Growing out facial hair while off duty or on leave? AR 670-1 says YES, but many Leaders frown upon people who do. What is your take?

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 11:53:42 -0400

As I prepare to go on 3 weeks of leave starting Monday, my wife asked me if I was growing out my goatee like I have in the past and for once, I had to think about it. I don't personally have an issue and I know AR 670-1 reads "as long as you are not in uniform or civilian clothes while on duty, so what's the big issue? Many installations have initiated Command policies adding to what the reg has outlined. These Command polices state that you have to shave everyday regardless if you are on duty or not. I don't agree with these added installation polices, how do you feel? Does not shaving on weekends and while off duty make you less of a professional?

Response by SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. made Jun 27 at 2015 11:58 AM

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 11:58:48 -0400

how do they know what you are doing on leave?

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Jun 27 at 2015 12:36 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 12:36:27 -0400

I had an old SgtMaj and his philosophy (on liberty) was "If you are hanging out inside the barracks or at home, and don't shave, fine. But if you run around town, shave. Make yourself presentable for public."

As for leave, that's your time, not the governments. We have a VERY formal process for checking out and back in, for a reason.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2015 6:04 PM

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 18:04:03 -0400

The Navy doesn't seem to care about those issues. It's unfortunate that you have to question that...

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Jun 27 at 2015 7:11 PM

Capt Richard I P. — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 19:11:02 -0400

Is that picture Dwayne Johnson?

Another beard topic.

Response by CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2015 8:27 PM

CMSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 20:27:55 -0400

I came here to acknowledge the picture of Dwayne Johnson. That is all. :)

Response by SPC Todd Hanson made Jun 27 at 2015 8:56 PM

SPC Todd Hanson — Sat, 27 Jun 2015 20:56:34 -0400

I am on leave right now rocking a Goetee. I shaved it once for my cousins wedding to look proper.

Response by PO2 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 28 at 2015 9:17 PM

PO2 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 28 Jun 2015 21:17:18 -0400

I think if ur on leave or off duty during the weekend, then u should be able to grow out some facial hair. As long as ur squared away in uniform. I just hate when certain guys dress like wanna be thugs during off duty or liberty knowing their in the military. I'd rather see neat professional civilian atire while off duty than a clean shaven face.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2015 2:56 AM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 02:56:27 -0400

My take is that leaders who get upset about that probably don't know the regulation. I ignore them.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2015 12:29 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 12:29:31 -0400

It allows your face to rest and not be scrapped everyday is good. It also allows for a closer shave when you shave next time.

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Jun 29 at 2015 1:28 PM

LTC Bink Romanick — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:28:11 -0400

I say leave is leave leave people alone on leave. As a leader I would never bother anyone about their activities on leave, if legal.

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Jun 29 at 2015 1:34 PM

LTC Bink Romanick — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:34:52 -0400

I want considering living in billets...discretion.

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Jun 29 at 2015 1:39 PM

LTC Bink Romanick — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:39:46 -0400

We are going back to a peacetime environment where little things matter and chicken...t reigns. Know your commander, 1SG and CSM and use your discretion.

Response by TSgt Joshua Copeland made Jun 29 at 2015 1:41 PM

TSgt Joshua Copeland — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:41:45 -0400

One more reason to love the Air Force!

Response by SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA made Jun 29 at 2015 1:48 PM

SGT Hector Rojas, AIGA, SHA — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:48:25 -0400

Every time I'm on leave I grow my beard.
As a matter of fact, for my last PCS, I was already on PCS leave when my old unit called me in to give me a platoon plaque. I showed up in civvies with a beard.
1SG didn't like it but oh well, AR670-1 is the cure for all maladies.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2015 1:50 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 13:50:25 -0400

Up until recently, Air Force AFI 36-2903 stated "must be cleanly shaven at ALL times". It was seldom enforced, and most people were unaware of it, but it was there. This topic actually came up at work last week, and we looked it up. A new change to the AFI in May of this year took it out.

Response by SFC Walter Mack made Jun 29 at 2015 4:08 PM

SFC Walter Mack — Mon, 29 Jun 2015 16:08:06 -0400

If you are unable to read and understand the regulation, that is your problem. I will not shave on leave, and you can't make me. That would be a blatant abuse of power for personal gratification, which is immoral and unethical. Not speaking to anyone in particular. Just a generalization.

