Expert Badges (Infantry, Field Medical)

2014-11-17T15:30:13-05:00

Given that the Expert Infantry Badge (EIB) and Expert Field Medical Badge (EFMB) are based on technical/tactical proficiency, should non-qualifying MOS-holders be eligible if they successfully compete a qualifying course?

Example: a 42A can complete EIB testing, however, per AR 600-8-22, is ineligible to be awarded or wear the badge.

Should this be changed?

Note! I am referring to the Expert- badge family ONLY; I am not referring to Combat Infantryman Badges, or Blue Discs/Cords.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2014 3:47 PM

2014-11-17T15:47:32-05:00

Full disclosure: I believe non-Infantry Soldiers should be eligible for the EIB.

Response by SGT Richard H. made Nov 17 at 2014 3:55 PM

2014-11-17T15:55:47-05:00

I think if they can make it through the test, they should be able to wear it. It's not an easy test. I'd venture to say the time it takes between prep and the actual test, especially for a non-infantry person, is a damn site more than the time one puts in to get airborne wings.

Response by CPL(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2014 7:21 PM

2014-11-17T19:21:27-05:00

I don't see why they can't wear it. I think everybody should go through training for the EIB after all the tasks on the EIB are Skill Level I tasks & a few Skill Level II tasks. All stuff you as a soldier should know to begin with.

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 17 at 2014 7:27 PM

2014-11-17T19:27:02-05:00

I have 2 mos my first is 11b so am I still eligible for the badge?

Response by PO2 Corey Ferretti made Nov 17 at 2014 7:30 PM

2014-11-17T19:30:16-05:00

I don't see how you can qualify for the course bout not the EIB? I have a friend who was a Equipment operator and had his Surface warfare and Airwarfare device. So i guess what im saying is if they have the course open to Certain non Infantry MOS don't see why they cant be awarded and ware the EIB.

Response by SFC Boots Attaway made Nov 18 at 2014 1:35 PM

2014-11-18T13:35:28-05:00

For all of you that think ANYONE should be able to wear the EIB, that would diminish it's meaning just as awarding anyone the CIB. That is why they came out with the CAB. Also not everyone not even infantry can wear the Expert Medics Badge, do you want everyone to be eligible to wear it also? Maybe if enough people suggested it the army will come out with an Expert Soldiers Badge for non infantrymen or medics.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 18 at 2014 5:05 PM

2014-11-18T17:05:04-05:00

NO! We all (vast majiority anyway) have talked about getting tto tradtional Army Valures and Traditions. It seems today's Soldiers really have developed an "Army of One" mentality and atttitude, specifically for themselves and not "One Army".

These badges were designed specifically for Soldiers that hold those MOSs carry the burden of the tasks required by the MOS and units everyday, in garrison and in the field.

Now if a Soldier from a non-infantry or medical MOS goes thru the training and passes the test...super, great, outstanding performance and very worthy of recognition...an impact AAM. I know some units where this achievement would get them an ARCOM (not saying I agree withthat, but it would happen); Accomplishment would definitely merit an outstanding remark on annual evaulation.....but to be awarded either badges, absolutely NO! If you want the badge that bad, reclassify into the MOS, do the job full time!

Once again as I read many of the comments of those supporting, I see a lot of, "I don't see why not," I think they should be able to". Here's my "I think"....Let's get back to accepting the rules and regulations in place, lets get back to adopting, accepting and supporting Army traditions. And again, if you really want the right to wear the badges, all you have to do is re-enlist for or attempt to re-classify into one of the MOSs that are authorized to be awarded and wear. Being assigned to an Infantry Unit as a commo, clerk, supply, truck driver, etc does not make you an infantryman! You do not belong to the traditions and values that were put into place when those badges were created, unless you are an infantryman or medic.

If you wanna wear the badges, don't be a wanna be infantryman or medic! DO it full time!

Response by SPC David S. made Nov 19 at 2014 2:16 PM

2014-11-19T14:16:47-05:00

Much like the tomb badge of the 3rd U.S. Infantry Regiment this is an infantry only award. Being a grunt does have its benefits, infantry cord and all. Much like the CAV with our Stetson and spurs this is part of the the infantry tradition. Certainly I would like to see some sort of skill identifier but it would need to be different in design.

Response by SFC Stephen P. made Nov 19 at 2014 3:02 PM

2014-11-19T15:02:44-05:00

In the scenario of the 42A earning the EIB:
You take that soldier away from his primary duties to test for the badge. It has been many years since I tested, but I recall several days for testing, and weeks for the training.

What is the benefit? Is the 42A going to regularly employ those skills? Will he teach them to members of his team?

While I can certainly appreciate the position of recognizing the skill alone, I don't think it particularly useful in enhancing readiness.

Response by Capt Gregory Prickett made Nov 19 at 2014 7:18 PM

2014-11-19T19:18:18-05:00

Absolutely not. If they want the EIB, they need to be infantry.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 3 at 2014 6:34 AM

2014-12-03T06:34:05-05:00

From the Infantry perspective at least, your question is based on a false premise. The EIB is not the "Expert Infantry Badge" it is the "Expert Infantryman Badge" (to be sure I just checked my orders). As such, unless you are an Infantryman (ie- 11 series MOS), or 18 series, and successfully complete the testing, you are not eligible.

