How important is wisdom in today's military leadership?

COL Mikel J. Burroughs — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 09:28:17 -0500

Where do you rank "wisdom" in conjunction with other leadership attributes or characteristics? Can it be taught or does it develop over time? Is there such a thing as young wisdom versus old wisdom?

Share your thoughts about the importance of wisdom in today's military leadership? Is it present today in our leadership, are we losing it, and will it be there for in the future?

Should we place a higher emphasis on Wisdom during junior and senior leadership training?

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Feb 25 at 2018 10:01 AM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:01:47 -0500

Wisdom is an affect of life experiences, education and upbringing. It is the process through which people choose to process their life’s experiences that determines how much, and when the develop wisdom. There are many who never develop wisdom, young or old. The spark that ignites wisdom is the desire to do right in the world. If one does not have a “Care in the world”, the will likely be devoid of the type of wisdom that contributes to one becomming strong leader.

As for old and young wisdom, i agree with this as when we are young we are presented with the same or similar life’s challenges as our parents, and communities, we just face them on a diffferent level. As stated earlier it is how we approach life and our desire to contribute positively that determines if we develop wisdom. Thank you all for your service.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Feb 25 at 2018 10:02 AM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:02:35 -0500

I rank wisdom at the top of the list after trustworthiness.

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Feb 25 at 2018 10:17 AM

Capt Tom Brown — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:17:17 -0500

Kinda like experience and lessons learned.

Response by Lt Col Charlie Brown made Feb 25 at 2018 10:32 AM

Lt Col Charlie Brown — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:32:53 -0500

Wisdom is the ability to learn from experience. IMHO, not every seems to be able to do that. Some people seem to grow in widom as they mature. Others, not so much.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2018 10:38 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:38:22 -0500

Wisdom is very inspiring if you know how to pass it on. If somebody is a prick and acts like a "know it all," then they can have all the wisdom in the world but nobody will want to listen to them.

Response by SPC Margaret Higgins made Feb 25 at 2018 10:39 AM

SPC Margaret Higgins — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 10:39:59 -0500

COL Mikel J. Burroughs: When I was a Squad Leader, in the Army, I made every effort to think of my Squad member's needs before my own. I believe that wisdom is gained through experience.

Response by SSG Warren Swan made Feb 25 at 2018 11:00 AM

SSG Warren Swan — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 11:00:23 -0500

Sir years ago it would've been the most important thing alongside experience. Now I'm not so sure. With Sequestration, "Zero-Defect Army", "Up and Out", and revisions on what seems to be everything we hold dear, except wisdom and experience I feel that it's not required. If you can BS with the best, look like a model in uniform, have a 600 on a 300 point APFT, and be an insufferable ass to your subordinates, forget any creed out there except where you put in the part when you will be promoted ahead of peers.

Once upon an Army, getting an Art15 was a way of life. It was either expected you'd get one, or at least be recommended for it. Most who got them I knew, took it on the chin, manned up (even when rank was lost), and if allowed to stay in, were some of the best leaders I ever had. For those I knew who were not allowed to stay in, even they were some of the best being once they got over the hurt and pain of the incident, they still knew many of us were still there, and would talk to us off post whenever we got together. They'd tell us not to screw up like them. For me almost all of the SNCO's I had received an Art15 they bounced back from. You can't do that anymore. You won't recover from it. So that wisdom is gone the second the offender is. I came in under "Be All That You Can Be, Get An Edge On Life in the Army". I considered it a badge of honor being it was used when my father was in, and I hated when it became "Army Strong" (dude running the wrong way with his Alice large....still haven't lived that one down from my friends in sister services). Now they should bring back "Be All That You Can Be" with a correction of "Be All That YOU Can Be Screw The Rest" get an edge on your peers in the Army". Wisdom and Experience is not required.