Response by LTC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 11 at 2015 2:21 AM

LTC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Jul 2015 02:21:26 -0400

An "addition" to the AR 670-1 by a commander or installation is one of the biggest frauds that have ever been perpetrated. I had a 1SG tell me that I needed to cut my sideburns to be level with the hair coming over the top of my ear when the 670-1 CLEARLY stated that they were allowed to be as low as the bottom opening of the ear. He said he could add but not take away from the reg. I said in that case...I will add about two inches to my sideburns. Needless to say...my sideburns remained. If I was a private...or any rank for that matter...and was receiving an Article 15 for not shaving while off duty in civilian clothes...you can dang sure bet I would ask for a court martial. I would love to see how the IG handled the command giving an unlawful order.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jul 11 at 2015 2:38 AM

PO1 John Miller — Sat, 11 Jul 2015 02:38:26 -0400

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member, if I was not on duty/on leave and didn't have to go on base you can rest assured that I was NOT clean shaven!
Of course, now that I'm retired I have a full beard!

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 11 at 2015 2:39 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Jul 2015 02:39:03 -0400

I do not agree with Installation policies that try to dictate what a SM can or cannot do off duty. To me, the shaving regulation clearly indicates what the requirements are in uniform, but if you do not live on post and are on your own, I don't think it should matter whether or not you shave.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2015 10:49 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 10:49:33 -0500

I don't agree to the policy at all, but as you know.... you local command can add to a policy but not take away.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2015 11:31 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 11:31:51 -0500

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member As long as it's gone by the time you return to post/duty and while sporting it you're not in uniform... go for it

Response by 1SG Patrick Sims made Nov 1 at 2015 5:26 PM

1SG Patrick Sims — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 17:26:59 -0500

Off duty and out of uniform---its your business---Once in uniform or on duty you meet the grooming standards everyone else does. End of story.

Response by 1SG Nick Baker made Nov 1 at 2015 6:52 PM

1SG Nick Baker — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 18:52:34 -0500

I did not shave on the weekends or on leave. If I went on post, I shaved. It is a profession and not a prison.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 1 at 2015 7:43 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 19:43:46 -0500

I personally let my facial hair grow on leave. For nothing else just to simply give my face a break from the constant shaving.

But I advise the application of common sense. If for whatever reason you are going to be in your unit footprint, shave your face.

Response by CH (LTC) Robert Leroe made Nov 1 at 2015 8:17 PM

CH (LTC) Robert Leroe — Sun, 01 Nov 2015 20:17:15 -0500

I did it once only to discover my beard was grey. :(

Response by TSgt Marco McDowell made Nov 2 at 2015 4:51 AM

TSgt Marco McDowell — Mon, 02 Nov 2015 04:51:26 -0500

If I was going to be on base or planned on visiting another installation ,I'd shave every 2 days. Just a choice,but if I was going away,the Chuck Norris would be in full effect. Unfortunately some guys go all out a turn into werewolves and stroll around base acting froggy. That might be a bone of contention with commanders.

Response by SSG Audwin Scott made Nov 3 at 2015 10:38 AM

SSG Audwin Scott — Tue, 03 Nov 2015 10:38:44 -0500

Well since Uncle Sam made me do my first shave in Basic Training causing my face to bump up, I have always had a shaving profile. I don't see the problem with it if you are wearing a beard during off duty hours. Special Forces does it all the time even in uniform, so what's the problem lol.

Response by MAJ David Vermillion made Nov 3 at 2015 6:15 PM

MAJ David Vermillion — Tue, 03 Nov 2015 18:15:57 -0500

In a public setting you are still in the military whether on or off duty. Police officers or firemen still have to up hold their accountability and responsibility. Some will agree with me and some won't, just depends how you view it.

Response by SSG Todd Halverson made Nov 4 at 2015 2:52 PM

SSG Todd Halverson — Wed, 04 Nov 2015 14:52:04 -0500

Don't really see what the big deal is if you shave or not while off duty. I for one hardly ever shaved when off duty. That included if I had to run to office for something or was called in for an impromptu meeting.
Hell, usually when we returned from deployment we would have a contest to see who had the best beard when we came back. Usually we would hold our first formation away from other eyes and have everyone come in to check the beards. Then released to go get cleaned up for work.
If you are worrying if service members shaving while off duty, you have your priorities mixed up. I always had more important things to worry about over off duty times. It is called the Honey Do List......

