always strive for the next one, once you become E5 you'll be wondering when you'll get E6. It's the way of the army, every MOS is different and although this is denied by most you're Pcs date may affect your promotion to E5, not saying that's the case for you. Also points, schools and etc can also affect these things. Somebody is always watching, it really just depends on situation. I know a lot of people expect their promotion but from E4 to E5 and there on out there are a lot of factors involved and it's not automatic, don't be to hard on your battles because you want to make an impression guys remember those things and until you become an NCO just focus on your tasks at hand

Response by SFC Wesley Arnold, Jr made Jul 14 at 2015 12:58 AM

2015-07-14T00:58:38-04:00

Your time in grade (TIG) and time in serves (TIS) should be your requirements to go to the promotion board and not whether holding a team leaders position.

I will give you the same basic advice I got as a PFC and as an NCO I tried to pass on; Never worry (to much) about promotion. Strive to not just master your job but learn that of the next higher rank. If you understand how the promotion points system works than all you have to do is master the skills. When you know the duties of your supervisor you basically ready to advance.

As a SPC wanting to be a SGT there are two things you need to do (other than above) you need to first ask yourself: Do you want to be an E-5 or an NCO? I hope the answer is an NCO, don't get lost in the SPC Mafia. Sooner than later they might be reporting directly to you.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 14 at 2015 2:54 PM

2015-07-14T14:54:38-04:00

It's all timing. You got great advice from everyone advice. You just have to apply your skills, let your actions speak for itself and achieve anything. I recommend once you start, finish all NCOES, that's the hardest chellange. Track your progress, update your records get use to update your progress in Your NCOERS. You must always walk your packets not depending someone else to do it for you. Good luck and stay safe.
At your speed
AForsythe

Response by SPC David Knippers made Jul 14 at 2015 5:45 PM

2015-07-14T17:45:47-04:00

The best thing to do is keep on keeping on eventually someone will take notice don't lose faith it may take you going downrange but it will happen keep it up you got this

Response by SPC Timothy BascomII made Jul 16 at 2015 7:38 AM

2015-07-16T07:38:22-04:00

You need to show leadership qualities to get those ranks also take the classes to advance.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2015 7:49 AM

2015-07-16T07:49:25-04:00

Keep your head and confidence up. You are being watched by your highers. They see your motivation and if they are anything like my leadership was, they are waiting to see how you handle situations that aren't moving in your favor. If you don't think that is what is going on. Talk to your NCO support channel. They are there to make sure you know what is going on and answer any questions you may have.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2015 4:41 PM

2015-07-16T16:41:14-04:00

It was like that for me at my first duty station, but I did my time there and moved on. Even though I stayed in the same brigade, I moved to a different post and eventually god E-5. You will have to start over again, but once you get it will be worth.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2015 7:48 PM

2015-07-16T19:48:12-04:00

Don't keep thinking like a Specialist. Start thinking like a SSG.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 16 at 2015 9:18 PM

2015-07-16T21:18:51-04:00

SPC O Quinn,
How much time in grade do you have?
Does your Company have an OML (Order of Merit List)? Are you AC or Reserve?

Response by SPC James Fie made Jul 18 at 2015 4:33 PM

2015-07-18T16:33:39-04:00

If I knew then what I know now...

Shortly before my ETS, around 1976, the Army came out with a new reg saying anyone who wanted to make Sgt had to go to the NCO Academy FIRST. Before that, they were making people ACTING Sergeant left and right, and they could go to the Academy at some point later. I asked everyone from my TC and 1st Sgt to the Bn Sgt Major to be put on the list for the NCO Academy. Every month a new list came out, and every month my name wasn't on it.

Meanwhile, my 1st Sgt, who used to be my Plt Sgt, made two guys who used to be on his tank crew Acting CORPORALS... clever, eh... mostly because they were the best coffee-getters he'd ever seen.

So I finally decided that if that was what they wanted for "NCOs", they didn't want me. My ETS came, and I left.

Now, what I maybe SHOULD have done was re-up for anywhere else BUT there, and gone after my stripes at Ft Knox or Ft Hood. If I had, maybe I would have retired in 1991.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 19 at 2015 4:39 AM

2015-07-19T04:39:21-04:00

Well first off stop referring to them as "joes" and saying they don't give you any lip. You sound like you're probably a dick and that is not a good leadership trait. I recommend memorizing the Creed of the Noncommissioned Officer, then progress into understanding it.

Response by SPC Nathan Acreman made Jul 19 at 2015 8:43 PM

2015-07-19T20:43:15-04:00

First question is, have you been to WLC yet? If you are a SPC, even as a PFC you should talk you Squad Leader into getting in to the school. How long have you been in your unit? This always a big deal, if you are new they might want you to continue to prove yourself awhile to show what your strengths are. I was a team leader for 3 years and if someone new came a long that had the time and grade to unseat me I had to be ready to either continuing to prove myself or be prepared to step one spot over. Motivation is an every day need not almost every day.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 22 at 2015 1:43 AM

2015-07-22T01:43:14-04:00

Firstly, if being overlooked is the reason you want a promotion, you are not ready to become a SGT.

You need to show you can be a good leader, and good leaders don't work for recognition. Just focus on your job, when appropriate, do more than that. Don't bicker about your leadership.

Speaking of leadership, the best way to promote is to ask yours. Your team leader/squad leader should be able to further assist and guide you.