For anyone who thinks I'm just a salty ass for what I said, It's not that I am upset or bothered by anything I did in my career. I had great leaders, but was a hardhead, and got what I deserved, maybe less than. I'm more bothered by what I've seen towards the end of my time with the speed changes that were implemented, removed, reimplimented, revised, removed, wash rinse repeat with better names that for the first time gave equal screwing to everyone without the chance to be right, do right but what's not popular, only what you can do to help yourself and your career. But we got a new APFU, ASU's, Multi-Cam, and soon Pinks and Greens. We also have higher TRICARE rates, service branches who won't levy their strength on the VA, and politics in the ranks at levels I've never seen before, discussed openly like I've never seen before, and blatant disrespect for elected officials that before would've had your ass in a sling, but is accepted. Wisdom and Experience would've told troops to not give up your beliefs, do not sacrifice your beliefs, but we are apolitical in uniform and you will maintain that standard no matter what you believe.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Feb 25 at 2018 11:15 AM

CPT Jack Durish — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 11:15:09 -0500

Wisdom is a rare, very rare commodity. Thankfully, it isn't a requisite for leaders though people with wisdom are leaders without authority. The wisest man in America, for me, is Mike Rowe. I pray that no one ever lures him into seeking elected office. That ruins a person.

I prefer my leaders to have principles and common sense, very uncommon commodities

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Feb 25 at 2018 11:30 AM

SGM Bill Frazer — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 11:30:10 -0500

Leadership without wisdom is a scary thought. Anyone can follow the regs, training manuals-but I think wisdom provides the temperance to do it smartly, humanly -letting you guide your people instead of hammering them. To my mind i it also curbs a lot of " Do as I say, not as I do".

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2018 2:52 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 14:52:38 -0500

As true wisdom can only come from both experience, successes, and failures, it is very uncommon with current leadership. The Army of today is so risk averse that only those officers who have had no failures, can really make rank. The absence of failures in military operations actually indicates an officer who lacks the will to stretch the envelope to accomplish a mission and generally lacks the willingness to throw out the book and think for him or herself. These are the prime prerequisites, of carrierism, timidity and the ability to scapegoat other officers for their own poor decision making. One example, what general worth his salt would have an affair with one of his junior officer's wife! Who would send his assets into an unknown situation, with inadequate intelligence, no emergency exfil plan or QRF prepped, and no air support already in the air or in a forward position? A four star General "H".

Response by Sgt Wayne Wood made Feb 25 at 2018 3:29 PM

Sgt Wayne Wood — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 15:29:14 -0500

wisdom (or lack thereof) has never been an operant criteria for leadership (as far as i know)

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Feb 25 at 2018 5:35 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 17:35:35 -0500

To me leadership is using experience, know what is true or false, and striving to see the big picture.

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 25 at 2018 8:02 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 25 Feb 2018 20:02:50 -0500

COL Burroughs, good question and food for thought. I once had my Company Commander, Who by the way was a Mustang Officer like myself asked me the same exact question you are asking us. First I would ask what is the difference between wisdom and the other leadership attributes or characteristics? Then I would give my best advice or answer. Which I believe I said to my C.O. “Wisdom is something you learned from making mistakes in the past so in the future you won’t do it again. Funny thing is we all know about history and our lessons learned whether in combat or peacetime.But do we have the Wisdom to learn from our past mistakes and not keep on repeating them over and over again. Again just this Marines opinion. Semper Fi COL B... Have a great day Sir!

Response by Alan K. made Feb 26 at 2018 3:57 PM

Alan K. — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 15:57:00 -0500

I just had a Deja' Vu moment when reading this...Thought I commented but apparently didn't. That said, I cannot comment on today's military....I can however throw my pennies in the ring on how to acquire it. Wisdom is gained through experience, good or bad. Can it be taught to you or is there a way to gain it through others? NO, unless you experience it you don't own it, if you don't own it, you have not the true appreciation of the situation. Wisdom is gained through experience, which makes young wisdom or taught wisdom an oxymoron, IMHO. However to model ones behavior, apprentice and be mentored by a person of great wisdom would surely speed the process. If proper decision making was the core of the teaching......True wisdom comes through decision making, Good or bad. That leads to experience, which gives you "Wisdom". There are exception to the rule like anything else, but that is generally how it works. That was a lot of typing....I need a nap!

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Feb 26 at 2018 4:14 PM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 16:14:10 -0500

I had several C O's that had wisdom, they started as E M's, a couple I had tried to tell me how to drive the vehicle when I was C O's driver, they were the ones that normally backed into trees or ran something over when they grabbed the vehicle.

Response by Capt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 26 at 2018 6:31 PM

Capt Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 18:31:03 -0500

Wisdom tends to follow unwise choices.

