How do you handle a disrespectful junior soldier that doesn't belong to you?

2018-03-16T17:30:29-04:00

I recently encountered a junior soldier who wore a patch I didn't recognize who was walking around outside in a VERY ate-up uniform. I showed him my ID card and identified myself and explained to him where he was wrong and asked him to correct the deficiencies. At which point, the soldier told me to go f*** myself and then tried to fight me. Now, the grunt in me got really excited and couldn't wait to wall-to-wall this young soldier, but the professional in me simply wouldn't allow it. So I asked what unit the soldier belonged to, to which he responded "To your f***ing mama, b****." Now RP Leaders, how would you suggest I go about rectifying this situation, or should I simply leave it be and let the Karma catch up with him?

**ADMIN NOTE** I still have not been able to find the patch and it's corresponding unit, so I have no way of finding this soldier's Command.

Response by SPC Jovani Daviu made Mar 16 at 2018 5:35 PM

2018-03-16T17:35:23-04:00

Probably stolen valor. It'll catch up to him.

Response by SFC Johnathan Severs made Mar 16 at 2018 5:36 PM

2018-03-16T17:36:58-04:00

For starters, wall to wall is out of the question - has been even before my time. Physical contact or even raising your voice is nothing more than a sign of weakness.

Did you not photo the Soldier or patch? With all the cross training taking place these days on each base - it may be a lost cause. As a SPC especially if you’re one who is in a TL role, it’s tough to get that respect but also don’t go out and seek it.

I can clearly see this even if it was reported being swept aside because of the rank alone and the validation to it.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Mar 16 at 2018 5:37 PM

2018-03-16T17:37:07-04:00

I'd let Karma take care of him, eventually he's going to pop off to an officer that's in civvies, and that will be all she wrote for the punk.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 5:40 PM

2018-03-16T17:40:51-04:00

Sometimes you just have to choose your battles and let the dirtbag's drown in their own karma.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 16 at 2018 5:51 PM

2018-03-16T17:51:15-04:00

How much verbal judo did you use?

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 5:59 PM

2018-03-16T17:59:09-04:00

If this encounter was off base, I agree with SPC Jovani Daviu, that this scumbag was not in the military, especially with a patch that you do not recognize.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 6:06 PM

2018-03-16T18:06:21-04:00

I wouldn't sweat it. Dickheads tend to dickhead a lot, and eventually it catches them on the chin.

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 6:12 PM

2018-03-16T18:12:46-04:00

Next time take a picture if you can and then you can find his command and report the incident. But more than likely the command, if you find them, won’t do $hit. He learned to have that attitude from somewhere and I bet it wasn’t from his drill sergeant. I ran into a simulator situation when I PCSed from Ft Bragg to Ft Sam Houston. A JR Soldier was about to park illegally in a parking area. I told him I was about to pull out and he could take my legal spot. He said ok and got in his car. I pulled away, went around the corner and circled back. He was still negotiating the illegal spot so I had him get out of his car and give me his supervisor’s name and location. I made sure he stood at parade rest while I told him what a dirtbag he was and that he needed to follow the orders of NCOs. He gave me some excuse that the MPs are ok with parking next to the no parking sign. I first stopped by the MP and they confirmed that they are perfectly ok with not doing their job. I let them have it too. Fat a$$ SSG! Then I went to his SFC PS where he went on to tell me that he was at Ft Bragg and that things don’t run the same at Ft Sam. Didn’t care that his Soldier failed to oney a lawful order from an NCO. So after a lot of verbal judo where I let him know that the reason Ft Sam is not like Bragg is because of the low quality of NCOs at Ft Sam. So, even if you do the right thing you will find other “leaders” that just don’t have the same level of respect for their responsibilities as an NCO. So you keep being you and police up your area and if all other NCOs do the same we can get these dirtbags trained the right way. Good luck.

Response by SPC David Willis made Mar 16 at 2018 6:42 PM

2018-03-16T18:42:17-04:00

I wouldn't worry about it. If he's a soldier he's a piece of shit and it'll catch up to him, if he's not it'll still catch up to him. Either way it's not worth risking what you've worked yo obtain.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 6:44 PM

2018-03-16T18:44:30-04:00

Do what you can, when you can. Always remain respectful. You can be respectful and still be firm.

Response by SGT Christopher Hayden made Mar 16 at 2018 6:55 PM

2018-03-16T18:55:32-04:00

As others have said, I question whether he was even actually a Soldier or not. But just out of curiosity, can you describe the patch? I've always enjoyed trying to hunt down things like patches or unit crests.

Response by MSgt Walter Clack made Mar 16 at 2018 7:11 PM

2018-03-16T19:11:14-04:00

Not sure, but it sounds like you ran across, and I am not sure what the Army terminology is, someone in casualty company who is just waiting for their OTH paperwork.

Response by PO2 Peter Klein made Mar 16 at 2018 7:34 PM

2018-03-16T19:34:50-04:00

I go along with many others here in thinking this dufus is not actually in the military. If he were junior to you and active duty, I doubt he would treated you as he did. If he were AWOL or a deserter, I doubt he would not be in uniform. Therefore Stolen Valor.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 7:41 PM

2018-03-16T19:41:40-04:00

I agree with all of the above. Leaders need to make corrections. Especially NCOs. I'm not saying officers do not, but NCOs have always been the standard bearers and enforcers. As for the rest, never lower yourself to their level. I've made plenty of corrections over the past 19 years, and I've let some be as well. I've never been upset i made a correction. I've been frustrated auth myself when i didn't. But I've loathed myself when i lost my cool and dropped to their level of disrespect. SFC Johnathan Severs, i disagree with your comment about raising your voice though, there are certainly cases where yelling is required, but i agree that it is the exception, not the rule. Either way SPC Private RallyPoint Member, you did the right thing. Keep up the great work.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 16 at 2018 8:16 PM

2018-03-16T20:16:44-04:00

You might have won the battle, but lost the war by throwing down on him. You would have been good to defend yourself if he made the first move though. No matter what his status is, any fight can lead to civil charges with all the UCMJ issues for you and PR problem for your Service. It can lead to death also, especially these days. Unless you could have gotten a picture, you were wise to walk away. He'll eventually hang himself with enough rope.

Edit: If this was aboard a base, that changes things. If you wanted to hold him accountable, the MP's would be the safest course. Call them while keeping him in view, and let the process run its course. If aboard base, he was likely on his way out with bad paper and more charges wouldn't matter to him. Definitely a judgement call on your part as to best COA.

Response by PO1 Mary Vermont made Mar 16 at 2018 9:51 PM

2018-03-16T21:51:27-04:00

I feel very sad that leaders in the militry have to deal with total dirt bags

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 17 at 2018 9:12 AM

2018-03-17T09:12:46-04:00

So, going into the situation with a because I told you to attitude will Garner one of two reactions. You got the unsavory of the two. Going into the situation with a let me help you attitude will more than likely convince the Soldier to make corrections. The definition of leadership is the ability to motivate individuals to do things that you need them to do. Use that in your future interactions with Soldiers you don't know, and you'll probably have a better experience. But, then again, you might have a similar situation.

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Mar 17 at 2018 9:43 AM

2018-03-17T09:43:02-04:00

This falls right in line with a thread that was popular some time ago about how and when to make spot corrections, esp to seniors, and how to deal with servicemembers who were grossly out of uniform in a public place, such as an airport where you don't have much leverage over them. That was an all-time popular thread. Now the theme seems to be more of disrespectful junior troopers fat-mouthing or otherwise showing disrespect to NCOs. No easy answers..

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 17 at 2018 10:35 AM

2018-03-17T10:35:56-04:00

Are you at jackson working with the AOC

Response by Lt Col Jim Coe made Mar 17 at 2018 11:44 AM

2018-03-17T11:44:04-04:00

Hummm. Interesting story. Those who said, take his picture have a great idea. You can look up the patch on line or in AKO maybe. If found, you should talk to the unit First Sergeant; otherwise, you might talk to your own First Sergeant. If this guy looked so out of it that he might have been a danger to himself or others, you should have called the MPs. Right now he just sounds like somebody's pain in the ass private.

Response by Maj John Bell made Mar 17 at 2018 1:00 PM

2018-03-17T13:00:16-04:00

I do not know the ramifications of being a Specialist vs. a Corporal. So before I answer your question, someone please clear this up for me. I have been told that an E-4 Specialist is not an NCO for UCMJ Article 92 purposes, even more so if the Specialist is not in the offender's chain of Command. Is that so?

In the Marine Corps, an E-4 is a Corporal regardless of MOS and therefore may issue legal orders under their own authority. Any subordinate Marine has an obligation to comply, unless it interferes with orders which supersede.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Mar 17 at 2018 3:50 PM

2018-03-17T15:50:54-04:00

That is interesting, certainly...obviously, I was going to suggest a picture, though I can see that was already mentioned here...I was just curious, though...was it on your installation? Off installation? Also, I realize this might be a stretch, however, aside from eventual karma catchup, which, given your description, clearly seems likely at some point in the near future, did you speak with any of the senior NCOs in your unit or at your installation generally, on the off chance they might perhaps know of whomever it was, assuming he was from your installation? I only ask that, as, given his obvious disposition, he clearly might've been a problem to others there in the past as well, you know? I only ask that if you'd actually seen him on your installation, of course, if you'd seen him off installation, then, certainly, that becomes a far vaguer problem, certainly. Then again, another thought occurs to me that he might've been a stolen valor; in watching numerous YouTube videos on that whole thing, I've frequently seen such reactions by those confronted, both off installtion, as well as having hear do accounts on installation...just a thought, of course...however, I'd be most interested in any possible elaboration, of course, whenever time might permit, no rush, of course, many thanks...

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Mar 17 at 2018 4:10 PM

2018-03-17T16:10:35-04:00

How is he Yours? All Specialist Grades fall below Corporal. Specialist is a reflection of skill in an MOS, not any kind of Command authority. You might examine where you are coming from

Response by PV2 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 17 at 2018 4:30 PM

2018-03-17T16:30:42-04:00

Collect the unit patch then find the unit and turn it into their chain of command with his rank and name?

Response by SSG Keith Amacher made Mar 17 at 2018 4:48 PM

2018-03-17T16:48:44-04:00

Get the Military Police involved and you have the right to detain him and his next destination will be Leavenworth and I hope he likes taking it on the backside. I have escorted prisoners to their way to Leavenworth. And I went through MP school in addition to Intel and SF...

Response by Sgt Jonathan Wiltsie made Mar 17 at 2018 6:55 PM

2018-03-17T18:55:32-04:00

I would simply look up the badge online and see what unit he belonged to. At which point remember his name on his name tag. Report him to his chain of command. At that point it’s up to them to take action, and if they don’t, well you’ve did everything you can do at this point. Miss the old days of taking him out back and dropping blouse and taking corrective action.

Response by PFC Tuan Trang made Mar 17 at 2018 7:44 PM

2018-03-17T19:44:28-04:00

Karma come quicker then we know it, but if me i take a picture of his name and unit, and reported to his company. Then just walk away.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Mar 17 at 2018 10:26 PM

2018-03-17T22:26:01-04:00

There is something called General Military Authority which empowers you to make on the spot corrections related to conduct, uniforms and safety. If a soldier won't cooperate with you, get his name and try to track down his First Sergeant.

Response by Cpl John Barker made Mar 17 at 2018 10:44 PM

2018-03-17T22:44:10-04:00

I'd say tree line that disrespectful boot, but all of my squad leaders earned their bones on the hard streets of Fallujah and I hear the military has changed in the 7 years since I've been out so maybe just say some mean things to him

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 17 at 2018 10:55 PM

2018-03-17T22:55:00-04:00

Army strong... sorry had too, this is a jacked up situation. I would go straight to his command and bring up the issue. Completely uncalled for.