If it was the "Expert Infantry Skills Badge" you may have an argument, but it is not. You may complete the training, and even the testing, which would be admirable for any MOS. But unless you are 11 or 18 series, the regulations should not be changed.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 28 at 2015 11:18 PM

2015-01-28T23:18:42-05:00

Simply put, no.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 7 at 2015 10:09 PM

2015-03-07T22:09:14-05:00

I do not believe that non-infantry should be eligible to earn/wear the EIB. The EIB is not a skill badge like Airborne or Air Assault. It shows that an Infantryman has mastered proficiency in his MOS. It is not a course or a schoolhouse that once completed awards a badge or skill-identifier. It is an infantry-only award. Simply passing the exam does not entitle one to all of the benefits of being an Infantryman. Being an Infantryman is a job and a way of life. Only by accepting that way of life and its hardships should one be eligible for all of its benefits; EIB, CIB, blue cord and disks.

I am a Forward Observer (13F) in a light-infantry BN. I am required to do almost everything an Infantryman is required to do. However, I am not an Infantryman. I have my own job and my branch (FA) has its own set of traditions. When my BN tests for the EIB I participate alongside my infantry brothers, but regardless of whether I successfully complete the exam, I cannot earn/wear the EIB.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 26 at 2015 5:05 PM

2015-04-26T17:05:31-04:00

Wait what? That is some dangerous speak. I you really want an EIB you can join the infantry. I sense a badge hunter. Keep in mind that these badges are not really for show. They are a mark of distinction. It is the same with the Ranger Tab. You shouldn't want the Tab. You should want the tab.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Apr 26 at 2015 5:27 PM

2015-04-26T17:27:50-04:00

Why not. But this is why I love the Marines. CAR and no CAR (Combat Action Ribbon). No muss, no fuss. If we still have badge envy after making a CAB (Combat Action Badge) Let's let TRADOC design a test for all career fields and let them award their own expert badge. All AIT soldiers will report to their units with the Never Earned a Badge Badge. I don't care what is on your chest, only what is in it (heart).

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 26 at 2015 6:23 PM

2015-04-26T18:23:33-04:00

After reading a lot of these responses, I really don't understand why this is a discussion.

It's call and 'Expert INFANTRY Badge' and an 'Expert Field MEDIC Badge.' That should be the end of it. If the Army wants to accommodate everyone they need to create a badge for all the people that aren't in those job fields to test for it. Call it an 'Expert Soldier Badge' for all I care.

We as a force need to stop feeling so entitled to awards that are designed for specific people.

Sure, in basic training, all soldiers are trained in the same respects to basic soldiering tasks, but that in no way makes them infantry qualified.

I specifically joined the Army to NOT be an infantryman, and my position on that has not changed once over the last 7 years of service. They do a damn fine job doing what they do, and I do well enough in my own field.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 27 at 2015 5:57 PM

2015-04-27T17:57:09-04:00

We've had this argument in the Navy as well, with the "Enlisted Submarine Warfare Insignia" (or as we call them, our Dolphins). We've had riders work on ship's quals for a deployment (I guess so they have something to do besides watch movies in their downtime) and, while most don't finish, there are a few hi-speed individuals who do and, though they won't serve aboard submarines because of their rating (outside of the occasional secret-squirrel mission), they've earned and are rightfully awarded their Dolphins.

Some of us aren't thrilled about it, but the guys DO put in the work to get it done, so you really can't knock them... (And it's something they can lord over their compatriots back at their home units, lol...)

Response by SGT Edward Thomas made May 7 at 2015 4:42 PM

2015-05-07T16:42:18-04:00

No it should not be changed. As a signal soldier I passed EIB testing and couldn't wear the badge except at the presentation. I was never 11 nor 18 series MOS. I will never forget the extra training to do that. Leave the programs as is. Medics for EFMB and Infantry/Special Forces for the EIB.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 10 at 2015 11:25 AM

2015-05-10T11:25:36-04:00

Why is this a question? NO!!

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 11 at 2015 1:37 AM

2015-05-11T01:37:22-04:00

I do not think it should be changed because it also represents that you're part of the team that does the infantry or medical work.however I do not think it's a bad idea to design a combat and expert badge for certain other field soldiers specialties such as armor. in fact I once saw a badge that looks like a combat armor badge. Looked similar to CIB it showed a front of a tank and was dark green. it seems like there was a plan to have that but it must have been scuttled.

Response by SFC Maury Gonzalez made Jun 20 at 2015 8:49 AM

2015-06-20T08:49:57-04:00

If you are army and want expert badge deploy to war zone and get a CAB , otherwise redising the cab without the wreath, rename warrior badge and develop a 5 day testing program similar to eib/efmb, this will make everyone posting & whining about the eib/efmb happy

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 20 at 2015 9:51 PM

2015-06-20T21:51:46-04:00

When it comes down to it, we are all Soldiers first, if I'm not mistaken... We all go through the same 9 week basic training and anyone at anytime can fill the spot of an infantrymen. No a cook or 42a may not be as good but they are still Soldiers non the less! And it's a. Proficiency test so I don't see why all soldiers can't be proficient and earn the EIB

Response by SSG Eric Trace made Jul 3 at 2015 1:08 AM

2015-07-03T01:08:41-04:00

No they are not of the mos. I have my EIB, Silver Spurs/Stetson, EIB. Earned the while in the respective MOS's when I re classed I stopped wearing them. If SM wants to train and do what it takes to challenge themselves to prove they got it , more power to them, if they want the privilege to wear it all the time, Reclass.