Response by TSgt David L. made Feb 26 at 2018 11:25 PM

TSgt David L. — Mon, 26 Feb 2018 23:25:34 -0500

A wise man will get men to follow readily. Without wisdom men are made to follow. Not leadership, IMO.

Response by Col Reed Bonadonna made Feb 27 at 2018 11:10 AM

Col Reed Bonadonna — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:10:09 -0500

Socrates argues that it is, everlastingly, in Laches, his dialogue with an Athenian general. How else do we know what's worth killing and dying for, because we're told?

Response by CSM Richard Welsch made Feb 27 at 2018 1:42 PM

CSM Richard Welsch — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 13:42:23 -0500

I Remember are Sargent straight out of West Point to the Stan.He was a smart guy but had no leader ship skills and we found it hard to follow someone like that.Im not sure of things have changed but I Fell they need to prover they have true leadership skills.A true leader runs towards the fire and has the plan of attack or flank and Their is nothing wrong with brain storming with your Battles because in the end it’s about camaraderie .

Response by PO1 Ron Clark made Feb 27 at 2018 2:32 PM

PO1 Ron Clark — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 14:32:50 -0500

It think a lot of the wisdom in the military has become (OBE) Overcome By Events, due to some our best wisdom being forced out due to new policies, political correctness and by advancing people who have no leadership qualities, wisdom or anything else. I said policies due to the "Up or Out" policy, the implementation in the 80's of Push button NCO's without spending very much time in the lower ranks. Advancing to NCO before you hone up your leadership qualities and or abilities to lead! Back in the old days when you made a rank unless it was a battlefield promotion you had time to observe real leaders lead, you had people who mentored you and showed you an example of what and how it is supposed to be done, most days now all you have is someone learning these important skills through schools and some type of test or book, not someone who is leading by example and experience and has that wisdom you emphasized in your statement! There is old wisdom of learned experience, and there are those people who are born with mother-wit! The ability to make smart common sense judgement calls and decisions based upon their knowledge and work experience. Young they may be but they also have the ability to make smart decisions as well as someone senior because they care about their career or job. I will get off my soap box now! Lol!

Response by SPC Douglas Bolton made Feb 27 at 2018 3:56 PM

SPC Douglas Bolton — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 15:56:36 -0500

COL Mikel J. Burroughs We have leaders, but some do not have much wisdom. Wisdom is learned through trials, and storms. Some leaders never have felt that because they always had what they wanted.

Response by CPT Scott Sharon made Feb 27 at 2018 4:19 PM

CPT Scott Sharon — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 16:19:53 -0500

I have been out of the military too long to comment on today's military. However, in Vietnam, I placed wisdom near or at the top because I witnessed wisdom saving lives several times.

Response by Sgt John H. made Feb 27 at 2018 4:34 PM

Sgt John H. — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 16:34:15 -0500

Wisdom is the backbone of all decision making... experience and common sense are supporting ribs.

Response by SSgt Boyd Herrst made Feb 27 at 2018 4:48 PM

SSgt Boyd Herrst — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 16:48:13 -0500

I reported back after a TDRL(Temp Disab Ret. leave and missed out on a deploy and got saddled with several Reserve Airmen to help me provide sustenance to those using the Airmen’s Dining Facility.... This was my chance to shine and show these Airmen what I learned at the Comm college I went to., I took what what we had
and between us we put out some really nice lunches and dinners.. depending if we worked lunch or dinner shift..
After 4 days of busting tail putting out quality meals, there was a meeting.. a few times it seems a wrench was thrown in to make it harder.. (had the menu switched to make it easier on the less experienced shift.. we both had inexperienced Airmen to put the meals out with.. it was in how did the production.. ). I had come in that night before my lunch shift and done some work..,to make it less laborsome on us.. I cooked the Roasts and cooled them
And all we had to do is slice and pan them and do a few other things.. I’m not saying there was a conspiracy, but i believe there may have been.. between the mid shift crew and the other shift leader and the Assist. Dining Hall Facility Supervisor.. They were buds from before I got there ..
and I would deal with it.. I went in and found the menu switched.. not a prob.,
We would handle it. And we did., They
Got our beef and we got their Roast chicken quarters.. We cooked them halfway in the big kettles as half chickens.. then grilled them .. we produced gravy out of the stock
Before panning we quarter and panned them We did roasted potatoes and veggies in the steamer.. We also had another entree switch they did on us and I changed that to the grill( meatloaf became sslibury steak... WE still pulled off Aus jus style sauce with mushrooms for the Salisburys.. I kinda bit the bullet about switching meatloaf to Salisbury and since it came out good.. (I had a trump card on them.. they switched my meal on me, so I shouldn’t catch heck for Changing the meatloaf.. we prob’ly could of done better leaving the ground beef as meat loaf... I didn’t have enough oven space.. . I had all them Reserve cooks and made use of them.. (and I still had some that were off duty . To work the following days.., I definitely got tested ..
and after it actually felt good to be able to show what I knew. Much credit went to the Airmen and NCOs that worked with me.. we got compliments and criticism..
some were half-n-half... the criticisms were why was the menu switched..? I left the explanation to the big guy.. what he said was satisfactory... from those I read..