Response by SPC Wesley van Meter made Jul 29 at 2015 11:04 AM

2015-07-29T11:04:01-04:00

I was at the same point as you one time in my care and I lost my drive. I was able to find it again but by that time I no longer wanted to be an NCOs. So keep up your drive and passion to be an NCO volunteer for every board you can. This may mean going to the first Sargent and expressing your desires but make sure you do this in the proper milatary way.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 2 at 2015 1:13 PM

2015-08-02T13:13:00-04:00

Take as many classes as you can: CLS, UPL (once you get your 5), just anything extra to make you stand out. This way, when they need people for those things, they can come to you. If this stuff Keeps up, take it up the chain and ask. If it still continues, check into transferring to a unit that won't be like this. Seems to me that the NCO doesn't want the work, but wants the credit.

Response by SGT David Naessens made Aug 3 at 2015 1:37 PM

2015-08-03T13:37:35-04:00

Take charge of your situation without asking if it is ok. Be the leader. Be the quiet leader that everyone looks to. Don't be a whiner and don't be lazy. And remember, it's the Army, things change quickly with turnover. So, be the leader that also knows when to follow. We don't get to pick our leaders, at least I didn't, but I did get to pick my attitude. I chose to project leadership. When people see you step up to lead and then see what you described as another NCO taking over, they will notice that. But if you take the half hearted attitude of 'Oh well, someone is going to steal my recognition' and fail to LEAD, then it is on you. Perhaps reading the NCO creed might help you sustain. But most of all, be the leader. https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/3a/21/73/3a21735ed0dccbf6464c13ac20dbe856.jpg

Response by SGM Steve Wettstein made Aug 14 at 2015 4:58 AM

2015-08-14T04:58:35-04:00

SPC Private RallyPoint Member I have two things. Don't forget where you came from and you are not just one of the guys anymore.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Aug 31 at 2015 12:33 PM

2015-08-31T12:33:25-04:00

As a commander, I told the E-5s that they were the SGTs who knew the soldiers the best, thus telling me who to praise and who needed help. Essentially, take care of the soldiers due to their proximity to the soldiers.

Response by PFC Tuan Trang made Aug 31 at 2015 1:16 PM

2015-08-31T13:16:49-04:00

Every Nco and leader will always watch everyone in they unit, if an individual shows leadership, when slot is open for e-4(coporal) or e-5,etc. More chances of promotion. But my tips is to do your best, motivate, shows everyone your leadership skills but don't be cocky(I don't mean any offense, but some individual try to get cocky). You'll do fine.

Also another thing, in spare time volunteer for desk duties.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 20 at 2015 4:49 PM

2015-10-20T16:49:41-04:00

Not getting credit for the extra hard work, non-complaining, and pushing on, is the name of the game man.

Just got remember, your hard work will pay off in the end just like it did for me. There's someone watching you and what you're doing, even if it doesn't seem like it.

I was in the same boat. Working my ass off day to day, always saying yes to being called in, taking charge when there was no one in charge, etc. and finally one day our platoon had a get together after formation and they rearranged the platoon and I hear "2nd Squad, Charlie team, TL: Spc Davis"

Just got to keep on pushing, make it known what you're doing and that you want more and are hungry for it. Also you got to give it a little time, you need to season your self in as a Spc. Do what you can as a soldier, and your name will brought up when a spot comes open when the time comes.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2015 3:41 AM

2015-11-01T03:41:19-05:00

I am familiar with the unit that you speak of and the frequent goings on. You should consult with your NCO about how to get credit for the work you have done, it should be reflected in your professional development counseling and if it isn't, ask why you are not being recognized. These are the sort of leaders who will typically ask you a day before your 638 is due, what you have done to improve the unit. I used to tell all of my soldiers, take the initiative before the initiative takes you. In other words, if something needs to get done go and do it, regardless of your position and skill level. You will not only develop your competency in this manner but will become more proficient in the smaller or lesser grade tasks. The joes not giving you any lip isn't an indicator of anything when it comes to accomplishing small tasks, some will do it kicking and screaming and others in silent resentment. You have no control over that. My advice to you is, get the tasks done before the NCO arrives.

Response by TSgt David Bariu made Nov 1 at 2015 4:12 AM

2015-11-01T04:12:46-05:00

Be patient and a good listener. You have to persevere hardship as it is the process of grooming future strong and noble leaders. Good Luck in your endeavors.

Response by SPC Prudent Bute made Nov 28 at 2015 9:58 AM

2015-11-28T09:58:44-05:00

Take some college courses

Response by SGT Jesse Velasquez made Nov 29 at 2015 7:35 PM

2015-11-29T19:35:02-05:00

Don't ever make your men do that you would never do yourself. I had a couple of bad NCO's who only cared about making privates do push ups instead training them.

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 1 at 2015 3:55 AM

2015-12-01T03:55:08-05:00

I was in this company, 118th is way better. my advice....PCS! call branch

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 20 at 2016 11:46 AM

2016-04-20T11:46:24-04:00

Be a sponge and keep your mouth shut. Educate yourself on your duties and obligations. Understand this, you are not expected to be the Subject Matter Expert tomorrow, but eventually, you will have to be.

Lean on your leadership and other NCO's.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2016 3:29 PM

2016-04-21T15:29:04-04:00

JOES??? You mean Soldiers? and Sergeant not E-5. It takes more than just work to be a good NCO, maturity.

Response by SGT Paul Mackay made Apr 21 at 2016 11:13 PM

2016-04-21T23:13:46-04:00

don't let it go to your head