Response by CPT(P) David Thorp made Nov 5 at 2015 9:15 PM

CPT(P) David Thorp — Thu, 05 Nov 2015 21:15:38 -0500

Isn't that just in keeping with good OPSEC? Why go around in public look like you are in the military more than you have to?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2015 9:23 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 05 Nov 2015 21:23:56 -0500

The reason why many Male Soldiers have issues with theirs skin is because they are constantly shaving, your leave time is for Rest and Recuperation therefore it's your decision to growth your goatee or not, it will give your skin some time to breath, Just remember to keep yourself presentable
Presentable meaning nice clean goatee not crazy, messy, dirty looking

Response by SGT Drue Rockwell made Jun 10 at 2016 5:50 PM

SGT Drue Rockwell — Fri, 10 Jun 2016 17:50:11 -0400

The regulation is quite specific. There's a reason for that. Except in specialized units where there is a reason for controlling your off duty activity or cases where there is a specific problem that must be addressed, off duty, leave the troops the hell alone. I've been held to the strictest standards, I've had relaxed grooming standards, and everything in between. If there's a reason for it, got it. Done. If not, get priorities straight and as long as mission is done, troops are taken care of, and our guys aren't getting trouble, stop trying to exercise power or micromanage or babysit. And in case several of you guys are unaware, even on post when off duty you needn't shave. I figure it's good juju to keep at least semi presentable. Brush your teeth, take a shower, wear clean clothes, try not to look homeless or criminal (since that's a look, right? Sarcasm), don't start fights or break the law, take care of your responsibilities (your family, yourself, and your property, home/vehicle), and make sure you know your command has your back. Be back on day when you're supposed to, in the correct uniform and within standards. Oh, and try not to get us all recalled for a safety brief or cause some meme to come to life...Carl....

Response by SPC John Lebiecki made Jun 22 at 2016 1:42 PM

SPC John Lebiecki — Wed, 22 Jun 2016 13:42:11 -0400

Just stay away from the installation when off duty and you wont have anything to worry about. If you have to go on post, then clean yourself up so you dont have to deal with the PC of it.

Response by Sgt Dale Briggs made Jun 23 at 2016 8:10 AM

Sgt Dale Briggs — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 08:10:04 -0400

Lol, back in the day I took 30 days leave and let as much grow out as I could. Had 30 days worth of hair and as much mutton chop growing as I could, never could grow a good beard. Made everyone kinda laugh when I returned from leave. On Monday it all went away, so what? I was platoon Sgt then, didn't effect a thing we all went back to work. Regs? What regs, I was out of uniform 600 miles away from base. My only regret was not showing the 1st Sgt my efforts, he would have pissed himself and turned purple, then probably kick my ass.

Response by SSgt Jim Gilmore made Jun 23 at 2016 8:15 AM

SSgt Jim Gilmore — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 08:15:17 -0400

I personally detest shaving. When the weekend rolled around or I was on leave, my razor remained in barracks.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 23 at 2016 10:15 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 10:15:51 -0400

Sounds like chickenshit to me. As long as you're not acting in an official capacity or in a uniform I don't see the issue. I work in industrial maintenance when I'm not wearing a uniform. I certainly don't shave every day.

Response by 1SG Patrick Sims made Jun 23 at 2016 7:21 PM

1SG Patrick Sims — Thu, 23 Jun 2016 19:21:06 -0400

When your off duty it's no ones business what you look like, as long as you're not in uniform. If braiding your nasal hair is your thing go for it. But remember, when you put on that uniform you become a soldier, and are expected to meet the same grooming standards as the rest of us-----Unless your a disciple of Barrack the Magnificent

Response by SPC Anna Larson made Jun 24 at 2016 11:30 AM

SPC Anna Larson — Fri, 24 Jun 2016 11:30:03 -0400

In 1995 my (then boyfriend) now hubby was stationed in Korea while I was still located at Ft Huachuca, Az. He left Korea on leave and spent a couple weeks at his parents' house and didn't shave. When he showed up at Ft. Huachuca to visit me, he already had a full beard going. Maj. Gen. Leffler was retiring and Keith had previously been a member of the B-Troop Ceremonial cavalry unit before shipping to Korea. Keith was asked to 'rejoin' the unit just for the Gen's retirement ceremony. Since B-Troop was made up of volunteers including civilian DOD contractors, he was still allowed to keep his beard for the ceremony. Although his Sgt Maj. was at the Ceremony and told him to shave before he got back to Korea. Neither of us have been in for a while now, but I'm sure Keith would grow his beard (it grows fast anyway) while on leave.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 4 at 2017 8:18 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 20:18:43 -0500

I only shave if I am about to put on a uniform and or if I am on duty. I have never shaved any other time. And why should the shaving requirement only apply to male service members and exclude female service members?