Response by SFC Giovanni Bennett made Apr 3 at 2017 1:15 AM

2017-04-03T01:15:24-04:00

Hell NO!!!

Response by SPC Kenneth Mawson made May 19 at 2017 11:45 PM

2017-05-19T23:45:53-04:00

I earned the EFMB in 1967 while in Germany with the 24th Division 24th Med. Bn. I firmly believe that a Medical MOS should be the qualifier for this award, as Infantry MOS should be the qualifier for the EIB. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 12 at 2017 10:17 PM

2017-08-12T22:17:37-04:00

Having anyone being able to train and complete the tasks would only make the Army better trained. EIB/EFMB may not be applicable to the everyday tasks that a 88M (Truck Driver) would have to complete but if put into the position through misfortune he/she would be trained and I don't see how that negatively impacts any mission.

Wear the award? If you earned it by completing the standards to each task I don't see why you shouldn't be able to.

Response by SPC Jeffrey Stone made Aug 14 at 2017 9:20 AM

2017-08-14T09:20:26-04:00

The everybody gets a trophy generation is now old enough to join the army. Lord help us....

Response by 1SG Morales Mata made Mar 24 at 2018 3:01 PM

2018-03-24T15:01:09-04:00

I served as a medic for 23 of my 26 years in the Army, served with tank units, infantry, artillery, air defense, as well as hospitals alongside my comrades, like the EIB which is only for the IN, the EFMB should be ONLY FOR MEDICS, NOT ALL MEDICAL PERSONNEL.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 17 at 2018 3:54 PM

2018-09-17T15:54:04-04:00

It looks like everyone wants a participation award now. The EIB needs to be left alone for infantry only. It's their MOS and it's their badge. If you want one, then change MOS. This has been an Infantry tradition for a very long time.
On another note, if they allow other non Infantry Soldiers compete for the WIN, then maybe a Letter of Completion/Recognition would be good. They can use that for promotion points when it's time to move up in ranks. (No AAM or ARCOM).

Response by SSG Jason Clark made Sep 17 at 2018 5:10 PM

2018-09-17T17:10:03-04:00

I think they should be eligible to compete and earn their EIB or EFMB, just not wear it. Just like some “state” awards earned in the National Guard or Reserves is not eligible to wear on ASUs because their aren’t active or “federal” awards.

Response by SGT Ryan Keyes made Sep 17 at 2018 5:28 PM

2018-09-17T17:28:05-04:00

A little off topic, but something that has irritated me since 2004. When the medical MOSs were consolidated to the 68 series there were several CMBs handed out to nonmedical. Due to the loophole that xray and Charlie's were now 68w with an identifier. They did not work the line, they did not leave the hospital, and they were not medics other than a prerequisite course. I was a little sore from that, felt it took away from mine (not really I know what I did). None the less these were created for these MOSs alone and should stay with them. You look to those wearing them for leadership and inspiration when you are in the haze. It means more than candy for you dress blues and ERB/ORB

Response by Cpl Rc Layne made Sep 17 at 2018 9:59 PM

2018-09-17T21:59:57-04:00

As a Marine, the only thing that mattered to me on my uniform was the Eagle, Globe and Anchor. My dad was proud of his jump wings. My two uncles that fought in Korea, were equally proud of their Combat Infantry Badge. To give anything out like candy on Halloween is demeaning to everyone involved, and lessons the value. Things need to be harder to earn, not easier.

Response by SGT Justin Singleton made Sep 18 at 2018 11:37 AM

2018-09-18T11:37:32-04:00

Honestly, I have no problem with a non-Inf soldier getting the EIB if they pass the test. CIB is different, though. I firmly stand behind the inf/sf only for CIBs.

Response by SFC David Bellerue made Sep 18 at 2018 11:56 AM

2018-09-18T11:56:38-04:00

If you test and are proficient in it, then you should be able to wear it. All it says is you took the time to study and excell. It is all about becoming the best you can be.
Personally, I believe the Army goes into overdrive when coming up with some of these awards, but that is another issue.

Response by CPT Jeff Robinette made Sep 18 at 2018 12:23 PM

2018-09-18T12:23:23-04:00

As an Infantry Officer I have no problem with the SSG in his given MOS competing in either the EIB or the EFMB testing.

Here is my rationale, given a combat situation we expect that we will be in a fluid environment. The SSG may be put into the situation where he would have to take over an Infantry role.
The question of his being able to wear that badge is also simple. He can't.

As the HHC XO I took the EFMB with the medical platoon. I did not take it for the badge that I could not wear. I took it to try to motivate those young soldiers. It worked. I also passed all of stations.
I did get a cheesy certificate from the BN and an EFMB to hang on my wall.

Response by SSG Shane Shepherd made Sep 18 at 2018 2:36 PM

2018-09-18T14:36:42-04:00

As a Medic no way only the medical field. I was always in Airborne Infantry units except for a few months. I never wanted an EIB or my Infantry brothers an EFMB

Response by SFC Edwbl Edwbl made Sep 18 at 2018 3:17 PM

2018-09-18T15:17:22-04:00

They should not be able to take the course is they do not hold the MOS....

