How many generations does it take to lose your claim to a particular Heritage?

2014-09-19T20:44:39-04:00

There have been a lot of discussions regarding the whole 'heritage' month thing. I am not wanting to get into the 'big' debate. In fact, I think everyone should be proud of their heritage and background, whether you're a first generation or a 10th generation. But whatever happened to just being an American?

Well, actually that is misleading if you think about it…

Canadians, Mexicans, Brazilians, Falkland Islanders we're all Americans. Which is not an ethnicity or a race but continents largely made up of non-indigenous people. The Native Americans are the original Americans (by the geographical use of the word) however, that opens a whole new debate… Please save that for a different discussion (thank you).

The name though, that is one thing our founding fathers should have considered when they gave birth to a new nation. Like all new parents, they think of a name that is so cute at the time, then reality hits. Something I can relate to, my poor daughter… However, calling us a United Statesian just doesn't sound right... So back to being American (USA) and proud!

Moving on…

Now as it has been pointed out in previous discussions we lump everybody into one category or another, besides my aforementioned American. Something, many wish we would just stick with. Focus on what unites us and not what separates us. After all just how many generations of living in a place (nation) does it take for one to stop counting themselves as part this or that? 1-2-3-4-5 ("the kind of thing an idiot would have on his luggage!") Just how many degrees of separation are necessary before you are solely an American (USA)?

Many refuse to see it that way and everyone wants to be united yet remain individual??? And be recognized for this, yet ironically they still allow themselves to be lumped together??? Asians, as example, have May... Asia is a large place made up a lot of different people. Native Americans have November (again a large diverse group of people). February Black history month… Even zombies get a month (they share May). The Hispanics have September-October…

But now where is European American month? Just like Asia and Africa, Europe is a continent. Most of the current nations in the 'Americas' trace their roots East to European beginnings. Hispanics, are of Spanish decent… which is in Europe… ergo… we should celebrate National European Month.

However, we don't…

So this brings me back to be proud of who you are, where you came from, and the contributions that have been made. But if The United States is to move forward we need to be American first or otherwise we all should call ourselves Nigerian-American, Greek-American, Dutch-American… though I prefer the plain and simple American.

Actually I think I will add one last point for consideration…

My great- times whatever- grandmother (Miss Jansen) was born in the Flatlands (Fort Nassau, the first Dutch settlement in North America) New York Area in 1617 they returned to Holland then came back a few years later. Miss Jansen married Jan Van Arsdalen (Born in Holland) and had Simon Van Arsdalen (born in 'America'). Jump ahead to 1936, my mother, maiden last name Van Arsdalen was born (in The United States). The family tree directly traces the line, on US soil, all the back to Miss Jansen, and even on back to Holland for another couple hundred years at least.

So, my mother's family is clearly of direct Dutch heritage (most likely 'pure' blooded Dutch) and has been on 'American' soil almost 400 years… Does that make me a Dutch-American or have I earned the right to be just American?

Response by LT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 19 at 2014 10:01 PM

2014-09-19T22:01:32-04:00

I am a Naturalized Citizen and I am an American. It is my choice to be an American. I will continue to be an American until the day I die. I have my heritage and I am proud of it, but I came here to be part of this country.

Response by SGT Richard H. made Sep 19 at 2014 11:32 PM

2014-09-19T23:32:46-04:00

Heritage and nationality are two different things entirely.

Certainly for most, if not all of us on this particular site, our Nationality is American. Nationality, while mostly (initially) determined by birth, remains a choice.

Heritage, whether it be African, Spanish, Irish, or whatever is a matter of lineage. Heritage can be "watered down" (i.e...German Mother/Irish Father, etc), but remains constant for a lifetime and can't be changed.....leading me to my answer: You can't lose that claim. All you can do is choose to embrace it or not.

Response by CDR Kenneth Kaiser made Sep 20 at 2014 12:50 PM

2014-09-20T12:50:16-04:00

Thank you. You summed it up very well. I am the son of an Army officer (who told my brother and I to join the Navy, but that is another story). My dad and mom instilled certain values or tenants which have guided me. First respect is earned, secondly you can lose that respect very easily with one or two stupid actions. Third whether you are wearing the uniform or just associated with it (e.g. a dependent) your actions reflect upon that service or in some cases service members in general. So what does that have to do with the question. From these premises I concluded that my behavior, my character determined who I was. Not my heritage. You are not hot tempered because you are of Irish decent or have red hair. You are not lazy or stupid because you are black, You are not stupid because you are Polish or whatever. You are what you are because of you and what you have made of yourself. We as a nation have fought for too long to get away from these stereotypes and now it seems that we are clamoring to recapture them. That is very disturbing. It leads to promotions or awards based upon quotas or worse yet it leads to the idea of entitlement. Life is not always fair, but the way to fix it is not grant unequal opportunity. Rather the goal should be as stated by Dr. King to base it on ability, not skin color, not ethnicity. Heritage months etc are not quite that bad but the promote indirectly the concept that your heritage (Black, Hispanic, and I am not sure who else there is in the current favored status) instills in you certain characteristics which in turn can lead to discrimination based upon generalizations. And that to me is not good.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Sep 20 at 2014 2:19 PM

