Has the Army become too hyper focused on SHARP, online training, suicide prevention, & social experiments that preparing for combat suffers?

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 06:56:28 -0400

Response by SPC Kenneth Koerperich made May 24 at 2016 7:03 AM

SPC Kenneth Koerperich — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:03:37 -0400

IMO yes. When I was in, we had no such training. And we were deployed/in the field all the time, being wore out. Nobody had time to think about this. Mission Preparedness 1st, everything else after. But, we didn't have the Internet/Cell phones, & the BS soldiers have now. Hell, we only got 3 channels of TV if we paid for it....Community bathrooms & 4 man rooms. None of this single/double room crap like there is now. We never had problems w/ any of this. Lower standards trying to be PC I guess.

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 7:04 AM

SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:04:57 -0400

When it comes to suicide prevention I believe that a person would complete their mission no matter how many classes you go to or teach.

Response by CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 7:06 AM

CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:06:13 -0400

Yes. Not to say that those things are not important, but we need to remember what our mission is. We are not a Fortune 500 company. We need to be efficient in a different way and using any other company or institution as an example is not going to fit our unique needs. With all that being said (and this is a cardinal sin), I have no solution. It's a very complex organization.

Response by SGT William Howell made May 24 at 2016 7:17 AM

SGT William Howell — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:17:35 -0400

We are an army of leaders with nothing to lead. You got to look busy or you are going to get cut. Be the best SHARP OIC you can be!

Response by SPC Nathan Freeman made May 24 at 2016 7:42 AM

SPC Nathan Freeman — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:42:05 -0400

Social experiments we can do without but the rest is necessary

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 7:56 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:56:48 -0400

IMO it is all about a wartime vs peacetime Army, and downsizing the Army. As leaders have to keep busy with minutia of everyday Army tasks in a peacetime, conversely a wartime Army will overlook minutia and accomplish the big picture.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made May 24 at 2016 7:57 AM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Tue, 24 May 2016 07:57:03 -0400

Absolutely Yes. Congress pushes for correction through the NDAA and are well intending, but good luck dealing with some issues even when clear cut. Have an SJA come on here and explain the time and layers involved to adjudicate a non-substantiated SHARP allegation if you need an example.
Online training takes contact time from the primary trainer, NCO's, and gives it to a computer monitor. It seems logical to rob the leaders of contact time for check the block training, while blaming them when things go wrong.
Social experiments. You can either do the job in a deployed environment or you cannot. Any detriment to standard is a detriment to our combat effictiveness and this is totally discounting the time being spent by leaders at all levels handling the issues.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 8:22 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 08:22:40 -0400

We pretend we are hyper-focused, but in actuality, the Army still treats all of it (SHARP, Suicide prevention mainly) as a joke.
We just need stickers for our daily activity charts....

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 9:10 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:10:17 -0400

Yes the Army has became way to focused on 350-1 training in general. There is no SGT's time training, hip pocket training, NCOPD's, etc. The days of a SGT being able to take their soldiers out to the wood line to either conduct a off the cuff class, SGT's time training, or just to scuff up and teach a few life lessons. But, SHARP, EO, Suicide Prevention, bringing females into combat arms these are the new Shiny Balls for the ARMY. Until they loose their glimmer, our soldiers will be victims. This will have to create a new learning cycle for young NCOs and soldiers. These soldiers that are not getting this training by their NCOs are going to become the NCOs that are supposed to train the soldiers. We will begin to suffer when all that we are focused on is SHARP and EO, when the enemy is trying to kill us.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 9:10 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:10:29 -0400

I'm going on a limb here- but much like the safety brief, I feel it's a check the block. I shouldnt have to tell leaders and subordinates alike (adults who graduated from high school, can buy homes and cars, and have babies) that drinking and driving is dangerous. We need to change the caliber of person as a whole that we are raising as a society. Now, there is an issue so I support countering the trend fully, but if you don't have any form of internal discipline or psychological resiliency- we need to weed those folks out from the recruiting pipeline. Parents should be teaching their children to have that foundation, not a Sergeant.

