I was told recruiters will lie to you and you will end up with a different job after basic. Is this true?

Grant Varnum — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 02:24:49 -0500

I am a high school senior and just scored a 98 on the ASVAB. I have to talked mostly to the navy, they told me nuclear was the best option. But while I was in the office they were talking to 3 people about it. I am skeptical if they say that to get you to enlist and then give you a different job. I don’t have any military members in my family and need some guidance.

Response by SN Greg Wright made Feb 27 at 2018 2:50 AM

SN Greg Wright — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 02:50:33 -0500

98 is so stellar a score that I am not surprised they are pushing you to nuke. You will sign a contract before you enlist in MEPS. They cannot change your job unless you were lying about your enlistment, or fail to perform to the standards of the job you chose. So. If you were/are honest, and you can hack it, you WILL wind up in the job you signed up for. If you lied, or you somehow gamed the system, you're going to wind up chipping paint.

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 3:17 AM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 03:17:34 -0500

Grant Varnum I agree with SN Greg Wright about recruiters. In addition to the Navy, I would consider what the other branches of the military have to offer. Please keep us informed on what you decide to do. Excellent score on the ASVAB!

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US Military 101 - Organizational Structure and Roles

Information about the U.S. military: the mission of the five military branches, organizational chain of command, and an overview of military ranks.

Response by SSgt Jim Gilmore made Feb 27 at 2018 3:21 AM

SSgt Jim Gilmore — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 03:21:43 -0500

Don't limit yourself to one branch. Talk to the others if only for comparisons. You can also get a guarantee written into your contract. If you sign for it and don't get it you have grounds to nullify the contract and be discharged. Do your homework, read and ask questions.

Response by SGT Christopher Hayden made Feb 27 at 2018 4:37 AM

SGT Christopher Hayden — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 04:37:13 -0500

The Army has you choose before you ever leave for basic, and it won't change unless you flunk out of the training for it.

Response by Cpl Jeff N. made Feb 27 at 2018 7:01 AM

Cpl Jeff N. — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 07:01:57 -0500

The most common reasons people do not end up in the MOS they signed up for is they did not meet some standard. That could be anything from being recycled in boot camp to failing to swim qualify (you might need to swim in the Navy). If they put you in a the nuclear program it is normally a pretty specific MOS and you may have to sign a longer contract due to the length of the schools you will need to attend. Keep your nose clean, do well in your quals and your school.

Response by CPT Lawrence Cable made Feb 27 at 2018 7:47 AM

CPT Lawrence Cable — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 07:47:01 -0500

The job you sign for on your contract is the job you will get as long as you pass the schools for that Rate/Military Occupational Specialty. What the recruiter will do is push you towards the jobs that require that entrance score and are generally harder for him to fill. I would go to the Navy website and look at the jobs available, including the ones mentioned by the recruiter, and see which you might be interested in doing. I have a couple of friends that are ex-nukes, they say that the rank come quick and the re-enlistment bonuses are insanely generous, as long as you don't mind living in a tube of a couple months at a time with a 130 or so of your best buddies. And you should be very employable when you decide to get out.

Response by SSG Brian G. made Feb 27 at 2018 7:56 AM

SSG Brian G. — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 07:56:51 -0500

Recruiters want to get you in and so they will upsell the glamorous jobs as these are what most people hear and read about growing up. NAVY Sub, Army Ranger, Marine Force Recon, Air Force Para. Not really a selling point to be talking about being a quartermaster, personnel specialist, cook or mechanic even though these jobs are equally as crucial to keep the warfighter going.

There is a clause somewhere in your contract that you sign that you may be reassigned at the needs of the military. Basically what that means is that while you score 98 on the ASVAB and you qualify for say Sub school, and you want that, there are only so many sub school allocations and the Navy might have other needs in other areas that you can fill. This will all be detailed out at MEPS when you sit down with another recruiter there for the final contract. What you actually sign on the line for though, is what they physically agree to so they cannot change you from being a Sub to say being a Quartermaster as that is a breach of contract and allows you the option to get out with nothing detrimental to you.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 8:30 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 08:30:35 -0500

What ever you get on your signed contract is what you will be trained for.

