Does use of profanity impact your civilian life?

2015-04-06T14:15:13-04:00

When I was in the the Army ('68-'70) use of profanity seemed to be ingrained into life. Truly exceptional and original uses scored very high amongst the troops.

Then came civilian life and college and jobs and it seemed like I was the only one .. and I still let a few fly on occasion!

So how about you?
I think the survey covers the bases .. but let me know

Response by SSG Buddy Kemper made Apr 6 at 2015 2:22 PM

2015-04-06T14:22:27-04:00

I go thru spells. Can go days even weeks without dropping one....but then I'll get on phone with an old battle buddy or around a few other vets and they just start rolling out. I'm not proud of it.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Apr 6 at 2015 2:31 PM

2015-04-06T14:31:36-04:00

Some days, weeks or even months better than others. Having children around help keep me honest, but being around other service people never helps.

Response by PO2 Steven Erickson made Apr 6 at 2015 2:39 PM

2015-04-06T14:39:08-04:00

[I have completely stopped using profanity] - Well, almost...

As a former sailor, I learned to cuss like... well... a sailor. I could hold my own with any "old school" drill sergeant or Marine. That was many years ago, however.

The use of profanity, vulgarities and curses as adjectives and adverbs bothers me a lot at this age. I don't talk like that, I don't like it, and I will correct (or visibly cringe) when others talk like that to me in public.

It's just not necessary.

Response by SGT Chris Reese made Apr 6 at 2015 2:43 PM

2015-04-06T14:43:34-04:00

I believe this problem would be eliminated from civilian use if stupid people and telemarketers were illegal and done away with

Response by SGT John Wesley made Apr 6 at 2015 3:15 PM

2015-04-06T15:15:51-04:00

I use it when I feel my guys aren't getting the point. It works!

Response by MSgt Jamie Lyons made Apr 6 at 2015 8:59 PM

2015-04-06T20:59:07-04:00

Couldn't resist...sorry

Response by SGT Steve Oakes made Apr 6 at 2015 9:37 PM

2015-04-06T21:37:42-04:00

Its really the Military specific insults that I sometimes fire off that gets the civies. Like Broke Dick with or without MF thrown in.

Response by SFC Lynn Santosuosso made Apr 6 at 2015 9:45 PM

2015-04-06T21:45:12-04:00

I work for the DON as a civilian now and with many veterans. The retired Navy guys can put some Army Tops to shame! Not a problem!!

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2015 9:57 PM

2015-04-06T21:57:11-04:00

Profanity affects my life interacting with those with no military background to exact extent that I allow it. I base my manner of speech based off of my surroundings. Am I talking with some of my old military buddies or those who have a military back ground, or am I talking to my parents? I can turn my use of profanity on and off like a switch, but I know that's not a skill that everyone is able to cultivate.

Response by Sgt Blake Inscore made Apr 6 at 2015 10:02 PM

2015-04-06T22:02:57-04:00

I'm finishing up my bachelor's degree this fall and have noticed that young people these days (18-22) use profanity just as much as those of us in the military. I have been shocked more than once over some of the things I've heard on my college campus. Some of these kids can curse with the best of us. It has definitely made it harder for me to kill that habit.

Response by MAJ Monique Ruiz made Apr 7 at 2015 12:13 AM

2015-04-07T00:13:08-04:00

The military is definitely responsible for many habit-forming behaviors. Cursing is the most common. The worst thing I said before joining was "jerk." Nowadays when my blood boils, I refuse to talk because I know word vomit is about to happen. At that point, I might as well hand over my rank before speaking. lol

Response by PO1 John Miller made Apr 7 at 2015 12:13 AM

2015-04-07T00:13:38-04:00

Luckily I work as a contractor so my co-workers are fellow vets and Air National Guardsmen who don't give two @$*%! about cussing!

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Apr 7 at 2015 3:20 AM

2015-04-07T03:20:49-04:00

I try to use profanity around others who I know, and they know me. I do not use profanity in public around others who I do not know especially in uniform. I have corrected service members who were uniform at the PX who were using profanity around children and family members. It's not my fault certain words are offensive, but if I know that such language offends others, I will correct the behavior.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Apr 7 at 2015 3:25 AM

2015-04-07T03:25:53-04:00

I once let out an F bomb with a subject when I was involved in a felony pursuit by vehicle. When I caught up with him and he was apprehended my first question to him was and he was a Private, "What in the F is wrong with you"?

Response by LCpl Mark Lefler made Apr 7 at 2015 3:28 AM

2015-04-07T03:28:04-04:00

I swear, my wife swears... we try not to around kids especially other peoples kids and discourage ours from doing so... I don't swear for the sake of it.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Apr 7 at 2015 5:24 AM

2015-04-07T05:24:02-04:00

When I was a young Seaman I worked in a shop with a few females. I had a little bit of experience as a fleet Sailor so my language was pretty salty and I didn't give a damn about watching my language around my fellow Sailors, regardless of the fact they were women.

