How do you properly deal with a superior who does not adhere to regulations?

2015-06-14T15:07:18-04:00

I am sure this type of topic has been brought up somewhere else but I cant find it and am looking for advice. In brief my specific situation is as follows:

My base is FPCON Bravo , my ship shares the pier with another ship and when I was standing as the Anti Terrorism Watch Officer the other day I got informed that the upper chain of command on the other ship (Ship A) consistently refuses to open their bags up to the compulsory bag check when entering the pier ( that's a 100% , all personnel identification and baggage check). At our entry control point the guard is supplied by both ships. When discussing this with the sentries after watch they informed me that guards from ship A ( the other ship) were directed not to enforce the entry and exit procedures on their upper chain. My upper chain plays by the rules.

I think there is a National defense act and other guidance that states " consent to search" when entering a controlled area but I cant find it and I would like guidance on how to address this situation.

Beside the obvious disregard for posted policy and the poor example being "above the rules" sets, I am more concerned that this practice is dangerous to allow to continue in the name of security as it breeds complacency.

**UPDATE**

I reported it to my XO who in turn referred it to our CO, they agree that it is an issue and are going to handle it at the command level. While we do share security of the pier, we are not the senior ship (SOPA) as such it is more difficult to get them to comply and I have been told to be patient on the issue. We have instructed our sentries that if someone can confirm them as the CO, XO or CMC of the ship them to not press the issue while this is being resolved. We joked about putting their pictures up with a " do not search " sign but recognize that as antagonistic and a further security threat.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 14 at 2015 3:19 PM

2015-06-14T15:19:35-04:00

Send your report up your chain of command, sir, as I believe you are Ship-B. Let your Captain handle the situation, since this is an inter-ship issue and compromises the security of boths Ships A and B.

If your Captain plays by the rules, he will handle it.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jun 14 at 2015 3:29 PM

2015-06-14T15:29:25-04:00

Report it up your CoC Ensign. If your CO is Pier SOPA he/she should be able to fix it on the lowest level possible. If not, he/she can take it higher. You're doing the right thing by addressing it/asking for advice.

Response by PO2 David Hagwood made Jun 14 at 2015 3:29 PM

2015-06-14T15:29:43-04:00

When I correct a superior, it's done respectfully and with discretion. Don't do it in the presence of subordinates. Everyone must be held to the same rules, regulations, and standards. For example, I've known of a base commander to get fined by an MA for violating a base traffic law. The perception can not be given that if you have seniority, you can bend/break rules without consequence. That causes a breakdown in order, discipline, and respect for senior leadership.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 14 at 2015 3:48 PM

2015-06-14T15:48:11-04:00

FPCON Bravo is there for a reason. That Ship A blatantly disregards this is a major security problem. It needs to be reported up your chain to be handled by an appropriate officer.

Response by SSG Roger Ayscue made Jun 14 at 2015 6:14 PM

2015-06-14T18:14:13-04:00

Sir:
I would relay my concern to the Upper chain from your vessel. Your Command may be able to get the command from the other ship to comply. If that does not work, then the upper chain from your ship should then refer it to the Base Command, or the Provost Marshall

Response by SCPO Joshua I made Jun 14 at 2015 6:28 PM

2015-06-14T18:28:15-04:00

Call your CDO or senior section leader. One of them will probably be happy to deal with it.

Response by LT Devin Rojas made Jun 14 at 2015 11:16 PM

2015-06-14T23:16:27-04:00

I want to thank all of you for your quick responses. I think that informing my CoC is the best action in this case and will let the captains battle it out. My concern is that exception for the top 3 will turn into all Department Heads then all officers , then senior enlisted etc... and that it makes its way over to my ship. From recent news we know unfortunately that service members do sometimes mean harm or theft from each other.

Response by Capt Mark Strobl made Jun 15 at 2015 1:32 AM

2015-06-15T01:32:28-04:00

There's a lot of factors that could lead to incongruent enforcement of the rules (e.g. "bag check) at the pier. First, I will assert that both CO "A" and "B" share the concerns and, or course, the responsibilities of pier-side security. From your brief summary, I'd suppose that CO "A" and "B" are not enforcing the order, as you perceive, congruently.