Response by Maj John Bell made Feb 27 at 2018 8:38 AM

Maj John Bell — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 08:38:36 -0500

Its not a matter of lying. Its a matter of the needs of the service. Furthermore, along the way it may become apparent that the MOS you signed up for is not a good match.

I had an aviation guarantee in the Marines. I found out in TBS that I loved the infantry, plus at that time I found out pilots were full-time something else (more time on collateral duties than on primary MOS) and only flew about 12 hours a month. In the FMF I was working on infantry skills 32-40 hours a week, at a minimum. I dropped aviation like a hot potato and never looked back.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 9:23 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 09:23:14 -0500

Recruiters can lie because they are humans with quotas and that can make people do things they shouldn't. But plenty of them are upstanding individuals who tell the truth no matter what.

Bottom line. Make sure you read your contract. Ask them to show you where you are guaranteed an MOS. If they seem put off by those sorts of questions, take some time to make sure you understand what you're reading. If it's not in the contract, it doesn't exist.

Response by LT Brad McInnis made Feb 27 at 2018 10:26 AM

LT Brad McInnis — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 10:26:40 -0500

If it is in your contract, and you meet the requirements, then that should be the job you get. That being said, it is the military. Nothing is really guaranteed. My advice, make them show you exactly what you are guaranteed, and then do your best to meet (and exceed) the standards and you will be fine. Things happen, though, and don't get discouraged if things change... it very well could be the best thing that ever happens to you.

Response by SPC David Willis made Feb 27 at 2018 10:50 AM

SPC David Willis — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 10:50:03 -0500

The recruiters may tell little white lies, but most are pretty upfront about what job you'll be doing. Also if I remember right I had to sign for the MOS specifically or it was in 5 different places something that makes it pretty clear what you're getting into, but that was a long time ago so I may be misremembering.

Response by CPO Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 11:14 AM

CPO Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:14:16 -0500

Grant, I am Active Duty Navy to answer your question Recruiters don't exactly lie they tell you all the good that you CAN get into and leave out the suck.

So your thinking of going Nuke, I currently work at the Nuke training base so I talk to the Nukes a lot. Its hard... let me say that again.. its insanely hard... the amount of school these kids go through is like getting your Masters in a fraction of the time and with out the diploma on the wall. They study 7 days a week, and have mandatory 4 hour study sessions on top of their normal class work every day. IF they pass power school they move on to prototype IF they pass prototype they head to the fleet to spend their lives in front of dials, gages, and screens deep in Subs or Carriers. They do rank up fast and get huge bonus's but can never cross rate and don't get to be stationed overseas in cool places like England, Germany, Spain ect.

IF they fail out they end up being given a job at the needs of the Navy. They have no guarantee or even really a say in the rate they take if they fail, and the fail rate is high. Recruiters get a bonus if they sign up a Nuke so they will always try and get people with a brain to go that route. My grandfather was a Civ Nuke and I have the brains for it but went IT instead. There are so many other rates don't just look at the shiny the recruiter is offering. As others have said talk to other recruiters, while I am partial to the Navy it is a hard life and I want you to succeed. See what the others are offering for you, see if something else meets your standards and interests better.

I wont lie to anyone, Military life can suck, Navy life can be very hard, but the end rewards far out weigh the suck. As of next moth I will have been doing this for 14 years through all the ups and downs I can look back and know I made a difference. if I can help in any way please send me a message. For now I leave you with a quote from JFK.

“I can imagine no more rewarding a career. And any man who may be asked in this century what he did to make his life worthwhile, I think can respond with a good deal of pride and satisfaction: 'I served in the United States Navy.”

