Can someone collect both a regular pension and a medical retirement? How will medically retiring early impact what I collect from the Army?

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Dec 2023 14:49:22 -0500

I was just got 100% rating from the VA and now that the suprise over not having to fight with them has settled, I have questions about how to move forward.

I just hit 17 years TiS in August. Apparently I can remain drilling with my unit for the next three years and just collect retirement points and no pay or I can contiue getting paid and accrue a debt.

If I stayed until I hit 20 and then took a medical retirement, would I be able to collect both? If I cut and run now with a medical retirement, would I be able to collect anything at all from the Army?

I've heard a lot of mixed things from the barracks lawyers and the full-timers don't seem too spun up on these things.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 4 at 2023 4:12 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Dec 2023 16:12:38 -0500

Haye to break it to you but the fight with the VA is just beginning.

Response by SP5 Peter Keane made Dec 4 at 2023 4:43 PM

SP5 Peter Keane — Mon, 04 Dec 2023 16:43:07 -0500

https://www.dfas.mil/retiredmilitary/disability/crdp/

Defense Finance and Accounting Service > RetiredMilitary > disability > crdp

The official website of the Defense Finance Accounting Service (DFAS)

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 4 at 2023 4:50 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 04 Dec 2023 16:50:18 -0500

I know several reservists that are 100% VA that continue to drill, I know one on ADOS and I know of 100% VA soldiers being mobilized. VA ratings do not directly relate to service medical requirements so there is no automatic trigger for a medical separation.

You will need to do some math to determine if it makes sense to drill for points only or to drill for pay. The VA will back off 1/30th of a month's VA pay for each day of active service and each MUTA of drills. The question is are you paid more for a MUTA or for 1/30 of a month of VA pay at your rating Takoma in to account the tax advantages.

Yes if you medically retire you can collect both checks. If you do a traditional reserve retirement you can collect both as well but you have to wait until after the gray area.

Response by COL Randall C. made Dec 4 at 2023 9:51 PM

COL Randall C. — Mon, 04 Dec 2023 21:51:20 -0500

You're mixing a few apples and oranges together.

You can't "take a medical retirement" as it's not up to you. If your illness/injuries are such that you are medically incapable of performing certain functions of being a Soldier or of your MOS, then you'll be referred over for evaluation and processing through the IDES process (PEB, MEB, etc.).

Medical retirement from the military is all about if you can function as a service member and your ability to perform your military duty. VA disability pay is compensation on your decreased ability to perform work after leaving the military, impact to future health, etc.

As LTC Private RallyPoint Member stated, you can still be active in the military (reserve duty or active duty) with a VA rating - Federal law* prohibits you from being compensated by the federal government twice during the same period, which is why your VA pension is recouped (just a rough SWAG, but you'll get likely receive more money from your military pay per day than you will from the VA).

Regarding the collection of both VA Disability and a medical retirement from the military - Yes ... and No. If you are medically retired (Chapter 61), it's a possible "Yes" if you have 20+ years of creditable service, but a firm "No" if you do not.

There was a law change* that started about 20 years ago (2004) which implemented Concurrent Retirement and Disability Pay (CDRP) (the DFAS page that SP5 Peter Keane pointed you towards), but most individuals focus on "as long as you have a 50% or higher rating from the VA" part of it - mainly because they are longevity retirees (20+ years)*. Put plainly, CDRP doesn't apply if an individual has less than 20 years of service.

However, if you were medically retired and had less than 20 years of service, if any of the disabilities are combat related, then Combat-Related Special Compensation (CRSC)* may apply. CRSC is a program to add back compensation for those disabilities that were combat-related. Hypothetically, if you had two injuries that were deemed combat-related and they totaled to 30%, then 30% of the recoupment would be 'paid back' under the CRSC program. If you are eligible for CDRP, then effectively CRSC wouldn't apply as you'd already receive 100% of your VA pension.
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* 38 U.S. Code § 5304 (and 5305) - https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/38/5304
* 10 U.S. Code § 1414 - https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/1414
* Of the ~2 million retirees at the end of FY22, a bit over 133k were disability retirees, and only 29k of those disability retirees are collecting CDRP.
* VA CRSC - https://www.va.gov/resources/combat-related-special-compensation-crsc/

38 U.S. Code § 5304 - Prohibition against duplication of benefits

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Dec 5 at 2023 6:00 AM

CPT Lawrence Cable — Tue, 05 Dec 2023 06:00:12 -0500

To answer the last part of your question, if you stay until 20 and take a Reserve Retirement, #1 you can't collect until you are 60. There are some deployment deduction on retirement time, but I don't have that in front of me. 2. If you have 50% or over VA rating, you will pull a VA pension without penalty when your retirement pay starts.

