How do you feel discipline has changed since the removal of drill sergeants from AITs?

2015-04-13T09:34:19-04:00

I have talked to Soldiers of various ranks and overall there is a feeling the discipline is falling. Can we begin to reverse this trend by reinstating Drill Sergeants in AITs? Do you think Soldiers are developing the needed discipline quick enough at their initial duty stations?

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 12 at 2015 9:39 PM

2015-09-12T21:39:17-04:00

We need better train NCOs in AIT to lead those troops. AIT Platoon Sergeants are there now and until last September they only went through a two course to do the same job a Drill Segeant that went through a nine week course did. It also depends on the Command team in the AIT that approves all the privileges Soldiers receive. When Drill Sergeants was there they typically had 12 per company now on average its 7 AIT Platoon Sergeants. They go through a six week course now and receive better training but does not stop on AIT. If we need to reverse course and bring back Drill Segeants then how do we fix the young E-4 in the unit that's been there for two years that can't still pass an APFT or the NCO that gets a DUI. Should we bring Drill Sergeants to the operation Army to fix every discipline issue. I say no, we need to do a better job across the board to enforce standards and discipline across the Army. Sooner or later the hat and badge will come off what happens then discipline disappears. We need competent NCOs in AIT and FORSCOM to maintain discipline.

Response by CPT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 13 at 2015 8:56 AM

2015-09-13T08:56:50-04:00

Sir, I can tell you at 13F AIT in 2012 the discipline was not lacking. Most feared the instructors more than the drills. That may just be the case with 13F's though.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Sep 13 at 2015 2:06 PM

2015-09-13T14:06:18-04:00

Well, Drills were removed in 2007. I've been hearing that new Soldiers lacked discipline since the 90's and I'm still hearing it now. Apparently it didn't make much of a difference...

Response by SSgt Alex Robinson made Sep 14 at 2015 9:22 PM

2015-09-14T21:22:47-04:00

Discipline has gotten weaker since today's young people are soft. We have allowed it. we give trophies for participation. We don't make them work and we don't let them fail.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 14 at 2015 10:09 PM

2015-09-14T22:09:20-04:00

I started in the Marine Corps so we had none after boot camp because we had enough discipline (so they said) we didn't need them.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 15 at 2015 7:12 AM

2015-09-15T07:12:50-04:00

Will putting back Drills in AIT change anything? Why did they go away in the first place? Manning issues or ideology on how to treat AIT vs. BCT recruits? (Hard vs. Soft)?

If we train NCOs, put a hat on their head and then hamstring them from being able to instill discipline, what have we gained?

Response by SSG John Erny made Sep 15 at 2015 3:43 PM

2015-09-15T15:43:14-04:00

OK Boys and Girls Welcome to the Special Army where everyone is a winner!!! Yay!! OK, one person got their E-2 rank now lets all pin them on at the same time, everyone is a winner. PV2 Snuffy is home sick let's all make him feel special. OK here is an AAM to pin on all your uniforms so they all look the same.
>>>>Me....tick, tick, tick, tick, tick..BOOM!!!

Drop and do push ups until you puke and I get tired or you puking. Roll over and do the dying cockroach until your hands and arms fall of then pick them up with your teeth. Prove to me that you have what it takes to earn the right to wear the uniform, if you can not I will show you the door. Now do the duck walk around the PT field followed by the crab walk and then alligator walk.

Response by SGT Jerrold Pesz made Sep 15 at 2015 3:44 PM

2015-09-15T15:44:59-04:00

I know that things change with time but I went to infantry AIT at Ft. Jackson in 1966 and we did not have drill sergeants and I noticed no lack of discipline. Our platoon sergeants seemed to do just fine.

Response by SSG Jamil Spruill made Sep 15 at 2015 5:09 PM

2015-09-15T17:09:00-04:00

I've noticed a lot of the new soldiers are very mouthy and seem to have a mentality that an NCO has no power to do anything to them dicipline wise. Now some soldiers are still very professional because of the great leaders they had to influence them.

Response by SSG Jamil Spruill made Sep 15 at 2015 5:15 PM

2015-09-15T17:15:12-04:00

Drills do enforce the dicipline but we are all NCOs and that's all of our jobs as well. I think new AIT graduates should not be allowed to go to relaxed units because the dicipline is enforced but on a more relaxed level. They need to be assigned to standard units to gain maturity and dicipline

Response by SFC Craig Dalen made Sep 16 at 2015 10:46 AM

2015-09-16T10:46:00-04:00

Speaking from attending OSUT at Ft. Sill, I feel that we were groomed to fit the demanding role as an artilleryman. Now that Soldiers attend BCT anywhere has changed the level of readiness in today's younger artilleryman. AIT Platoon Sergeants do go to training but are not viewed as a Drill Sergeant in the eyes of Soldiers which can have a negative outcome.

Response by SrA Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2015 10:33 PM

2015-09-18T22:33:54-04:00

I don't think it's necessary. I was in AIT for about 4.5 months, in the beginning I actually WISHED we had DS's there but once I loosened up a bit I came to love the atmosphere & PLT SGTs. We all respected our NCO's but I will say that the discipline level dropped going from BCT to AIT. That's also on the individual soldiers to be able to uphold their own level of professionalism & discipline.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 18 at 2015 10:52 PM

2015-09-18T22:52:44-04:00

This is something that I find very intriguing, but I've come to the conclusion that sometimes we confuse "lack of discipline" as "not following my orders when I say it."

I mean, if you really think about it, there has been a huge push for critical thinking within primary and secondary education these days. That being said, should we be surprised that we now have soldiers that won't just do things when they're told? They want to know the reasoning, and to be honest, a lot of NCOs don't know or don't care.

So, I'm not sure whether Soldiers are lacking discipline, or that, they're just a smarter bunch who wants to know why we're doing things the way we are.

Response by PFC Alexander Oliveira made Jan 15 at 2016 1:35 PM

2016-01-15T13:35:23-05:00

To me, AIT was a much better place than basic because of a lack of drill sergeants. I kept my discipline, was a good private, kept everything I was taught and drilled in my head. but god am I glad AIT was nothing like basic. I was not in while DS' were at AIT stations but I feel my NCOs at AIT were fully capable of what they were assigned to do. from a recruits POV. the ones with the discipline problems in AIT were the same ones in basic. I don't think it has anything to do with the specific NCOs or DS'. but its on a personal level with the soldiers going thru their IET. we had a bunch of shit happen in both areas of training and both places had the same fuck ups who all ended up getting chaptered. I still respected my DS' and PSGs respectively.

Response by SP5 Roberta Sanchez made Mar 31 at 2016 11:31 AM

2016-03-31T11:31:20-04:00

I think it depends on the AIT. I went to the SAIC in Fort Huachuca and there was not a drill sergeant in sight.

Response by SPC Sheila Lewis made Jun 14 at 2016 2:17 PM

2016-06-14T14:17:50-04:00

Station DI's in AIT.

Response by PO1 Jason Looney made Feb 3 at 2017 10:12 AM

2017-02-03T10:12:48-05:00

I am retired and I was talking to a bar back at a bar he was in the reserves and he said he would not go active because the military has turned into a emotional and feeling military they worry about people's feelings and are very pc what has this world come to

Response by PFC Ronald Vickery made Feb 3 at 2017 6:36 PM

2017-02-03T18:36:47-05:00

Yes restate them, they help to make a boy into a man!

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 29 at 2017 6:58 AM

2017-04-29T06:58:08-04:00

The discipline did not change because they removed Drill's; the discipline changed because of TR 350-6