Response by SSgt Walter Lonsdale made Mar 4 at 2017 8:51 PM

SSgt Walter Lonsdale — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 20:51:37 -0500

Why not?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 4 at 2017 9:11 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 21:11:02 -0500

I often wonder what is the issue with being against something that naturally grows on almost every male Soldier. I understand that shaving is needed for proper gas mask seal, but there has been no CBRN attacks while in garrison. If there ever was a CBRN attack on a US military installation we all be in a very dire situation trying to get all our CBRN equipment out of Cp storage. I also wonder how did the US won the revolutionary war and the civil war without shaving, maybe that's why Crazy Horse was able to defeat General Custer (too big of a mustache, and hair definitely out of AR 670-1 regulation).

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 4 at 2017 10:51 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 04 Mar 2017 22:51:27 -0500

Well this is a bit outdated, you don't have to shave at all if you don't want... I could grow a beard and if questioned say I'm a christin and Christ had a beard so it my religious obligation to grow one... room goes silent, mic drop and walk away... or I could say, do you know who the Fu@k I am, do you!? And when they say no, who are you? I cover my name tag and run :)

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2017 12:49 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 05 Mar 2017 12:49:26 -0500

AR 750-1, "Males will keep their face clean-shaven when in uniform, or in civilian clothes on duty...Handlebar mustaches, goatees, and beards are not authorized." This applies to "on duty" only, as described in the Army Regulation. However, if your installation deems it necessary to have a policy to add to the regulation and have an off-duty grooming policy, then you must respect those policies while on that installation. Each installation has their own policies, and it is our responsibility to make sure we research what policies to abide by before stepping foot on that installation. Therefore, when you're off post and off duty(on leave), you can grow out your facial hair. Read the Army Regulations, understand them, and teach your leadership.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2017 1:06 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 05 Mar 2017 13:06:05 -0500

I've been in for 15 years.

There are a few answers to this question, none of which will likely sit well with any potential chain of command who (laughably) thinks this is even remotely enforceable.

1) I remember a while back there was a rumor/talk of a supposed change to AR 670-1 which would alter the verbiage to enforce shaving standards while on leave. I'm uncertain as of this moment whether or not this was passed and has changed, and frankly, I don't care enough to research it. For such a regulation/order to be enforceable, especially for someone like me who typically doesn't lurk around a military installation while on 2-4 weeks of leave, this would require surveillance to be established to determine whether or not I was actually shaving while on leave. If such a measure was taken, this would be in violation of federal law and whomever ordered such a measure would be facing far worse than a simple reprimand for a lack of following a grooming standard.

2) When I was younger and only a couple of years into my military career, I used to be afraid of the chain of command to an extent. This has obviously changed. What I do when I'm on leave is my business and mine alone - so long as I'm not breaking the laws of the US or violating the UCMJ. I prefer to keep stubble on my face and shave my neck so as to give my face a break from shaving while on leave. So, in essence? I don't give a shit if someone likes it or not. This old adage of "I can add to but not take away from a regulation?" A hallmark of shitty leadership. It shows only that someone can manipulate the system to be more controlling and exhibits marks of micromanagement.

3) This ventures into the realm of another issue I have. Jeans. Not to venture too far off topic, but in my field and in other 'professional' systems - denim has been outlawed. Yet no one can conclusively explain what makes a clean pair of jeans any less professional than a clean pair of khakis. Any argument mounted to this effect ends up drawing upon emotional statements and very little fact is ever provided. "Jeans look unprofessional." --Right. In your OPINION. Anyway - same applies to shaving while on leave. I'm not on duty. I'm not in combat. I'm not walking around with a gas mask with the possibility of having to wear it. Therefore, any argument that could be mounted as to why I should shave while on leave would more than likely follow the same lines as the jeans argument.

4) So. No. I have never, nor will I start - shaving on leave. Or weekends, for that matter. Unless fucking World War III breaks out in the US - I have ample time to shave before reporting to work while off.

