How should we handle students who are complaining about their PT session ending after the scheduled time?

2017-09-20T08:29:31-04:00

Situation: SHOW-ME Gold program (like ROTC but we all been through Basic and AIT as it is required) has PT from 0600-0700 before classes start. Some have an 8am class and they are allowed to leave at 07 if PT runs over. But people who don’t stay and do the cool down. So here’s the problem: soldiers are complaining about being dismissed at passed 07 even if they don’t have a 8am as they feel it’s

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 8:36 AM

2017-09-20T08:36:12-04:00

not right for cadre to keep us because PT is scheduled to 0700. It’s usually only 5-10 minutes tops.

Sometimes we don’t have time to do a cool down so we are told to stretch on our own if we would like. People complain about that too saying cadre should have no excuse for making the workout go past 0645 and not have us do a cool down.

Now the reason why it takes so long is because we have to also do the preparation drill plus about 5 minutes to explain the workout.

How I see it is that if you don’t have an 8am class hen what’s the big deal to do a cool down? What’s 10 minutes going to hurt? I’d much rather have a good workout and not do a formal cool down than to have a workout that doesn’t benefit majority of the platoon amd have a cool down. So what’s some advice on how to solve this or go about it?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 8:39 AM

2017-09-20T08:39:53-04:00

It looks like your response was cut off. But if they don't like doing PT past 0700 is the question. And so who cares. Soldiers will complain about everything. I don't see the issue.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 8:50 AM

2017-09-20T08:50:33-04:00

I have to agree with SSG Private RallyPoint Member, soldiers are going to complain no matter what. As you said yourself SGT Private RallyPoint Member, they complain about being held over, but if they get released on time they complain about not getting a proper cooldown. Complaining is going to happen. As long as the issues they are complaining about are not interfering with the mission actually being accomplished, let 'em complain.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 8:54 AM

2017-09-20T08:54:42-04:00

OMFG.... These snowflakes are going to be the leadership of the Army in a few years? Wow.
When I was in ROTC back in the early 90s, PT was optional and everyone managed to pass the APFT every 6 months. I guess we had something called self-discipline. I'm with TSgt Joshua Duplin and make PT earlier in the morning. That'll teach those snowflakes that for every complaint, there is a solution that is even worse than the original complaint. Welcome to the Army!

Response by LTC Kevin B. made Sep 20 at 2017 9:51 AM

2017-09-20T09:51:32-04:00

I'll be the contrarian here. I see problems with the planning and execution of the PT session, not with the people who are complaining.

If you only want to schedule one PT session, and that PT session is on the books from 0600-0700, then all PT-related activities need to occur during that one-hour window (stretching, warm up, exercises, cool down, etc.). If one hour is not enough, then start earlier, since you can't end later. The fact that some participants do not have classes at 0800 is immaterial. If they are complaining about being kept after the planned training timeline, then the leadership decision has played a role in creating that complaint. Own it, and fix the underlying problem. The problem isn't the attitudes; the problem is the decision that created the attitude.

I think the best options are to a) end at 0700 as planned, b) start earlier to give more time, or c) have separate PT sessions.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 9:53 AM

2017-09-20T09:53:48-04:00

Easy problem to solve. Start PT at 0530 or even 0500.

Response by SGT Joseph Gunderson made Sep 20 at 2017 10:20 AM

2017-09-20T10:20:39-04:00

You tell them that they are going to be officers and thus better be prepared for certain things to run late. The military is a 24/7 job; the work day day not always end at COB formation. If they cannot handle putting in the time when necessary than they shouldn't be in the military let alone be leaders in it.

Response by CW3 Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 20 at 2017 10:31 AM

2017-09-20T10:31:02-04:00

I wouldn't have a problem with starting PT earlier. I actually got in trouble as an active duty PFC for asking for PT to start 30 minutes earlier. I realized that when PT ran over, I didn't get extra time to report for work call. I didn't get that option and I was okay with coming to PT earlier.

Response by Cpl John Barker made Sep 20 at 2017 3:44 PM

2017-09-20T15:44:33-04:00

Send those cherrys to Afghanistan

Response by Cpl Justin Goolsby made Sep 20 at 2017 5:54 PM

2017-09-20T17:54:40-04:00

Well first off, I'm going to say if they've got complaints, it sounds like they're entering the wrong profession. Whether it's the PT aspect, the being forced to wait aspect, or even things taking longer than they should... all of those are problems and realities that we face in the military. Deal with it.

But to piggyback on some of the other comments, if you set PT from 0600-0700, then no one should be there after 0700. Conclude the session and carry on with the plan of the day.

That being said though... if we didn't start on time because people were late or something similar, I made sure I got my time back because my time is also precious. If I said we were PTing for a full hour, then I got my full hour. Then my Marines would have to choose how they spent their remaining time, whether it's showering or eating chow. Suffice it to say, my Marines never showed up late more than once.

