PO3 Aaron Hassay 6797477 <div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Not sure if things have changed but in the 1990s in bootcamp a memory would still be there, the fundamental &quot;you have no rights&quot;<br /><br />I think I would of faired better in life, as when I was 26 honorably finished, I was so used to abuse, and I was vulnerable, with no real sense of identity, no real transferable skills to the civilian life from the ship, sort of empty one might say, drifting, unable to identify a real predator, definitely older guys usually looking for younger guys who are obviously lost, as it can be seen in the eyes and in the voice<br /><br />The unintended Consequence of not teaching a young guy or girl in bootcamp how valuable and protected they are by the Constitution of which they swore an Oath to Defend, can put someone back into society unable to identify and defend from a real predator<br /><br />Infact it will be harder to identify in service right from wrong when you disarmed mentally with a statement they have no right<br /><br />In reality this statement is false and that should not be a threat to anyone that someone brave enough to sign a military enlistment and swore an oath to defend the constitution has more rights from being victim of abuse, then they possibly even imagined <br /><br />I think young kids would still line up and put out <br /><br /><br /><br />Some are very impressionable like a sponge. <br /><br />You could of told them they are very valuable United States Citizens and we are going to need every last ounce of your courage commitment dedication to Make America Great Defend the Constitution and the Rights it encodes. <br /><br />I think. you could find an unlimited amount of Patriotic Kids who would be emboldened and make America Great by stating this in bootcamp and get better results as they were now doing things with a more developed sense of the reality they are attempting to affect<br /><br />This is just a memory of my bootcamp experience mid 1990s. You Have no Rights as if was funny. I had no idea. <br /><br /><br />Its not like I needed that thought process put in me the day you step off the bus onto the grinder. No father to fall back on the military was my family, I was doing this willingly and was very patriotic and going to put out. 2021-03-05T11:45:55-05:00 PO3 Aaron Hassay 6797477

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Not sure if things have changed but in the 1990s in bootcamp a memory would still be there, the fundamental &quot;you have no rights&quot;<br /><br />I think I would of faired better in life, as when I was 26 honorably finished, I was so used to abuse, and I was vulnerable, with no real sense of identity, no real transferable skills to the civilian life from the ship, sort of empty one might say, drifting, unable to identify a real predator, definitely older guys usually looking for younger guys who are obviously lost, as it can be seen in the eyes and in the voice<br /><br />The unintended Consequence of not teaching a young guy or girl in bootcamp how valuable and protected they are by the Constitution of which they swore an Oath to Defend, can put someone back into society unable to identify and defend from a real predator<br /><br />Infact it will be harder to identify in service right from wrong when you disarmed mentally with a statement they have no right<br /><br />In reality this statement is false and that should not be a threat to anyone that someone brave enough to sign a military enlistment and swore an oath to defend the constitution has more rights from being victim of abuse, then they possibly even imagined <br /><br />I think young kids would still line up and put out <br /><br /><br /><br />Some are very impressionable like a sponge. <br /><br />You could of told them they are very valuable United States Citizens and we are going to need every last ounce of your courage commitment dedication to Make America Great Defend the Constitution and the Rights it encodes. <br /><br />I think. you could find an unlimited amount of Patriotic Kids who would be emboldened and make America Great by stating this in bootcamp and get better results as they were now doing things with a more developed sense of the reality they are attempting to affect<br /><br />This is just a memory of my bootcamp experience mid 1990s. You Have no Rights as if was funny. I had no idea. <br /><br /><br />Its not like I needed that thought process put in me the day you step off the bus onto the grinder. No father to fall back on the military was my family, I was doing this willingly and was very patriotic and going to put out.

2021-03-05T11:45:55-05:00 2021-03-05T11:45:55-05:00 MSG Private RallyPoint Member 6797532

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>They still have rights. Their rights are not gone. Still have religious freedoms. Still have freedoms of speech (however there are consequences for what they may say). However, there are some liberties that we willingly surrender when we willingly enlist.