End Rant.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 5 at 2017 5:28 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 05 Mar 2017 17:28:45 -0500

During my last few years on active duty I didn't shave when I didn't have to be inuniform. Since I was married and had three small children (an infant and two toddlers) me and my family didn't know go anywhere when I was on leave. Since I lived on post four minutes from the unit I was the NCO who got the call when something happened in the barracks. Many times during the weekend or while on leave I'd get called in for something and show up in jeans and beard. Never heard a complaint

Response by COL Charles Williams made Mar 6 at 2017 11:13 PM

COL Charles Williams — Mon, 06 Mar 2017 23:13:51 -0500

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member .... I am old, and old school... So, I say no... You can't ever have an on duty and off duty persona... Both need to be in sync, or eventually they will collide.

Response by CSM Michael Sweeney made Mar 7 at 2017 7:58 AM

CSM Michael Sweeney — Tue, 07 Mar 2017 07:58:10 -0500

After all these years (served 69 to 99) I guess I can admit to growing out my beard during one 30 day leave while PCSing. And then only because I was so far away from any military installation. In those days NOT shaving everyday was never considered. I had joined at 17 and couldn't even grow peach fuzz. The first thing I did when I retired was begin to grow out my beard and I have kept a full beard, neatly trimmed, since retirement.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 23 at 2017 1:25 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 23 Apr 2017 13:25:56 -0400

I personally don't shave on weekends and on leave. It allows more time for your face to heal and get a closer shave. Although the regs states that we must be clean shaven at all times use common sense. If I know I'm going to the PX or anywhere on post I am going to shave. Same thing as wearing proper civilian attire. You should not look like a slob representing our military.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 15 at 2017 7:56 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 15 Jun 2017 19:56:41 -0400

Grow your facial hair while your on leave. This why they call it leave, R&R. And your correct on AR 670-1.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 29 at 2017 6:08 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 29 Aug 2017 18:08:32 -0400

I'm on con leave right now and have for 6 weeks. I was just called in while on leave to update some forms. I have facial hair and was pulled into the SGM's office to be reamed for doing so.

Response by CH (COL) Geoff Bailey made Nov 2 at 2017 7:45 PM

CH (COL) Geoff Bailey — Thu, 02 Nov 2017 19:45:41 -0400

CW4 Private RallyPoint Member I was looking for another question in AR 600-20 and stumbled upon something which addresses your question...

4–4. Soldier conduct
a. Ensuring the proper conduct of Soldiers is a function of command. Commanders and leaders in the Army, whether on or off duty or in a leave status, will—
(1) Ensure all military personnel present a neat, soldierly appearance.

This means that a local policy is unnecessary as this Regulation already mandates that requirement.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 4:48 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:48:19 -0400

NCOs try to enforce shaving during off duty time but it's perfectly ok to get drunk. Brought that up to an old first sergeant a while ago and he didn't have much to say except try to pull rank on me

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Apr 12 at 2018 4:56 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:56:23 -0400

I use to frown on the inability to flog my troops instead of ART-15's. Frowning didn't get me anywhere either.

Response by SPC David Willis made Apr 12 at 2018 4:59 PM

SPC David Willis — Thu, 12 Apr 2018 16:59:03 -0400

During a typical month I never bothered shaving Saturday or Sunday, but I also didn't grow hair fast enough for it to be a real issue. When I went home I would grow it out for a couple weeks because honestly who was going to say anything? I always shaved before I left home though so when I rolled through the gates my face was baby smooth.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 22 at 2018 10:34 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 22 Nov 2018 10:34:49 -0500

I think it is perfectly fine to embrace the new revisions IAW AR 670-1. It bolsters morale and allows Soldiers to for once let their hair down whicle maintaining a professional mentality and appearance.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 15 at 2018 2:34 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 15 Dec 2018 14:34:47 -0500

I have always believe, that when you are not at work, you should try you damn best to blend in with society. Doesn't mean lose your morals and values, just blend in. Make yourself a hard target.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 15 at 2019 2:30 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Jul 2019 02:30:39 -0400

I’m on PCS leave right now rocking a beard. :)

Response by PO2 Nick Burke made Oct 15 at 2019 7:56 AM

PO2 Nick Burke — Tue, 15 Oct 2019 07:56:54 -0400

Yeah, pics of you not shaving and needing a haircut.
It's been like that forever.