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2018 4:36 PM

2018-09-18T16:36:44-04:00

When I was active duty 12B, we were offered the chance to test and if successful would be awarded the EIB! However it would go into our records but weren't authorized to wear it unless we would reclass. Did that change in the last 20 years?

Response by CPL Clyde Willis made Sep 18 at 2018 4:48 PM

2018-09-18T16:48:17-04:00

I get why it would only be for soldiers with 11 or 18 series MOSes. Living the life of an expert infantryman is probably much more difficult than earning the expert infantryman badge.

I was a 98G. Here is a dirty little secret: we earn more than you. Up to $300 a month if we can score the highest marks on our primary foreign language proficiency test and have multiple other foreign languages. Non language MOS holders can earn $50 a month extra, but not as much as a 98G. If you want the benefits of being a 98G reclass and spend 2+ years in training going through mind fuck after mind fuck, and then spend countless hours of your own time at your duty station maintaining your proficiency. If you want the honor and glory of the EIB or CIB, reclass and wear your body down living the 11 or 18 series lifestyle.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to being proud of your own accomplishments in your MOS. Just be the best at what you do, and you won't have the time or energy to be jealous of what others do.

Response by SGT Carl Brown made Sep 18 at 2018 5:11 PM

2018-09-18T17:11:59-04:00

As an 11B that holds the EIB and cherish that award I feel that only MOS's authorized to wear should be allowed to compete for badge. If the soldier held the MOS when tested and then changed MOS he should be allowed to continue to wear, as he held MOS when he tested. I also feel that way for the Blue cord, that cord represents the Infantry and should only be worn by those that earned.

Response by PO1 George Bouchard made Sep 18 at 2018 5:28 PM

2018-09-18T17:28:33-04:00

Sorry badges of any kind should not be handed out like candy. Possessing the head knowledge is great and I encourage everyone to learn it.
However till the knowledge is actually physically applied in a combat or stressful situation the badge should be not given and then only given if said soldiers go above and beyond. I have mine but it was awarded to me after I earned it on the combat field in Granada. It was awarded 3 months after my return home after several recommendations.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2018 6:08 PM

2018-09-18T18:08:36-04:00

Response by SGM Ronald Cheatom made Sep 18 at 2018 6:55 PM

2018-09-18T18:55:59-04:00

The EIB, and EFMB, are MOS specific badges, otherwise they would be named something else. Leave the EIB, to the infantry, and the EFMB, to the field medics. If you want an EIB, change your MOS, and join our ranks.

Response by SPC Eric McInteer made Sep 18 at 2018 7:52 PM

2018-09-18T19:52:36-04:00

As one of the envious POGs that worked with grunts, I wanted an EIB, and a CIB, badly! They ARE coveted by those of us who aren’t infantry, as is the blue cord & disk and crossed rifles. My crossed semaphores just didn’t have that same flair. That said, I also knew that my color vision kept me out for a reason, and that unlike LOMs and MSM on staff weinies at the Pentagon, those were the accoutrements of men who had earned the right to wear them. I knew my place, and respected my brothers for earning that badge. Don’t diminish their work by making the EIB & EFMB something any jackhole can grab, it’s not for everyone. If you want it, switch MOS.

Response by SPC Erik Thompson made Sep 18 at 2018 7:52 PM

2018-09-18T19:52:53-04:00

Many years ago I was a radio operator in a LRS-C at Fort Reilly. When it came time for the 11's to earn their EIB's I trained along side them. I learned everything they learned and even tested with them. It established a comradeie between the 31C's and the 11B's. I never once thought I deserved to wear it also. Learning, testing, and completing was enough.

Response by TSgt John LaBelle made Sep 18 at 2018 7:52 PM

2018-09-18T19:52:57-04:00

It's that slippery slope, one gets it everybody gets it. Left the Army went to the Air Force. Its a stay in your lane world. Some of us wanted to go and get expert medic badge. Powers to be responded that although admirable it doesn't benefit the unit nor the Air Force. Money for schools is usually tight and nobody is going to approve funding to go to another branch school if there are mission readiness training/school requirements.

Response by SPC Charles Batchelor made Sep 18 at 2018 8:34 PM

2018-09-18T20:34:24-04:00

yes they should.

Response by SFC Wayne Harold made Sep 18 at 2018 8:46 PM

2018-09-18T20:46:58-04:00

As a Former 13F, I spent a great deal of my 21 years with the Infantry, and when I was in Alaska, my entire team and I went thru the EIB course and passed, however we all went into this event knowing that we could never be awarded it or wear it and we were all fine with that. Back then we didn’t need a badge to show or know our accomplishments. So with that being said, absolutely NO, should not be awarded outside 11B MOS. Reclass, get the MOS and go thru the course if it’s something you just have to wear on your uniform

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2018 9:05 PM

2018-09-18T21:05:31-04:00

Why don't we just give everyone a beret while we're at it? Oh... wait...

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2018 9:13 PM

2018-09-18T21:13:01-04:00

As eager we may be to obtain a right to wear these symbols of distinction, the criteria is in place for a reason. Badges aside, it maintains the integrity of the specialty and you know that the badge speaks of one's devotion to it. The skills required for a badge reflects what is implemented on any given day. I am a Religious Affairs NCO (formerly Chaplain Assistant and it drives me insane when a mediocre soldier decides to transfer from another MOS with no heart for the profession; just taking up space to obtain a promotion or believing they can just skate by. Let's respect the MOSs. Second, let's respect all badges and awards by not deeming them as something to collect. If you desire everything that is associated with a MOS, just reclass.

