Freedom of Speech -- do you still have this right in the military?

1SG Alan Bailey — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 11:39:38 -0500

Once we join the military do we still have Freedom of Speech. And, should a Soldier be punished for posting on a social media about unit leadership?

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2014 11:42 AM

SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 11:42:15 -0500

we should have free speech but at the same time you shouldnt slander or talk bad about the unit or leadership directly

Response by 1SG Steven Stankovich made Jan 10 at 2014 12:17 PM

1SG Steven Stankovich — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 12:17:26 -0500

I believe that "freedom of speech" and "posting on a social media about unit leadership" are two different things.  If what you post on a social media site or discuss in an open forum violates any posted regulation or article of the UCMJ, then yes, punishment may be warranted.  Right, wrong, or indifferent, I believe that my "freedom of speech" as a service member is different than that of a non-military civilian.  I accept that and have no heartburn about it whatsoever.  I believe that caters to good order and discipline and is something that should be adhered to. 

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Jan 10 at 2014 12:22 PM

SPC Christopher Smith — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 12:22:55 -0500

After the few response I have seen, I think people are forgetting that Freedom of Speech goes beyond just speaking, or writtting a post online. Freedom of Speech also covers things like the ability to wear pretty much whatever clothing you like, the ability to express oneself without limit or censorship artisicly, and the list goes on. I would say that our freedom of speech is not fully taken away but very much choked down.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2014 12:29 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 12:29:33 -0500

As long as we, as Soldiers/Sailors/Airmen/Marines/Coast Guardsmen, wear the uniform, we represent something larger than ourselves. While we are still allowed the same "Freedom of Speech" that our Civilian counterparts enjoy, we have an obligation to be a little more responsible with our Liberties. Our displays, especially those publicly visible, (such as social media) reflect upon our Units, Branches, and the Military as a whole, regardless of intent. 

Response by Sgt John Henry made Jan 10 at 2014 1:32 PM

Sgt John Henry — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 13:32:27 -0500

Voicing your own personal opinion can directly conflict with your duty to perform as a professional warrior operating in the chain of command.

Response by SPC Christopher Morehouse made Jan 10 at 2014 1:57 PM

SPC Christopher Morehouse — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 13:57:10 -0500

Short answer? No.

When you join the military, you give up that freedom. You also give up your privacy (unreasonable search and seizure) and your right to trial by a jury of your peers. You also do not have the right to remain silent (bye bye 5th Amendment for you Joe Private) and so on. They should have gone over all of this at basic training (I bet that seems just like yesterday for you Master Sergeant =P ). I remember that long, boring day when they went over all the legal stuff, yeah, I remember struggling to stay awake, failing for LITERALLY like 2 seconds, and opening my eyes to find my drill sergeants face 2 inches from mine.

It is a great irony that to protect these freedoms, some people, for a time at least, must give them up.

Response by Sgt John Henry made Jan 10 at 2014 2:03 PM

Sgt John Henry — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 14:03:07 -0500

Consider this as well: Any person in a business of any size, or working for a nonprofit organization, or government agency, could be fired if their public statements conflict with the public image of said organization.

Members of the military need to be even more discreet than them.

Response by SFC Stephen P. made Jan 10 at 2014 5:36 PM

SFC Stephen P. — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 17:36:57 -0500

People have the freedom of speech. Government only has the authority delegated to them by the people by the constitution.

A service member is not a person, he is a government agency. We do not have the right to speak our minds while acting as a representative of the government.

Also, don't leaders have better things to do than spy on their subordinates' social lives?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2014 11:14 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jan 2014 23:14:20 -0500

I would say your freedom of speech is limited, and yes they should be punished for bad mouthing leadership on social media. You are a Soldier 24 hrs a day and UCMJ applies at all times.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2014 12:44 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 12:44:00 -0500

While in uniform or on duty, you are bound by the UCMJ. Off duty & out of uniform, u have free speech. HOWEVER: If you identify yourself as a member of the armed forces AND say or do something stupid on Social Media that your command can trace back to you, expect trouble.

Response by PFC Earl Herman made Feb 27 at 2014 12:46 PM

PFC Earl Herman — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 12:46:39 -0500

While we didn't necessarily give up certain 'rights' in the broad sense of the word, we are held to a higher standard. Service members need to be mindful of the fact that we are 'looked up to' by our fellow citizens and our families. Perhaps some sensitivity training is in order?

Response by SrA Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2014 1:20 PM

SrA Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Feb 2014 13:20:01 -0500

We do still have our freedom of speech. However, there are other rules and guidlines that must be followed that could make it feel as if our freedom of speech is being infringed. That being said, I feel that social media has created an opportunity for people to be couardous about the issues that they have with certain people who may be above them. Regardless of where it is said, we still have an obligation to not disrespect those who outrank us. I would be a liar if I were to write in here that I have not said disrespectful things about people who outrank me. However, there is a time and place for everything. A couple buddies and some brews is a decently constructive area to get frustrations out. People just need to consider the possibility of a pipeline from the source to whoever it is that is being spoken about.