2021-03-05T12:03:28-05:00 2021-03-05T12:03:28-05:00 CPT Private RallyPoint Member 6797548

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>The military is an institution that relies on rebuilding individuals with a common purpose. Not everyone is able to deal with this. The military is not for everyone. Some people fail. A couple years after my basic training I was in combat. If someone couldn&#39;t handle the military lifestyle in their initial training when they joined they should be assessed if the military is right for them. The last thing I need as a leader is a Soldier that is questionable in relation to their ability to perform their duties. <br /><br />Next, the military you know from the 90&#39;s is not the military today. Stuff like that was said but it is more of a mental judo move to shock you. I went in 2000. It wasn&#39;t bad at all. It did suck. Service members have rights! They have to train and they might lose some sleep once in a while but they train in a safe environment. A service member may be treated harshly at times. It is some challenging training. A Soldier has the right to feel safe from harassment, of any type, and from physical harm. The military today makes the most deliberate effort it ever has.

2021-03-05T12:07:30-05:00 2021-03-05T12:07:30-05:00 SFC Michael Hasbun 6797646

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>At no point have servicemembers ever &quot;lost their rights&quot;. That&#39;s not a thing. We are federal employees who signed a contract with a behavioural clause. Much like thousands of other professsions with similair clauses.

2021-03-05T12:42:57-05:00 2021-03-05T12:42:57-05:00 Lt Col Jim Coe 6797660

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Nothing in my officer training indicated we did not have Constitutional Rights. Some of those rights were limited by the requirements for &quot;good order and discipline.&quot; In basic training, those rights were temporarily very limited so young people could be reshaped to follow orders with immediacy and precision. As our training progressed we had classes on the UCMJ and realized the rights protected under the Constitution were still there, just somewhat limited as a circumstance of employment. Of late, it appears the Services have become more liberal in their protection of individual rights. Example, allowing people of various religious or ethnic backgrounds to wear beards or head coverings that would have been prohibited in my day.

2021-03-05T12:46:41-05:00 2021-03-05T12:46:41-05:00 SFC Private RallyPoint Member 6797663

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Not once in basic did I get told I &quot;have no rights.&quot; Everyone in the military retains every single right that the Constitution affords everyone else in the civilian world. <br /><br />The difference between the military and civilian life is that we are held to a different standard. We have UCMJ that applies to us. The only things we are prohibited from is participating in political activities/rallies in uniform. Not participating in extremist groups/activities. Those seem relatively fair to expect SMs NOT to participate in. <br /><br />I&#39;m curious - have you ever or do you get counseling? You don&#39;t have to answer but it seems like you have a lot of issues you need addressed.

2021-03-05T12:47:58-05:00 2021-03-05T12:47:58-05:00 Sgt Private RallyPoint Member 6797822

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>The job of the military is not to tell young men and women that they are valuable. The constitution is not mentioned in Boot Camp. My Boot Camp was in 1968 and we were being prepared for combat to endure the hardships and survive. Boot Camp did the job because I am still alive. Combat is harder than any Boot Camp will ever be. The mental, physical, and emotional stress of combat is enormous. Those that can&#39;t handle Boot Camp will not be able to handle combat.

2021-03-05T13:27:27-05:00 2021-03-05T13:27:27-05:00 TSgt Thomas Monaghan 6797993

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I was in basic in 1992 and I was never told that I had no rights. I knew I had rights still but this was not the olace to exercise them. This is how the help instill discalpine, it is part of the game called BASIC TRAINING. We all played it.

2021-03-05T14:12:00-05:00 2021-03-05T14:12:00-05:00 CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member 6797994

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Why lie? &quot;No rights&quot; would be just that. Recruiters find them, and Drill Instructors train them. The two don&#39;t overlap. They should have a basic understanding of their Constitutional rights and the UCMJ before going to boot camp. If under 18 their parents have to consent, so nobody is to blame within the military if they are &quot;confused&quot;.

2021-03-05T14:12:41-05:00 2021-03-05T14:12:41-05:00 SSG Edward Tilton 6797999

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>How sad for you. Did they take everyone’s rights or just yours?