Response by SGT Aric Lier made Mar 17 at 2018 11:09 PM

2018-03-17T23:09:37-04:00

straighten yourself out first, no need to worry about or trying to correct others if you are a soup sammich

Response by MSG Charles Turner made Mar 19 at 2018 2:16 PM

2018-03-19T14:16:16-04:00

Spc Pietrantonio,

Well, needing a bit more information on location (0n base vs off base & where at then), the military gives us a few options. Contact authorities (MPs, Police, Security. etc), make quik but accurate notes of the individual, where he was, where he was going, time of day, actions, comments, and anything else that may assist in identifying the individual. Then report this to the appropriate folks. (Although in my day we did not have the availability of a phone camera. Today I think I would photograph him. Then as long as he was not committing a crime. go on you way and report him as soon as time permits.

I guess, this brings to mind the advice of Dont be Drawn in to others problems and Pick your battles. You attempted to correct the problem. He refused the correction, now the correct action is to report it.

~ole Sarge~

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 19 at 2018 2:18 PM

2018-03-19T14:18:16-04:00

I am curious what this patch looks like. Can you describe it? There is always the possibility that its a NG patch. I would definitely not have let that go and would have at-minimum snapped a pic of this idiot and worked it up the chain. And I hear ya about *physically* correcting him, but these days unless they throw a punch at you first, that can go bad for you in the long run.

Response by SFC Donald Souza made Mar 19 at 2018 7:44 PM

2018-03-19T19:44:07-04:00

Chain of command

Response by SPC TerryandShelia Alcon made Mar 20 at 2018 10:19 AM

2018-03-20T10:19:45-04:00

Tree line!!!

Response by Brandon Swanger made Mar 20 at 2018 2:08 PM

2018-03-20T14:08:34-04:00

Smack him

Response by PO3 Mark Chambers made Mar 21 at 2018 11:44 AM

2018-03-21T11:44:17-04:00

I agree with the previous comment a case of stolen valor!

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 21 at 2018 6:47 PM

2018-03-21T18:47:24-04:00

For those who have asked, this incident happened off post about a mile away from the gate at a gas station.

Response by SPC Thomas Smith made Mar 22 at 2018 6:11 PM

2018-03-22T18:11:50-04:00

Man I was going to give some hard core army answers from 1979 to 1988 back when I was in. Bit after reading some of the comments I am sadden at how the army has become. I know I am not that old but damn has it really changed that much. As far as the patch goes simple look up all the patches in the military and than see if any unit is station there with that patch. The MP can assist with that info

Response by Cpl Daniel Sixta made Mar 24 at 2018 3:47 AM

2018-03-24T03:47:37-04:00

Is this really a question? You out rank him/her and as such, they are required by the UCMJ to follow any lawful order given by you so long as it does not conflict with an order given to them by someone who outranks you.
1. Keep your tact and military bearing.
2. Order them to do whatever it is you require
3. Light them the F*%# up if they refuse without the proper justification or if they comply with “attitude”.
4. Order them to produce their military ID and then take a picture of it.
5. Contact their senior Staff NCO or NCO and inform them of what happened.
6. Laugh to yourself about how you lit up some boot E3 for being a little shitbag and how he/she is going to be lit up again by their command.

Maybe it’s a just a Marine Corps thing, but I can’t believe this procedure isn’t common knowledge for anyone in any branch of service.

Response by 1SG Dave Carello made Mar 24 at 2018 10:04 AM

2018-03-24T10:04:48-04:00

I have to applaud your "restraint" I don't know if I could have done it myself. Were you able to see his last name? It should be fairly easy to find the Soldiers billet using his last name and rank. His patch? I know there are several newly flagged Brigades and other commands. You can try the Army institute of Heraldry or other sources online. But, finally, you did well, In attempting to correct this guy. This is nothing new, Soldiers have corrected and been corrected since Washington's day. Keep it up.

Response by SMSgt Lawrence McCarter made Mar 26 at 2018 12:50 AM

2018-03-26T00:50:41-04:00

Although i wasn't involved in this encounter at Travis AFB, CA in 1974 I did witness it, an E4 that had just been discharged and was still on base walked out of a building and took off His uniform hat and shirt and threw them on the ground. Just at that moment a staff car with a plate beating a Colonels eagle and the words BASE COMMANDER on that same plate stopped, He had observed the conduct and less that proper comment from this individual who now had His 214 in hand for a few minutes. within approx one minute a patrol from the Security Police arrived and that individual was taken into custody. His uniform as it was and haircut didn't meet standards.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 26 at 2018 9:45 AM

2018-03-26T09:45:41-04:00

I think that the lad might have a close encounter with my size 9 1/2W boot.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 26 at 2018 9:58 AM

2018-03-26T09:58:04-04:00

Professionally and if they still give you attitude tell their NCO to handle it. If you can't figure it out and it's already happened, there's not much you can do unless you encounter the person again.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 26 at 2018 1:25 PM

2018-03-26T13:25:00-04:00

Unfortunately there isn't a whole lot you can do immediately; just follow up with the Soldier's CoC. If you get pushback from a FLL, just keep going up the chain. Eventually there will be so much heat, leaders will be forced to do their jobs. I wouldn't leave it to karma, this idiot will probably be a CSM some day...

Response by COL William Oseles made Mar 27 at 2018 2:53 PM

2018-03-27T14:53:07-04:00

Probably stolen valor. When that happens take his picture.
Also, if you got his name you may be able to run it with CID.

Response by SGT Jake Miller made Mar 27 at 2018 2:54 PM

2018-03-27T14:54:22-04:00

Most likely a national guard soldier

Response by COL William Oseles made Mar 27 at 2018 2:54 PM

2018-03-27T14:54:31-04:00

Maybe Stolen Valor, you did not mention if it was on or off post.
Take a Picture and Not his name. Both can be run through the system to identify him if he was in fact a soldier.

Response by SSG Mark Tsunokai made Mar 27 at 2018 3:11 PM

2018-03-27T15:11:03-04:00

I remember I was heading for the Dining Facility at Camp Virginia in Kuwait. An E5 and E3 walked past the clearing barrel with clearing their rifles. I called out, guys you need to clear your weapons. The E3 complied immediately, while the E5 asked me where my weapon was? Secured in the Arms Room. After trying to stare me down, he eventually complied. As we were in the serving line, I could hear him saying loudly, did you clear your weapons, you better clear your weapons before eating. He was saying this to his teammates, trying to get a rise out of me. I kept quiet, but it took a lot of effort. Yes, I was only an E6, but clearing barrels are there for a reason and the place wasn't closing. I let it go.

Response by SPC Andrew Eggers made Mar 27 at 2018 6:55 PM

2018-03-27T18:55:51-04:00

Call the military police and have him detained under an article 92 and have his unit pick him up from mp station.

Response by Cpl Phillip Brame made Mar 27 at 2018 7:44 PM

2018-03-27T19:44:14-04:00

What rank are you? If you are of the NCO rank the very 1st thing to do would be is to have that young soldier to go to the position of at ease. The soldiers response to that would have been all you needed to gauge that soldiers respect or lack of. He should have been counseled right there on the spot all corrections should be. If that soldier wanted to fight in the light let him cast the first punch at that point you are obligated to protect and defend yourself, that is of course if you are capable of that as an NCO. NCOs of good quality will know what to do with a situation like this, if you do not then perhaps you should not be an NCO.

Response by Capt Gregory Rush made Mar 27 at 2018 9:57 PM

2018-03-27T21:57:52-04:00

Might have been fake. Some stolen valor wannabe.

Response by PFC Elijah Rose made Mar 27 at 2018 10:38 PM

2018-03-27T22:38:29-04:00

I admitively done thing I do not regret doing for a variety of reasons, but in this case this guy seems like he's going full gangster. Trying to prove to himself and others that he's the big and bad. This is a deeper problem than be solved by article 15s and chapters, and he's undoubtedly a collosal bully to his peers. He probably needs to be separated from some enablers and of course everyone must realize that this behavior isn't tollerated.

Response by SGT Tom Recupero made Mar 28 at 2018 9:50 AM

2018-03-28T09:50:16-04:00

Kiwi ennima

Response by SGT Jim Knaeble made Mar 28 at 2018 11:16 PM

2018-03-28T23:16:05-04:00

Wow! This is the military that evolved from laziness. If you don't have absolute respect in day to day dealings, what do you get in combat. These used to be covered under UCMJ Article 15. Even while I was still in leadership was reluctant to give article 15s because they were being used to deny promotions. If we can't bounce them off a wall or take pay, grade, and time for minor offenses, we don't have any real authority. I promise if one of mine was disrespectful in this way, they would be doing extra duty until you felt they had adjusted their attitude.

Good luck!

Response by MSG Frank Kapaun made Apr 1 at 2018 11:49 AM

2018-04-01T11:49:26-04:00

You should have knocked the shit out of him.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 4 at 2018 8:10 AM

2018-04-04T08:10:48-04:00

Depending on the Unit and Post, (and it's getting worse) arrogance, disrespect, and Noncommissioned officers that will not or do not do their duty is running rampant in the New Action Army. Yes, raising your voice is a sign of weakness, Military police and the individuals chain of command simply do not care unless it will affect them directly somehow.
The Army needs to get out of the daycare business, the feel-good business, and get back to the basics of developing disciplined soldiers that can fight and endure. It seems that there is more compassion for offenders than action.
It's the Army and our Country that will reap that Karma.

Response by SFC Vernon McNabb made Apr 4 at 2018 9:14 AM

2018-04-04T09:14:00-04:00

I'm sorry, as soon as I read the part about "and then tried to fight me" I had to stop reading. As soon as the "Soldier" went down that road, you are well within your rights to lay into him. Respect is earned, not given. If he didn't respect your rank, he'll respect a right cross to the temple in short order. Self defense, all day long!

Response by SGT Rick Ramos made Apr 5 at 2018 12:58 AM

2018-04-05T00:58:10-04:00

I WOULD OF KINDLY ADJUSTED HIS UNIFORM. IT was done by my drills in Knox basically shake the crap out of him. When he swung, open the can ood self defense whoop ass lol

Response by SGT Alan Miller made Apr 5 at 2018 4:05 PM

2018-04-05T16:05:20-04:00

The General I drove busted a SP4 to private for failure to salute the marked sedan as we passed in front of him on post...

Response by MSG Frederick Otero made Apr 10 at 2018 9:54 AM

2018-04-10T09:54:08-04:00

Sounds like a set up to me.

Response by CW5 Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 12 at 2018 11:37 PM

2018-04-12T23:37:08-04:00

I am retired now, but for the future you might try calling the MPs, who could legally get that information from the soldier without you having to assault him. Stick around for the MPs to arrive, and if the individual attempted to leave, note their direction of travel and if leaving in a vehicle, get the license number. With a license number you can notify the Provost Marshall's office, explain what happened and ask if they could contact the individual's chain of command and pass on your phone number to contact you at their earliest convenience. I have done this in the past and the individual's SGM contacted me and reassured me that corrective action was being administered.

Response by SFC Scott Parkhurst made Apr 18 at 2018 11:31 AM

2018-04-18T11:31:48-04:00

Me personally, I would not pass the buck. Here is an example of what happen a couple of years ago that I felt needed to be taken care of: Yes, I saw a US Soldier on a porn site because it was brought to my attention by a guy I knew and no...I am not making this up. I was shocked because this Soldier was doing something very wrong and IN UNIFORM and with his Unit in the background. So I took pictures of him with his dang name tag and Unit Crest and everything....I went through the chain of Command and we ended up finding him in Alaska. His Commander was not to happy....My point is that we are all responsible for each other and nip it in the butt right then and there and do so as professional as possible. If you don't do it who will? We are a "Team" aren't we? That "Jr" Soldier and or whomever otherwise will feel like they can just get away with it and or feel that no one actually cares. If and when one of my Troops acted out I wanted someone to hold them responsible and I certainly didn't care who or what Unit/Platoon or whatever they came from....as long as it was addressed and that Soldier have better told them where they came from so I was contacted. Then I could be having that nice little chat with them later on....

