Has the reputation of the National Guard improved in recent years?

2019-11-20T14:32:08-05:00

I read that NG soldier recently won both the Best Ranger and International Sniper competitions, beating out their counterparts from the Regular Army and SOF. I also ready that statistically NG soldiers fair better in SFAS and Q course compared to Regular Army. Any insight on that?

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2019 3:29 PM

2019-11-20T15:29:33-05:00

Bobby Maddox it all depends on where you are, and what branch (Army or Air). Our SQN has a high reputation in the Air Intel community - especially with the active branch at Hickam.

Response by CPT Nicholas D. made Nov 20 at 2019 4:02 PM

2019-11-20T16:02:34-05:00

I have to imagine the reputation has improved over the “Nasty Girl” slurs of yesteryears. The National Guard has moved heavily into the operational force pool rather than being a “strategic reserve.” There might still be some “weekend warrior” zings in the barracks of Basic Training, but the Army Leadership (GEN Milley) has repeatedly said that the future of the Army does not exist without the future of the Guard. So we have that going for us.

Regarding some occupations, the ARNG does shine a little brighter. It is not uncommon for an ARNG Aviation line company to have one or two 4,000 - 5,000 hour pilots and a higher percentage over 2,000 hours. There isn’t a lot of places for National Guard Aviators to move inside their states, so they end up in operational assignments for much more of their career than their average active component comrades.

SOF is another arena where the ARNG typically does very well. Most ARNG SF soldiers have civilian skill sets that they bring into the unconventional fight. This makes for a much more well rounded warrior. I would say the Active Component has the reps to excel in the soldier skills, but when requirements remain pretty comparable for proficiency, your Guard guys have to work a lot harder at being “good.” The SFAS selection rate for ARNG is very good for a number of reasons. The primary motivation starts with limited school seats and limited funding. The ARNG can not afford to waste a lot of money on training failures. Most states with SF units typically hold competitive screening and selection programs before a Soldier is even allowed to attend SFAS.

Ironically, the same Soldiers who perpetuate the most amount of shade towards the Guard are usually exploring their local reserve component options after their first enlistment is over. But it doesn't take a lengthy google search to see we have our "gems" too. Every component has APFT failures and those that struggle with HT/WT. For all of the amazing rockstars we have in the Guard, you can find just as many wrestling to meet the basic army standards. No component has a monopoly on talent.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 20 at 2019 4:39 PM

2019-11-20T16:39:37-05:00

I’m in the signal community and our IT nerds tend to blow the doors off their active duty counterparts due to most of them performing higher level functions in the civilian world.

I’ve seen dirtbag AD units and dirtbag NG units. It ultimately comes down to command emphasis and leader engagement. One thing I think the NG wins hands down is their ability to perceive the world outside of their foxhole.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Nov 20 at 2019 9:06 PM

2019-11-20T21:06:18-05:00

The National Guard does not out perform RA Soldiers in the Q-Course. I was an instructor from 2010-2013 and they barely made it trough. Their ranks are filled by guys that leave active duty.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Nov 20 at 2019 9:12 PM

2019-11-20T21:12:40-05:00

I’d be willing to bet those NG Soldiers that won, are all full timers. Not to take anything away from them, but it takes more than a weekend a month to win these glories.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 21 at 2019 3:22 AM

2019-11-21T03:22:12-05:00

From what I've seen working in the Guard and with Guard Soldiers, they bring the best and the worst to the fight. The active duty Army has this very narrow band of people they accept and keep. They're mostly people who joined at 18, have no life experience, and are very fit (compared to civilian population).Basically, meat heads with who are told they are the best until they're old enough to realize they aren't.
The National Guard employs almost anyone. Prior service who failed or were kicked out, 17 year old kids in Junior High, people with degrees, people with trades, cops and first responders, construction personnel, IT geeks. They also hire the licensed trades - lawyers, doctors, PAs, nurses, PTs, Dentists, etc. But they also employ the certified trades - electricians, linemen, plumbers, carpenters, pipe fitters, steel makers, etc.
Yeah, they have that 350 pound 11B E4 running around wearing his combat shirt as tight as Kim Kardashians leggings. But they also have that also have that marksmanship instructor who can shoot the ass off a fly. They have that Lineman that knows how to run power to your building and downshift it from 230 volts in Iraq to 120 volts to match your American made electronics. They have that 50 year old Infantryman who can break down Small Unit Tactics to his Soldiers in the jungle like he learned in Panama.
In my opinion, it's easy to make fun of the Guard because they accept the worst. But, in my experience they were the most adaptable units I ever worked with in combat.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Nov 21 at 2019 12:05 PM

2019-11-21T12:05:19-05:00

The disrespect for the Army National Guard started during Vietnam when LBJ decided not to declare a National Emergency and active the Guard. That was the first time in History that the US had went to War without it's militias/National Guard. Although there was some participation in the war by the Army Guard, the Active Service (Draft Army) generally saw enlisting in the Guard as dodging service in Vietnam. That wasn't entirely without justification. After the move to the Volunteer Army, on paper there was generally a Guard Round Out Brigade assigned to every Combat Division that trained with these units. When the first Gulf War came around, the Generals in charge were all Vietnam era soldiers and they basically reneged on that agreement. Their excuse was the performance of one of the Round Outs at NTC, but my experience supporting the OPFOR there says everyone got their asses kicked at NTC. They had to take the Combat Support section, a lot of those just didn't exist in the Regular Army anymore.
I was Co of an Army Guard Divisional Engineer Company during Desert Storm, which means that we provided mobility, counter mobility, bridging and route recon for Mechanized Divisions. They gave us a Warning Order and we did POM, and set there through the whole thing. Instead, they used Corp level engineer units out of Europe that had no Divisional experience and weren't trained on the right equipment, verse a unit that was trained to do it and had just come off an NTC support mission. WTF?
Yes, I frustrated by that move. I did a keep up tour in Europe after the War with one of the Corp units that had gotten moved to a Division unit when the Army added a brigade to each Division instead of a battalion. I walked into the Assistant Brigade Engineers job, the Brigade Engineer is officially the Battalion Commander, who has a bunch of other responsibilities, with more maneuver experience and divisional experience than anyone on the staff, including the BN CO and S3. My home equipment operators and my maintenance section would have run circles around theirs and I didn't see anything in the squads that I thought my platoons couldn't have handled.
I think that we have done a much better job at integrating the Reserves and National Guard in the Army since Desert Storm than we did before. A lot of the Vietnam Era prejudice about the Guard aren't around today and Guard has once again become a valued asset.
BTW, the Air Force has done a much better job of integrating their Reserves and Guard units. Even when I was in, if you were flying on an Air Force Transport, there was a better than even chance that the pilot wasn't a full timer,

Response by CSM Richard StCyr made Nov 21 at 2019 3:05 PM

2019-11-21T15:05:36-05:00

I think it depends entirely on the unit. We had a National Guard unit as a round out line company in OIF 1 and they did a great job.