2021-03-05T14:15:04-05:00 2021-03-05T14:15:04-05:00 MSgt Mark Bucher 6798001

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I knew what I was getting into when I first enlisted in 1981. At no time was I ever told that I had no rights. My rights changed when I put on the uniform. I had the rights of the constitution as well as the UCMJ. It’s a totally different society being a member of the military. We are held to a different, a higher standard as a member of the military.

2021-03-05T14:15:20-05:00 2021-03-05T14:15:20-05:00 SSgt Christophe Murphy 6798061

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I don&#39;t agree with the premise.<br /><br />I never felt that I was valueless or without rights. There are circumstances that my experience as a 22 year old Marine was different than my peers. I would also say there are certain limitations due to my status or billet compared to other 22 year olds but to say I didn&#39;t have any rights that would be an incorrect statement. <br /><br />I do think that the out processing process and available resources has changed for the better since your time.

2021-03-05T14:37:14-05:00 2021-03-05T14:37:14-05:00 SSG Bill McCoy 6798230

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I was NEVER told anything like having no rights either in the Navy, or the Army. On the contrary, the Navy actually explained our rights to redress, and our rights under Article 31, UCMJ.

2021-03-05T15:44:27-05:00 2021-03-05T15:44:27-05:00 PV2 Glen Lewis 6798309

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I was never told that and neither was anyone else who I took Basic with. All I was told on this is that I should follow the regs and respect my superiors.

2021-03-05T16:45:10-05:00 2021-03-05T16:45:10-05:00 SPC Christopher Perrien 6798317

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Put the farce GWOT behind you, only realize that the laws enacted during the GWOT will be used against you as a civilian. The US gov indentifies veterans as enemies.<br /><br />I am puzzled as to your recent posts, please look at them , and edit them , to make them more cognizant. I would add the addage as to a 10 legged octopus, but that has been banned on the internet , but this &quot;tread-head&quot; CDAT , thinks you need to observe better in your original postings. Look at them several times and work on them.

2021-03-05T16:49:10-05:00 2021-03-05T16:49:10-05:00 Lt Col Timothy Cassidy-Curtis 6798671

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I can see your argument. I am also aware of the possibility of being told this in Basic Training. So, basically, the approach was a classic &quot;tear down/build up&quot; approach. The thought was to tear down the individual so that the individual could become more &quot;part of the greater whole.&quot; In theory, it had some merits; in Basic, there were a great deal of activities that were curtailed for the newly-enlisted person. And it would clearly appear that all the &quot;rights and privileges&quot; belonged to the TI and/or other NCO&#39;s or Officers. The TI&#39;s had a tough job to get a bunch of (essentially) teenagers to conform to a particular way of life and thinking. <br /><br />The good news is that I believe this is now an outmoded approach. It&#39;s been made so by the all volunteer nature of today&#39;s military. The people who get to be at Basic are people who want to be there. That&#39;s why I never want to see the draft return. Ever. Moreover, instilling good order and discipline is now recognized as being consistent with better approaches used in Basic. <br /><br />Bottom line: You seem to think this was not as good an idea as might have been originally thought., and maybe wished for a better approach. Well, congratulations. You got your wish.

2021-03-05T19:08:13-05:00 2021-03-05T19:08:13-05:00 SPC Mark Stevens 6799430

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Your questions trouble me. You see, I went through Basic in the Summer of &#39;85 two weeks out of HS at the age of 17, and I don&#39;t ever remember being told I didn&#39;t have any rights. I was told quite a few things that I needed a somewhat thick skin for, but at the end of it all, once Basic was done, and again when AIT was completed, we were treated with the utmost respect and military courtesy due newly minted soldiers. If Basic was that much of a quagmire for you, there might be other underlying issues that you may need some assistance with. There is no shame in seeking a mental health professional to work through these issues with, and it should help you become a better person overall once you can put everything into proper perspective. As for handling predators, the service helped prepare me for dealing with them much better than my family did. The service gave me the confidence and strength of character to deal with people like that in a positive and socially acceptable way.