Response by SPC Gary Welch made Sep 18 at 2018 10:10 PM

2018-09-18T22:10:22-04:00

Absolutely not

Response by SFC Dan Schipper made Sep 18 at 2018 10:11 PM

2018-09-18T22:11:55-04:00

Response by SGT David Nicholas made Sep 18 at 2018 10:26 PM

2018-09-18T22:26:36-04:00

Hell no! I was an Infantryman and I earned my EIB! The expert badges should be reserved for their specific MOS to show who is not only proficient in their MOS but to distinguish them among their peers!

Response by PFC Elijah Rose made Sep 18 at 2018 10:39 PM

2018-09-18T22:39:57-04:00

I think we're way over the top with all these certifications about who can do what. Screw badges and ribbons and metals, work for the team.

Response by CSM David Draughn made Sep 19 at 2018 12:34 AM

2018-09-19T00:34:32-04:00

Absolutely not! These skill badges connote proficiency. There are not “expert computer badges.” No self-respecting medic or infantryman would take the test. These badges are not “merit badges.” If one wants the badge, join the carter fields where one tests for it.

Response by Sgt Lopaka Ornellas made Sep 19 at 2018 3:37 AM

2018-09-19T03:37:35-04:00

How about berets? It shouldn't go to everyone as well.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 4:31 AM

2018-09-19T04:31:10-04:00

This problem was fixed already. You have to be 11 or 18 series MOS to compete for the EIB; and 68 series (and whatever else covers medical) to compete for the EFMB. It’s part of the initial cantidate packet.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 7:25 AM

2018-09-19T07:25:55-04:00

Ok non infantry or medical personnel do not have a right to ware it even if they earned it. It is this same mentality that caused the CAB to be born.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 9:59 AM

2018-09-19T09:59:30-04:00

It’s bad enough that aircrew wings got changed to basic aviation wings because of the PC environment. The EIB and EFMB are meant to distinguish those within their respective MOS’s who are beyond just proficient at their job - they’re exceptional at it, and awarding such outside those MOS’s takes away from the purpose of the award. Would you really want a 42A leading an Infantry squad or attempting to provide professional level medical care?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 10:01 AM

2018-09-19T10:01:41-04:00

I concur with 1SG McPherson's comments. As a holder of both the Combat Medical Badge and Expert Field Medical Badge, I strongly believe that while anyone should be able to go thru EIB/EFMB, space being available that is, only the MOS's of Infantry and Medical have the right to wear them. History and tradition side with this.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 10:17 AM

2018-09-19T10:17:43-04:00

To be honest why is it even "a thing". Congratulations, you can do your job. I know somebody is gonna say, "shut up pog". But I have 0 foxtrots to give about it.

I went through EIB, passed, then had a burning ceremony because we couldn't wear it but were forced by the unit to do it. Even putting it on our ERBs doesn't mean crap except a few promotion points which my MOS has not needed in the 15 years I've been in.

Since the Army is all about awarding people for being able to do their job than maybe we should make a expert admin badge, expert supply badge, and expert truck driver badge.

If not, than each individual should strive to do their job to the best of their abilities because it is your job and thats why you get paid.

Response by SSG Larry R. Jones made Sep 19 at 2018 10:49 AM

2018-09-19T10:49:53-04:00

Heck NO. The most disgusting example to me is, "MY ARMY RANGER BLACK BERET. My self and thousands that EARNED the right to wear the "BLACK BERET" we worked hard, we bled hard, we sweated hard, we earned that beret. I wonder how a Special Forces soldier or an Airborne troop would feel to have to give up his/her green or maroon beret cause some generals cry baby son couldn't hack Ranger School. I've earned all my badges with hard work, TEAM work, if the ones who haven't earned them, they need to make a badge with a "baby pacifier" and call it the
"BPB" "Baby Pacifier Badge"
I'm sick in tired of hearing this crap. Earn it or don't cry about it.

Response by SFC Chris Horvath made Sep 19 at 2018 12:22 PM

2018-09-19T12:22:58-04:00

I personally think that people get hung up to much on badges, ribbons, medals, patches the whole thing. Granted as a young private growing up watching war movies yeah I wanted medals. But I learned very quickly the only thing that mattered were my brothers. As an nco it was never about awards it was about, are my men taken care of? Have I done everything I can to help them progress? Have I taught them all I can to be proficient at their jobs. I’m a Cav scout, “insert your joke whenever” Only thing we can get is our spurs and yeah I do not think you should be able to get them if you are not 19 series but you only have to be in the squadron to earn them. I agree with another mans comment if you want the badge or bling from that MOS go do it full time otherwise quit complaining and stay in your lane and worry about improving your tankers and not learning someone else’s for something shiny. Yo much of that these days.

Response by SGT Darrel Cartwright made Sep 19 at 2018 12:23 PM

2018-09-19T12:23:28-04:00

Response by SSG Fred Campbell made Sep 19 at 2018 1:20 PM

2018-09-19T13:20:36-04:00

If they can pass em, I say sure, why not?