Basically, with how closely social media is being watched, if you are going to put something on one of these sites about someone in your unit leadership you may as well go up to that person and tell them directly because when word gets to them about what you said they are going to get the unfiltered, raw, and blunt version of the point that you may be trying to convey. The supervisors that we all have and the chain of command have an excellent way of taking complaints, gripes, and raw emotional breakdowns and "churching them up" or filtering them so that they can be presented in a way to the next level that does not offend, directly ridicule, or demean the targeted individual, but still has the power to get the point across. The majority of issues can be solved in this manor. And then if the issue is not resolved, use that as a motivating factor to get to the next level so that you can either have your voice heard or utilize your experience as a learning tool to create a "better class of leadership." Which in the end should be the goal of anyone who decides to make this lifestyle a career. We should always be looking for ways to improve ourselves so that when we get to the levels that we aspire to be at we can be the best leaders.

So, in short...yes people should be held responsible for the things they say on social media...people being held responsible for their own actions...there is a rant that is far too long for here. lol

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 27 at 2014 12:24 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Mar 2014 00:24:18 -0400

As long as we wear the uniform we must conduct oursleves in professional manner no matter what we enlisted into the military to serve our country not serve oursleves. As Americans we have the Freedom of Speech, but once we put the uniform on and rise our right hand we must keep our thoughts and actions in check at all times. Not just while we are talking with our buddies in the motor pool, but also on social media.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 27 at 2014 5:01 AM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 27 Mar 2014 05:01:56 -0400

You always have freedome of speech.  However, it doesn't mean you won't get prosecuted for it.  You might win the trial with the freedom of speech defense, but you just have to decide on whether what you have to say is worth going through all that potential hassle.

Response by SGT Donald Croswhite made Mar 27 at 2014 5:03 PM

SGT Donald Croswhite — Thu, 27 Mar 2014 17:03:29 -0400

We defend freedom and democracy. We don't practice it.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2014 9:47 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 01 Apr 2014 09:47:03 -0400

If you were a civilian and trash talked your Boss, what do you think would happen to you? The military is supposed to be held to a higher standard.

Response by SFC Richard M. made Jan 21 at 2015 11:10 AM

SFC Richard M. — Wed, 21 Jan 2015 11:10:19 -0500

This is an easy one

I used to tell my Soldiers that they absolutely have freedom of speech, but they are not free from consequence.

No different from the civilian sector. If you post on facebook that your boss is a/an (expletive), and he/she finds out about it, you will be punished or fired. Why would this be different in the military?

Response by SGT Don Matyja made Jun 22 at 2015 1:38 PM

SGT Don Matyja — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:38:03 -0400

The only free speech is if you dont offend any one's feeling do not have a opinion that defers from them.

Response by SCPO David Lockwood made Jun 22 at 2015 1:40 PM

SCPO David Lockwood — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:40:45 -0400

You still have your rights to free speech. But you also have to remember that you are in the military and you can not say or do anything that will bring discredit to the armed forces. For example, you can not go to a demonstration in uniform because you are now representing the military, however you can demonstrate in civilian clothing as long as you do not wear anything that can associate you with the military.

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Jun 22 at 2015 1:42 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:42:37 -0400

CPT M Cannonie, I am Old School Army 1974, the Drill Sargent lesson was we had no free speech rights, a fact that was drilled into our heads by having the whole platoon drop and do push up for one person saying what he wanted. After the push ups the Drill Sargent walked away for us to deal with Free Speech issues.

Response by COL Mikel J. Burroughs made Jun 22 at 2015 1:43 PM

COL Mikel J. Burroughs — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:43:53 -0400

CPT Private RallyPoint Member this was some great information. I remember seeing this before, but totally forgot about its existence. I guess I better be careful about what I say in reference to current and former Commander's in Chief. I would hate to test this information. Just kidding. Great post and solid information - thanks for sharing.

Response by SCPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 22 at 2015 1:52 PM

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 13:52:07 -0400

EXTREMELY LIMITED.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 22 at 2015 2:09 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 14:09:19 -0400

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CB8QFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnlgmltf.org%2Fleaflets%2FGI_Rights_free_speech.html&ei=UkWIVeqzD9GkyASl9oKIAQ&usg=AFQjCNG8kCVPT6D9yoR1O-Rb9a6ouKmXMA&bvm=bv.96339352,d.aWw

Response by LTC John Shaw made Jun 22 at 2015 4:40 PM

LTC John Shaw — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 16:40:04 -0400

Cpt M I am getting an invalid URL from your link

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 22 at 2015 4:56 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 22 Jun 2015 16:56:16 -0400

They are lawfully restricted in one's official capacity. Your link appears broken. What is your specific question?