2014-09-20T14:19:14-04:00

I'm Proud to be German/English/Scotch/French American and because we are definitely a melting pot I am disappointed I don't have more diversity in my Heritage but my Grandkids make up for me in that department.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Sep 20 at 2014 3:26 PM

2014-09-20T15:26:34-04:00

75% Italian and 25% French Canadian married to 50% Italian 50% Irish makes my kids: 5/8 Italian, 1/4 Irish and 1/8 French Canadian

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Sep 20 at 2014 5:38 PM

2014-09-20T17:38:56-04:00

Great Question. I did the ancestry.com thing for mom, dad, and my daughter. As expected, we are mutts. I can claim everything and nothing.I stand proud as a 2% young black man who somehow traveled through England, France, Germany, Portugal, Norway, Ireland, and Turkey. I am confused. My little Hitomi feeds me all Japanese food and I swear I was Japanese in another life. I'm in that general category...one of God's children. My daughter has a big percentage of Scandinavian! Who knew?

Response by COL Randall C. made Sep 20 at 2014 5:45 PM

2014-09-20T17:45:32-04:00

Proud to be a 15th generation American (or something like that) with English and Polish background primarily with a lot of other heritage such as American Indian, Irish, German, Dutch, Welsh and a few others thrown in (my mother is the genealogist, not I).

Basically I'm a mutt (of course, I haven't met very many 'pure' anything, which sums up SSG Pete Fleming's point)

Response by SPC Richard White made Sep 20 at 2014 6:49 PM

2014-09-20T18:49:02-04:00

I have found that if you can trace your family tree to a particular point and come up with documentation then you may claim whatever heritage you are claiming.I know in my family one side is European and the other is hispanic and there are some mixes in the blood line.So its whatever you embrace.Call yourself what you want.

Response by SFC Mark Merino made Sep 21 at 2014 12:34 AM

2014-09-21T00:34:19-04:00

Did anyone do that one million veteran DNA test with the VA?

Response by LCDR Rabbah Rona Matlow made Jul 31 at 2015 5:27 AM

2015-07-31T05:27:41-04:00

I once heard someone describing a person of African descent living in Japan as an "African American..." what chutzpah!

But seriously, sociological studies have shown that imigrant families lose the vast majority of their native culture by the third generation - the third generation is usually fully assimilated. I am a third generation Litvak, and I speak no Yiddish, Russian, or any other Eastern European language. I am a dedicated Jew, but I'm the only one in my family who is...

Enough said.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 28 at 2015 1:52 PM

2015-08-28T13:52:54-04:00

"Heritage"...the word implies the past. To be justifiably proud of one's origins is not disengaging from pride in one's nationality. I believe current events muddy this issue, and the best way to approach this issue is to separate "heritage" from "issue".

Response by PO2 Ron Burling made Sep 4 at 2015 1:11 AM

2015-09-04T01:11:26-04:00

But...but...but my mother was a full blood Ojibwa Indian and I'm old enough that I may not be around for any different discussions! ;-)

Response by CPO Nate S. made Jan 21 at 2018 8:39 AM

2018-01-21T08:39:30-05:00

I think those of us commenting here get the pride of our respective heritages (Polish, African, Dutch, Irish, ...) and yet we each stand tall to be "...a more perfect union" as Americans. Please, take a look at this link: {http://www.lifecourse.com/about/method/timelines/generations.html}.

Since I have just become aware of this very interesting website and am still studying it. Yet, I want to share it here to see how each of you "Men and Women of Honor" respond to it. Its focus is on something called the 4th Turning. So far it is interesting. Looking forward to feedback as it applies to the original questions about "generations and their claims."

Also, please look at this additional link {http://www.lifecourse.com/practice/military.html} from this same site.

Lifecourse Associates: Error

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2021 10:09 PM

2021-02-15T22:09:21-05:00

SFC Joe S. Davis Jr., MSM, DSL My Heritage Days are July 4th & November 11th... "American Veteran"!
Thanks Brother Joe!

Response by 1SG Dennis Hicks made Feb 18 at 2021 7:16 PM

2021-02-18T19:16:08-05:00

To be short, you only loose what you have when you no longer care to remember or pass it on.

Response by Wayne Soares made Feb 18 at 2021 9:29 PM

2021-02-18T21:29:58-05:00

Thanks for the question Pete