Response by MAJ Milan George made Sep 19 at 2018 1:25 PM

2018-09-19T13:25:43-04:00

No way.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 2:34 PM

2018-09-19T14:34:14-04:00

No they should not as others have stated only those who are qualified as infantry or medical fields should test for the badges.

Response by SGT John Smith made Sep 19 at 2018 2:37 PM

2018-09-19T14:37:23-04:00

While I understand and appreciate the premise of both badges, I think one thing we lose sight of in this debate is that these badges are awarded for expert proficiency in a soldier’s MOS. Shouldn’t we all expect that from each and every soldier? In my opinion, that should be the standard, regardless of a shiny uniform item.
The Navy has enlisted specialist badges awarded for proficiency in a broader area (Surface, Air, expeditionary, Seabees, etc.). These quake require the sailor to demonstrate proficiency in areas outside of their specific job. Perhaps this is an area where the army could develop a program.

One thing the navy has done however is essentially make these devices mandatory at the E-5 and up levels. I think this does a disservice to the individual qualifying as well as the program as a whole. When everyone becomes a “specialist” it’s really not that special anymore.

As far as EIB and EFMB go, the regulations are in place with criteria set forth for qualification. As another poster suggested, if you want to take the test good on you, but that doesn’t qualify you for the badge. Use the skills you gather and become the best soldier you can be.

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Sep 19 at 2018 3:04 PM

2018-09-19T15:04:41-04:00

Well if one is an "expert infantryman"; and one gets deployed as 11X, because one is a dismounted tanker, shouldn't one get a CIB?

The navy has equivalent badges to the EIB, they are called warfare designations, and the qualification ARE WY HARDER THAN FOR THE EIB. So, for instance the AW ( air warfare specialist), not only knows every job on the flight deck, but also every job on the actual ship, a AND has to have 2 years of sea duty before he can get his designation.

The issue in the army is not necessarily the EIB, but badges in general. It is a funny thing, but the navy actually has more qualification badges than the army (mostly because officer and enlisted badges are different), and yet, you hardly ever see a Navy enlisted guy with a badge.

The founding fathers were anti royal order, and military decorations have gotten WAY out of hand.

I think campaign medals are warranted, but service medals, and all the achievement medals, especially since they are all politically given by rank, should be done away with. it should go Medal of honor, DSC, silver star, and campaign medals only. Maybe keep the national defense service medal, and the expeditionary medal. Many of the current awards are duplication's.

The national defense service medal was meant to be issued to any personal on active duty during a national emergency, as declared by the president. So, why doe wee need the GWOT Service medal? it is a duplication.

The bronze star was retroactively issued to anyone who had been awarded the CIB. So it is a defacto Combat action award for non infantry. Keep it that way. The air medal is the equivalent to the Bronze star, only it involves being off the ground. Why does that matter? Same with the DFC.

If i had to guess the reason why these awards were made is because the "regular army" looked down on the army air corps.

the legion of merit, and all those officer awards, which don't mean shit, should be done away with, officers are supposed to be exceptional, especially field grade and general grade. Getting selected for Major, is the achievement, why do you need 5 arcoms too? We should recognize participation in a specific war effort (campaign medals), being on active duty during time of national emergency, and actual valor. fuck your tour at the pentagon, all those pukes do is fuck up the way shit gets done anyway.

Special skill badges like air assault shouldn't exist either, every light infantry gets air assault, every airborne trooper is jump qualified. What does it matter if i am in a non airborne unit and i have been to airborne school? it is in my MOS that i have that qualification, and all it does is create divisions in a system where everyone is supposed to be the same.

Response by PO2 Roger O'Day made Sep 19 at 2018 4:00 PM

2018-09-19T16:00:01-04:00

I don’t get it.
But I’m from a different time.
I got to about 5 ribbons and didn’t want anymore.
Pain in the butt on my coat.
And floopy on my dress shirt.
Too heavy.
I wanted to just chuck ‘em.
I was in to do the job I trained for.
All this atta boy recognition was for officers who lived for that stuff.
But I’m an a$$kole.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 4:24 PM

2018-09-19T16:24:51-04:00

So a couple of things:
Would it be better to let a POG earn and wear an EIB/EFMB, or would it be more favorable to have a expert badge for other branches (say FA or Engineer) to denote expertise in their MOS?
Correct me if I’m wrong, but if you’re 11A/B/C and earn the EIB, but then reclass to 69J or whatever, you’ll still be permitted to wear the EIB? Sooo, a non-infantryman has an EIB now (scary thought!)

Response by SGM Wally Holston made Sep 19 at 2018 4:24 PM

2018-09-19T16:24:59-04:00

OK, what if the person was awarded the badge while in that MOS and reclassed to 42A? Can they wear it if that is the case? A CIB stays with the individual throughout their career regardless of any MOS they may later hold. I understand where you are coming from and do agree with your thoughts. I can also see the flip side of the argument. This from an old, Old Personnel SGM.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 5:18 PM

2018-09-19T17:18:58-04:00

Look, I see the point of view of both sides of the debate, I do. But here's a couple points of discussion that aren't being addressed:
1) specifically expert badges in particular are high praise awards. But IMO soldiers these days don't care about any other awards because of what they stand for. They care about them because they are worth promotion points and are a method of advancing ones career. An award that only has "bragging rights" is therefore set apart from the rest. If I accomplish the same tasks to the same standard and only get 5 promotion points and no bragging rights, I'm gonna feel less than my peers. It's that simple.