Response by Amn Ed Stiefvater made Feb 27 at 2018 7:32 PM

Amn Ed Stiefvater — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 19:32:14 -0500

I think the better question is how often do we see wisdom used in todays military leadership?

Response by SP5 Robert Ruck made Feb 28 at 2018 12:57 PM

SP5 Robert Ruck — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 12:57:39 -0500

I believe wisdom is an inherent trait in true leaders. But, a huge but, it must be developed along the path of life. Each experience is a chance to learn and to become wizened as to how to resolve problems. It is up to each person to utilize the wisdom or not. Wise people learn to take advantage of each opportunity to learn from experience. These are the great leaders.

Response by Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 7:44 PM

Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 19:44:57 -0500

Thank you for this soul searching question, Col. Wisdom is the #1 attribute of a Leader, in my book.
James 1:5 (KJV)
5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
Ask GOD, HE has never failed to enlighten my mind when I called on HIM for help !!! HOORAH !!!

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 8:58 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 20:58:19 -0500

It came with time for me Sir. And, a lot of lesson learning.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 1 at 2018 11:33 AM

CW3 Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:33:54 -0500

Interesting question. Usually, one associates wisdom with experience. I'm wiser than my 19 yr old self. Not smarter, but wiser. Not sure you can emphasize wisdom in lieutenants. Some are sharp folks but wisdom? I hope by the time officers are at the O4-O5 level, they are 'wise'.

Response by Mara Hedin made Mar 1 at 2018 11:53 AM

Mara Hedin — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:53:10 -0500

I think typically wisdom comes with age and experience, but I think "younger" leaders/folks can have a great intuition and willingness to gain that wisdom and to learn from their experiences.

Response by MSG Mark Million made Mar 1 at 2018 11:54 AM

MSG Mark Million — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:54:29 -0500

My opinion on wisdom in the military today is that it is wise to just deal with all of the politically correct platitudes that are what in my opinion, is making todays military a shadow of what it had been if former years. The problem with wisdom in the military today is that in order to utilize it you have to be able to override common sense, in many cases due to the current politically correct atmosphere. It's not all bad, however I do believe political correctness does cut down on the fighting effectiveness of today's military.

Response by CPL Dave Hoover made Mar 1 at 2018 12:19 PM

CPL Dave Hoover — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:19:12 -0500

COL Mikel J. Burroughs There are many important ingredients that makes a great leader, without wisdom however, they are weakened. Wisdom is the operation manual for thoughs characteristics and ties them all together. Wisdom = Working Knowledge.

Response by SFC Greg Bruorton made Mar 1 at 2018 12:19 PM

SFC Greg Bruorton — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:19:20 -0500

Some great responses have thus been provided so I'll add a snippet to them:
When God was asked by Solomon that he may be given wisdom that attribute was quickly provided, telling me that wisdom is high among the attributes desired in life.

But despite all his wisdom, Solomon allowed the pleasures of man to bring him down.

Response by CPO Charles Helms made Mar 1 at 2018 12:58 PM

CPO Charles Helms — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:58:31 -0500

Not sure any more as the Navy continues to purge the senior enlisted ranks!!

Response by SFC Jerry Sodan made Mar 1 at 2018 12:59 PM

SFC Jerry Sodan — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:59:00 -0500

I believe wisdom is how one reacts mentally and physically to situations. It must be learned through experience. As a senior NCO I reflected on the leaders I had served under. I did my very best to emulate what they did well and attempted to not do things that they didn’t do well. If you are don’t make mistakes you don’t truly learn. So wisdom, in my view, is a learned process. It can be young or old.