Response by PFC Eric Parrish made Sep 21 at 2017 5:06 AM

2017-09-21T05:06:28-04:00

I know that your training has serious time constraints as does every training cycle. You should try to find the time to PT them until they puke. The military is not a democracy and everyone does not get a say in what goes on.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 21 at 2017 9:41 AM

2017-09-21T09:41:51-04:00

Other's have already responded to the question with good and practical advice. The only thing I would add is that there is one standard in the Army. Allowing some students to "leave early/on-time" and forcing others to stay, creates two standards and that breeds resentment. This resentment can extend to fellow SM's and leadership.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 21 at 2017 6:47 PM

2017-09-21T18:47:55-04:00

I'm surprised by some of the responses here about the students being whiners and snowflakes. How about the cadre get their shit together? If they are supposed to be setting an example of how leaders should act, they are doing a crappy job. If these students took this PT example as the way things should be in the Army, then they will get to their units and run PT late, then when their troops don't have time to eat chow before the next formation because they have to clean the barracks, etc, that's supposed to be OK? Hardly. That's poor leadership and it's not taking care of the troops. There will be plenty of times in the Army when you have to work the troops late. Doing it because you can't plan a one hour PT session properly isn't one of them.

Response by SPC Rob Lewis made Sep 22 at 2017 12:37 PM

2017-09-22T12:37:44-04:00

Smoke 'em a few times....You can't stop in combat because you are having a bad day. Train harder than the bastard trying to kill you.

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Sep 22 at 2017 4:06 PM

2017-09-22T16:06:04-04:00

We as leaders owe it to the troops to provide fair and realistic timeframes and schedules for PT. to do less, is a failure of leadership.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 5 at 2017 4:32 PM

2017-10-05T16:32:48-04:00

Why are you conducting PRT and not doing the cool down? The Army didn't approve the cool down as a time filler. The cool down is done to help prevent injury. Whoever is leading your PRT needs to do a better job planning for training.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 18 at 2018 7:44 PM

2018-08-18T19:44:03-04:00

Just remember that u were that private complaining

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made May 10 at 2019 4:21 PM

2019-05-10T16:21:37-04:00

U whine more than they do now, can we stop with the “back in my day” bullshit”

Response by CW4 Craig Urban made May 10 at 2019 5:29 PM

2019-05-10T17:29:42-04:00

I would not take any crap. However if you are violating policy routinely you could be in a bad situation on the cool down period. At fort ord my soldiers arrived at 6. Did their hour and were at work at 9. I was in the shop at 7. I did my own pt. I was first in and last out.

Response by SCPO William Akin made May 10 at 2019 6:32 PM

2019-05-10T18:32:12-04:00

1a. Having been part of more amphibious operations/exercises then I care to remember, I can safely say, Land the Landing Force, Away All Boats, ALWAYS, Without fail was started/sounded On Schedule.. It Never, EVER ended as scheduled..
1b. "Back in the day" my river patrols always went out on time/schedule, but almost never came back on time...
2. The other half of the Varsity team (Navy Marine) would say, "Improvise, Adapt, Overcome"

Response by Cpl Phillip Brame made May 10 at 2019 7:13 PM

2019-05-10T19:13:11-04:00

Is it me or does the Army have a problem with young soldiers bucking authority? WhAt the hell is next, I’m not going to stand to because it’s to early or I am not going to do this road March because it is to far and I have to carry to much, no guard or fire watch because it cuts down on my sleep time. NCO’ s get in that ass stop trying to be these young soldiers friends and do your jobs. You will be sorry if you do not later on when they have to protect or hold a flank.

Response by CW3 Matt Hutchason made May 10 at 2019 7:21 PM

2019-05-10T19:21:39-04:00

I heard a story about how firefights were only scheduled for 1 hour at a time, and they often went over that limit. It was horrible how those Soldiers were treated by being made to stay and fight for the extra 10-15 minutes.

Response by SFC Kory Schaubhut made May 10 at 2019 9:40 PM

2019-05-10T21:40:18-04:00

IMO, finish PT on time or schedule it for 1.5 hours to start at 0530... and then finish PT on time.

Response by Cpl Bill Gordon made May 11 at 2019 1:11 PM

2019-05-11T13:11:43-04:00

Get your ass out early buy the time stretching starts your ready for round two...thats all i got to say about that.

Response by SSG John Jensen made May 11 at 2019 10:40 PM

2019-05-11T22:40:54-04:00

did medical spt for a ROTC Co. summer camp early '80's, driving my M715 jeep ambulance behind the PT run, some cadet is puking his guts out, we stop and ask how much beer he drank the nite before, he responded "2 beers", we shouted at him "only 2! get your ass back in the run!"

Response by Cadet 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 1 at 2020 6:02 AM

2020-06-01T06:02:32-04:00

Conduct business to the best of your abilities and remember who complained. When its time to select for positions, remember. That being said, I understand their complaints. They actually are paying for education so, nothing unreasonable should affect it