2) many people have talked about "if you want it, reclass!" But here's the thing: many of us ENJOY our MOS and don't want to reclass. That doesn't mean we don't want to be able to do other things if we can. That said, every MOS has it's specific skills and tasks that make it unique. At the very least each branch should have it's own "expert" badge in order to distinguish soldiers who can and do show expertise in those skills, but they don't...
3) here's the reason behind #2: many branches have attempted to create such badges in the past, sometimes multiple times. However the approving authorities for creating such awards are almost entirely infantry personnel or retired infantry personnel. All of these "old hats" have the same argument when presented with one of these applications. "They don't need a badge just for doing their job! Besides, the expert badges are reserved for soldiers who are experts in fields that involve risking their own, or saving others' lives!" It basically comes down to the 'im infantry and therefore better than you, POG!' argument. It's asinine and we all know it, but it results in the attempted creation of such badges nonetheless.

Response by CPL Zoltan Gyorgy Varga made Sep 19 at 2018 5:30 PM

2018-09-19T17:30:57-04:00

My opinion as a foreign veteran who worked a lot with the US military: y’all give ribbons for everything! Really? Most of them are “didn’t get caught “ medals/ ribbons or for participating! I understand that people like shiny things but come on! Finished basic training? That is not an achievement! Everybody who is serving did it! Ridiculous sometimes when an American solider (E4) goes to Europe and attend some facny ass event shows up with 3”x2” ribbon collection and never left CONUS before. Meanwhile a local soldier with 1 max 2 lines of ribbons was 2/3 combat deployments, has 10-15 yrs of service, served in natural disaster control etc... as a European who served it is just too funny.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 6:23 PM

2018-09-19T18:23:23-04:00

If they can pass the test they should

Response by SGT Christopher Hayden made Sep 19 at 2018 7:42 PM

2018-09-19T19:42:42-04:00

How can you be an "Expert" Infantryman or "Expert" Medic if you're not an Infantryman or Medic? This whole "Us too" thing that the POGs constantly cry about makes the Army look silly, especially when they cave and create whatever meaningless badge or award for them. (See UAV operators)

Look, if you want an EIB or EFMB, then reclass and become an Infantryman or Medic. Otherwise, just be good at whatever support MOS you have and be proud of that.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 8:29 PM

2018-09-19T20:29:37-04:00

No, only those who are in the MOS category. If you want the Expert INFANTRY Badge, Join the INFANTRY. Thus the same with the EFMB. I prefer the traditional way by the book.

Response by John H Green Jr made Sep 19 at 2018 8:49 PM

2018-09-19T20:49:12-04:00

Yes, warrant officer pilots assigned to medevac units can earn the efmb so why not anyone assigned to a med or infantry unit.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 9:02 PM

2018-09-19T21:02:54-04:00

There are some MOSs that could possibly be included. But then when do you stop? As part of a dust off crew the pilots and medic were both allowed to qualify for the EFMB. But I was much more likely as a crew chief to ever be involved in medical care.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 9:07 PM

2018-09-19T21:07:03-04:00

I need to follow up with my original post. I agree with the First Sergeant’s comments saying no. But long ago the Army screwed up on this. Every one in Aviation now gets an Aviation Badge. Which practically makes the badge meaningless. When I was awarded my wings it was because I was air crew; they were Crewmember Wings. Now even aviation clerks get them.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2018 11:13 PM

2018-09-19T23:13:20-04:00

I agree not every MOS should get EIB or EFMB, but what can non infantry and non medic personnel get when they do those jobs in combat. My self and many many more soldiers have kicked in doors along side the infantry. I know cooks that have more combat experience than some infantry soldiers

Response by SSgt J.D. Bowser made Sep 19 at 2018 11:34 PM

2018-09-19T23:34:23-04:00

.....and yet the Army and National Guard gives away the Bronze Star like its candy. They treat it like an Army Achievement medal. Lol what a joke. Medals are a token for doing your Damn job now days.

Response by CSM Ralph Hernandez made Sep 20 at 2018 1:08 AM

2018-09-20T01:08:32-04:00

No it should not because it is MOS specific. It is not only an Badge it's a prestigious award! It's what seperates a Expert Infantryman from rest of the Infantry. It's time honoured. If you want an EIB change your MOS and become Infantry!

Response by CSM Lynn Chrisman made Sep 20 at 2018 7:25 AM

2018-09-20T07:25:40-04:00

No to be awarded the EIB one needs to be MOS qualified and assigned to CMF 11series MOS.

Response by LTC Russ Smith made Sep 20 at 2018 8:53 AM

2018-09-20T08:53:19-04:00

No. Come up with a 42a Expert Clerk Badge. They can type for speed and accuracy . . . Join the infantry if you want the EIB.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2018 9:42 AM

2018-09-20T09:42:01-04:00

No back when I was in the guard all awards was earned.

Response by SGT Ben Barr made Sep 21 at 2018 12:52 PM

2018-09-21T12:52:59-04:00

All the bitching and moaning could be avoided if people would reclass and earn it. Guess hitting that entitlement button and crying is easier. Probably doesn't hurt that it requires the minimum amount of effort.