Response by SPC John Decker made Oct 17 at 2019 9:04 PM

SPC John Decker — Thu, 17 Oct 2019 21:04:17 -0400

IMO unless a "state-of-war" exists (that only happens when Congress declares war), your off duty time is your own. During the time of a declared war, you would have to be ready to go at a moments notice.

Response by CPT Robert Holden made Oct 27 at 2019 8:32 AM

CPT Robert Holden — Sun, 27 Oct 2019 08:32:44 -0400

People actually worry about their facial hair while they’re on leave? So long as they shave before returning to duty it doesn’t matter

Response by SPC Rick LaBonte made Oct 27 at 2019 8:10 PM

SPC Rick LaBonte — Sun, 27 Oct 2019 20:10:18 -0400

I don’t know about the rest of you, but I always saved up my 30 days per year, used them all at once and got FAR FAR away from my duty station.
I doubt my CO on Ft Riley was going to come check on me while I was on leave in Ossineke Michigan!

Response by SPC Greg Campbell made Oct 28 at 2019 11:42 AM

SPC Greg Campbell — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 11:42:57 -0400

after having to shave twice a day in basic to not shaving on weekends. the Army in Germany was more worried about the mission than how pretty you looked, Ft Carson had uniform inspections while working in the motor pool. I got yelled there because you could see the shadow of the 8th ID patch under the 4th patch. now I shave when my face gets itchy

Response by SSG Danny Anderson made Oct 28 at 2019 12:35 PM

SSG Danny Anderson — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 12:35:27 -0400

My take on this is I don't have an issue with it. Not shaving while on leave and off for liberty is your time to relax. Shaving while on leave doesn't make you a professional its how you conduct yourself is what makes you a professional. With what's going on today with terrorism at home and abroad I was always told always keep a low profile and blend in with your surroundings and by growing facial hair it allows you to do that. Also growing out facial hair allows your face to heal from shaving every because of skin irritation. Plus in addition, you save money on shaving cream and blades because these items are getting expensive. Every time I went on leave or if I'm off for the weekend I didn't shave unless I had to be in uniform because of duty.

Response by SCPO Frank Carson made Oct 28 at 2019 1:47 PM

SCPO Frank Carson — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 13:47:14 -0400

Is this made up? Who cares?

Response by SP5 Gary Smith made Oct 28 at 2019 4:26 PM

SP5 Gary Smith — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 16:26:10 -0400

Glad I got out after 4 years. Chicken shit reg.

Response by CW4 Jim Struder made Oct 28 at 2019 5:53 PM

CW4 Jim Struder — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 17:53:35 -0400

Soon after I transitioned to the WO Corps, while on leave I stopped in to see my 1LT cousin at Aberdeen Proving Grounds. My moustache was a bit long and I had not shaved that day. Cuz introduced me to his SGM; my enlisted brain kicked in and I found myself explaining my lack of grooming to the SGM with the excuse "I'm on leave". He didn't buy it and told me politely I was wrong. I told cuz (in private) his SGM was a dinosaur.
Odd thing is, now that I've been retired 13 years, if Household 6 says we're going to the Commissary today, I shave just to remind myself of what I was.

Response by PO2 Tim Druck made Oct 28 at 2019 6:26 PM

PO2 Tim Druck — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 18:26:55 -0400

Yeah, I used to do it. I once took 37 consecutive days of leave and grew a glorious goatee, and got accustomed to it to the point that I forgot to shave it before reporting on the quarterdeck the night before my first muster back. The duty officer looked at me like I was nuts, and rubbed his chin, and I said “Oh shit!”, ducked into the nearest head with my kit and returned clean-shaven. He checked me in and it was all good.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 28 at 2019 7:15 PM

CW3 Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 19:15:32 -0400

Don't go on post. Plain and simple.

Response by MSG Alison Klein made Oct 28 at 2019 7:56 PM

MSG Alison Klein — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 19:56:54 -0400

Hah!hah! I don't know how many guys underneath me grew full beards! It was a contest!

Response by SPC Gary Mckeown made Oct 28 at 2019 8:02 PM

SPC Gary Mckeown — Mon, 28 Oct 2019 20:02:13 -0400

Is any body from my post going to travel a 1000 miles to my home town and wake me up at zero dark 30 Just to see if I need a shave, sorry but hell no, but before I come back, I bet I’m shaved

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Oct 29 at 2019 12:46 AM

MSG John Duchesneau — Tue, 29 Oct 2019 00:46:39 -0400

Having facial hair off duty does not impact the "good order and discipline of the service". Yes, their are some anal retentive NCOs who starch their underwear but don't let them tell you how to spend your away for the Army time.

