What do I do if I am given an Article 15 that reduces me from SSG to SGT, but I PCS before it is processed?

Tue, 09 Jan 2024 22:19:13 -0500

Response by COL Randall C. made Jan 10 at 2024 7:45 AM

COL Randall C. — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 07:45:38 -0500

SGT Michael Mason, I read through the different comments you had throughout the post and addressed them below rather than piecemeal.
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I'm with MSG Private RallyPoint Member, SGM Bill Frazer, and SGM Erik Marquez - someone screwed up.

You'll have an "adverse action" flag placed on your file when an Article 15 or UCMJ is initiated. That flag is non-transferrable and will stop you from PCSing.

When the Article 15 proceedings are completed and you have your punishment, you will have a "punishment phase" flag placed on your file for the duration of your punishment. These flags are transferrable and will allow you to PCS.

HOWEVER, if the punishment includes things that are "geographically limiting" such as extra duty, confinement, or restriction, then the original "adverse action" flag remains in place until the geographically limiting punishments are completed.

What SHOULD have happened is that you would have stayed at your old location until the extra duty was completed, the flag would be changed to a punishment flag for the rest of your punishment (the suspension of "2 months of a half-months’ pay" could be up to 6 months) and you would have been allowed to PCS at that point (assuming HRC still allowed you to go as you would go to an E-5 position, not an E-6 position).

Now, as to what is going to happen with you now.

I saw a few comments about who can and can't impose punishment, so I want to give you the straight answer.

The "imposing commander" is the one that imposes the punishment from your article 15 (this is your old commander who gave you the reduction, extra duty and suspended forfeiture of pay). However, any commander who has the appropriate authority over you, may impose punishment on you.

Normally the imposing commander must be the same throughout the process from the time it is initiated until the punishment is complete. The exception is when you cease to be under that commander's authority because one of you changes units. Per AR 27-10*, para 3-8b:

"Termination of status. Once a member ceases to be part of the command as outlined in paragraph 3–8a, the authority of the losing commander to impose NJP over that member terminates. However, if UCMJ, Art. 15 proceedings have been initiated and punishment has not been imposed prior to the time of the change of the member’s assignment, the commander who instituted the proceedings may transmit the record of proceedings to the gaining commander for appropriate disposition. This only applies when the member changes command. Proceedings initiated prior to a change in the individual exercising command, whether temporary (under an acting commander) or permanent (change of command), the punishment may be imposed by a lawful successor-in-command."

The DA 2627, which lists all the punishments given as well as which were executed or suspended, will be forwarded to your new unit. Your new commander will see that the 2 months of half-pay was suspended but that the reduction in rank and extra duty was executed.

While para 3-8b above may make it sound like the reduction won't happen at your old unit, it will. The punishment was executed (imposed) by your old commander prior to your PCS. At that point (not when the administrative records are updated), you were no longer a SSG, you became a SGT again. The records may be wrong because the paperwork hasn't gone through the process yet, but when the packet finishes its local processing, HRC will be notified, a reduction order will be issues/placed in your AMHRR, and IPPS-A will be updated.

Regarding extra duty - that will be completely up to the discretion of your new field grade authority (battalion commander assuming you're in a line unit) and how much your old unit pushes for the remainder of it to be implemented. The old commander could send an amplifying letter explaining the circumstances why you were allowed to PCS while still under extra duty and request that the new command implement it the remainder ... or the old commander might not care about it at all. Bottom line - your new commander will implement it, if they are so inclined (personal note - If I was the new commander, I'd likely not do it and just suspend the punishment to match the timeline of the pay suspension so you could start at a new unit on the right footing).

As for the suspended pay. If you screw-up within the timeframe of the suspension, and your new FG authority wants to, they can implement whatever punishment was suspended immediately. Don't screw up.