Response by SFC Scott Parkhurst made Apr 18 at 2018 11:40 AM

2018-04-18T11:40:58-04:00

WOW, times have changed when a "real" Soldier would even go there...talk like that to anyone. We are so trained to maintain our professional status and manners I don't care who you are. I'm still like this and always will be. So I'm wondering if this "person" truly was a soldier ....ever a soldier or what?! Cause we just don't act like this even with PTS(D) and I have that....

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 26 at 2018 2:15 PM

2018-04-26T14:15:37-04:00

Well in all honesty, you really can't do much due to the fact that you cannot identify his unit, the most you can't really do is call around with the information that you have his E-grade and name and see if any units have anyone there that corresponds with what info you have and make a complaint but I would honestly let it go, if that's the way this soldier is the unit may not be any better.

Response by Sgt Frank Staples made Apr 29 at 2018 9:36 PM

2018-04-29T21:36:34-04:00

Is there a possibility that he wasn't even a service member?

Response by SFC Rollie Hubbard made May 5 at 2018 9:26 PM

2018-05-05T21:26:44-04:00

Depending on your rank has alot to do with how you should react. Me as a srnco try to find out his unit turn it over to the 1sg let him deal with. But if I was below the rank of sgt I would have beaten his ass.

Response by SCPO Melvin Burt made May 7 at 2018 9:37 AM

2018-05-07T09:37:57-04:00

Are you sure that you encountered a active-duty soldier? he could have been just someone who had been dishonorably discharged or simply bought the uniform any number of ways he could have been in a disheveled uniform.

Response by CPL Peter King made May 7 at 2018 10:22 AM

2018-05-07T10:22:58-04:00

Not a junior soldier, but the Colonels wife. She thought she wore her husbands rank.

She came out to drive a tank. We filled the turret race with water, oil, and other unpleasantries. As she was driving the commander yelled “emergency stop” the contents of the turret race went all over her, soaking her to the skin.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made May 9 at 2018 8:27 AM

2018-05-09T08:27:28-04:00

I think I would let the man atack me and defend myself, then, when he is subdued, I'd call the local PD and have him arrested for assault or at the very least public affray. Then his tune will change really quickly, stolen valor or not.

Response by SGT Michael Wells III made May 23 at 2018 9:28 PM

2018-05-23T21:28:50-04:00

This one is easy... Front-leaning rest mother fucker! Don't stop until it rains.

Response by Cpl Adam Strickler made May 26 at 2018 9:26 AM

2018-05-26T09:26:42-04:00

Honestly, it sounds like you encountered a dependent with a penchant for trolling.

Response by SFC Melvin Frazier made May 31 at 2018 11:06 AM

2018-05-31T11:06:04-04:00

I saw the U.S. Army begin it's decline of discipline beginning in the mid 80s through the early 90s. It was largely due to NCOs who had lost their moral compass and deviated from the traits of the professional NCO.

Response by SGT Willie Norwood made Jun 2 at 2018 10:26 PM

2018-06-02T22:26:11-04:00

It is extremely important as a leader to correct soldiers when they are wrong.

Response by SGT Willie Norwood made Jun 2 at 2018 10:39 PM

2018-06-02T22:39:57-04:00

I always feel that it is extremely important to correct soldiers when they are wrong. That is your job as a leader. However, through my experience as an MP and as an NCO, I found that I am able to get the respect that I deserve and earned by the way I approach soldiers. For example, the posting about the incident in the parking lot, I would have left it alone because if soething was to happen or the right MP came along he would have gotten a ticket. When I am talking to a soldier yea I can yell at them and make them stand at parade rest anywhere on the installation. Hell I even locked a soldier up at parade rest an scolded him in front of his family before. But where is the professionalism. I've had some difficult sokdiers in my time and even had to correct some outside my unit but that whole idea of respect going up and not down is a bunch of b.s. pick your battles, approach as a leader and not a tyrant, it is then you will find a soldier who respect you and will follow you to the moon an back.

Response by SGT William Benson made Jun 3 at 2018 3:08 AM

2018-06-03T03:08:40-04:00

Used to be one reason for the Provost Marshall's Office...

Response by MAJ Jimmy M. made Jun 8 at 2018 4:42 AM

2018-06-08T04:42:22-04:00

I will assume that this was out in public and not on post. It was, if that is the case, someone looking for a free meal by wearing the "uniform" of a service member.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 12 at 2018 4:31 PM

2018-06-12T16:31:54-04:00

KARMA, No witnesses huh?

Response by Sgt James D. made Jun 12 at 2018 7:41 PM

2018-06-12T19:41:48-04:00

get is id and write him up!!! expecially if you are senior! if he refuses to give you his id call the mps they will place him under arrest and take his id! then you can find his unit!

Response by Sgt James D. made Jun 12 at 2018 8:04 PM

2018-06-12T20:04:05-04:00

I would ask for his id If im senior to him and write him up if he refuses to give me his id I would call the mps and have them arrest him for disobeying a lawful order, then when they have him in custody and have his id you can find out who his unit is! and forward charges to his command! disrespect is never ok in the military! second I am going back to 1978 I was in the parking lot of my unit which had reserved spots for radio jeeps to be parked while gear was being worked on! I aproched the car and knocked on the window and the person inside rolled the window down and a green fog rolled out! that smelled like burning rope! I could see a bag in the console so I called my fellow sgt over to witness and got every one out if the car, got their ids and then took possision of the bag of marijuana! I wrote charges up for the 4 men and took it and the charge sheets to their 1st sgt he took it all and thew it in the trash and told me to leave his men alone, I promptly reached into the trash can and took possession of the drugs again along with the charge sheets! walked straight to the batt commanders office where I boldly walked in on his staff meeting to my capt dismay handed the col the sheets and drugs and told him I thought he would want to know one of his 1st sgts said to me about it! he quickly read the charges and then called the 1st sgt and fired him on the spot! always have your ducks in a row before you ever try something like this!

Response by SGT Brett Naughton made Jun 15 at 2018 12:44 AM

2018-06-15T00:44:43-04:00

Suplex

Response by Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2018 2:48 PM

2018-06-24T14:48:41-04:00

You were totally correct to attempt to correct a deficiency. No matter the rank you have to act like a professional. Just recently as a range OIC, I approached a Col to explain oporder and he thanked me. I approached him professionally and he responded in kind. I have received on there spot correction from an NCO. I thanked for pointing out and correcting my issue. He was right, I was wrong. I don't care if it had been a PFC. Right is right.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 24 at 2018 6:25 PM

2018-06-24T18:25:25-04:00

Depends honestly how polite you were doesn’t it? Being corrected is dicey ground.

Response by 1LT Joe Schmuccatelli made Jul 2 at 2018 11:23 PM

2018-07-02T23:23:59-04:00

Refer his actions to his Command.

Response by MGySgt Anthony Yallum made Jul 7 at 2018 1:42 PM

2018-07-07T13:42:02-04:00

First off, if you are an NCO/SNCO every Junior "soldier" should belong to you especially when correcting a deficiency as serious as disrespect. Every NCO/SNCO/Officer is tasked with maintaining the good order and discipline of whatever branch of service they represent. They are obligated and have the responsibility to take charge of any situation that threatens the good order and discipline of their service or the military in general especial when it comes to junior troops. As a retired Marine, I guess I don't get this relegating that responsibility to the unit or section leadership. If this guy was truly a soldier and he told me to go f*** myself, my new mission in life would be to ensure he did not remain a soldier in MY Army. Once identified, I would charge him then run it through his chain of command. Is that not the way it works in the Army? Hoping that Karma would catch up to him only gives that behavior a foot hold and allows that cancer to spread. With that said, short of taking this guy out, I'm not sure what you could have done other than to document via a picture and then try to identify him later. This situation would have been much easier to handle on base, if indeed he was a soldier, no? This is one of the reasons Marines do not allow Battle Dress Uniforms/Cammies to be worn outside Military installations.

Response by SSG Patrick Williams made Jul 26 at 2018 1:47 PM

2018-07-26T13:47:08-04:00

I have encountered many with patches I didn't recognize, however I found many of them were national guard or reserve. I have also encountered ex soldiers who still wore their uniforms around town. I think you may have confronted the latter.

Response by MSG Martin Vartanian made Jul 29 at 2018 5:41 PM

2018-07-29T17:41:16-04:00

You didn’t say if you are on a military installation at the time. First you should have ordered him to come to attention and give you his name, ID number and unit. If he responded as before get your cellphone out and call the Provost Martial or nearest MP station. He should have been detained for being out of uniform and for insubordination. After you give your statement it’s out of you hands

Response by MSG Martin Vartanian made Jul 29 at 2018 5:50 PM

2018-07-29T17:50:07-04:00

I had read the two other posts before I made my earlier post. I ret a MSG but previously was a 1SG. I wouldn’t have accepted that behavior. That’s why

Response by SSG Omar Ruiz-Canales made Jul 30 at 2018 8:23 AM

2018-07-30T08:23:55-04:00

The individual was probably Reservist or NG.. they tend to have the air of IDGAF more than any and their unit patches are not as easy to identify.. just like they said.. try to take a pic may he the best thing you could do..

Response by SSG Craig Person made Jul 30 at 2018 11:30 AM

2018-07-30T11:30:00-04:00

o I would have found the unit u could have even got his last name and do a search on AKO and narrowed down the person or research the patch ..i understand your issue not wanting to wall to wall his dumb A but that is what you get in today's service .. they discipline and respect left about 10 years ago

Response by SSG Craig Person made Jul 30 at 2018 3:23 PM

2018-07-30T15:23:21-04:00

what does the patch look like
go to the post site they should have all the units on it

Response by SSG Craig Person made Jul 30 at 2018 7:15 PM

2018-07-30T19:15:47-04:00

trust you could have found out.. at least i could have

Response by MSgt Don Dobbs made Aug 2 at 2018 10:25 AM

2018-08-02T10:25:12-04:00

When I was a Sgt E-4 I had an Airman coming on to some female Airmen under my care. I asked the Airman to leave and he responded "You aint nothing but a piddly assed buck Sgt so F$#K OFF". I promptly pulled my ID card and informed the Airman that he was under apprehension and I can and would use force to detain him. He attempted to leave I grabbed him and placed him in an arm lock and held him until the Security Cops arrived. He had been in trouble before and received an article 15 with loss of pay, reduction to Airman Basic E-1, and received an undesirable discharge. There are times when simple conversation or suggestion is not quite enough.

Response by SPC Ramon Urias made Aug 4 at 2018 8:39 PM

2018-08-04T20:39:06-04:00

He’s probably some YouTuber looking for a reaction to post online. You know he wants to be the next Roman Atwood.

Response by SGM Eddie Green made Aug 6 at 2018 9:30 AM

2018-08-06T09:30:03-04:00

Let Karma take over it will get him in the long run. Not a service member!

Response by PO1 Tommy French made Aug 8 at 2018 8:19 AM

2018-08-08T08:19:11-04:00

I'd say that you should just walk away and allow the young fool to continue f*cking up, sooner or later, that old Karma bulldog will bite him on the *ss.