Response by SGT Christina Barron made Nov 23 at 2019 6:45 PM

SGT Christina Barron — Sat, 23 Nov 2019 18:45:06 -0500

My take is that you aren't to be in the "scruffy, in-between" phase in uniform. I have known plenty of male Soldiers who came back from leave with an in-regulation mustache. They had wanted the mustache for a while, but couldn't grow it out on duty. Once on Leave, they had time to grow it past the "scruffy, in-between" phase, and they were fine. Beards grown on leave had to be shaved, of course, before going back into uniform.

Response by CPO William Rys made Dec 19 at 2019 10:15 AM

CPO William Rys — Thu, 19 Dec 2019 10:15:02 -0500

I had to comment on this, mainly for “nostalgic” purposes-LOL

I joined the US Navy at the turn of the ‘70’s decade, during the anti-Vietnam movement, with the majority of civilians absolutely hating us (“Thanks for your service” was a phrase none of us EVER heard), and grooming standards were somewhat relaxed so we didn’t “stick out” quite so much... Admiral Zumwalt fully realized this and authorized enforcement of these regulations at the lowest levels. One small ship I was on actually did away with most haircut/beard length standards, with the exception of stating “reasonably neat appearance” as the standard.

Now, back to the original question regarding off-duty “standards”. During this same time period (‘70’s decade), official Navy policy was “what you do on your own time is your business, just don’t bring it on board ship”. This was essentially aimed at drug use (“recreational” variety, not hard narcotics of course), and quite honestly, the Navy simply didn’t care WHAT you did off-duty, as long as you reported aboard on-time every morning reasonably sober...

With respect to a person’s “appearance” while off-duty, IMHO, that is another situation in which it is NONE of the military’s business. I spent 20 years in, and of course, pushed those appearance standards as much as possible (hey, I was a product of the ‘60’s, so cut me some slack here-LOL).

Whenever I had any kind of time off, be it one or a few days, or 30 days leave, anything military-related was out-of-sight, out-of-mind. I never got haircuts or shaved, and after that fateful January day in 1985 when we lost our beard authorization, enjoyed showing up for work on the first morning after being gone with a full beard and long hair. Usually my department head would just shake his head and say “Chief, you ARE headed back to the CPO Mess after quarters to shave, RIGHT?”. Grinning back at him, I’d usually say “Yes sir, and I may even swing by the barbershop sometime today”.

Those were the days...LOL

I would think the same attitude should apply even today. Guys have it tough enough without being expected to be “AJ Squared Away” while off-duty conducting personal business or household chores...

Response by SGT Chester Sprankle made Jan 5 at 2020 10:38 AM

SGT Chester Sprankle — Sun, 05 Jan 2020 10:38:21 -0500

No it does not. The regulations are there for a reason and unless you are on duty, or on call who cares. I never shaved when I was on vacation, or otherwise not performing official duties.

Response by Cpl Bobbylee Dominguez made Jan 24 at 2020 2:31 PM

Cpl Bobbylee Dominguez — Fri, 24 Jan 2020 14:31:56 -0500

I had this happen to in 1975, upon returning back from leave. I received office hours. Accepted it because I knew marine policy. No buggy, made my bed and happy to lay in it, as I knew better. Didn't complain to mom and dad or even my Congressmen. I knew I hadn't enlisted into the boy scouts didn't whine

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 6 at 2021 10:12 PM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 06 Jun 2021 22:12:55 -0400

"If you're not taking from the population, idiotically adding to the population, ending up in jail, or on the news in a negative manner whatever you do on leave or in your off time is none of some salty officers or NCO's business", as told to me by my former CSM.

Said former CSM believed there were too many leaders trying to micromanage happiness and life in the off duty hours and trying to pretend they didn't violate rules and regs in their own little ways. Off duty time is a time to decompress and de-stress yourself.

If you want to contribute to poor retention, by all means conduct actions like this as a leader. I guarantee your Soldiers hate you.

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made Jun 7 at 2021 3:27 PM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Mon, 07 Jun 2021 15:27:25 -0400

I had a medical appointment on leave one time. Was sitting in the clinic (in civvies) and a CSM (not mine) tried to kick me out of the clinic for not being shaved. I informed CSM I was on leave. He said, "I don't care. You look scruffy. Go home."