Response by SPC Tom DeSmet made Mar 1 at 2018 1:46 PM

SPC Tom DeSmet — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 13:46:28 -0500

I believe wisdom can not be based upon knowledge only. It takes experience AND knowledge to fall intro the realm of wisdom. I don't believe wisdom is necessary for a true leader of men. There are many other traits you must have for leadership, but wisdom would definitely help make others follow you.

Response by Cpl Kevin Partlow made Mar 1 at 2018 2:29 PM

Cpl Kevin Partlow — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 14:29:14 -0500

Wisdom has to be sought after. Age alone does not bring wisdom although a wise person who ages is experienced and wise which is a valuable combination. Wisdom is essential for good leadership.

Response by GySgt Charles O'Connell made Mar 1 at 2018 2:55 PM

GySgt Charles O'Connell — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 14:55:30 -0500

Leadership Wisdom, would be more of a philosophy, encompassing not only leadership traits and principles, but the experience of the leader. Wisdom is subjective.

Response by PO3 Phyllis Maynard made Mar 1 at 2018 3:03 PM

PO3 Phyllis Maynard — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 15:03:51 -0500

COL Mikel J. Burroughs I have read a few of the responses. I was taught not to reinvent the wheel. The responders are articulating the very beliefs I have on the subject. Those core societal elements that are being constitutional eliminated, declining rules and morals, watered down education, and so many other aspects of society that are decaying need to get back in our psychi.

Response by SSgt Bruce Probert made Mar 1 at 2018 3:14 PM

SSgt Bruce Probert — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 15:14:31 -0500

Wisdom is the collective knowledge going back generations. In our profession the lessons learned were paid for in blood, we should take care to pass on this precious knowledge on to the next generation. We hear a lot about thinking outside of the box but unless you define the box first by what reference do you go by. There are no real shortcuts to wisdom, a good starting point is study and learning to listen It's very difficult to learn much when you are doing the talking. While it is important to study successful commanders, the study of spectacular failure has as much value, teaching you what not to do. Any leader that doesn't ground himself in the history of his profession is a fool. Good leaders are prepared, they have studied the successes and failures of those who have gone before and will be miles ahead of those reinventing the wheel unnecessarily. Paradigms are made to be broken when they've become impediments to success. Leaders need to be open to seeing the trees in the forest and acting accordingly. The naval battles around Guadalcanal high light the need for commanders to be on top of new technology as the radar wasn't used effectively, The battle out comes could have hugely different as the later battles showed effective use of radar and dramatically different results. We need to be able to fight successfully in any environment using any weapon from butt stock and bayonet to precision rocket artillery. There is no short cut to wisdom it takes work, dedication to detail and an open mind.

Response by Lt Col Bill Fletcher made Mar 1 at 2018 4:31 PM

Lt Col Bill Fletcher — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 16:31:10 -0500

In my opinion, Wisdom and Compassion are the 2 main points. If you have both you can go far and your Troops will follow you. You also need the physical ability to complete the Mission but that is third and only really necessary in physically demanding jobs (combat arms)

Response by SPC Daniel Rankin made Mar 1 at 2018 5:00 PM

SPC Daniel Rankin — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 17:00:16 -0500

As Solomon said, And this does still apply today, Knowledge is good, But knowledge without wisdom is for fools. I watched the original movie Paton last night and I saw the man get frustrated because he had to work with a lot of foolish men. He saw what needed to be done and in a wise manner, but he worked with foolish men, And yes that did include Eisenhower. When they finally let Patton loose he started to win battles. He was a brilliant strategist and knew his war history. He also knew his enemy. So yes wisdom does go with knowledge.

Response by SFC Robert Walton made Mar 1 at 2018 5:01 PM

SFC Robert Walton — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 17:01:03 -0500

Wisdom is Amassed by tons of trial and error. IMHO Not just yours but every one around you and more importantly the People that raised and groomed you, if you took the time to listen. How ever I fear it is now a dying art which in time will ruin what we have now, may not be today or the next but it will come hopefully we will have enough people left with real wisdom to pass it forward to those who will Listen. Just my thoughts.