Response by SSG Jb King made Feb 27 at 2018 11:18 AM

SSG Jb King — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:18:01 -0500

Key to any military enlistment is not to get in a hurry. The wrong occupational choice can really hurt you in the long run. Jobs at M.E.P.S are offered through guidance counselor based on military needs per job. If the job you want is not available now and you qualify , just wait and go back later when it does. Sometimes waiting will also result in a better bonus. Recruiters are pressured and evaluated and promoted based on performance i.e. putting guys in boots to them your a number SO TAKE CARE OF YOU DO NOT RUSH IT RESEARCH IT, BE PATIENT, BE FOCUSED

Response by CW2 Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 11:29 AM

CW2 Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:29:33 -0500

I'm an Army Recruiter, so I can't speak on behalf of Navy, Corps, AF, or CG. But Army Recruiter will reserve you a spot for a job that you qualify for AND there's a training slot available for - they should show you the screen with everything available to you. They reserve the spot, but you are not locked in. It is at MEPS with the guidance counselor where you for real lock in and are signed up for a specific job.

As others have stated, shop around. The military has an absurd amount of jobs. Combat, Intel, Signal, Healthcare, etc... What are you interested in? What are you experienced in? What is your dream job? All of these things can help you choose a job best for you, it may be the chAir Force (hehe, had to) it could be the Coast Guard. Check them all out based on what you are interested in. Some may lie and push you one way or another. Street recruiters have a mission, and you are it. Treat it like you're buying a car, get all the information before you commit.
Use Rallypoint to talk to people in specific MOS/Ratings/Specialties. This is an open forum and people can be honest.
It's your career, don't just be another number for the recruiter, use the recruiter to get into the service that will best provide you the training and specialty you desire.

Response by PO1 William "Chip" Nagel made Feb 27 at 2018 11:37 AM

PO1 William "Chip" Nagel — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:37:04 -0500

Grant Varnum Scored High Enough for Nuke that puts you in the Top 5% of the Navy. You May Catch some Flack about being a Geek a Nerd but you can laugh all the way to the bank if you finish the program. Congratulations and Welcome Aboard.

Response by GySgt Joe Strong made Feb 27 at 2018 11:50 AM

GySgt Joe Strong — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:50:28 -0500

The problem, or most common sticky point that often goes unsaid with the more technical programs is: that if you become unqualified for the promised position for any reason, your contract is still valid for the time you chose to get that position and your job is now a needs of the service item that may or may not take your preferences or desires into account. To some this feels as though they were lied to. I found it out, and opted not to go nuke(was probably a good choice) as I barely made it through Radio Tech School as it was.

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 27 at 2018 11:51 AM

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 11:51:42 -0500

Short answer Grant. No it's not true, the job you choose is the job you will get as long as you meet the requirements and pass the schooling.

Response by LCDR Scott Stroman made Feb 27 at 2018 1:15 PM

LCDR Scott Stroman — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 13:15:19 -0500

The best advice I can give you is "get it in writing". I think most recruiters are truthful but the facts are that it's a 'dog eat dog' business. A recruiter can beat his/her quota one month and get a medal, then fall below next month and get a bad eval. If you get all the promises (schools, duty stations, jobs etc.) in writing, the service has to honor that. Word of warning....read the contract carefully and get a written explanation for anything you don't understand. If you screw up and violate the contract, all bets are off. An example would be having a guarantee for three schools that build on each other and flunking out of the second school. Sorry, Charlie....you are probably now subject to the needs of the service.

Response by SPC Rob Lewis made Feb 27 at 2018 3:10 PM

SPC Rob Lewis — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 15:10:15 -0500

Watch what you contract actually states. Your recruiter is there to walk you thru the process. When you go to MEPS for your physical and contract is when the hard sale will start.
Bottom line is there will be a clause that will say “at the needs of the army, navy, air force, etc.” somewhere in your paper work.
I personally never meet anyone who had their orders changed unless the failed a school.