While it is strange that your packet "hasn't made it back from legal nor to S1", the fact that you PCSed before it was processed is immaterial. The legal review is 99% likely to have nothing to do with you (you would have been given 5 days ask for reconsideration or appeal to higher your punishment). It probably is anything from making sure the “I”s are dotted to making sure the correct additional notifications are completed according to local/installation policy.
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* DA Form 2627 - https://armypubs.army.mil/pub/eforms/DR_a/pdf/A2627_2.pdf
* AR 27-10 (Military Justice) - https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/ARN31271-AR_27-10-001-WEB-2.pdf
* AR 600-8-19 (Enlisted Promotions and Demotions) - https://armypubs.army.mil/epubs/DR_pubs/DR_a/ARN36067-AR_600-8-19-000-WEB-1.pdf

A2627_2.pdf

Response by 1LT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2024 8:25 AM

1LT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 08:25:31 -0500

Short answer, prepare to be a SGT again and earn the trust of your new leadership. The Article 15 is getting processed. The changes should go through S1 channels and then big Army, eventually making its way to your new unit. Be professional and give them the heads up when you get there, if they don't already know.

Sorry you're getting demoted. I hope you learn from whatever caused it and use it as a lesson in humilty and gratitude.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 10 at 2024 9:58 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 09:58:53 -0500

To help me understand, you are going to receive an Article 15 and be reduced in rank but the proceedings (the reduction, extra duty portions) are scheduled to occur AFTER you PCS?

Chances are you are probably flagged or will be flagged soon. If/once you are flagged, you are not PCSing as it is more than likely a Non-Transfer Flag. If that is the case, you will want to start getting your civilian resume prepped and packing your bags. The reason being is that you are a SSG about to be demoted to SGT via Article. I am betting there will be a GOMOR and/or an NCOER Relief for Cause in the mix. Any one of these WILL trigger a QMP. And, depending on what your Article 15 and reduction is for, the QMP can declare you unfit for continued service. For example, any SSG to CSM that receives a DUI, the QMP is 100% fatal for DUIs.

Response by CSM Chuck Stafford made Jan 10 at 2024 10:17 AM

CSM Chuck Stafford — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 10:17:21 -0500

I suspect that you will not be PCSing during the UCMJ process -- this isn't a pass on to the next commander situation. Since you imply you will be reduced and there is no hint of innocence here - expect to carry on as a SGT immediately after the proceedings happen; expect to be stripped of the rank while in the room and S1 will process paperwork soon after. I would also recommend that you start soldiering right and get your resume in order, because your future in the service may be short-lived

Response by SGM Bill Frazer made Jan 10 at 2024 1:28 PM

SGM Bill Frazer — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 13:28:19 -0500

1. Any Judicial actions immediately stop all personnel actions until they are resolved. Then personnel actions can resume. With a reduction in rank, HRC will have to decide if there remains a slot for you to PCS into.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 11 at 2024 7:16 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 07:16:33 -0500

I was already giving the Article 15. 45 days extra duty, suspended 2 months half of pay, reduction to SGT, the article 25 will go in my restricted file. I was able to PCS, but I know the packet hasn’t made it back to legal nor to S1 yet. So as of now everything remains the same in ippsa, etc… So now that I am at my new unit, once the packet makes it back to my old S1 what happens? Do they forward it to my new unit to be processed? Do they process it? Will the extra duty roll over? Will I be notified by my old battalion S1? I am asking humbly and just trying to get a better understanding. Thank you everyone for the help.

Response by SFC Birk Ellis made Jan 11 at 2024 8:10 AM

SFC Birk Ellis — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 08:10:51 -0500

Appears that you have an active flag therefore no favorable actions can come your way, that includes PCS either by way of branch instructions or reenlisted for duty station of choice.
Once the admin stuff is out of the way for the UCMJ, get yourself back on the right track, do good things, and continue on your career.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 12 at 2024 12:17 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 12 Jan 2024 12:17:49 -0500

Does anyone know what the time frame is as far as appearing to the promotion board again and earning my promotion status back for the primary zone?