Use your chain of command first. Also, I would strongly recommend that you take any verified concerns to your Div-O. If your ship rates a Master at Arms (MA), take your concern to that office as well. Before any accusations are made, you'd best have your proverbial ducks in a line. Know the order(s). Know the applicable directives. And gather your facts.

Response by Cpl Samuel Ward made Jun 15 at 2015 1:46 AM

2015-06-15T01:46:03-04:00

Go above his head and report it, report it to the officer of the day. You have a duty to guard said entry to ship, this may have some backlash but at least you know you have done the right thing.

Response by PO2 Skip Kirkwood made Jun 15 at 2015 7:32 AM

2015-06-15T07:32:52-04:00

Major (all the way at the bottom)....... Except that if a test ringer slips by, and is not properly checked, it will be the ENS who will get the letter of reprimand or whatever!

In my day on an SSBN I believe those guys were called ZULU 2 OSCAR....and God help you if they slipped by with the monkey photo on the ID card.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Jun 15 at 2015 1:52 PM

2015-06-15T13:52:48-04:00

I wonder if you ask for a courtesy inspection of the pier and the ships. Let a neutral party be the bad guy.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 15 at 2015 8:25 PM

2015-06-15T20:25:33-04:00

https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/32/552.18

Look up DOD instruction 5525.15.
The link is the federal law granting base commanders the authority to search, the DODI is the the department of defense guidance to the individual services regarding searches and implied consent while on a military installation.
Sorry I can't help finding something uniquely navy, I just don't know where to look, but I'm betting that there is something at the installation level from the way the instruction is written.

Response by PO1 Kerry French made Jun 16 at 2015 2:02 AM

2015-06-16T02:02:09-04:00

Justy saw the update... but for future reference, tread very carefully... Learn to pick your battles... if it is a gross violation (jeapordizes the safety of the crew or the ship) then yes, report it up the chain of command. Also, when you do report, keep some kind of proof somewhere safe off the ship. You never know when you may need it.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 17 at 2015 2:35 PM

2015-06-17T14:35:43-04:00

Considering I'm an enlisted dirty blue shirt and I take my job seriously. They give me a gun and tell me to guard the boat. If my CO tells me to search every bag then you will open your bag or you are not coming across my pier. If your CO is worth anything he will back you. If the officers above you are worth anything they will comply. Develop a backbone, and tell them to open their damn bag. If they don't like it they can file a complaint.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 17 at 2015 5:40 PM

2015-06-17T17:40:31-04:00

In addition to what has been mentioned, you may want to reach out to the CMEO and/or legal.

Response by CWO3 Jeff Metcalf made Jun 18 at 2015 6:15 AM

2015-06-18T06:15:53-04:00

ENS,
Title 18 US Code. 100% means 100% regardless of rank or position. The ship is, in effect, a tenant and subject to the policies of the installation commander.
Warrant (SECO)

Response by CPT Chris Loomis made Jul 25 at 2015 9:43 AM

2015-07-25T09:43:50-04:00

When I correct a superior its out of public view and not in front of anyone else. It's respectful and tactful.

I recently observed a SPC assisting a SSG in unfucking his uniform (this SSG albeit technically amazing looked like hammered shit). The SPC did so in public, but with great respect and tact. My only issue was that it was done in public.

I'm a HUGE proponent of praising in public and scolding behind closed doors.

Response by MSgt Nathan Krawitz made May 8 at 2019 6:51 PM

2019-05-08T18:51:39-04:00

I'm sure when the squadron or group commander catches wind of this, corrective action will be applied. Senior commanders have lost their jobs for less.

When a sentry or deck watch is doing their job, they are direct representatives of the commander who put them there, and (lawful) orders carry the same weight as that commander. A pier watch might be assigned to a particular ship, whose CO is the one "giving" standard orders, but that pier watch itself is assigned by an officer senior to every CO on that pier, even if outranked. If DesRon this or CruDesGru that or some CarGru is in direct contol of that pier, they normally have certain authority over all ship performing various roles. A DesRon commodore might be a junior captain outranked by a cruiser or carrier CO, but positional authority exists and is extended. So if the rules state more thorough inspections, you flipping comply. I don't care if it's a Seaman Apprentice from another ship. His authority came from a boss who outranks you, and most likely from regulations derived from the SORM, which have higher backing, CNO, SecNav or SecDef.