Response by Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 14 at 2023 2:48 PM

Lt Col Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 14 Dec 2023 14:48:49 -0500

OK, I went through this. I luckily was medically retired (disability) retired after getting more than 20 good years. You definitely want a medical retirement if the will submit you for one PEB,MEB. Thats part is and is not up to you. Most reserve units don't know how to handle a PEB and will never submit you for one unless you pressure them.

Assuming you were medically retired before reaching 20 good years, here are the facts.
1. You will start drawing a pension immediately if at least 30% of your rating are unfit. You can be 100% VA rated and still be FIT FOR DUY, but its unusual. There are also laws and regulations that require you to report conditions to the military and not hide them, its illegal.
2. If you don't get your 20 in you will never qualify for a Reserve retirement at age 60. This is important because once you reach age 60 you can collect your VA disability and military retirement. If you don't qualify for a retirement besides medically you will not collect both.
3. In my case my PEB rated me 30% which is the minimum for a medical retirement. Even though my VA rating was 90%. So as a reservist you get 30% of active duty pay, but in my case I had so many points they based my retirement off of my points. I had 18.5 years of points so I ended up getting about 47% of active duty pay. Once I turn age 60 I will be able to collect my VA and pension.
4. So my advice is you need to meet at PEB/MEB. If you think you can wait until after you get 20 good years in do it. Also be aware when you drill you have to pay back your VA benefits as a daily rate. The following year the VA will notify you that you have a debt for drill pay received.

Response by 1SG Frank Peck made Jan 11 at 2024 9:20 AM

1SG Frank Peck — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 09:20:20 -0500

I have the best answer. I retired out of the guard with 35 years and two days as a 1SG. I had prior service, (USMC), and 3 combat tours in the Guard. I was 60% disabled while active in the Guard. I received my VA and collected my drill pay, every year I would get a letter from VA stating there is a overpay because I was getting pay from both. I would have to go on avg. 6 months with no VA pay, until it would balance out, after it got paid back, it would resume again. I could have been 100%, and still serve. Just like Col Cudworth said as long as you can perform your job, you can collect both. Some soldiers would waive their military pay anyway because they made more money with VA. Either way works, it's your choice. They are trying to change it, where you can get both if you have a medical, right now it cuts into each other if you are medically retired. Who knows how long that will take. I've been retired since 2014, had to wait till I was 58 and 5 months old when I started getting my pension, got it early cause of my deployments. I am getting both Va and Pension. I even got to 100% couple years ago. It only took about 17 years to get there LOL. I am 65 right now.

Response by SGT Keith Smith made Feb 17 at 2024 6:26 PM

SGT Keith Smith — Sat, 17 Feb 2024 18:26:59 -0500

Okay. The law states you can only get one check so what they do is give you the highest of the two. That said yes there is a way to get both. Strangely you have to request from DFAS to be concurrent. If one of your conditions was due to war or training for war or was worsened by so said training then DFAS can pay you as well as the VA. Since I do not know your issues but I can say that any physical injury can be made worse through use during war or training, I would think that most conditions would be covered. I would ask DFAS. What’s the worse thing can say? No? They can only add not take away so there is no harm in asking. Research concurrent pay. It is actually on the DFAS homepage.

Response by CWO4 Carter Owens made Mar 25 at 2024 9:23 AM

CWO4 Carter Owens — Mon, 25 Mar 2024 09:23:41 -0400

I was always somewhat confused between the difference of being 100% VA disabled and or 100% actual disabled for SSI. I've served with so many dudes that retired from A.D. and then got 100% VA disability and then got a sweet GS job. So that's an Annuities Pension. A VA check for Three Grand and then GS-11 pay. The key word in all of this is Disability.