Response by PO1 Donald Hammond made Oct 6 at 2018 3:00 AM

2018-10-06T03:00:15-04:00

It doesn't matter. The only "badge" that matters is the submarine dolphins. And you aint getting that by being in the Army, Air Force, or Marines. :)

Response by CSM David Porterfield made Oct 6 at 2018 8:10 PM

2018-10-06T20:10:26-04:00

Qualify course? It's a test of the highest standards for a Soldiers MOS not a course. If you want a badge for top proficiency for all stick with a CAB without the wreath. Expert Action Badge?

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 20 at 2018 11:41 PM

2018-10-20T23:41:57-04:00

Our brothers in the Marine Corps don't need all of these stuff unless they are Recon or Raider. Why are we in the Army overkilling our selves with one too many badges or whatnot?

Response by SFC Timothy Wieboldt made Oct 25 at 2018 3:32 PM

2018-10-25T15:32:02-04:00

EIB is sticky infantry. Now if you want the badge go into the infantry. Same for the EFMB you want it go be a medic. Now if your MOS came up with some sort of badge then thats fine. But leave the EIB and EFMB Alone!!!.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 7 at 2018 6:27 PM

2018-11-07T18:27:38-05:00

New reply to an old thread, but I digress. Another thing to consider, (besides all of the points already mentioned) is that the 11 and 68 MOS series' contain the largest per-cent and second largest per-cent soldiers per MOS in the U.S. Army. Wheras a a very small percentage of Soldiers in the Army are infantrymen and medics, those are the two largest MOS's out there. I cannot speak for the infantry as I'm a medic. That being said, as a medic, specifically as a 68W "Healthcare Specialist", we are expected to remain highly involved in the workings of basic soldier tasks and duties as well as that of nearly any specialist medical field (i.e. field sanitation, hospital nursing, surgical assistant, trauma care, to name but a few). Whiskies are the wild cards of the medical series. On top of that, if we are in a combat arms unit (infantry, tankers, artillery, etc.) we are also expected to know everything that they know and drill and maintain ourselves to their standards. My point is simply this: medics have to be VERY flexible and know how to perform a bunch of differing roles in a very wide range of environments, more so I'd say than any other MOS. To that end, I STRONGLY feel like we should maybe get a little extra recognition with the expert field medical badge, it just makes us look a little bit more squared away. (If you want it bad enough, reclass. We always need more medics!)

Response by SSG Carlos Garcia made Nov 9 at 2018 6:44 PM

2018-11-09T18:44:33-05:00

No, since is for MOS specific this in fact and as a former EFMB Instructor the training is for field, support, and/ or hospital medical personnel that will apply their learning when needed be. Any medical/ medical personnel can get a CMB (Combat Medical Batch) all you have to do go to a Theater of Operations and that's that you got it. EFMB separate the "Creme de la Creme" from the ordinary no motivation at all ding dongs.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2018 5:43 AM

2018-11-20T05:43:24-05:00

No.

Response by LTC John Bush made Nov 23 at 2018 9:48 AM

2018-11-23T09:48:21-05:00

Personal opinion , I think they should remain MOS specific. Initially the CIB was to recognise the great sacrifice infantrymen made in actual combat during WWII when many believed they were just "cannon fodder" with no recognition. Another post was concerned with the wide variation in criteria for awards. In the case of these expert badges the criteria are tough, fixed and the individual can be justifiably proud to wear it. As with the CIB MOS and assignment specific. During my first tour in Vietnam I was an Infantry officer but commanded a non infantry company and we got in a intense firefight during the 68 TET offensive but no CIB. On my second tour as an advisor to ARVN infantry I did earn one but it required five direct fire encounters. I think these badges are significant and say something about the individual wearing them and should not be diluted.

Response by SFC Dennis Yancy made Nov 24 at 2018 3:01 PM

2018-11-24T15:01:53-05:00

Not even. Some things should be for that MOS.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 27 at 2018 10:39 AM

2018-11-27T10:39:26-05:00

I honestly think they are all stupid, i.e: tabs, patches, badges...and whatever else the Army wants to make up to give Joe's warm and fuzzies. Everything that the Army puts on a garrison uniform creates further division among the ranks and branches. When meeting a new Joe, the first thing you do is look at what he is wearing on his sleeves and chest. Prove me wrong! Marine Grunts and POGs wear the same uniform in garrison, the only time you can "see" their story is when they are in dress.

Response by SGT Willie Norwood made Nov 27 at 2018 2:16 PM

2018-11-27T14:16:08-05:00

I feel that if you can prove you can accomplish a mission then you should be awarded the badge regardless of the MOS. The reason the badge was created was to identify those who have met the requirements of a certain skill. Therefore, if you have met the requirements of that skill regardless of MOS, that badge should be awarded. Just like the parachutist badge. You have people who attended jump school, of different MOS, who do not jump regularly nor have a reason to but because they attended the course, showed their proficiency, they where awarded the badge.

Response by MAJ Bruce Davie made Dec 3 at 2018 1:34 AM

2018-12-03T01:34:19-05:00

Absolutely NOT. The EFMB is hard earned & not everyone passes. It is a badge of a true professional. I have proudly worn my EFMB as an E-1-E-7 medic and O1-O4 logistician.

Response by SP6 Michael Snyder made Aug 30 at 2023 3:15 AM

2023-08-30T03:15:08-04:00

If it's not in your specialty then you shouldn't be able to compete for it. Period. You want earn a badge? Don't they now have I participated badges? Earn one of those.