How will the Army deal with trans-gender urinalyses until the trans-gender numbers can support trans-specific observers?

SSG James Doherty — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:38:11 -0400

As uncomfortable as it is to watch someone of the same biological gender as me pee, I would feel even more uneasy if they were biologically my opposite. I can only guess what the feeling for a TG must be having to watch and be watched by their opposite. So what is the right answer until there are sufficient TG numbers to facilitate proper observation?

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2016 7:40 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:40:22 -0400

Excellent point. Where does this path lead. Watching opposite sexes?

Response by SSG Alleria Stanley made Mar 31 at 2016 7:42 PM

SSG Alleria Stanley — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:42:55 -0400

Have a medical observe, if requested by the Soldier.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Mar 31 at 2016 7:50 PM

CPT Mark Gonzalez — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 19:50:18 -0400

There is never going to be enough trans-specific observers. The numbers just are not there despite inflated studies. In the military you are the sex at which you were assessed as under current legal guidance. Regarding a UA. I have a SM who is transgender and has done UA's without issues. However, if an issue was made of it, the SM is the sex they were assessed as and a UA is not an optional event. I guess we will see what the future policy holds.

Response by Capt Mark Strobl made Mar 31 at 2016 8:00 PM

Capt Mark Strobl — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 20:00:33 -0400

One male observer. One female observer. SM pees in front of the observer who shares the same gender. Whiz Quiz isn't optional. So, best figure it out before Operation Golden Flow commences.

Response by SSG Patricia King made Mar 31 at 2016 8:01 PM

SSG Patricia King — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 20:01:19 -0400

I am an openly trans soldier. I worked with my CoC and until army policy catches up I have an NCO from the aid station observe me. I am more comfortable with a medical professional than some random E5 infantry soldier. For us this was a good solution for now.

Response by CSM Michael Chavaree made Mar 31 at 2016 8:39 PM

CSM Michael Chavaree — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 20:39:17 -0400

Easy! Super pubic tap with a 10G needle, problem solved, problem staying solved

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 31 at 2016 11:41 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 31 Mar 2016 23:41:44 -0400

Why is observation even needed? When going for a job interview and they need to test you, they do not watch you. If you are going to come up hot you are going to come up hot regardless of being watched or not. Having someone stare at you pee in a cup is ridiculous in my personal opinion.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2016 9:15 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 09:15:21 -0400

SSG James Doherty There will never be enough tg numbers to facilitate proper observation. If numbers are to be believed, less than half of a percent point of the us population is tg, and then the active duty military population is around .04 of the us population. So try getting half of a percent of half of a percent.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2016 10:23 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 10:23:31 -0400

a tricky situation....

Response by MAJ Bill Darling made Apr 1 at 2016 11:01 AM

MAJ Bill Darling — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 11:01:28 -0400

All that matters is that the soldier can do the job...that's what some politicians and 3rd wave feminists have told us anyway. So if women can be infantrymen, then why do they need separate quarters, why do we segregate bathrooms and showers and why should it matter who is observing whom for a urinalysis?

Response by SGM Mikel Dawson made Apr 1 at 2016 11:23 AM

SGM Mikel Dawson — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 11:23:49 -0400

Not too difficult - if one squats to pee - female observer. If you stand and unzip, a guy. And why not make it a medical MOS - this way everyone will feel better. NOT ROCKET SCIENCE.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 1 at 2016 11:56 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 11:56:44 -0400

Remove the observation requirement. Sterilize the restroom and allow one soldier at a time to fill the bottle with a guard on the door. Soldiers wear PT gear for the process

Response by CPT Pedro Meza made Apr 1 at 2016 2:40 PM

CPT Pedro Meza — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 14:40:40 -0400

Our and your job is to ensure that untainted urine comes out the body and goes in the container. So do you job.

Response by SPC Heidi Goodnature made Apr 1 at 2016 4:27 PM

SPC Heidi Goodnature — Fri, 01 Apr 2016 16:27:00 -0400

I would suggest not putting your face directly in their gentiles. BAM problem solved!

Response by LTJG Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 6 at 2016 8:50 AM

LTJG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 06 Apr 2016 08:50:30 -0400

All UAs are uncomfortable and awkward, but they must also be professional. I don't see how we can't just be observed by someone of the same gender identity. However, for me personally since I don't like to make waves, I would go up to the female observer and explain my situation and ask if she was comfortable observing me. If not, then I would request a female observer from medical. There should be no problem with that because in my 5 years in the Navy, the only medical person who has examined my junk in a medical check was a female, and she was very professional about it.

Response by PO1 Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 25 at 2017 6:05 AM

PO1 Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 25 Jan 2017 06:05:56 -0500

Excellent question SSG James Doherty , so in reference to training I received today actually. ACROSS the DOD there is a set plan. The process takes approx. 1 and half- 2 years. Once the medical diagnosis of " Gender Euphoria" is received the individual will begin transition (Command and operationally approving). During this phase they are to be treated as their BORN physical gender. All rules, regulations, and governing guidelines are to be adhered to. In the case of the Urinalyses program the member will be observed by what ever sex they are born to UNTIL certificate of completion of process is issued by their medical provider ICO their specific treatment if you will. Upon completion the standards go into account and the members service record "Gender Marker" (new add) is selected as whatever CHANGED sex they are! Cheers!