How should I counsel a soldier who leaves work without permission?

SGT Ronnie Warford — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:08:16 -0500

I was the shift leader today for my dining facility. I had a soldier leave without permission and did not answer his phone when i tried to reach him. What should I put his counseling for exactly? Thank you

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2016 8:10 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:10:26 -0500

No being at appointed place of duty at appointed time.

Response by SSG James Elmore made Feb 14 at 2016 8:14 PM

SSG James Elmore — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:14:03 -0500

Do an Internet search and you will get a lot of baseline things to start with.

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Feb 14 at 2016 8:17 PM

Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:17:58 -0500

Confront/Investigate.

Find out the facts. Just because you didn't give permission, doesn't mean he didn't have permission. Sometimes there is more information than what was initially available. Sometimes "emergencies" do happen, which although not "excuses" are "explanations." They change the tone of the counselling or negate the need for a counselling completely.

"Hey Spec Benatz, what happened yesterday? I came back and you were gone."

"SFC Smith grabbed me, and sent me down to XXX." (no phone service) or "Remember, I had the doctors' appointment. We talked about it last week. We didn't have a chance to confirm it yesterday morning because you were out taking care of ZZZ" (informal buttchew) or "Wife called, broken leg, had to run immediately. I'm really sorry. Completely my fault" (formal counsel, but understandable).

Just a couple examples.

I've had the 1stSgt grab one of my guys before, and get called away before he had a chance to tell me. Also had a new SSgt not realize how "base closings/delays" on Quantico Work.

Check with the troop, figure out what happened, and then go from there.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2016 8:18 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:18:37 -0500

Simple...dereliction of duty, the shameful failure to fulfill one's duty.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2016 8:19 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:19:08 -0500

Keep it simple. You left early without permission. For XX days, you are to report to me or the shift leader for that day before you leave. Failure to do may result in non-judicial punishment under the UCMJ.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Feb 14 at 2016 8:43 PM

CAPT Kevin B. — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:43:13 -0500

Wow, some Hard A responses which in the right circumstances is appropriate. Since you're a junior NCO, part of your sorting it out involves taking a look at yourself to make sure you did the drill correctly. Some juniors need to be told up front what's expected, i.e. see me before your blast out of here. Some senior NCOs will say all people of your crew should know that without asking. I'll just say every group has a few rocks that need to be brought along, hence need a bit more direction and reinforcement of your expectations. You want to make sure you're doing the drill right so the problem stays with the junior and doesn't shift to you. If it turns out you have a problem child, your SEL should have made all NCOs aware of how the Command wants to deal with them.

That said, you appear to be on the front end of it so it starts out with a confirmation of expectations drill that you document. If the problem persists, or others come up, make sure you're tapping your NCO upline a bit to ensure you're on the right track. Good mentors expect you to use them.

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Feb 14 at 2016 8:50 PM

MAJ Ken Landgren — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:50:22 -0500

He must tell a superior when he is leaving or have him report to CQ at 1800 every day for 30 days.

Response by SSG Scott McIntyre made Feb 14 at 2016 8:53 PM

SSG Scott McIntyre — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 20:53:32 -0500

It is better to not label the event/action if you you are ever unsure. In Part II, just put "Event-Oriented." Describe in Part III the event that took place with as much detail as possible, but keeping it short and to the point. Make sure you include times, places such as building numbers, etc. Counseling don't have to be difficult or long and drawn out. As for the labels, leave it up to legal. If you decide to on corrective training make sure directly correlates to correct the deficiency or infraction and set a follow up date. Plan of action must have an end date, "until further notice" is unacceptable. How can you assess if the corrective training corrected the deficiency/infraction? Always follow up and close out counselings. If you plan to recommend for UCMJ, consult your BDE legal office, I'm sure they will be more than willing to assist you.

Response by MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht made Feb 14 at 2016 9:08 PM

MSgt Marvin Kinderknecht — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 21:08:47 -0500

I can't answer the question with out more specific information. Could he leave when his shift was over or his assignment complete? did he need to be formally dismissed. Perhaps he did not know all this and innocently walked off. Call him aside and let him know where the bear craps in the buckwheat.

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2016 9:10 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 21:10:41 -0500

Remind them of their general orders. That's basic soldiers knowledge. It is dereliction of duty for leaving an appointed duty position without permission, or failure to obey ucmj art 92
This is a very good template to use for the wording.
http://www.armywriter.com/dereliction-of-duty3.htm

Dereliction of Duty Counseling

is a betrayal of the organization and your troops and the worst example of leadership I have ever seen.

Response by CPT Aaron Kletzing made Feb 14 at 2016 9:12 PM

CPT Aaron Kletzing — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 21:12:49 -0500

make sure you are also focusing on corrective measures that will improve the misbehavior and the soldier. not just the punishment unto itself :)

Response by MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P made Feb 14 at 2016 9:31 PM

MSgt Steven Holt, NRP, CCEMT-P — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 21:31:45 -0500

Is it possible the local SFC or CSM grabbed your troop without telling you? I ask because I got burned on that once. I had a young troop who was already on my crap list. He got "Line of Sight" tasked by the resident CMSgt and did not have time to inform me of the Chief's task. I was all set to hang the poor soul from the base flag pole until the Chief happened to walk by and said, "Oh yeah, BTW SSgt, I borrowed your guy for a while. You don't mind do you?"

Just make sure you know the WHOLE truth before you send rounds down range. Your troop will respect you more in the end if you take the time to make sure you know the exact circumstances.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 14 at 2016 9:36 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 21:36:56 -0500

leaving place of duty falls in the same area as being AWOL. Counsel that soldier the same as you would for any other poor performance. In Righting with a plan of action. Good luck.