Response by SSgt Dan Montague made Feb 27 at 2018 4:26 PM

SSgt Dan Montague — Tue, 27 Feb 2018 16:26:55 -0500

No offense to my fellow Navy recruiters here, but when I was recruiting the navy was pushing the Nuke program hard to anyone qualified. Unless you are interested in the program, look at all your options. You don't need to limit yourself to the more educational demanding MOS's. Not saying you need to, but I put in several guys who scored really high in the grunts because that was what they wanted.
As for lying... some will flat out lie
Most just wont tell you everything. Manly because you only get 45 min or so with them.
Just don't let them push you into a direction you don't want. That is why I didn't join the first branch I looked into.

Response by SPC Steven Depuy made Feb 28 at 2018 6:10 AM

SPC Steven Depuy — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 06:10:31 -0500

They have quoto's to fill, and do what they are pressured to do. They are like politicians, they say things to you, that are a total stretch. When I enlisted, I wanted to go in right away, they said there were two openings, a Radio Repairman, and a Calvary Scout in USAEUR, West Germany. I was hoping to learn a skill for a career, I asked what scouts do that could teach me a skill. She replied, they draw maps. I then asked, so you mean I could become a topographer when I got out, she said sure. Now scouts made map overlays, not maps, so technically that was as stretch, and saying I could work as a topographer was true, its just that my job would not train me to do it and I would have to get training, but she simply said I could work as one, which was kind of true. I said to her West Germany was a long way from home, how long would I have to stay, she replied after 18 months, you can apply for transfer back to the states if you don't like it. When I got there, I told them this, they laughed, and said yeah, you can apply..... When my son went in, the wanted him to go into Artillery, I assume it was a position of need at the time. They told him he would be on a 155mm gun crew. And that he would not have to go to Afghanastan, because the current weapons platforms were not being used there, and neither were the new systems. I went on line and did a google search, and the new 155mm guns were deployed there. Not sure how they figured that one was a true statement. All I can tell you son, is if they don't put it in your contract, don't believe it. If they make you a promise, make sure its in writing.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 9:30 AM

LCDR Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 09:30:51 -0500

There are a couple of varieties of jobs within the Nuke community-- machinists/radworker lab techs, IT types, and electricians. (The smartest of the smart go IT, but I always had a preference for machinists.)
The nuke community is always hurting on maintaining enough people. Mostly because the training is really hard (so not a lot of people make it through), the work after completion of training is soul-suckingly hard (so not a lot of people who do make it through are willing to stick around for too long despite knowing the importance of the work), and the training and qualifications are SUPER marketable in the civilian sector. All of that put together leaves us with a really high percentage of people who do only one tour then go on to make real money in the civilian sector...
Bottom line-- once you get through the screening process to sign as a nuke-- the nukes aren't going to let you go (assuming you make it through the training.) This is a double-edged sword. On one hand, they have your back when it comes to being 'voluntold' to do something else. On the other, voluntary cross-rating is completely out of the question (with the possible exception of cross-rating within the nuclear community, but I've never seen anyone try to do that.)

I am a nuke and find it incredibly rewarding-- and incredibly hard. That said, I'll echo what others have said about doing your research and walking in with your eyes wide open.

There is a FB group called "The Reactor is Critical"** that is almost entirely populated with Navy nukes. If you can navigate the really dank sense of humor most of them have, you should be able to get some good insight there. Hope this helps.