2021-03-06T02:02:04-05:00 2021-03-06T02:02:04-05:00 CPT Private RallyPoint Member 6799437

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>Boot Camp or Basic Training is all just a bluff. <br /><br />The reality is the only stress there is induced, induced well, but still only simulated stress propped up by a facade made by a Hollywood understanding of the military once they step of the bus. The naivety of the young makes it worse on themselves. So the Drills leverage that the best they can. <br /><br />All that initial training can use is fatigue, and muscle failure. They don&#39;t even use hunger or thirst as simulated stress. <br /><br />The most dangerous thing to an NCO or Officer is a PVT that knows the regulations and who stays in their lane out of reach of adverse regulatory action against themselves. <br /><br />Even in my advanced age of 39 at basic I felt the stress, and lost it with those litter F-er&#39;s that were my &quot;peers&quot;. It&#39;s amazing what exhaustion will do to you. <br /><br />***** <br />The only things that the NCO&#39;s say that matters are all content directly related to training requirements. Pass PT, Pass Range, Pass Combat Life Saver, Go through the required confidence builders (tower, and gas chamber), etc....<br /><br />Do all those things, stay in your lane, don&#39;t break a reg or an order, and there is absolutely NOTHING that can be done from stopping new service members from graduating Basic/Boot. <br /><br />You can straight up tell an NCO to F-OFF. It will suck&#39;n for the remainder of training. They will try and make you quit, and you&#39;ll probably lose rank at the company commander level, but you know what, you&#39;ll still graduate (maybe prohibited from the ceremony). But the trainee will move on to MOS training, and effectively have a fresh start again and an inconsequential blip to their long term service. <br /><br />***********<br />OH!!!!!!!!!!!<br /><br />There was a punk ass kid in my basic training class that straight up raise his weapon to a Drill SGT (with is back turned), and pulled the trigger. This was observed by another Drill SGT, and you would have thought that would have been the end for that punk. <br /><br />Nope. He still was able to graduate. <br /><br />Had I been the commander now I have 10 years behind me I&#39;d be on the phone with JAG every last day I had the kid in the class trying to jump through whatever regulatory hoops to get him out. I&#39;d probably would have ended up with the same result as my Basic Training Commander as well. Nothing but Company level action afforded by the position.

2021-03-06T02:16:33-05:00 2021-03-06T02:16:33-05:00 SSG Edward Tilton 6799867

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>You give a simple order which is critical to the mission. Your troops want to argue the legality and their right to decline. While you are talking you unitand the one on your flank are overrun

2021-03-06T09:02:51-05:00 2021-03-06T09:02:51-05:00 SPC Private RallyPoint Member 6800482

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>I went through in 2016, I don&#39;t recall being told I had no rights. They covered the DS/1SG/Commander open door policies for complaints and the ability to contact IG, SHARP, or the Chaplain pretty thoroughly.<br /><br />We knew we had limited freedoms due to the training environment demanded of recruits before they could call themselves Soldiers.<br /><br />I would think it&#39;s accurate to say you have rights, but you as a recruit/trainee are incredibly restricted due to the training environment. This restricted environment was needed to cast us from Civilians into Soldiers, such as it is with other service members and their respective branch of the armed forces.

2021-03-06T13:14:59-05:00 2021-03-06T13:14:59-05:00 SFC Carlos Gamino 6802284

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>USMC boot camp, 1989. Never heard that statement from my DI’s. Are you looking for some type of justification?

2021-03-07T08:28:55-05:00 2021-03-07T08:28:55-05:00 LTC Ken Connolly 6802540

<div class="images-v2-count-0"></div>The only things I concerned myself with in BCT were to complete it and stay out of the Drill Sgt&#39;s cross hairs. Everything else was just part of the game, which is to try and toughen the soldier emotionally and physically. In any case, BCT is a cakewalk when compared to combat or interred as a PW. So, lace up your boots and charge on Soldier to hone your combat skills.

2021-03-07T10:31:31-05:00 2021-03-07T10:31:31-05:00 2021-03-05T11:45:55-05:00