Response by Cpl Bernard Bates made Aug 13 at 2018 4:44 PM

2018-08-13T16:44:56-04:00

This sure wasn't the military I was in from 59-66. Where has the respect gone. Rank doesn't seem to mean anything more. NCO,s don't seem to have any power anymore. If an Officer had been treated like that, Their would have been a court Martial and possibly brig time. If we got into trouble with another unit. Our 1st sgt. wanted the discipline to stay in the company. Usually Our ID cards would be taken and returned to the company with the infraction explained. I remember 1 sunday morning at camp lejune someone whistled at the Sgt. Majors Wife. from a barracks window. Every one in that barracks was disciplined. The duty NCO that sunday had to march us through 10 miles of the worst muddy trails with our combat gear on. When we were covered with mud from head to toe and our gear including our M1 rifles were full of mud the march was over. There were about 25 of us in the march. The only complaint I heard was" I hope she was good looking or I didn't even get to see what she looked like. Semper fi.

Response by CW3 Kevin Storm made Aug 13 at 2018 5:10 PM

2018-08-13T17:10:57-04:00

There is always the calling the MP's and let them deal with Soldier Billy Dumb A$$. The Picture is always an option. I suspect this person maybe a fraud?

Response by SGT Mark Richardson made Aug 13 at 2018 11:30 PM

2018-08-13T23:30:42-04:00

Punch that little faggot in his suckhole

Response by SFC Antonio Nieto made Aug 16 at 2018 12:30 AM

2018-08-16T00:30:57-04:00

Take a picture? I would have call the cops have him detained under the general authority have the MP’s pick him up retain his ID and article 15 in progress

Response by SPC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 16 at 2018 8:48 PM

2018-08-16T20:48:19-04:00

can you describe the patch

Response by SSG Brian G. made Aug 20 at 2018 12:29 AM

2018-08-20T00:29:49-04:00

Likely stolen valor but you never know. Can you describe the patch he was wearing as it might not have even been Army as some of these stolen Valor douche nuggets are simply too stupid.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 20 at 2018 7:49 PM

2018-08-20T19:49:52-04:00

Always have the Post SDNCO & MP Non-Emergency phone numbers on your phone. If the post SDNCO cannot get a hold of his Command call the MPs. They will restrain him until his Leadership shows up because he’s violating Article 91 UCMJ. While making phone call take pic of him with name tape in case they run. Or just call the MPs.

Response by CPT Kevin Connolly made Aug 24 at 2018 3:47 PM

2018-08-24T15:47:30-04:00

Are you sure he was a soldier and not, e.g., a paintball player?

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2018 8:10 AM

2018-08-28T08:10:19-04:00

You should had let the grunt in you out..... some people need to realize that there are consequences for there actions

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 2 at 2018 12:24 PM

2018-09-02T12:24:27-04:00

Post a picture of the patch, can Google image search based off your description. I'm sure there is something that Soldier is good at, it's just not at being a Soldier. We all should help them transition to "former Soldier" status.

Response by CDR Tom Davy made Sep 4 at 2018 3:47 PM

2018-09-04T15:47:44-04:00

I'm a retired Navy Commander (0-5) and would have just corrected the individual rather than show my ID, with the assumption that the sailor did not know the problem. Clearly this loser knew the problem and didn't care (to say the least). I would have then assumed he was known to the MAA (MPs/Provost Marshal) and if I had the time, taken his name and description to them. The person who said his command would not care was probably right as his NCOIC should have corrected him a long time ago. This problem child is probably awaiting a General Discharge.

Response by SGT David Whitley made Sep 11 at 2018 12:23 AM

2018-09-11T00:23:12-04:00

It depends on your sincerity. To be frank, Leaders these days are not developed very well. Unfortunately, that very broad assertion comes with a few rare exceptions of those fortunate enough to have been invested in, or took it upon themselves to learn proper leadership.
Because of this, junior soldiers have become accustomed to most leaders being passionate about the rules, but not giving 2 farts about the soldier.
With that being said, I’d encourage you next time to show some passion/compassion for the soldier themselves. If they are “ate up”, start the conversation with asking how they are doing. Then proceed to start a conversation concerning the issue at hand and relate how rectifying it autonomously in the future will lead to better military career prospects.
I garuntee that will resonate with more meaning than acting like just another leader holding a stick while looking for junior SM’s to wallop.
If the soldier is from unknown origins, and still insists on acting like a fool, tell them to follow their heart and wish them luck.
I’ll part ways with some others on this thread and say that it’s not your job to run around the post policing up infractions, and you’ll drive yourself mad in the process of trying it. Moreover, if they aren’t your charges, then you have no idea what they have going on in their world and your attempt to police up a nameless and faceless person with no regard for their well-being could have disasterous consequences for a group or family that you hadn’t thought about once.
If you find yourself reading all that and thinking, “I’m not going to invest that much energy and time in to someone else’s project” then you probably ought to politely request they fix themselves and walk away without further question, or better yet, just walk away.
I welcome any feedback for that approach to leadership, and hope I didn’t offend any person/s in my response.

Response by 1SG Ernest Stull made Sep 13 at 2018 8:42 AM

2018-09-13T08:42:14-04:00

Since he tried to fight you as an NCO you could have called the MP's and have detained the soldier until they arrived. If he was in town then call the cops and have him arrested for assault.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 15 at 2018 1:00 AM

2018-09-15T01:00:15-04:00

As a former member of the 52nd MP CO. stationed on Ft. Sam Houston I am disappointed that the MP you talked to did not do his or her job and transport the young soldier to his orderly room and tell the ranking NCO or Officer about his attitude and behavior.

Response by CPT Edwina McCall made Sep 16 at 2018 2:01 PM

2018-09-16T14:01:51-04:00

I am an Army Combat Support nurse since 1988, when faced this last war with mouthy, unruly and totally out of pocket soldiers, only one or two, I addressed it immediately, calling his Sergeant into my office along with the soldier. Settled right there and then, his Sergeant listening to the situation took it from there.

So for one sounds like you let him walk away , I would have taken him into my office and gone from there. If he wanted to fight or run I would call the MP. I am hearing way too many stories of this kind and I understand that Mathis is even having to tell these newbies if they won't deploy they are gone. Sad state this. As an officer when I was corrected or my uniform called into question I listened. As an officer I was reminded on and off by Sergeants concerning my boots etc. I listened.

Glad I am Reserves and inactive for now. Don't know who these guys would fear more the enemy or me cause not for one darned second would I put up with this.

Response by CPL Jay Strickland made Sep 16 at 2018 7:18 PM

2018-09-16T19:18:45-04:00

If you can't find his chain of command you might have to let it go. Unless it is a repetitive issue.

Response by Sgt Mike Lunsford made Sep 24 at 2018 10:08 AM

2018-09-24T10:08:22-04:00

WOW. Things must have really gone down hill since I was in (USAF 83-90). I never once saw disrespect that wasn't dealt with quickly and forcefully. I was a Security Specialist who saw many TDYs all over the world and never experienced this. As a SSgt I only had this happen to me once where an A1C didn't like his duty assignment (he had to carry the M-60 for his 10hr duty watch). He told me this would be the last time he did it). The next day at Guardmount I had him not only carrying it but I had him do a full breakdown demonstration for the flight. Afterwards I explained to him at "Close Range" in front of the flight why he would never again gainsay my authority to post him or anyone where I felt they were needed. Problem solved...............................

Response by 1SG Marion "Ron" C. made Sep 25 at 2018 8:51 PM

2018-09-25T20:51:47-04:00

I would have to agree with the comments about possibly being an impersonator. It seems this individual may be looking for a fight and it would behoove you not to engage. If this person is not in the military then you may get into more trouble than he will; just keep that in mind when you decide to put your boot up his fourth point of contact. As others have commented, try to get a picture next time if you can. As you stated, you have been unable to find the patch so it may not be a valid patch. Also, have you notified your chain of command just in case they encounter this person? Were you able to get a name from his uniform? Just a couple of things to think about from a "seasoned" Soldier. Yes, in my younger days I would have had the same initial response as you, but you learn to handle things differently as you get wiser. Just maintain your professionalism and don't let others bring you down to their level.

Response by LTC Gene Moser made Oct 7 at 2018 9:34 PM

2018-10-07T21:34:45-04:00

I've been retired for more years than I was in the service, but I'm not sure how one could track down PVT Snuffy from a unit patch. I've never seen a unit patch below brigade level.

Response by SGT Kyle Bickley made Oct 19 at 2018 10:12 AM

2018-10-19T10:12:21-04:00

Disrespect me and I got the stripes? Your gonna be a lot stronger when I get done with you! Plus I guarantee the Earth will be about 5 feet closer to the sun! Not gonna play that game. You refuse to get your face on the ground I'll help you! A officer or an NCO is a powerful thing that has a lot of responsibility that goes with it. If a troop will challenge your authority on base they'll do it in combat! People then die! Nip that crap in the ass immediately!

Response by SFC Joseph McCausland made Oct 25 at 2018 11:45 PM

2018-10-25T23:45:39-04:00

My guess is he wasn't in the military. He was probably visiting someone or maybe a military dependent. No junior soldier would act that way knowing that he could face charges under the UCMJ.

Response by SGT George Duncan made Oct 27 at 2018 12:27 PM

2018-10-27T12:27:24-04:00

get them transferred to my unit

Response by SPC Greg Campbell made Nov 23 at 2018 3:54 PM

2018-11-23T15:54:40-05:00

SP4, had 3 PFCs and another SP4 on a detail. one PFC who had just arrived started giving me the 'your not a NCO, you cant tell me what to do. other 3 guys where telling him I could. mu problem was solved when dirtbag PFC was still mouthing off as Top came around the corner. he ended up finishing the detail under Tops supervision and there wad instruction abouy the rank structures in our unit.

Response by 1SG James Kelly made Dec 6 at 2018 12:57 PM

2018-12-06T12:57:21-05:00

I used to just rip his head off and shit in his neck.

It may be that he wasn't GI just a wannqbe.

Response by SGT Jason Yago made Dec 8 at 2018 11:37 AM

2018-12-08T11:37:39-05:00

He’s probably stolen valor

Response by SSgt Ty Morse made Dec 9 at 2018 1:49 PM

2018-12-09T13:49:06-05:00

Why do I have a sneaking suspicion that you went up to soldier and bitched at him about his uniform and had zero tact about it. Did you ask him if he was just getting off work? Or did you go straight in calling him a dirtbag? I had this happen to me before after 14 hours of turning wrenches on a jet in the hot sun covered in hydraulic fluid and anyone who knows about hydraulic fluid knows how bad you smell. So there I was getting gas and a burrito on my way home and had a stuck up desk jockey bitch at my uniform. No questions just straight in calling me a dirtbag, to which I told them to go fuck themselves and where I worked. Said individual went to my supervisor and flight chief to which they told that individual to go fuck themselves. Next was to the first sergeant who go the commander involved. It was starting to get serious when I got called in. So then I got to stand at attention while my commander and first sergeant ripped the desk jockey up down left and right about what the actual mission of the Air Force. That there are some that actually earn their paycheck everyday with blood sweat and tears and that the real Air Force isn’t a recruiting commercial. The commander looked at me and said what do you have to say for yourself, I told him as much as I want to disrespect this man I won’t disrespect the rank again sir. My commander nodded and told me to leave.

Response by PO2 William Kennison made Dec 17 at 2018 2:30 AM

2018-12-17T02:30:58-05:00

He's probably some asshat Jody that likes to play soldier.
Just let it go or rip off his tabs and see him report it to the cops. When they arrive he can stutter about his violation of stolen valor.

Response by SPC Chris Ison made Dec 31 at 2018 1:38 PM

2018-12-31T13:38:19-05:00

Sounds like stolen valor.

Response by PO2 Mike Shorey made Jan 4 at 2019 9:35 PM

2019-01-04T21:35:42-05:00

You should’ve went old school and whooped his ass.