Response by SFC Collin McMillion made Jun 23 at 2015 5:55 PM

SFC Collin McMillion — Tue, 23 Jun 2015 17:55:17 -0400

None

Response by SFC Curtis Halford (Ret) made May 17 at 2016 10:09 AM

SFC Curtis Halford (Ret) — Tue, 17 May 2016 10:09:43 -0400

This will take a few minutes to read, but it is a very thorough discussion of just this question. It was written by a JAG lawyer during the Iraq surge. http://cape.army.mil/repository/materials/WhenSoldiersSpeakOut.pdf

Response by SPC John Decker made Aug 23 at 2016 4:56 PM

SPC John Decker — Tue, 23 Aug 2016 16:56:10 -0400

We were told, in my day, that the constitution did not apply to the military. That, of course, was before the day of social media. We would complain to each other in person but it usually didn't go further than that. Posting on social media about unit leadership would be the equivalent of doing a newspaper interview in my day. We just didn't do those things. The one thing that is never made clear to incoming service members (and this probably applies to all services) is the fact that we are no longer persons. We are military assets. To be used as someone else as deemed necessary. We were trained, sometimes at enormous expense, to do a specific job. To be ready to do that job at a moments notice. To do that job 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. Recruiters should be made to make sure potential recruits understand and accept those facts. The military is there to protect others rights. Not to practice those rights until they are out of uniform(out of the service).

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2016 8:10 PM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 Aug 2016 20:10:53 -0400

I think people forget that with freedom of speech come responsibility.

And, there is no guarantee that there will not be consequences for what you say.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2016 9:32 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 Aug 2016 21:32:39 -0400

I think by posting on social media, while in active duty, (or is it 'on' active duty?) Should probably be abstained. Too much bad things can be done and unintentionally as well...too much room for error...

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 23 at 2016 10:34 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 Aug 2016 22:34:34 -0400

No, you do not "give up" any of your freedoms guaranteed under our Constitution. You are however more restricted and held to a higher standard than our counterparts in the civilian world. Social media is by far NOT the place to express your feelings about leadership because it can be construed as insubordination and a break down of discipline. The public in general looks to our armed forces as the most disciplined, most professional, and most trusted segment of the government. We carry ourselves this way because of our shared values, training, and discipline.

Response by Sgt Larry Gibson made Aug 24 at 2016 11:03 AM

Sgt Larry Gibson — Wed, 24 Aug 2016 11:03:58 -0400

Not true, at least in the af. I had to advise people of their rights when questioning them. We had to get the equivalent of a search warrant before we could search dorm rooms or anything like that. Vehicle searches at the gates were warrantless but bug signs warned anyone coming on base that they were possible. Also, even those were restricted and carefully monitored. I saw little difference in civilian law enforcement practices and the way we did things in Air Force Security Police.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2016 3:58 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 Aug 2016 15:58:13 -0400

Well, here is where I have to disagree with you 1SG. You can have all of the oratory freedom you want, as long as your rank can afford it. See, in today's Army (at least, the Army, I cannot speak for other branches), and especially in TRADOC, if you are below the rank of E-6 (SSG), then you do NOT have the freedom to say or do ANYTHING that draws attention to you, unless you want to have your fourth point of contact in a sling. Believe me, the IET Privates have more freedom than you do as Support Cadre (Non-Command or DS). I cannot speak freeliy, or offer an opinion at any given time, except on here, or on Facebook. and I've gotten a royal a** chewing more than once for speaking up on both of those outlets as well, because it is "counterproductive to unit cohesion and it hints at insubordination."

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 24 at 2016 5:16 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 Aug 2016 17:16:52 -0400

freedoms come with responsibillities and accountabillity, think first act second

Response by Cpl Benjamin Weston made Jun 26 at 2017 12:50 PM

Cpl Benjamin Weston — Mon, 26 Jun 2017 12:50:25 -0400

Oh you can say there is freedom of speech in the military,... but in reality.... I do not believe there ever was freedom of speech in the military... without having the fear of retaliation by a court-martial or being drummed out of the service or being put on the worst details you can imagine....
Should a soldier put something on social media you ask...... only if he wants to go to the brig..... so no I would say that is definitely unwise.... for the most part you keep your head down and your mouth shut..... otherwise you would be hearing about a lot of missions that happened to get the benefits that the veterans so rightly deserve.... but cannot speak up because it is still classified, or the government doesn't want to pay out on the claims.... and you are branded a liar or branded for treason....

Response by Sgt Wayne Wood made Sep 15 at 2017 12:17 PM

Sgt Wayne Wood — Fri, 15 Sep 2017 12:17:49 -0400

yes you do... sunject to restrictions of the UCMJ. the military is NOT a democracy

Response by SSG Steve Knox made Dec 30 at 2022 11:27 AM

SSG Steve Knox — Fri, 30 Dec 2022 11:27:01 -0500

When we take our enlistment oath, we don't give up our freedom of speech...it just may not be heard. In a sense, we elect to have leadership speak and make choices for us the moment we say, "so help me GOD".

Response by Amn Dale Preisach made Dec 30 at 2022 12:56 PM

Amn Dale Preisach — Fri, 30 Dec 2022 12:56:35 -0500

Only off duty and in civvies .
And NO Mentioning any rank or service status.