Response by CMSgt Steve Pennington made Mar 1 at 2018 5:28 PM

CMSgt Steve Pennington — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 17:28:42 -0500

Wisdom often comes with the experience, and as often the experience of something that did not work out as planned. Sometimes surviving the experience leaves one with the wisdom to learn from it.

Response by LTC John Griscom made Mar 1 at 2018 5:29 PM

LTC John Griscom — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 17:29:37 -0500

From personal experience, I think wisdom can be taught and developed over time. Learned a lot from the senior NCOs when I first entered service and think more of it developed observing how things were done (some good, some not).
Wisdom should rank high for the need to know how to function in the surrounding environment and adapt to changes that affect that environment.
It needs to be taught at all levels to be able to understand how decisions can impact on personnel and organizations that must deal with those decisions.

Response by SGT Roger Bunton made Mar 1 at 2018 6:10 PM

SGT Roger Bunton — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 18:10:25 -0500

I believe that wisdom comes with experience. That can be as simple as listening to those around you who have many life experiences....and listening is wisdom.

Response by SSgt Gary Andrews made Mar 1 at 2018 6:53 PM

SSgt Gary Andrews — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 18:53:43 -0500

IMHO, wisdom is a blend of formal education, experience, and common sense. The ratio of each varies from person to person. You can be light in one or two of those areas as long as you are strong in the other.....and still achieve wisdom. How important is it? It's everything.

Response by CW5 John M. made Mar 1 at 2018 8:15 PM

CW5 John M. — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 20:15:39 -0500

Experience and wisdom often go hand-in-hand. “The school of hard knocks” teaches wisdom to the “humbled”.

Response by 1SG Klayton W. Hayes made Mar 2 at 2018 1:12 AM

1SG Klayton W. Hayes — Fri, 02 Mar 2018 01:12:01 -0500

Wisdom is that inate factor that kicks in when the hair on the back of your neck warns you that fire and brimstone are about to wreck your day. Today’s Army IMHO are lead by bean counters who had a successful stint as a Recruiter and are conditioned to put unrealistic goals on others to punch their ticket.

Response by Col Robert Wallace made Mar 2 at 2018 1:20 AM

Col Robert Wallace — Fri, 02 Mar 2018 01:20:33 -0500

Hello Col. Burroughs and RP members. Where would I rank "wisdom" in the hierarchy of leadership? In my opinion, it would not be first but somewhere after "Respect". Yes, missions may be accomplished but not smoothly without it. As for "wisdom", I sort it into two categories - academic/educational; common sense. I know of engineers who are well qualified in their particular fields of engineering but lack common sense knowledge. To be a successful leader, the two areas of wisdom cannot be separated but must be in conjunction with each other. If they do not coexist within a "leader", it can lead to unpleasant attitudes by subordinates. I'm sure you all have heard the phrase more than once - "I respect the rank, not the person". Why? Is it because the leader has"widom" in only the academic category, not both? That is my belief in "wisdom" in the hierarchy of leadership.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 3 at 2018 7:29 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 03 Mar 2018 19:29:24 -0500

Wisdom is definitely developed by experience, unfortunately we aren't given the opportunity to grow and experience much. I have to agree with SSG Warren Swan. We are becoming risk averse and it's affecting the professional growth aspect of the force.

Response by Capt Christian D. Orr made Mar 4 at 2018 4:03 AM

Capt Christian D. Orr — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 04:03:19 -0500

Wisdom CAN be taught AND it can be developed over time--the two notions aren't mutually exclusive.

Alas, in this day & age of political correctness, "safe spaces," and Tide pod-eating millennials, alas, wisdom and common sense are endangered species.

Response by A1C Ian Williams made Mar 4 at 2018 10:26 AM

A1C Ian Williams — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 10:26:44 -0500

Very good query, sir COL Mikel J. Burroughs Wisdom is vital to leadership in today's military leadership. The ability to effectively lead is contingent on more than being the subject matter expert. With the rising prevalence on a reliance on data banks and telemetry, we so more people relying on old information for how they handle situations.