Response by PO1 Chad Alcock made Jan 9 at 2019 1:30 PM

2019-01-09T13:30:06-05:00

As much as it irks me to say so, let it go, taking the time to hunt him down is probably just a waste. Most of us don't want to have "that guy" in our military, but his time in is limited anyway. Either it will catch up with him, or he'll ETS. Now the fact he tried to fight you, I would probably have contacted the authorities and had them deal with it, suppressing the urge to throttle the little brat.

Response by SFC Scott Beck made Jan 11 at 2019 11:56 AM

2019-01-11T11:56:04-05:00

That's why Retirement looked so good, Military has changed too much!

Response by COL Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 13 at 2019 7:40 PM

2019-01-13T19:40:46-05:00

Kick his ass...what Army do you belong to?

Response by CDR Tom Davy made Jan 20 at 2019 7:24 PM

2019-01-20T19:24:15-05:00

As an O-3 (Navy LT) I shared a bus stop with a Jr ROTC HS student from St. Johns who had a major attitude. He would not salute me even though we were both in uniform. The word "sir" was not in his vocabulary, etc. I tried to appeal to his sense of pride, when I had been a Boy Scout, we had great respect for St. John's cadets and so on. He was having none of it. After a few days of my instruction being met by his disrespect, I called his Commander's office.
They told him to change bus stops.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 20 at 2019 8:22 PM

2019-01-20T20:22:16-05:00

His attitude may have been disrespectful, and you did the right thing by making an on the spot correction. You missed the only opportunity to give him a significant emotional event when you didn't punch him in the throat when he tried to fight you.
More likely than not, his unit already knows he's ate up, and they haven't fixed it.
There is no course of action ,as cussing you out didn't violate the UCMJ, and it is unlikely anyone would bother with him "trying to fight" you.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 24 at 2019 10:45 PM

2019-01-24T22:45:15-05:00

Todays degenerate generation.....what a joke.

Response by Sgt Steve Williams made Jan 27 at 2019 1:29 PM

2019-01-27T13:29:56-05:00

I doubt if he was actually in any branch.

Response by SFC Thomas Howes made Jan 31 at 2019 4:37 PM

2019-01-31T16:37:44-05:00

I would drag the troop back to his or her unit but that was back in the day from what here you can't put hands on a troop.

Response by MSG Richard Medina made Feb 12 at 2019 9:52 AM

2019-02-12T09:52:13-05:00

It may be that this so called soldier, could've been a civilian impersonating a soldier. His responses to your correct actions just sounded too much like someone off the street. I believe even and ate soldier would respond with some military bearing. My two cents.

Response by MSG Richard Medina made Feb 12 at 2019 9:54 AM

2019-02-12T09:54:57-05:00

Sorry on my last comment. It's "corrective actions" and an "ate up" soldier.

Response by PO2 Karl Lehn made Feb 22 at 2019 2:23 AM

2019-02-22T02:23:38-05:00

First you have to play this on a psychological level. In other words you play the little #_@&-. Ask him where his command is supposed to be saying you have business there. Appeal to him to show you where you're going or if he begs off escorting you to his command ask for his name so you can mention what a good thing he did helping you out. Once you have ensnared him by escorting you when you arrive you get his senior enlisted leader to deal with him. While hes escorting you to where you need to be you can casually get information such as name. If he doesn't escort you and youve gotton his name to praise him to his command they can then lower the boom upon him.
Onr thing we tended to do in the Navy was back each other up.. when a petty officer had trouble with all petty officers came to his assistance. There is strength in numbers.. Example- a junior threatened me once. Several other petty officers reacted before I did and the junior was suddenly in a world of crap.. His disrespectful threat was handled without bothering the officers with it.

Response by PV2 Mark Walston made Mar 4 at 2019 4:29 AM

2019-03-04T04:29:25-05:00

Report him to the base commander and base MPs.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 11 at 2019 7:33 PM

2019-03-11T19:33:38-04:00

I have ran into this teice as a retire first one was at a super Walmart. Soldier was walking around with his hands in his pockets. I identified my self and corrected him but he got lippy with me and walked off before I could catch his name. Fortunately, I recognized his Brigade patch and had a chat with his Bde CSM the next work day. 2nd one was in a restuarant parking lot. Granted it was a windy day. 2 soldiers walking across the lot, one Male and other female without her PC on. I corrected her. No noticeable attempt to put it back. Male soldier copped an attitude with me. I identified myself as a retiree and corrected again. Male soldier told to GFY and my rank no longer matters

Response by SGT Jeff Neal made Mar 13 at 2019 12:33 AM

2019-03-13T00:33:59-04:00

When did dragging over an mp for a mcj violation for a dingleberry who clearly needs from PT so hid/her gets on straight.

With lack of maturity cones lack of common sense. This is the case with this lad who resorts to profanity in uniform . If he/she wants to attracr attention give him the attention cAll in your senior Nco or anothe aenior NCo passing or bring the MPs they love handling thise because the fool will act the same with them. Clearly needs some extra duty and extra PT

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 13 at 2019 6:10 AM

2019-03-13T06:10:32-04:00

If there was a crescent moon on the top of the patch like an old outhouse door, then it was probably a SC Guard member that wandered off of McCrady Training Center.

Response by Capt Daniel Goodman made Mar 13 at 2019 7:50 AM

2019-03-13T07:50:01-04:00

Wow...I take it that was at your installation? Only twice did I ever have to say anything, once when I was at USAF OTS, a junior OT had been walking past with a friend, he had on sunglasses, which were specifically forbidden by the Commandant for OTs to wear, I'd seen him while walking with my family, who'd flown to see me finish, I had to give him a demerit...the other time, I'd been walking through the parking lot of the enlisted barracks where I was assigned, a junior airman had his fatigue shirt open, holding an open beer can, yakking with two more senior guys, both NCOs, I'd had to get mail, that was where we in the BOQ went for it...he was also yelling across the lot to a friend quite loudly...I just stopped and stared at him and the other pair, till both NCOs got the point, and told him to lose the beer can and close his shirt...I'd also been with the base commander for a day, my installation had new 2nd Lts do that, we had to go to a daily briefing with the Lt Gen he had to attend, so he brought me along...as we both got out of the staff car, he saw a junior airman walk out with something wrong with his uniform, the Col called out, with index finger raised and beckoning, "Young man..." and walked over to him...the junior airman, suitably chastened, saluted and was allowed to leave, I didn't hear with the Col said to him, I just was standing by the staff car watching (needless to say, I was obviously immaculate that day)...I just figured you might find those anecdotes interesting and/or useful...that story you'd told was actually pretty incredible, certainly, I'd love to hear more if you find anything out, of course....

Response by PO2 Willis Linn made Mar 13 at 2019 9:05 AM

2019-03-13T09:05:16-04:00

I would have placed him under arrest and help him till the MP's came. There is NO PLACE for being disrespectful senior military personal. However, not knowing both sides I'm just speaking for me!

Response by LTC Denis Sullivan made Mar 13 at 2019 11:43 AM

2019-03-13T11:43:01-04:00

Sounds like a possible Stolen Valor issue. Probably wasn't a soldier at all!

Response by MSG Justin Kuchar made Mar 13 at 2019 4:45 PM

2019-03-13T16:45:36-04:00

Never let it slide. That is a large part of the problem with today's NCO's collectively and junior soldiers cash it in because of it. Lead the way, don't fade away ever. I don't care if it is COL, just do appropriately and respectfully out of view. You do it right and people will generally appreciate it in terms of peers and up.

Response by MAJ John Green made Mar 13 at 2019 6:13 PM

2019-03-13T18:13:53-04:00

He was Probably a Wannabe using Stolen Valor uniform from some Army Surplus store. I would of asked for his Military ID and if he didn't comply, used the UCMJ on him and have the MP's, SP's or AP's to verify this ass wipe!!

Response by LTC Jeff Shearer made Mar 13 at 2019 8:24 PM

2019-03-13T20:24:48-04:00

You do not have to contact his/her command. Nope, when he started you and about 5-6 of your guys take turns beating him until he can't move. Then put a bag on his head put him a trunk drive him to the seediest bar in town pitch him in the dumpster. Then tell the bouncer to call the MPs and tell them he is a trouble maker.

DONT DO THIS!

however man that would make life better

Response by SP5 Geoffrey Vannerson made Mar 14 at 2019 5:14 PM

2019-03-14T17:14:53-04:00

Keep an eye on him and contact the MP's. Have him detained until his commanding officer shows up and then explain the situation. No matter what his rank is or (was) if you out rank him and are an NCO he is still required to follow orders and do it in a respectful manor. Disrespect to an NCO can and SHOULD result in an Articular 15. He wouldn't do that to an officer. If basic training teaches a soldier anything it is respect of rank. Whats next he refuses to salute an officer as he walks by? I do believe in Karma tho and maybe you will get lucky and see his behind in an area off post and then you can "tune his ass up" in regards to your mom. Sure is a different army then when I was in!

Response by MAJ George Buzby made Mar 15 at 2019 1:18 PM

2019-03-15T13:18:16-04:00

Describe the unit patch and maybe we can help?

Response by LCpl Cody Collins made Mar 15 at 2019 1:32 PM

2019-03-15T13:32:58-04:00

It's situations like that that I remind myself I am so glad I did not join the army. I am so glad I join the Marine Corps because the Marine Corps is not this huge organization for people like that scumbag to fall through the cracks. You missed your opportunity to straighten that disrespectful P.O.S. out. Since the " hour of Power " has passed, I wouldn't waste my time thinking about that puke. Hopefully he was sent to Afghanistan and met his maker shortly after he arrived.

Response by SP6 Greg Jetter made Mar 15 at 2019 2:03 PM

2019-03-15T14:03:55-04:00

sounds like you stumbled onto one of many stolen valor situations , the odds are the kid was not a REAL soldier , just so wanto be with a surpluss uniform he managed to come up with.

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made Mar 15 at 2019 9:00 PM

2019-03-15T21:00:54-04:00

I would call the military police.

Response by MSgt Scott Gaston made Mar 17 at 2019 6:35 PM

2019-03-17T18:35:42-04:00

Just my opinion, but a talk with whoever's soldier he is about the disrespect and general lack of Military bearing. Usually some manual extra duty after a lecture of military tradition of respect for rank and position coming before what you think of someone if they out rank you (regardless of the service they belong to) is paramount to military success and mandatorily in the oath of enlistment. I believe "Those Appointed over me" doesn't just refer to giving orders. Let him smart off to a Marine NCO and watch him get ripped from limb to limb! Just my opinion. I asked some sailors to keep their rowdiness down and was told FU First Sergeant, we don't even have First Sergeants in the Navy". I got their names and spoke with a Navy E-8who we allowed in our First Sergeants Group (Joint Services Base Misawa, Japan). Funny what a different attitude they had next time we crossed paths!

Response by MSgt Scott Gaston made Mar 17 at 2019 6:41 PM

2019-03-17T18:41:35-04:00

I'd make him take a swing at you. Then when you beat the shit out of him and police arrested him for assault, the situation would have taken care of itself! One of my favorite ways of dealing with the 3% taking up 97% of my time was to "Give them enough rope to let them hang themselves"! Semper Fi Marine, Professional as usual and well respected for it!

Response by SPC Julie Sullivan made Mar 18 at 2019 6:29 AM

2019-03-18T06:29:10-04:00

as someone in command I appreciate your self control,, personally I would have beat him so hard, his mother would have felt it.