Response by SGT Michael Leary made Feb 14 at 2016 10:32 PM

SGT Michael Leary — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 22:32:45 -0500

The time out rug with labor bonus.
He needs a labor job. He thought something else was worth the risk. You make it so doing the other costs him more.

Response by SFC Bryson Amaral made Feb 14 at 2016 11:23 PM

SFC Bryson Amaral — Sun, 14 Feb 2016 23:23:05 -0500

He's awol plain and simple, absent with out leave, dereliction of duty, failure to follow instructions you name it, you could counsel him on a number of things. But first I would get the initial counseling that was done on the soldier and bring it to your new counseling session to remind him that he failed in his duties. Good luck.

Response by TSgt Terry Hudson made Feb 15 at 2016 12:02 AM

TSgt Terry Hudson — Mon, 15 Feb 2016 00:02:43 -0500

Throat punch!! No I'm kidding I'm kidding! Investigate find out why? Even though it really doesn't matter because the solider shouldn't be leaving with permission. But you want to make sure they don't have anything that could be issues that's affects the mission going on. If they do counsel them and then find a way to help them fix the issue.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2016 12:11 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2016 00:11:00 -0500

First off, this Soldier violated first general order. Secondly he/she leaving without permission is a sign of disrespect regardless of the circumstance. However I would still as why in the event there was an emergency. Other than a negative 4856 (Counseling form) is what should had been drafted. That is the problem with some Soldiers today.

Response by SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth made Feb 15 at 2016 6:30 AM

SGT David A. 'Cowboy' Groth — Mon, 15 Feb 2016 06:30:55 -0500

Personally, I would take the person off to the side, and have little one on one talk. Show this person the error of their way's and then let them know if they do it again without notification to me or an assistant, they would get one bad counseling report.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2016 5:52 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2016 17:52:39 -0500

Well, he was absent from his appointed place of duty so unless he just fell off the turnip truck he knew it was wrong. A nice Company Grade Article 15 would be a good place to start. Fixes his problem and sends a message.

Response by CSM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 15 at 2016 5:54 PM

CSM Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 15 Feb 2016 17:54:08 -0500

Simply put something like this:

You knew that your shit did not end until XXXXhrs and you were properly released. This has been the same procedure we have used since you got here.

Don't forget the magic bullet at the end of the counseling

Response by SSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 23 at 2016 1:35 PM

SSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 23 Feb 2016 13:35:34 -0500

If he just left because he felt like it? Simple charge with UA. Rinse repeat if necessary.

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 24 at 2016 11:58 PM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 24 Feb 2016 23:58:31 -0500

You counsel the Soldier for Failure to report. Make sure you include in the counseling about the Soldier responsibility to answer or respond to your phone call.
Make sure you verify his/ her contact info, i.e. Telephonic alert. If it continues, I would bar the Soldier and recommend UCMJ.

SGM

Response by SFC Willie Manning made Mar 18 at 2016 4:46 PM

SFC Willie Manning — Fri, 18 Mar 2016 16:46:09 -0400

You are in charge think of a situation when you had to be talked with, make a good and bad situation then choose the way you would have been more comfortable with, but you have to handle all problems immediately to keep the respect needed and earned.

Response by MCPO Roger Collins made Apr 19 at 2016 5:09 PM

MCPO Roger Collins — Tue, 19 Apr 2016 17:09:47 -0400

UCMJ Art. 86 covers it pretty well. If someone senior in your COC authorized it without your knowledge, it's on them. If not, it will be sorted out and be a good lesson for him.

Response by PFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 20 at 2016 10:03 AM

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 20 Apr 2016 10:03:03 -0400

extra duty, was KP in my day,but other dirty are there.

Response by CPL Aloysius Grimaudo made May 10 at 2016 1:35 PM

CPL Aloysius Grimaudo — Tue, 10 May 2016 13:35:13 -0400

U write him up..after 2 written warnings it's a company grade article 15 end of story..if u don't handle it accordinly it won't ever stop...I wrote tons of people up...and was involved in giving out lots of 15s...

Response by Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth made Jun 26 at 2017 3:37 PM

Lt Col Scott Shuttleworth — Mon, 26 Jun 2017 15:37:10 -0400

Good old fashioned smoke session!!

Response by CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 7 at 2019 3:06 PM

CWO3 Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 07 Jun 2019 15:06:15 -0400

Find out what's going on with him before you go to paperwork. Then go from there. His past record and overall performance should be considered as well as his alibi.

Response by Maj John Bell made Jun 7 at 2019 4:54 PM

Maj John Bell — Fri, 07 Jun 2019 16:54:44 -0400

At the point where a soldier is missing, there is very little with higher priority than establishing the whereabouts and welfare of the missing soldier, doesn't matter if it is in garrison, the field. The Battalion prior to mine going through a Combined Arms Exercise at 29 Palms left a Marine in the desert. No one knew he was missing until after the they'd been back at Camp Pendleton for 4 days. He died of heat exposure.

First, ask him/her what happened.

Second (Option 1 There is a somewhat valid but misguided reason):
_If there was a valid reason to be absent, address his/her failure to personally notify you PRIOR (or as soon as possible thereafter) to absenting himself, or asking someone else to notify you, immediately.
*If someone higher up his chain of command issued an order, without notifying you, address it with the person who issued the order. There is no excuse for a leader to not know where his subordinates are/should be during duty hours.
*While the miscreant watches, fill out the charge sheet. Leave the date blank. Put it in a document protector. Put that in a notebook. Put it on the shelf. Tell the soldier, there will be no second chance.

Second (Option 2 There is no valid reason): No counseling for errors of malice aforethought. Seniors choice every crap detail until one of you dies of old age, OR charge him.