We should place a higher emphasis during junior and senior leadership training? Of course, we should. Even senior leaders can benefit with more options when facing the new issues and accepting the more diverse and talented servicemen that the modern armed services have now. Capt Christian D. Orr TSgt David L. Lt Col Charlie Brown Sgt Vance Bonds MSgt Robert "Rock" Aldi SPC Douglas Bolton Sgt Randy Wilber CPL Dave Hoover CW5 Jack Cardwell LCDR Private RallyPoint Member MGySgt Private RallyPoint Member SPC Margaret Higgins TSgt Joe C. Maj William W. 'Bill' Price LTC Private RallyPoint Member

Response by MAJ Montgomery Granger made Mar 4 at 2018 11:33 AM

MAJ Montgomery Granger — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 11:33:03 -0500

I see wisdom is a euphemism for experience, maturity and good judgement. The question should be, can these qualities be taught, or are they part of a person's personality many psychologists feel is developed by the age of six? If this is so, then psychological testing to reveal one's best qualities associated with "wisdom" should be done in conjunction with practical exercises and tests that reveal a person's ability to ACT with wisdom. I believe we need to be careful simply admitting those who test well academically into programs that develop leaders of any rank. Service academy entrance requirements attempt to do this, but a summer of leadership training aimed at revealing one's ability to PERFORM with wisdom should be included in order to screen out those who merely SEEM wise. Prove it. Hooah!

Response by SSgt Boyd Herrst made Mar 4 at 2018 12:28 PM

SSgt Boyd Herrst — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 12:28:47 -0500

We learn from other people’s wisdom .. garnered from their many years of service
And from those they have met (military and civilian). Sometimes a good head session brings out what has been learned from young troops as well as the senior troops... so giving mutual respect to different sources is good!

Response by SSG Brian G. made Mar 6 at 2018 7:36 PM

SSG Brian G. — Tue, 06 Mar 2018 19:36:14 -0500

Wisdom is huge and should always rank high with a military member. It is the ability to learn from situations, people and to know when to swallow your pride and rank and realize when another member that is perhaps lower ranked than you, has more experience in a given area and thus is wiser. It is one reason why green lieutenants were handed off to seasoned senior NCO's during wartime.

Sadly in today's military 'wisdom' is lacking and that goes from the top down as the military is and has changed and not for the better in a lot of cases and situations.

It used to be that when a troop messed up even badly, they were taken to the side, counseled, given their punishment and then retrained. Command had the wisdom to see and understand that shit happens and people screw up sometimes. Now we see too many that are separated for stupid things that in the past would have resulted in retraining and punishment. This is hurting us especially now that we are having a basic physical qualifications problem in that 70% of those that apply for military service are unfit.

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made Mar 29 at 2018 1:34 PM

SFC Ralph E Kelley — Thu, 29 Mar 2018 13:34:01 -0400

Wisdom is when you know what is correct, true or right based on your common sense, drawn from your experiences and accumulated knowledge.
It is when you demonstrate intangibles such as leadership, confidence, initiative, problem solving, deliberate thought, and integrity.
For instance, you may not always be able see if an individual has leadership, but it is often and sadly very clear if an individual is lacking in the skills of a leader.
It's very important have wisdom and a duty to develop it in others.

Response by MSgt Mason Manner made Apr 7 at 2018 8:23 PM

MSgt Mason Manner — Sat, 07 Apr 2018 20:23:16 -0400

The only thing that DOD has got right in the last 50 years is officer progression it's no longer about the job OR the mission it's about making stars and having a chest full of bullshit ribbons and medals that you get even though you are incompetent

Response by SP5 Geoffrey Vannerson made Apr 27 at 2018 10:07 AM

SP5 Geoffrey Vannerson — Fri, 27 Apr 2018 10:07:32 -0400

With out wisdom you don't learn, you don't learn you fall behind. You fall behind, you fall behind you may need to learn another language and culture. Wisdom is the most important thing we have to give in life. It is the main reason we don't live in caves anymore. If we had listened to our parents and they had listened to theirs and so on instead of repeating the same mistakes over and over we would be in a near narvana. If you or someone knows something and passes it along it saves many from making the same mistakes in life. It's wisdom. Wisdom is knowing what works and what won't work over a period of time. Wisdom = knowledge, knowledge = success, and success = happiness.

Response by CW2 Donald Loughrey made May 10 at 2018 8:56 PM

CW2 Donald Loughrey — Thu, 10 May 2018 20:56:33 -0400

Wisdom has always been a critical element of Leadership. Whatever made anyone think it wouldn't be?