Response by MSgt Don Dobbs made Mar 18 at 2019 2:27 PM

2019-03-18T14:27:35-04:00

I had a very similar response from an Airman who called me nothing but a piddelyassed Sgt. Being a professional NCO I placed this individual under apprehension (arrest) and contacted the SPs. I filled out a statement and pressed charges. The SPs locked him up. Later his CO contacted me and asked if I would drop the charges, I told him no and he asked me why. I stated sir if he spoke to you like that would you drop the charges? His CO art 15d him. You don't have to wait for anyone and IAW the UCMJ you can use force to detain the individual.

Response by MSgt Don Dobbs made Mar 18 at 2019 2:28 PM

2019-03-18T14:28:00-04:00

Response by PO3 Ryan Gilbert made Mar 18 at 2019 11:23 PM

2019-03-18T23:23:42-04:00

I think it’s stolen valor. The lack of discipline shows that. If he is active duty than I think it’s just an example of the millennial generation. I’ve been out for a while now but I remember during my time that sort of disrespect didn’t happen no matter what branch the senior person was in.

Response by SFC Wesley Tankersley made Mar 19 at 2019 9:18 AM

2019-03-19T09:18:12-04:00

I find it amazing that you were able to keep your military bearing in this situation being a SPC. So I am guessing that this would be soldier is a PFC or PVT ? Was the incident on post or off ? I would hope that if this happened at the food court in the Exchange that there would have been other more senior NCO's that could have intervened and set this individual straight. It almost sounds like a case of "Stolen Valor" especially if cannot identify the shoulder unit patch. If you would like I would like to see the pic of the patch ? SFC. (Ret.) Tankersley Email me at: [login to see]

Response by Sgt James Walters made Mar 19 at 2019 5:26 PM

2019-03-19T17:26:38-04:00

forget trying to go after this soldier. you need to concentrate on understanding the UCMJ and develop the leadership skills to handle a situation like this in the correct manner.
now you did not state where you encountered this soldier, if on base the MP's would be called and I would at the very least get his commands Sgt.Maj's contact information. if out in town and he is active duty he would be needing a visit or two to dental.

Response by 1SG George Wever made Mar 20 at 2019 9:06 AM

2019-03-20T09:06:33-04:00

Effidently this happened off post, I as an old retiree would of called the cops for him being disrespectful and treathning me. And you would of found out his true character. Someone like him does not need be in any branch of the military

Response by SSgt Doug LeKander made Mar 20 at 2019 10:33 AM

2019-03-20T10:33:16-04:00

This is prepping you for the 1stCivDiv. Walking turds everywhere.

Response by CW4 John Beebe, BS, DML made Mar 21 at 2019 10:28 AM

2019-03-21T10:28:10-04:00

SPC,
Something to consider is that this was a HS JROTC cadet. I see them daily walking home off the bus in completely disheveled uniforms and representing the ghetto more than the Service Branch they are wearing the uniform of. If you didn't recognize the patch, that may be why. If you know the JROTC patches (they differ by branch) in your area, you can contact their HS JROTC Leadership and, well things may get handled. If not, the likelihood of a perpetrator in uniform committing a stolen-valor offense is very high. As COL Harris stated, get a picture. As much as most of us that were NCO's or junior leader get riled up quickly and getting a picture is the last thing on our mind (verses mopping the floor with that insubordinate, disrespectful, pile of refuse), we still need a record. Deep Breath, then think. Remember: Command Voice, not Command Yell Down The Block, Drill Sergeant. I hope this helps.

Chief

Response by SSG Gerald King made Mar 23 at 2019 10:48 AM

2019-03-23T10:48:59-04:00

Old Army response here. 1974 I was a SSG in Nurnburg. One morning I decided to go to the chow hall for breakfast. Standing in the line outside the mess hall, there was a SP4 in front of me with his hat on lopsided, jacket unbuttoned and hands in his pockets. Looking like a complete slob. I instructed him to take his hands out of his pockets, put his hat on straight and button his jacket. He told me to go fuck myself and stated that he had less than 30 days to go in my fucking Army and furthermore he worked in personnel and had access to my personnel files and could create some problems for me. I informed him that: Number 1 - he did not have access to my personnel records because they were at my HQs in Augsburg. Number 2 - He was making a threat to a NCO and after I finished with him he would have 6 months and 30 days to go in my fucking Army. Number 3 - If he did not take his hands out of his pockets immediately, I would personally break both of his arms removing them. He looked rather shocked, put his hat on straight, buttoned his jacket, took his hands out of his pockets and decided he did not want any breakfast and departed. I am sure you could not get away with that in today's Army.

Response by SSG Dave Johnston made Mar 23 at 2019 6:08 PM

2019-03-23T18:08:15-04:00

Have you ever looked though the National Guard's collection of Distinguished Unit Insignias(DUI's)? And it may be possible the individual could very well have been a member of the NG. … and one last thing to remember concerning the Reserve and Guard components of the Armed Forces; They do in 48 hours what Active Duty does in 22 days.

Response by SGT David Racette made Apr 3 at 2019 12:54 AM

2019-04-03T00:54:27-04:00

It may be a patch from another branch of service, or a NG unit.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 7 at 2019 5:31 PM

2019-04-07T17:31:39-04:00

SPC Pietrantonio,
Just for my curiosity's sake, how many times during a calendar month does someone kick your a*s? As you aren't an NCO but seem to stick your nose into everything, I would suspect it to be a fairly common occurrence. You need to consider becoming either an NCO or an MP. I love MPs after I observed them locking up the post-commander for a DUI. We are all equal (or equally worthless) in their sight and what you seem to always be doing is (or was) part and parcel of their daily duties. They may not care to have a man of your sensibilities in their platoon but hell, they know what to do in those situations better than we do. Be careful should you find yourself alone during grenade qualification.

Response by Cpl Joe Terry made Apr 20 at 2019 1:22 PM

2019-04-20T13:22:25-04:00

We don't have this problem in the Marines. Every Marine is taught to obey every order that is given to him by someone of a higher rank. The fact that he doesn't (belong) to the ranking person has no bearing on the matter. You always obey your last order first. ALWAYS! Respect of RANK is always first and foremost! Punishment can be rather severe!

Response by SSG William Kimbrell made Apr 25 at 2019 9:42 AM

2019-04-25T09:42:23-04:00

Man have things changed from my time. Confrontation with disrespect would be shut down with great prejudice

Response by 2LT Paul Denhup made Apr 25 at 2019 1:18 PM

2019-04-25T13:18:20-04:00

I would had made an on the spot correction. Then use the smart phone to ID him and the unit in my spare time.

Response by SFC Ssg Sabin made Apr 25 at 2019 6:05 PM

2019-04-25T18:05:54-04:00

Were you an NCO at the time? If you were I can think of at least a couple of things right now + call the M.P's. If not, call the M.P.'s!

Response by Sgt James D. made Apr 26 at 2019 2:32 PM

2019-04-26T14:32:31-04:00

first off I had a problem like this back in 78 I happened to go to the parking lot where we kept jeeps when working on radios, I saw a car parked where it was not supposed to be! when I walked up the smell of marijauana was so strong and the whole inside was fogged with smoke! I hollered at one of my other sergeants to come quick! once he got there to witness I knocked on the window and told them to open the door! there were three lcpls in the car we got their ids and wrote them up! they didn't seem to even care, took the charge sheets to their 1st sgt, in a line company, I took a bag of marijuana that was laying on the console with me! the 1st sgt took all the charge sheets and the baggie and thru them in the trash! told me to leave his people alone! I promptly picked them all out of trash and left with him cussing me telling me to bring it back! from there I walked over to the regimental commanders ask if he was in I was told he was in a staff meeting I knocked but didn't wait for an invitation to enter the room! put all of it on the desk in front of him and explained the problem! I got results!! the other option is keep them there and call the MPs and have them take him into custody! disrespect is punishable by the ucmj if a junior troop refused to surrender his id it is cause for the mps to get involved!

Response by SPC Tr Hendricks made Apr 26 at 2019 4:50 PM

2019-04-26T16:50:46-04:00

Makes me wonder if he is actually a soldier, or perhaps "something else".... I would call the MP's if this substandard is poking around, especially if this "wandering about" is on post. But then I have been out far, far too long to really give you a better answer.

Response by SFC Lisa Leverett Bailey made Apr 27 at 2019 8:38 PM

2019-04-27T20:38:57-04:00

He is not the military turn his butt over to the mp’s.

Response by SFC Lisa Leverett Bailey made Apr 27 at 2019 8:39 PM

2019-04-27T20:39:54-04:00

Call MPs they will find out

Response by SGT Juan Robledo made Apr 27 at 2019 11:49 PM

2019-04-27T23:49:33-04:00

Try to pull him or her aside and find out what the issue is and try to inform them that being a soldier also requires understanding, tact, and respect, and if that doesn't work file a complaint with his or her command

Response by SGM Major Stroupe made Apr 28 at 2019 6:50 PM

2019-04-28T18:50:14-04:00

I actually liked the suggestion of taking a picture. In my day not everyone was carrying a phone or camera. But it was not stated if this occurred on or off post. There are a ton of NG and USAR patches that I don't recognize either so along with the Stolen Valor comment that opens some possibilities. But a picture could clear up a lot of questions that both military law enforcement and chain of command could act on. Staying calm and professional are key.

Response by SP5 Jeannie Carle made Apr 29 at 2019 5:01 AM

2019-04-29T05:01:46-04:00

My RECRUITER sat in his office very near my home town, presenting himself like that! What do you do about THAT? This wasn't after some kind of field-training - this was every day! I told him one day he looked like sh** - he's E6 - I'm E4 - he said that was "disrespect" - I said "No - YOU are disrespecting the Uniform - MY uniform!".

Response by CW4 John Soto made Apr 29 at 2019 7:32 PM

2019-04-29T19:32:30-04:00

Folks, many of you keep saying to call the MPs when the SPC said it occurred off base. MPs will not go off base as they have no authority there. Second it appears to me that this guy was either a reservist or a Wannabee Joe. Either way, from the picture I am seeing as per the SPC's description, he should have just left it alone as it could have escalated to something much worse and he would be relying on the civilian police for assistance. The civilian police will not care or want to hear you were making a uniform correction on a guy who probably may not even be in the military.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 2 at 2019 1:19 AM

2019-05-02T01:19:14-04:00

Describe his patch.

Response by LTC George Morgan made May 7 at 2019 12:24 PM

2019-05-07T12:24:53-04:00

Really depends on what he did? If is was minor: Bring him to attention, review his ID Card and give him a dressing down! If it was a Major encounter, ask him his unit and March him to it and address the Issue with his 1st Sgt. If it is criminal, take his ID Card , call the MPs. and give them his ID Card. You will be required to fill out a Statement,

Response by CWO3 Bryan Luciani made May 12 at 2019 2:36 PM

2019-05-12T14:36:00-04:00

It's simple. You're demeanor (polite, calm, angry or "in your face") will be a factor as will the attitude and demeanor of the person you are confronting. I start polite and concerned, if that does not work, I don't talk to the individual anymore. Nothing can be accomplished when the individual you are confronting is already disrespectful. You think your rank will scare them but 9 out of 10 times it won't. Then I decide if I'm going to waste time chasing down this clown's command (which I refer to as "being held hostage" by his/her behavior). Car license plates are helpful, taking a picture helps, and calling the base SPs/MPs can sometimes work. How far are you willing to go to correct the unacceptable behavior that this person's branch of service and drill Sergeants failed to instill? I came across this scenario three times in 22 years and two of them were officers when I was an E8. So, this scenario is not enlisted specific.

Response by TSgt Dan Kenna made May 20 at 2019 3:41 PM

2019-05-20T15:41:30-04:00

Did you ask your mama if he belonged to her?