One woman in particular had a wild hair up her ass about cursing and threatened to "write me up" even though we were the same rank and she wasn't in a leadership position over me. So my reply to her was "Fucking write my Gosh Darn (the one phrase I don't use anymore is GD) ass up. See if I give a motherfucking shit..."

My LPO overheard this and asked me to try and watch my language but it was futile. He ended up having to put me on a different boat crew from her just to keep us separated, and also had a talk with her. He basically told her that "Sailors curse and there is nothing in the regulations against it."

Response by CPT Alan W. made Apr 7 at 2015 6:47 AM

2015-04-07T06:47:56-04:00

I work hard at trying to find other, more creative, words to replace profanity in my day to day. Usually the best I end up with is "rats" or "gracious". Sometimes I come out with a real jewel, but promptly forget it before I need it again. Maybe using the word "entertaining" when something or someone is unusually "out of spec". Maybe going as far as using the term "booger eating moron" to describe someone that has a "severe and immediate lack of understanding or judgement".

As a leader, sometimes I think swearing is the easy way out and I've never been one to be easy on myself.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 6:53 AM

2015-04-07T06:53:11-04:00

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 7:17 AM

2015-04-07T07:17:13-04:00

Years ago I had a Company Commander that did not condone the use of profanity. His reasoning was because he believed that Soldiers were better educated than to use such words. He was a good Commander and meant well. He was trying to help make his better people by thinking more thoroughly before we spoke. Although I have to agree with him, I still have a tendency to fly off a few myself. Some habits are hard to break...

Response by SSG Christopher Parrish made Apr 7 at 2015 8:37 AM

2015-04-07T08:37:15-04:00

Yesterday I caught myself using the term "bitching and moaning" in a job interview. Sure hope it didn't hinder my chances.

Response by SFC Rich Carey made Apr 7 at 2015 10:17 AM

2015-04-07T10:17:53-04:00

I remember having a class as a young NCO that profanity shows a lack of professionalism. What does the use of profanity gain? It shows your lack of education and how to explain your position. Plus it shows disrespect for the other person. So I stopped long ago.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2015 11:01 AM

2015-04-07T11:01:27-04:00

I find my cursing starts out high on the Monday after drill then tapers down to nearly none within 30 days, only to be reset by the next drill

Response by SFC Christopher Perry made Apr 7 at 2015 11:05 AM

2015-04-07T11:05:43-04:00

This is my first week as a civilian. I know this is without question an area which I will need to work on. As an old school NCO I let the curse words fly where they will.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made Apr 9 at 2015 7:12 PM

2015-04-09T19:12:59-04:00

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S., I found that profanity just doesn't really have a place in the civilian work world.

Response by MAJ Brian Anderson made Apr 10 at 2015 11:00 AM

2015-04-10T11:00:35-04:00

Response by MSgt Manuel Diaz made Apr 10 at 2015 11:05 AM

2015-04-10T11:05:34-04:00

I am guilty of all the abovementioned; however the last 8years or so I just use it occasionally for shock value while wearing my Dysfunction Veteran cap...
Which I wear proudly.......... my wife dislikes that cap, so I try to not wear it when she is at my side.

Response by SPC Daniel Killam made Apr 22 at 2015 1:40 PM

2015-04-22T13:40:21-04:00

I apply situational awareness. There were many occasions I understood that profanity was a no-go, long before I ets'd. If I'm out camping, fishing, at a bar, sure, no fu**in' problem. At work? Hell no, not in front of customers... anyway, just be aware of your surroundings and adapt to the situation, according to whatever SOP you put together in your already warped mind.

Response by SGT Lawrence Corser made Apr 27 at 2015 9:53 AM

2015-04-27T09:53:53-04:00

It's hard, especially when I get around other combat vets. Or after watching military movies.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 10:39 AM

2015-04-27T10:39:45-04:00

Profanity is simply a word to describe words that people use to express feelings. If I stub my toe and say, "Fuck!", its the same as me stubbing my toe and saying, "Pudding!". But like the military and civilian world differences, the environment youre in dictates different CoA's. At a formal meeting, use language that would imply youre a formal and respectful person. At a biker bar, don't sweat it if you drop a "damn" or a "shit".

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 12:01 PM

2015-04-27T12:01:43-04:00

Drops the mic and walks away...

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 12:48 PM

2015-04-27T12:48:24-04:00

Now on a more serious note: I've always believed you aren't really fluent in a language unless you can swear in it, so based on that, I'm fluent in English, German, Spanish, and French, but not quite fluent in Czech....yet.

Having said that, there is a time and a place for profanity. I'm a TPU Reserve CW2, and in my civilian capacity, I'm a Software & Database Engineer for Booz Allen Hamilton. Liberal use of profanity is definitely NOT in line with our core values, and not seen as professional.

When I'm at my civilian job, I just don't do it.