**PSA-- For those who have seen too many movies, 'critical' simply means 'on' in reactor terms. Being critical is a good thing. :-)

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Feb 28 at 2018 9:44 AM

MSG Dan Castaneda — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 09:44:45 -0500

Do recruiters lie? Yes. I told my recruiter I had a criminal record when I joined. He said he ran a back ground check and nothing popped up. So he put in my packet "no record." When I was in OSUT guess what they do? Run back ground checks for security clearances, and guess what popped up? Pvt Castaneda has been changed with a felony. To make a long story short, I ended up staying there for 10 months until I was finally allowed to leave. I was only supposed to be there for 14 weeks total. My recruiter lied to me. I was young and didn't know any better. Thought maybe because I wasn't convicted there was no record of the arrest. 10 months around drill sergeants taught me some valuable lessons.

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Feb 28 at 2018 10:27 AM

SGM Erik Marquez — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 10:27:08 -0500

What is true, is they will tell you what you want you want to hear.
Lie? most no not directly, lie by omission? Well yes and to some degree its a requirement.
very, very few would ever sign up if the recruiter told them EVERY bad, crappy thing they might have to do in the service.. The enormity of it would overshadow the good of it.. even though most afterwards see it as worth the suck. Some dont, we call those "former service members" .... (Pipe down jar heads, I did not say former Mar....... nope wont get me to say it here either)
So assuming your not talking with the ultra small percentage of dishonest recruiters remember if its not written in plain English, its not a guarantee..assume it wont happen.
Its not just what is said, it is what is not said (lie by Omission )

"You can change jobs after you get to your unit" is NOT a lie, but it is not the whole story..
At the end of your enlistment as a 34N sub Q bat guano sanitation disposal expert .. you may have a option to change MOS's but thats a maybe and only then will it be from a needs of the service ..So you MAY be offered a choice from a list of what they service needs, not what you want.

"You get to travel and see cool places" is NOT a lie, but it is not the whole story..
You may get to travel to a cool place like Ireland, and never leave the lockkdown area inside the airport while waiting on the aircrew to get replaced so you can finish the trip to Iraq
You might get to go to England and spend 90 days there.....89 of them on post or in the field, and a 12 hour pass off post on the day before redeploying ......OR you might get stationed in a really cool place and have the time of your life,,I did, 3 years in Germany as a 19-21 year old.

So listen to everything said, trust but verifier and any promise made is just a good idea maybe, if it is not on the contract in plain English....

And like was pointed out on the Nuke rate... an important question back to the recruiter is.,,, What is the attrition rate and WHY (to see if it is a weak spot in your self) What happens if I fail out of the MOS schooling?
An Army For instance .. MOS 92R Rigger ...more than a few never make it to a unit assigned as a rigger.
Go through basic, get though AIT, go on to Airborne school and.....get hurt, be a jump refusal, get kicked out for sneaking to town and getting drunk, caught with a prostitute in the barracks, take a swing at a black hat all things I personally know of happening. Or, your security clearance is not yet complete after AIT, or Airborne school you may be a hold over,,if you are not granted a clearance you may be reclassified (NOTE, I see as of today a security clearance is "not Required" for 92R, I don't know if that is a change or if it is essentially a lie by omission...Secret or above clearance is not required, but there are only 3 MTOE slots world wide where you can be a level one rigger and not have a clearance..or something like that)
Point is, ask the questions....trust but verify and if told you can, you will, opportunity, most times, you should ..come into the conversation you better ask the follow up questions.

Response by Lt Col Charlie Brown made Feb 28 at 2018 10:31 AM

Lt Col Charlie Brown — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 10:31:35 -0500

As a former AF recruiting squadron commander, I can tell you that as long as you remain qualified for the job agreed to on your contract, you will get that job when you graduate tech school. That means physically, emotionally and intellectually qualified. Don't get injured in a way that disqualifies you, if you need a special clearance and you seem emotionally immature or unsteady, they might refuse to grant you the clearance level needed and of course you have to pass all portions of the tech school. Talk to other people, other recruiters and other services about what is on offer and what they did or didn't like about the service, their jobs and their lives.
My career field of transportation and logistics was not what I chose, they offered it to me as an alternative to the ones I wanted but they weren't available. I was very happy with the career field I ended up with. I loved what I did, even my special duty in recruiting.