Response by PO1 Richard Norton made May 22 at 2019 10:23 PM

2019-05-22T22:23:02-04:00

Im not sure what is the correct answer. I might contact the duty officer and have them deal with the solder in question. He has disrespected a senior NCO and could face according charges. Something else as well, if he has a unit patch that you don't recognize he could be a military faker and on the base illegally. In such a case he could actually be a terrorist. Again I think I would get the duty officer involved.

Response by PO2 Danny Ward made May 27 at 2019 8:24 AM

2019-05-27T08:24:13-04:00

Was this on base or was it off? With someone off-base it could very well have been "Stolen Valor" and not a real soldier. It is too easy to get old uniforms and wear them not knowing it is illegal, especially with the response from the "man" you encountered. Most that I served with would not disrespect the uniform, a senior non-mcom, nor the branch he or she was serving. Keep in mind, anyone today is a volunteer, many of those in my era, me included, received a draft notice. Respect is taught at home.

Response by Caitlin Williams made May 28 at 2019 10:22 PM

2019-05-28T22:22:37-04:00

It’s probably a stolen valor asshole or someone visiting and knows you can’t do anything

Response by MAJ James Miller made May 28 at 2019 11:07 PM

2019-05-28T23:07:28-04:00

I would lose my mind and kill his ass.

Response by SGT John Douglas made May 29 at 2019 9:32 PM

2019-05-29T21:32:23-04:00

I WOULD HAVE JACKED HIS JAWS....HE OR I HAVE GOTTEN HURT...

Response by MSgt John Crase made May 29 at 2019 11:25 PM

2019-05-29T23:25:28-04:00

Court martial, water boarding

Response by SPC Christopher Cook made May 30 at 2019 4:23 PM

2019-05-30T16:23:12-04:00

I agree. Stolen valor. I respect your professionalism. But sometimes one has to take out the trash.

Response by PO2 Michael Galey made May 30 at 2019 11:58 PM

2019-05-30T23:58:45-04:00

I'm too old school (1969 Navy) to have this rag bag ASVP waivered dirt bag address me. It's called counseling by the Braille method

Response by PO2 Michael Galey made May 31 at 2019 12:04 AM

2019-05-31T00:04:39-04:00

Retired SGT and Navy Petty Officer from the old school. With the fluffy new Army way he would have to be ignored and walked away even though deep within I would want to do what the Dear Lord would chastise me for! It's doubtful he is even a soldier maybe call Security for a check.

Response by MSgt Craig Gauger made May 31 at 2019 8:59 AM

2019-05-31T08:59:24-04:00

Since you didn't do anything at that time, there isn't much that can be done now. You should have noted name and grade and looked him up in a base alpha roster.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 31 at 2019 10:32 PM

2019-05-31T22:32:23-04:00

Hahahahahahahaha, sounds like you're the one with the ego, Specialist. Let him alone to go his own way; by your own admission, you're not much better than he is. You're still trying to find his superiors just so you can snitch on him and get back at him because your ego was bruised. Shrug it off, and let his own unit deal with him.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 31 at 2019 10:32 PM

2019-05-31T22:32:35-04:00

Response by CDR Darryl Gordon made May 31 at 2019 11:57 PM

2019-05-31T23:57:07-04:00

Maybe it's a diffent military than when I was in but why wouldn't you continue to exercise your authority up to and including detaining said young gentleman and getting the MPs involved if necessary. How can we maintain the integrity of our authority (military leadership's authority) and command structure if this is allowed.
If a soldier balks at this how much more if they are ordered into harm's way. It wouldn't make me feel good about serving with them.
I am not suggesting this should be handled with anything except respect but it should be handled quickly and with authority. Leaders must be leaders. Military service is quite reasonable when people conduct themselves appropriately. When they don't then life does, or at least should get quite uncomfortable for them.

Response by SFC Mark Lathan made Jun 1 at 2019 1:48 AM

2019-06-01T01:48:54-04:00

A fish rots from the head down. That behavior is a reflection of his leadership as well.

Can you describe the patch?

Response by SrA Marcus Frey made Jun 2 at 2019 2:13 PM

2019-06-02T14:13:16-04:00

I agree with Col. Harris,
Try to get a picture. I am unclear if this was off base or on base? If on base, there is a simple solution, call the MP's especially if the individual is severely Indignant and Obviously disrespectful to authority figures, see how he likes the attitude of the MP's as he disrespects them and they drag his sorry tail to either the brig or his commanding officer.
I shudder to think that he could have been a case of "Stolen Valor", I can't stand the thought of it... if that is the case, I suggest, an old fashioned smack down... jmho ( not that it would be right to strike anyone, I think there is an exception to those who "Steal Valor" by claiming Military affiliation of some sort).
Sorry if this offends anyone.

Response by SPC David Paine made Jun 2 at 2019 7:42 PM

2019-06-02T19:42:11-04:00

Can you draw a picture of it, can't imagine not able to find it internet makes it easy, did you search thoroughly? not trying to insult, just thinking aloud. could it have been a foreign military patch?

Response by SrA Brett Stratton made Jun 2 at 2019 8:46 PM

2019-06-02T20:46:00-04:00

I get the vibe this "soldier" was anything but. There's been a rash of incidents where some guys wear the uniform to get discounted meals, try to score with women, etc. Call him out on it and see how he reacts. If he CAN prove it, then you know what to do from there. If he can't, he's a faker and all you need to do is just let his identity be known throughout the area and let karma worker her justice.

Response by A1C Daniel Drake made Jun 2 at 2019 8:52 PM

2019-06-02T20:52:42-04:00

Well, I recommend a quick kick to the nuts, followed by calling MPs. They can figure out whose unit he belongs to.

Response by CW3 Joseph Lawrence made Jun 2 at 2019 8:53 PM

2019-06-02T20:53:10-04:00

Had a similar incident in Nurenberg Germany back in the early 70's. I was a Staff Sergeant at that time and the young private was telling me things about my ancestors I didn't even know. I would have like to light him up but I followed him to his unit and reported his conduct to his First Sergeant, after which I was summoned to make an official report to his commanding officer and he was given an article 15. You violate every regulation in the book if you decided to go fist to fist with this troop, but the best thing is to follow him to his unit and if that is not possible, get as much information on him as you can. In some instances you may just have to grin and bear it, but things like this happen. You never put your career on the line to straighten out a troop that is not yours. If he is disrespectful to you chances are he is the same with members of his own unit. Troops like that think they may be getting over being disrespectful, but eventually he will hang himself at his own unit.

Response by PO3 Eric Kerns made Jun 3 at 2019 8:27 AM

2019-06-03T08:27:15-04:00

Take off your blouse and go to the tree line. Or go to the Px buy the same rank, go back and find his azz.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 4 at 2019 1:40 PM

2019-06-04T13:40:48-04:00

I think you did the right thing. You went through the steps as prescribed. Two incidents happened which shaped my thoughts while I was in.
The first, I was a company commander and we were running an APFT when an officer passed one of my road guards and my soldier made a comment. This officer noted the chain of command, and I went and apologized face to face for my soldier, then brought her and her leadership in for a formal counseling session. Humbling for me, but I did what was right.
The second incident occurred when I was the S3 for a training BN at FT Lee. My CSM was returning from a meeting at the post HQ and noted a couple of soldiers who were not to standard. He stopped and made spot corrections; note, he did not yell, swear or in any other manner abuse these poor troops. In the five minutes it took for him to return to his office, he already had a message from the garrison CSM because my CSM didn't go through the proper chain of command to correct the troops. I'm still in disbelief that a CSM was called on the carpet for making spot corrections.
I'm not really sure what's happened to the Army in the last 20 years, but there's those who should be there, and those who will not last... I hope.

Response by COL Thomas McClung made Jun 4 at 2019 11:53 PM

2019-06-04T23:53:05-04:00

There was a day when Wall to Wall counseling with dimension lumber would have cured the issue, but I'm afraid we now have a kinder, gentler Army.

Response by MAJ Glynn Garcia made Jun 5 at 2019 3:37 PM

2019-06-05T15:37:24-04:00

If you're on post, easy.. Call MPs and just keep him in sight. Off post, where appearance in public matters, … yeah, video and get a tag and follow up with MPs or Base CDR/CSM. Thirty years ago?…. tag him till he's shaking on the ground.. THEN call MPs to pick him up. He's probably POS civilian stolen valor… which in some places is a misdemeanor ! Citizens Arrest!

Response by CPO Donald Crisp made Jun 6 at 2019 3:25 PM

2019-06-06T15:25:50-04:00

From your explanation, I take it this took place off base somewhere and that you were in civys. Unless you can identify the man, find his unit, or find a cop willing to step in, there's not much you can do. With so many people in the communities wearing uniforms, the stolen valor actions happening all over the place, and the mental issues that people are claiming and actually suffering, there's not much you can do.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 9 at 2019 8:41 PM

2019-06-09T20:41:39-04:00

If I was in your shoes. I would have called the MPs and had him arrested for disrespect and then they would have to contact his unit. I would then go to his unit and report him to his first Sargent.
I am pretty sure Top wouldn't want his unit representation like that.

Response by SFC Melvin Brandenburg made Jun 13 at 2019 9:52 AM

2019-06-13T09:52:56-04:00

There is a time and place for reason and discussion, and there is a time and place for other forms of communication.

Response by Sgt Steve Williams made Jun 14 at 2019 8:49 AM

2019-06-14T08:49:34-04:00

With no more information I wonder if this guy is actually a real soldier. Sounds like a civilian to me.

Response by MSgt Peter Vatistas made Jun 28 at 2019 5:26 PM

2019-06-28T17:26:40-04:00

As a Specialist, you probably should have found an NCO and let him know the situation. If there wasn't any around, you are obligated to correct him with an on-the-spot talking (just as you did), and walk away. Any good NCO would have that troop standing tall in his Commander's office so fast it would make his head spin.

Response by SGT Robert Schaefer made Jul 1 at 2019 9:14 AM

2019-07-01T09:14:08-04:00

Hello I was in the Army for 13 years. I was at the store General Jackson and a 1st SGT was stand there with his hands in his pockets in his uniform. So I walked up and said 1st SGT you might want to take your hands out of your pockets because in the store there were lower ranking solders like PVT'S,SPC'S and he gave me and attitude. I think he was mad because I corrected him.

Response by Sgt Mark Tarte made Jul 3 at 2019 10:50 PM

2019-07-03T22:50:03-04:00

OMG. Back in the day, even in the "Chair Force" I was in over 40 years ago, there would have been a junior enlisted man in the base hospital getting my size 12 EE combat boot removed from his butt! No way in hell is some punk going to do that to anyone, let alone a superior and get away with it.

Response by SGT George Gallant made Jul 5 at 2019 2:31 AM

2019-07-05T02:31:42-04:00

When I was in the United States Army back in the mid-60s you did not see much of this going on, but if you did and the individual was challenging your authority, well than you did what any good soldier did you went into the ring and settled it there and that was the end of it.

Response by SFC Nate Robertson made Jul 5 at 2019 3:21 PM

2019-07-05T15:21:23-04:00

If he tried to fight you. Why dident you stomp his ass. Ucmj dont say you cant use force to detain arrest or bring to justace anyone who is violating lawful orders. If your off post it may be a stolen valor Fuck lawfullly acting under free speech law unless he making a profit from his actions. Off post mind your own business unless you know them

Response by PFC Brian Hoyt made Jul 5 at 2019 7:31 PM

2019-07-05T19:31:44-04:00

It wasn't like that when I was in the Army. The slightest infraction caused you to get extra duty, an Article 15, or even a court marshal. Things changed after VN. But things like this have to be addressed. The big question here is why would the company this soldier belonged too, did not get on his case and tell him to straighten out his shit. When I was in the 82nd Airborne, even the need of a haircut, you were told to get it cut or else.