In my military job, I'm an officer, so held to a higher standard (one would hope). Granted, I don't worry about it if I let one slip, but I try not to make a habit of it, especially in front of my commander.

I had a commander who used profanity as a form of punctuation, and that was one of her good points. (Granted, if I ever have to work for COL Marcia Smith again I'd jump off the nearest tall building, but that's another story). The point is that she was generally seen as unprofessional, mercurial, temperamental, and unapproachable. She was a prime example of how NOT to be a leader.

Like anything else profanity is a tool. Just like you wouldn't use a screwdriver to hammer in a nail, don't use profanity where it clearly does not belong. THAT is not only the hallmark of a leader, it's the hallmark of an adult.

Response by SSG Robin Rushlo made Apr 28 at 2015 9:15 AM

2015-04-28T09:15:46-04:00

I attempt not to use it but when the blood pressure blows get ready for the paint to peel off the wall. It does not need to be F BOMB every other word in just normal daily speech.

Response by COL John Hudson made Feb 20 at 2018 6:48 PM

2018-02-20T18:48:39-05:00

FROM THE IG DESK: ARTICLE 134 - INDECENT LANGUAGE: I am not a verbal virgin - few are - but there's a time and place for everything and one must tread carefully in today's gender-integrated military environment. I urge all of you out there to take heed: Army, Air Force, Navy, Marines and Coast Guard. This regulation has been out there for a long time. Problem? No one stands up to use it.
I'm putting the following comment up front to set this topic off (it appears again at the end): "In U.S Vs Moore (CMA 1994) the court ruled that obscenity was not covered in the right to speech, under the 1 st amendment. What is 'obscene' is also 'indecent' and such language cannot be afforded protection under the constitution. The court noted that the personal relationship between the utterer and the victim could be used to determine whether the language used was indecent.

If a service member communicates indecent language either orally or in writing to another person, then he is violating the provisions of Article 134. Indecent language is covered under paragraph 89 (Article 134) of the Manual for Court Martial.

The text of statute under Article 134 says that all neglects and disorders which are adverse to the discipline and good order in the armed forces, all conducts which can bring discredit to the armed forces and offenses and crimes not capital, can be punished by convening a general, summary or special court martial as the offense demands.

ELEMENTS OF THE OFFENSE
The accused has communicated with another individual in writing or orally.
The language the accused used was indecent.
In the circumstances, the behavior of the accused was adverse to the discipline and good order in the armed forces or the nature of the act brought discredit to the armed forces.
(If the case is appropriate, add this element after the first point.)

The language was communicated to a child under the age of 16 years.

EXPLANATION FOR THE ELEMENTS
'Indecent' language is defined as language which can offend a person's decency, modesty or propriety or is morally shocking because of its filthy, vulgar or disgusting nature or tendency to create lustful thoughts. Language is said to be 'indecent' if it can reasonably incite libidinous thoughts and corrupt morals. Such language should overstep community standards.

MAXIMUM PUNISHMENT FOR THE OFFENSE
Indecent or insulting language

Communication with a child under 16 years of age.
The accused can be punished with a dishonorable discharge, forfeiture of allowances and pay and 2 years of confinement.

In other cases
The accused can be punished with a bad conduct discharge, forfeiture of allowances and pay and 6 months of confinement.

EXAMPLE OF HOW A SERVICE MEMBER MAY BE CONVICTED FOR THIS OFFENSE
It is not necessary that a service member communicates indecent language in words. In U.S Vs Green (CAAF 2010), the accused had made the victim come to him on the pretext of removing a bug from the victim's shirt, but instead he grabbed hold of victim's shirt and pulled it down, making an utterance (mmmm-mmmm-mmmm) in the process. The accused argued that the evidence (the use of mmmm-mmmm-mmmm) was factually and legally insufficient to support a charge of indecent language. The accused nevertheless, convicted for the offense of using indecent language along with several others offenses and punished. The lower court (U.S Navy-Marine Corps Court of Criminal Appeals) upheld the sentence and said that it was not necessary that indecent language constitute actual words.

If the armed forces strictly apply the rule book against indecent language, not a day would go by without violations of the provision or service members prosecuted for using explicit words.

Sometimes the service members are only being boisterous and no one seems to mind. Indeed, many 'indecent' words are common expressions and they are not uttered to incite any libidinous thoughts. In most cases, the language is either treated as provoking speech (no provision for bad conduct discharge) or a simple disorder, unless the accused used the words to incite libidinous thoughts in the other person.

It is very hard to punish a person for language that may not be deemed sexual, obscene, racial or even when it might cause a disturbance or fight. Usually the 1SG, SGM, JAG and commander will sit down and go over the practicalities of the case, before the service member is charged.

In U.S Vs Moore (CMA 1994) the court ruled that obscenity was not covered in the right to speech, under the 1 st amendment. What is 'obscene' is also 'indecent' and such language cannot be afforded protection under the constitution. The court noted that the personal relationship between the utterer and the victim could be used to determine whether the language used was indecent.