Response by MAJ Thomas Person made May 24 at 2016 9:13 AM

MAJ Thomas Person — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:13:07 -0400

As I mentioned earlier in another post Read "This Kind of War by COL T.R. Feheranbah USA RET. It will tell you why and it was written in the early 60's. I bet you have noticed a flurry of MSM for "suggestions" and ASM's to officers. ASM originally were for junior enlisted who excelled

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 9:16 AM

COL Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:16:59 -0400

Only if a leader at the Battalion level can't prioritize and get creative with the training calendar. There are a ton of ways to get this training done that does not detract from training for war. It is a requirement, but it can be accomplished in a way that meets the intent and then frees up time to do what we are supposed to be doing. If you are seeing it detract from training, the person to blame is not "the Army," but unit leadership.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made May 24 at 2016 9:21 AM

SSG Warren Swan — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:21:24 -0400

It's all shits n giggles until that ONE Soldier is harassed and the instigator gets off using the "I didn't know" BS. We need to train for war, but at the same time, no one in the Army will spend ALL of their time deployed. So in the rear, you do your jobs and be killed by powerpoint. I'd much rather be killed that way knowing info that could help a Soldier. Battle Tasks aren't going anywhere. Sexual harassment and rape unfortunately isn't either.

Response by MSgt Michael Smith made May 24 at 2016 9:49 AM

MSgt Michael Smith — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:49:05 -0400

I don't think so. The military has a problem with suicide right now. Increasing numbers every year point to a serious trend, and the services should do everything they can to prevent these things from happening. 'Social Experiment' is a very condescending term for the Army ending what was institutionalized shaming and discrimination of minorities. It isn't a social experiment to implement policies that include all of society. Honestly, I hate that term, because it assumes that the services are trying something different rather than doing the right thing.

Response by LTC Angie Habina made May 24 at 2016 9:50 AM

LTC Angie Habina — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:50:09 -0400

Absolutely! These are tools and used as a crutch. Way too much commanding by power point, online training, and email in the Army today.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 9:54 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 09:54:05 -0400

As a SHARP rep. myself we wouldn't be doing so much training if Soldiers would completely stop doing the horrific things they continue to do. The difference between the old Army with out SHARP is that people are not afraid to report issue of harassment or assault as before it was looked down upon.

I agree online training is a check the block type training, as most can be skipped right through.

But we can never due too much suicide prevention training as 1 to many veterans commit suicide everyday.

Response by SFC David Szucs made May 24 at 2016 10:23 AM

SFC David Szucs — Tue, 24 May 2016 10:23:28 -0400

pretty much since 1786. the statement "no combat ready unit ever passed inspection no inspection ready unit ever passed combat" probably started in the Roman Regulars

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 10:51 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 10:51:39 -0400

Yes it's a shit show

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 11:28 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 11:28:41 -0400

http://www.duffelblog.com/2016/04/soldier-learns-innovative-harassment-techniques-during-sharp-training/

Soldier learns innovative harassment techniques at SHARP training

FORT BENNING, Ga. — One soldier is making good use of his seventh Sexual Harassment/Assault Response and Prevention (SHARP) representative class in as many weeks, sources report, by documenting innovative harassment methodologies to implement after returning to his unit. Sgt. John Thompson, a self-described “harassment virtuoso” assigned to 3rd Brigade, 3rd Infantry Division, logged nearly […]

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 11:28 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 11:28:52 -0400

http://www.duffelblog.com/2016/05/army-forces-reporters-sharp-training-constantly-mentioning-new-secretarys-sexual-orientation/

Army forces reporters into SHARP training for constantly mentioning new Secretary's sexual...

THE PENTAGON— Army Chief of Staff Mark Milley is mandating SHARP training for the Pentagon Press Corps after their heavy coverage of newly-confirmed Army Secretary Eric Fanning’s sexual orientation this week. “Is it not 2016, or did I pound too much vodka with the Russkies last night?” Milley asked a group of reporters. “Grow the […]

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 11:43 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 11:43:29 -0400

YES , im quite frankly sick and tired of hearing it.

Response by SP5 Rod Cross made May 24 at 2016 1:32 PM

SP5 Rod Cross — Tue, 24 May 2016 13:32:32 -0400

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Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 5:04 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 17:04:20 -0400

I think asking why the Army has become so focused on it and what amount of pressure come from outside communities.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 24 at 2016 8:13 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 24 May 2016 20:13:55 -0400

Of course no one that has ever went through an inspection for combat has passed all because we had to do non soldier like training just to check it off.

Response by COL Charles Williams made May 25 at 2016 12:32 AM

COL Charles Williams — Wed, 25 May 2016 00:32:58 -0400

Perhaps...