Response by 1SG Bill Farmerie made Feb 28 at 2018 2:37 PM

1SG Bill Farmerie — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 14:37:59 -0500

If you go to MEPS, ensure it is spelled out in your contract or it is not so. Some recruiters, and I was one for 3 years, tell you everything they know and answer your questions truthfully, However, it would take them years to tell you about everything they know about their branch of service. Heck, I even used to show a video of Basic Training to include the gas chamber to prospective inductees.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 5:56 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 17:56:32 -0500

I kinda laughed when I read this one, no offense.
Recruiters can say whatever they want, it’s on YOU to read what your signing.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Feb 28 at 2018 6:12 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 28 Feb 2018 18:12:52 -0500

They won't put you in a different job. Once you sign that contract, it's binding. Now, they may not be entirely truthful about the glories (or lack thereof) of your chosen job.

Response by CN Todd Knoy made Mar 1 at 2018 8:49 AM

CN Todd Knoy — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 08:49:17 -0500

I can tell you with no doubt they lie, because they told me the exact same thing when I joined thirty years or so back and when it came down to it I got to be an operations specialist. Loved that job though

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Mar 1 at 2018 11:24 AM

SGM Bill Frazer — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 11:24:45 -0500

You get what you sign up for on your contract, unless you fail in Basic/Ait and then you are either out or assigned to the needs of the Army.

Response by SGT James Clark made Mar 1 at 2018 12:18 PM

SGT James Clark — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 12:18:53 -0500

Get it in writing that's all I can say. No matter what you do when you join the military make sure you always get a copy of everything that pertains to you and keep it in a safe place.

Response by GySgt Charles O'Connell made Mar 1 at 2018 3:28 PM

GySgt Charles O'Connell — Thu, 01 Mar 2018 15:28:36 -0500

Armed Forces recruiters cannot guarantee you a job. What they can do, assuming that you meet the mental/physical requirements, is guarantee you training. For instance, you want to a be a helicopter engine mech, you meet the requirements, a school seat is available to coincide with your successful completion of recruit training, bang, it's part of your enlistment package. Whether you become a helo eng mech depends on your mastering the school. Selecting a field requires research. Do yours.

Response by Capt Christian D. Orr made Mar 3 at 2018 10:22 PM

Capt Christian D. Orr — Sat, 03 Mar 2018 22:22:36 -0500

The key is to GET IT IN WRITING and make sure your recruiter knows that you will NOT raise your right hand for the oath and sign on the dotted line unless you have the job you truly desire spelled out on the contract.

Too many of my Air Force buddies made the mistake of coming in "Open-General" and then finding out in the middle of Basic that they were ending up with a job that they didn't want.

Response by SPC Brian Mason made Mar 3 at 2018 10:59 PM

SPC Brian Mason — Sat, 03 Mar 2018 22:59:48 -0500

Not all recruiters lie.
I did research and told the recruiter that if I didn't get Combat Medic (then 91W, now 68W) that I wasn't going to sign the final paperwork. Wasted more time on them than anything. He and the guy at MEPS got all huffy about it. I scored well above the minimum and as usual, most are trying to fill QUOTA.
Strength needs to have X personnel at each unit in each MOS (for Army at least). Too many and there can be over-strength. I got 3 copies of everything they gave me; especially your recruitment papers and ANYTHING to do with an enlistment bonus. Always keep one set and never hand over all your copies. Things tend to get lost and I got screwed out of a 3 grand sign on bonus.
You can get guaranteed MOS OR....duty station. Who cares if you go to a 'good' one but get a crappy, boring MOS that you don't like? If you get out you'll have experience in something you don't like.

Response by MSG John Duchesneau made Mar 4 at 2018 11:57 PM

MSG John Duchesneau — Sun, 04 Mar 2018 23:57:35 -0500

Its been known to happen...