Response by PFC Bobby Smith made Jul 6 at 2019 2:36 PM

2019-07-06T14:36:41-04:00

I am a PFC-E3 I have no junior soldier

Response by PO2 James Tufaner made Jul 6 at 2019 5:57 PM

2019-07-06T17:57:24-04:00

In all my 56 years of being in our around active or non active. Never had to deal with it, even when I made E-5 PO-2 and ran the line shop, but everyone one of us were smart asses and we dealt with it.

Response by PO2 James Tufaner made Jul 6 at 2019 6:00 PM

2019-07-06T18:00:46-04:00

Sorry part 2. But to pull that BS, call the closest military law enforcement.

Response by SP6 Guy Slater made Jul 6 at 2019 8:04 PM

2019-07-06T20:04:31-04:00

I have commented on several others comments. Now for my own.

If said douchebag was off post AND was in the Army (and it is really sounding more that he was not, maybe he was JROTC?) you would get your ass in a crack providing the "behind the barracks" discipline.

In general, people in your command know enough not to play that game. Someone in another unit may not, and that is where tact, or lack of tact comes into play.

Tact is getting name and unit and reporting the incident, and requesting to know what actions were taken.

Lack of tact is the "behind the barracks" solution. And I don't really understand why this cannot occur in today's Army. it wasn't supposed to occur in my day either, but it did. And sometimes that type of corrective action makes for a better soldier, even if it is out of feal that his (her) butt may get whopped again.

Response by SSG Charles McDermott made Jul 7 at 2019 8:58 AM

2019-07-07T08:58:18-04:00

You should have called the MP

Response by SPC Henry Francis made Jul 7 at 2019 12:40 PM

2019-07-07T12:40:53-04:00

Doesn’t sound like he has ever been in the military. Pretender comes to mind. Not even a stolen valor case. At least they try to pretend they are something better than they are. This guy was displaying just what he is, a disheveled angry miscreant.
In general, for real military personnel, I would let their command handle it. If I know their command I would tell them what I’ve witnessed if it’s egregious. This one, maybe report to law enforcement and bring charges. I’m pretty sure that’s a punishable offense under UCMJ and if he’s a civilian they should remove him from the installation.

Response by CPT Robert Yurecka made Jul 7 at 2019 5:02 PM

2019-07-07T17:02:10-04:00

I was a company commander of a 5th Army MP Company at Fort Riley, KS after returning from Viet Nam in 1970. I encountered one particular lad from the 1st Division (Big Red 1) that was apparently going to soon separate from active duty. I believe he thought he was already a hippy civilian, since his appearance was sloppy and he was disrespectful of anyone of rank higher then E-4. While at the base hospital for a disturbance call, I again encountered this solder giving a female 1st lieutenant nurse a really hard time, and politely ask him to back down and let the nursing staff do their jobs. He didn't think it was any of my business, that he was there for sick call and needed medication.
I noted his name tag and of course the 1st Div patch. When I returned to my company area I asked my 1st Sgt to contact the Division CSM and ask him if he would counsel this young man.
The next time I saw this young solder, about two weeks later, was after a meeting in the 1st Div HQ. The unruly solder was working in the Div CSM's office. He was no longer and E-4 but an E-2. Also he was saying yes sir and yes mame to any officer and hard stripper E-5 and above in close proximity. I do believe if the CSM told him to jump, he would ask how high on the way up. I have always found that senior NCOs have a nack or skill when dealing with these situations.

Response by SFC Bob Johnson made Jul 7 at 2019 10:52 PM

2019-07-07T22:52:43-04:00

ALCON - I hear what everyone is saying on this thread and while unfortunate, there are those bad apples out there that spoil the bunch regardless of rank and position. If you are an Officer, you already have the upper hand on any EM (at least from a regulatory perspective). If you are an NCO, then anyone lower than your grade and or position can be put into check through the use of regulatory compliance. Remember, to lead isn't just through knowing your MOS/AFSC/Rate/Etc., you need to know what the regulations say; the MCM applies to all branches universally! Unfortunately, many leaders have forgotten that leading by example involves following the regulations (as closely as possible, but remembering to use common sense, grace, and forgiveness when necessary); sometimes, they can be gently reminded if your approach is professional and tactful for which they comply. However, those that don't care and are only there for a paycheck, title, or rank will probably be the ones who cop an attitude and go off on you; with them, just do your part professionally and let karma take its course. If you have subordinates, teach them the right way of leading, give them scenarios, have them do the research to find the answer, cite their sources and then reward them appropriately for their efforts. I hope that this helps!

Response by PFC John Lanni made Jul 8 at 2019 5:55 AM

2019-07-08T05:55:03-04:00

If identity is in question, that would be a concern for the Provost. On the issue of respect, that is something you can not demand however the uniform and rank deserve a certain amount of decorum. It is doubtful he learned this behavior at his unit and they probably have their hands full with him or her too. Probably would love to transfer him to your unit. Ha ha. Obviously this troop is not going show you any more respect by ratting him out like a little bitch so maybe by trying to reach this person and his problem may help rather than kicking someone when they are down. None of us is perfect including superiors. On more than one occasion I, we, in the company would deal with out of control NCO's in the company harassing troops after becoming highly intoxicated by mid day and on duty. This would upset the barracks for weeks and fill the whole company with dissension. Words and action matter and have consequences. Of course there is only so far you can go and an ass kicking is still on the menu. Hmmm! I'd try the get in his head, I don't know where he's been or how he got to where he is at now.

Response by MAJ Jim Hollingsworth made Jul 9 at 2019 4:45 AM

2019-07-09T04:45:31-04:00

That situation happened at the Lawton Mall near Fort Sill in 1982. I was in civilian clothes. I showed my ID, identified myself, described the behavior, and described the policy. The Soldier wasn't as articulate as yours. But he did say "Stop harassing me!" and turned away. I was a Second Lieutenant at the time, but I was also a prior-service NCO. As all good NCOs know the final step in the "On the spot corrections" process is to follow up and ensure the correction is made. I didn't know his unit, but I knew his name and rank. One phone call to Post Locator gave me his unit and their phone number. I called his First Sergeant. The next duty day the greatly embarrassed Soldier and I met with his First Sergeant in their Company Orderly Room. "Top" assured me he would handle things from there and I am sure he did.
In all situations such as this it is important to remember the intent is not to destroy a Soldier. It's to correct behavior. Every Soldier is valuable. Be respectful and be professional. That young Soldier will learn and be a better leader someday.
By the way, I admire how you did not ignore the behavior.

Response by MAJ Jim Hollingsworth made Jul 9 at 2019 4:54 AM

2019-07-09T04:54:28-04:00

You have his name and rank?
Call Post Locator.

Response by SP5 Chuck Tilley made Jul 10 at 2019 1:49 PM

2019-07-10T13:49:30-04:00

This Soldier has a real problem , sooner or later this will burn him . Surprised he has lasted as long as he had . If you knew who his command was you could have his problem addressed. Because it is his problem and not yours , karma will bite him in the ass soon enough.

Response by SGT(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 12 at 2019 3:28 PM

2019-07-12T15:28:37-04:00

Can you describe the patch? Maybe others can help you with that part?

Response by SP5 George Traylor made Jul 14 at 2019 10:45 PM

2019-07-14T22:45:07-04:00

clear case of stolen valor.

Response by 1stSgt Timothy Phillips made Aug 4 at 2019 9:40 AM

2019-08-04T09:40:49-04:00

I would push and push until I found what unit he was in and go have a talk with his senior NCO's. His life would be total hell until he saw the light and straightened out. Not straightening out would get him kicked out of the Army. I know this, because I used it on recalcitrant/belligerent Marines when I was on active duty. Someone like him does not belong in the Army. You get his Staff NCO's on him and eventually he will do something that will lead to NJP. NJP usually leads to more NJP's. You get enough of them and you are gone.

Response by MSgt J D McKee made Aug 4 at 2019 12:36 PM

2019-08-04T12:36:30-04:00

Army ranks are fucked up (no insult, just don't understand) so no idea if you are an NCO--but if you are, you do know you have the legal authority to place any military member under apprehension, which civilians call arrest? Even no shit officers (provided it's to prevent disgrace to service, et al and you'd better be able to articulate) can be arrested by NCO's. But tried to fight? Loud noises are indicated in the treatment plan.

Response by SFC Tom Crenshaw made Aug 4 at 2019 12:48 PM

2019-08-04T12:48:34-04:00

Mil bases actually house awols, they go around in uniform and eat at messhalls, use gyms for showers and sleep in their cars. Free riding until caught. Sounds like you found one. MPs would have photos of them. Take a pic and see the MPs.

Response by SSG Chris Allsopp made Aug 5 at 2019 11:29 AM

2019-08-05T11:29:02-04:00

it is very likely you've come across a poser whom is not a soldier. my recommendation is to make note of name, and rank. report offenses to your command and make sure to ask what unit there in before trying to utilize corrective actions.

Response by SPC Steven Nihipali made Aug 12 at 2019 4:43 AM

2019-08-12T04:43:20-04:00

should have rung that bitches bell! throat punched his ass and hung him on the outside basketball hoop. Call your unit S1, describe the patch and let them find the little shit... most likely, he was NG or Reserve... that might help too

Response by SFC John Fourquet made Aug 31 at 2019 10:08 AM

2019-08-31T10:08:26-04:00

This is a classic example of failure of NCO leadership. Too many NCOs are failing and At their jobs. Someday this piece of feces will be an NCO & his soldiers will behave the same way. The CSM of the Army needs to discipline back to the NCO corps and make NCOs responsible for their soldiers behavior. STOP PROMOTING PEOPLE JUST TO FILL A SLOT!!

Response by SFC Melvin Brandenburg made Feb 29 at 2020 12:06 AM

2020-02-29T00:06:44-05:00

Definitely get a picture. I think I would have also let him strike me several times. Then taken him down, restrained him, and called the MPs. I would make sure there were witnesses. I wouldn't strike him, but I would definitely take him down and restrained him. Having a shitty attitude is one thing, but striking an NCO is another. Worth at least a field grade. And as long as I was simply restraining, it would have been a clear case of self defense.

Response by MSG Donald Onley made Oct 24 at 2020 11:22 PM

2020-10-24T23:22:43-04:00

I joined the Army back in 1966 and retired in 1993 back then I would have kicked his ass and the best man will be left standing be left. These days I would lose ever strip that the Army gave me the first young solider that told me F---k you baster he would be eating my boot or having it stuck up his ass be safe Don't do as I do but follow your orders I am just from the old school. I loved my country and I fought for my country and I would do it today if they would have me stay sharp stand tall this is the best country in this world

Response by SSgt Christophe Murphy made Nov 21 at 2020 10:32 PM

2020-11-21T22:32:32-05:00

Not recognizing a patch isn’t as big a problem compared to everything else you described.

Nothing really matters if you can’t identify the Solider and their parent command.

Response by SFC Melvin Brandenburg made Mar 4 at 2021 11:27 AM

2021-03-04T11:27:09-05:00

A lot depends whether or not there are witnesses...walls...and time for counseling...

Response by CPT William Jones made Jun 4 at 2021 12:06 AM

2021-06-04T00:06:46-04:00

If I couldn’t get I’d to include unit from him I would have him detained with my people. Then get protest martial people involved and we will find out all about the person. When their CO was located inform him of what happened and ash him what he was going to do about it. But it wasn’t then nor now that hard to find out who a person on post is. Especially on today’s posts.

Response by SSG Ronalda Frank made Sep 6 at 2021 8:14 AM

2021-09-06T08:14:03-04:00

In this world we are living right now we have to many important issues to tackle. Let KARMA take over. He will find someone to correct his attitude and guide him to the next level.