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2016 9:45 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 May 2016 09:45:54 -0400

Notice the lack of response form higher leadership. Remember SHARP has a place on ALL NCOERs and OERs that must be mentioned. Don't expect too many real responses.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2016 1:54 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 May 2016 13:54:20 -0400

Yes, yes we have. Between the annual SHARP, EO, 350-1, Anti-Terrorism, NCODP (now called LDP), Training meetings, Maintenance meetings, and any number of events that pop up every day, when do we find the time to shoot, move and communicate? Oh yeah, forgot to add SSDs into the above mix, or you will not be eligible for promotion.
I am not in any way diminishing the importance of the above training, but when new Soldiers spend more time in briefings than they do learning their MOS skill level there is a problem.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2016 2:05 PM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 May 2016 14:05:48 -0400

Yes. The problem is, in my opinion, how poorly thought out the training and execution is.

For example, I would argue that telling a potential rapist that rape is wrong will not change their behavior. Every adult knows that rape is wrong, short of perhaps the mentally unstable. Yet we sit through hours of training on how it's wrong to harass and rape people. Its a waste of time. Why not instead focus on prevention and reporting, where some actual ground can be made? Once more, our overzealousness with SHARP has created new problems. We take any allegation so seriously that it follows Soldiers even if they're exonerated.

Female Soldiers, who are typically the face put on SHARP are suffering as well. At a course I attended recently we had one female out of 47 total. The course had a strong academic requirement, which meant most people formed study groups. Most of the males actively avoided our female, making it difficult for her to find a study partner. I'll admit I was leary of talking to her as well. She expressed a lot of frustration over this. During a conversation she said: "It sucks. All the males are afraid to even talk to me. They're worried I'm that one female who's going to take something the wrong way." On another occasion I remember a female telling her fellow Soldiers "Please just be yourselves around me." Every time she walked into the room it went completely quiet.

The same goes for resiliency training. Sitting me in front of PowerPoint slides and telling me to "hunt the good stuff" is not going to build my resiliency. Tough realistic training does that.

Frankly, we're focused on these subjects because our civilian leadership is. Our priorities won't change until theirs do.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 25 at 2016 9:33 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 May 2016 21:33:38 -0400

Yes.

Too much time spent on these activities when we could be training to shoot, move, communicate, see, or else do equipment maintenance.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2016 8:26 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 May 2016 08:26:51 -0400

I was in China a week ago and I happened to catch a news broadcast on state TV showing their army training. BLUF: they are only focused on killing and breaking things.

Response by LTC Tom Barbeau made May 26 at 2016 11:50 AM

LTC Tom Barbeau — Thu, 26 May 2016 11:50:56 -0400

Well, in 2009, I told my soldiers, "Welcome to 1993". You can expect dollars for meaningful training to dry up, and you can expect horseshit requirements to ramp up exponentially. I expect they will be throwing people out for ridiculous reasons soon. I retired in July of 2013, and by then we were already nose deep in it. I expect the crap is way over everybody's head now.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 26 at 2016 3:33 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 26 May 2016 15:33:30 -0400

I know of at least 4 people from my old unit that commited suicide. So this topic kind of struck a little close to home. It's not that they were soft they just had nobody to turn to. Focusing on it is important but it is defiantly too much sometimes. It is more important to teach younger soldiers (officers included) that we are a family and they don't go through anything alone. It's a necessary evil that should be shrunk down and used in talking points to remind soldiers that we are their new family.

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2016 12:01 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 May 2016 00:01:31 -0400

Has anyone ever watched Russia train? They are hell bent on winning at all costs. They are a tough culture. As such, they're going to simply "out tough" us. While nobody is going to argue that suicide and sexual assault/harassment are awful, our focus on them are making us soft.. We've eliminated exercise because people thought it was hazing. The military needs to toughen back up if we ever plan to win anything ever again. Technology is only going to get us so far. It's time to put the impetus back on being tough and matching our adversary's tenacity.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2016 12:53 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 May 2016 00:53:53 -0400

The army is soft, plain and simple! We have like 25% of the force who is non deployable, then on top off that you have a shit load of fat body's in clear violation of AR 670-9! And it's not the bottom that is the cause or the level of soldier wwe get because if NCO's where allowed to train and instill discipline that is needed then we wouldn't have a issue with them. It's the top who pushes this shit on us to cover there ass. When in actuality we are savages trained in the art of war, to close with and destroy the enemy plain and simple but I think they forgot that a while back when they decided to turn the army in to a social experiment. Yes traing to bring awareness and information regarding these issues is great and important but when they constantly push it down are throats it's counter productive. And takes away from training time and readiness.

Response by SGT Charlie Steward made May 27 at 2016 3:39 PM

SGT Charlie Steward — Fri, 27 May 2016 15:39:21 -0400

Sadly, that's what happens when leadership start letting society dictate what the military should be.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 29 at 2018 11:46 AM

2LT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 29 Jun 2018 11:46:02 -0400

Knee jerk reaction = excess