Response by MGySgt Jerry Suarez made May 20 at 2018 1:13 PM

MGySgt Jerry Suarez — Sun, 20 May 2018 13:13:04 -0400

Wisdom just like leadership and other nontangible qualities such as tact, initiative, honor etc are things told about them slowly developed. The irony is you either want it or don't. It is very important to understand that everyone regardless of rank needs to take wisdom and intellect hand in hand. They both work in conjunction somethings take wisdom, experience and knowledge of lessons learned regardless of doctrine just as somethings take intellect and science. So in my most humble opinion the people who choose one over the other arent very wise to begin with so why listen to them in the first place.

Response by SGT Cy Sturgis made May 22 at 2018 12:51 PM

SGT Cy Sturgis — Tue, 22 May 2018 12:51:12 -0400

How long would Stonewall Jackson, US Grant, George Patton, or even Dwight Eisenhower have lasted in today’s PC army?

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made May 22 at 2018 5:59 PM

Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth — Tue, 22 May 2018 17:59:59 -0400

I rank wisdom up there as a needed attribute for effective leadership. I think wisdom is is taught through a combination of personal drive by reading and studying, formal military education, and by personal experiences. There is a saying that to be old and wise you must have had to to be young and stupid. There is a lot of truth to that in my book. I think to be an effective leader you would have had to have the life experiences and education so that you can effectively lead the ones you work for as a servant leader. I think there is more book wisdom and square filling for wisdom in our senior ranks today because we promote folks who have "completed appropriate PME" versus those who have continuously deployed and graduated from the school of hard knocks. To answer the last piece, I don't think we need to force emphasis on "Wisdom" at the junior ranks...that is where they learn form SNCO's and lifes uh ohs but encourage them to read and learn. Just my two cents worth. Lt Col Charlie Brown SMSgt Lawrence McCarter Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen COL Mikel J. Burroughs Maj Marty Hogan

Response by Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen made May 22 at 2018 6:52 PM

Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen — Tue, 22 May 2018 18:52:58 -0400

I rank wisdom up there, but in my mind it's what seperates a leader from a great leader. There are lots of people who are declared or become leaders but that alone doesn't make them great, or even effective for that matter. Those who able to apply the wisdom of life that they've learned along the way become the great leaders that people want to follow and work with throughout their lives. No wisdom and you just have a run of the mill leadership school (pick the name of any of the hundreds out there) graduate.

Response by CPT Alfred Smiley made May 28 at 2018 10:05 AM

CPT Alfred Smiley — Mon, 28 May 2018 10:05:14 -0400

Several times in my career, I have explained to peers how to complete a complex task while avoiding hidden obstacles that could send the whole thing crashing down. They've looked at me, sometimes in astonishment, and asked, "How do you know all that?" I'd reply, "Because I already made that mistake once before."
Presence of mind will help you avoid the obvious mistakes, but it's getting blindsided, waylaid, picking yourself back up, and learning from it, that builds wisdom.

Response by Marlene Hessler made May 29 at 2018 9:34 AM

Marlene Hessler — Tue, 29 May 2018 09:34:38 -0400

Seems to me Wisdom is at least equal to Leadership because too many liberals today second guess the actions that take place on the battlefield. Without wisdom there is too much potential to find oneself in front of a jury for the necessities of surviving a battle. War is hell. Those that avoid going there should also avoid judging those that do.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 27 at 2020 7:05 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 27 Mar 2020 19:05:09 -0400

Wisdom also comes from HAVING the wisdom to listen to experienced subordinates, leaders, and peers and trusting them enough to learn from. However, it is only natural to f#$k up from time to time. It's the best way to learn in my opinion. Just don't make any mistakes that are illegal, immoral, or unethical and you will be fine. Most of us have been given negative counseling statements. Just try to keep them as counseling statements and not UCMJ punishments.

Response by LtCol Robert Quinter made Sep 17 at 2020 10:39 AM

LtCol Robert Quinter — Thu, 17 Sep 2020 10:39:54 -0400

I've always considered wisdom as the trait that puts all of our regulations, laws and traditions in the appropriate perspective. It is timeless and, whenever encountered, serves to bridle inappropriate zeal with realism. Although we often consider wisdom a product of age and experienced, my five year old grandson has impressed me with wisdom resident in what he says that might otherwise be described as unvarnished truth.