I walked out of the clinic, grabbed some water, walked back in when the CSM had continued on his way. Wasn't worth fighting.

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Aug 5 at 2021 6:51 AM

SMSgt Lawrence McCarter — Thu, 05 Aug 2021 06:51:33 -0400

As far as I'm concerned if Your in uniform them You should meeting standards but in civilian clothes off duty who cares ? In both My Military and Police and later in life even now contract security I have always been proper in uniform. Sometimes on week ends I don't shave, so what ? I've always behaved and looked professional in uniform and always will however what I do in civilian clothes off duty is none of their business. Sometimes letting the facial hair grown out for a day or two once You do shave again get a cleaner smoother shave.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Aug 12 at 2021 10:45 AM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Thu, 12 Aug 2021 10:45:43 -0400

The regulation says what it says. We enforce regulations, not peeves and preferences. If homeboy wants to look like Gandalf while he's on leave, then more power to him (or her, I guess).

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 13 at 2021 8:23 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 13 Aug 2021 08:23:48 -0400

I am a reservist so my answer is no, you are not less professional. I was not aware of such policies. When on leave do you have to wake up pt as well when on leave?

Response by SFC Edward Ermey made Aug 13 at 2021 7:04 PM

SFC Edward Ermey — Fri, 13 Aug 2021 19:04:03 -0400

If you are going to grow it out, then stay as far away as you can from any military installation and your command. If your intention is to blend in. Get rid of it before you get near areas that know you are in the military. If you are going to be near it or within 30 miles, keep it shaved incase you get called back in a hurry. Regardless you should be able to get rid of facial hair in a hurry if needed.

Response by SFC Kenneth Goins made Jan 13 at 2022 8:40 PM

SFC Kenneth Goins — Thu, 13 Jan 2022 20:40:02 -0500

Did you know that if you are TDY in the Army, you remain in an official duty status even on weekend or holiday passes? So, I would assume if you are TDY in the Army, you must shave even on the weekends.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jan 14 at 2022 2:18 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Fri, 14 Jan 2022 14:18:28 -0500

As a commander there are better things to do than micromanage people's lives when they are off duty. My goal was to minimize the bullshit and stupidity.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 14 at 2022 2:21 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 14 Jan 2022 14:21:31 -0500

Let the Army Beard Again!

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 14 at 2022 2:48 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 14 Jan 2022 14:48:53 -0500

Lol, I’m never shaving on leave.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Jan 14 at 2022 4:16 PM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Fri, 14 Jan 2022 16:16:38 -0500

I always found that if remaining on the base for leave it wasent worth the 20 questions involved. If you are on leave and out of the are go for it, if you stay local be prepared to be challenged. Enjoy your leave.

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made Jan 14 at 2022 5:36 PM

Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth — Fri, 14 Jan 2022 17:36:17 -0500

Leave is an opportunity for an individual to do whatever they want to do to wind down as long as it isn't illegal...that is why it used to be called rest and relaxation R& R...as a commander I had a hell of a lot of other things to chase other than if someone shaved or not while on leave.

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Mar 25 at 2022 3:47 PM

SPC Chris Ison — Fri, 25 Mar 2022 15:47:14 -0400

Leave is intended to remove certain duty restrictions on the service member, that is why it is called leave and not liberty.
You can be unshaven in civilian clothes.

If you are on leave and, for whatever reason, you are wearing your uniform you must adhere to the grooming standards.

My issue is how would they even know? Most people who take leave go to their home of record right?

Response by SSG Omar Ruiz-Canales made Apr 13 at 2022 9:31 PM

SSG Omar Ruiz-Canales — Wed, 13 Apr 2022 21:31:52 -0400

I am all for military rules... but that one there is overstepping into dictatorial behavior... will they also say only one of your butt cheeks can touch the toilet when you take a dump? These are the kind of rules that have no place in the military.... this is the kind of mentality that allowed for certain leaders
in Vietnam to call for immoral orders to napalm a village to weed out the enemy (do as i say),. as long as you are good and ready to be present in the proper uniform and military look when you are called upon or are on duty that should be all it takes. Also for the sole fact that they are not going to be there with you on your vacation and enforce that rule... once again, overstepping. These base commanders need to get a clue and get off their power trip.