Posted on Sep 29, 2016
If I go to the clinic and the doctor writes me a profile saying no PT, can my 1SG make me do PT anyway?
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Responses: 43
You should have been given a DA 3349.
On that form, exercises that can not be performed or have restrictions (such as run at your own pace) will be listed. Anything not listed as prohibited or limited means that you can perform the exercise.
That aside, the First Sergeant does not have the authority to override a profile. The commander does, and when doing so assumes responsibility for any injury that may occur. Most commanders will not override a profile without a very good reason.
On that form, exercises that can not be performed or have restrictions (such as run at your own pace) will be listed. Anything not listed as prohibited or limited means that you can perform the exercise.
That aside, the First Sergeant does not have the authority to override a profile. The commander does, and when doing so assumes responsibility for any injury that may occur. Most commanders will not override a profile without a very good reason.
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MAJ (Join to see)
I agree with what the two senior leaders above have said. A profile is not a 'get out of jail free' card. Rather, I issue profiles with the goal of allowing that Solder the greatest freedom of movement without further aggravation of the existing pathology. The Commander has the authority to override temporary profiles (not permanent, as they have been issued by a board of specialists and fall under a Technical Bulletin.) However, like Top just said, that Commander assumes responsibility for the health of that Soldier, and that is not a liability that most Commanders want. If there is any question about the limitations of a temporary profile, Commanders now have the ability as of 1 JUN 2016 to interface directly with the issuing Provider via the eProfile system.
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1SG (Join to see)
PFC Julie Haas - True, but the OP seems to indicate that wasn't the case. If it ain't in MEDPROS, it ain't a profile.
I'd never bust up a joe because the doctor or PA is lazy. It is very important for the Soldier that any injuries incurred in the line of duty be documented and any aggravation of that injury not be incurred from training. That's what profiles are for.
The goal of any leader should be to get that Soldier healed and back on the line. It isn't just good for the joe, it is good for the unit.
I'd never bust up a joe because the doctor or PA is lazy. It is very important for the Soldier that any injuries incurred in the line of duty be documented and any aggravation of that injury not be incurred from training. That's what profiles are for.
The goal of any leader should be to get that Soldier healed and back on the line. It isn't just good for the joe, it is good for the unit.
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CAPT Dave Woodard
As so many others have said, if the profile is overridden by a command, then the individual who implements the override assumes liability. Having been in the Medical Department for more years than I care to remember, often we have "sick-bay commando"s", who we see almost weekly for an excuse to not PT, those are the ones who are getting pushback from the line companies. Communication between the MD and the Command are critical in these issues.
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1SG Jay Vanderford
Hmmmm, well, as a retired 1S, I may have been brought in at a time when things were a bit different, we had sick call after PT hours, sick call started at 0730 because the medics were allowed to keep fit also. With that, it wasn't until sometime after being a SSG that I ended up in a unit that had sick call hours before PT, and yes, Soldiers took advantage of it. We had smart Soldiers, they made friends with the Medics and knew all the protocols, for example, my back hurts gets you 90 days without PT initially. I had a Soldier work his way down from the neck, eventually I was able to make malingering stick with the help of our PA. Right wrong or indifferent, if you can breath, you can likely do something for PT so as not to endanger your fellow Soldiers that will have to carry your weight when you cannot. If you absolutely get injured, go to the emergency room, if you get a cold, go after PT hours, if its something you think may kill you, go to the hospital, but when it comes to your job, do it better than the guy above and below you and things will naturally workout.
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PV2 Duran, I strongly recommend you talk with your doctor, here is why;
There is a new profile system. So some of the advice you are being given is great but outdated. The new profile system does not allow anyone to over ride the doctors orders on a profile even the Commander. There is also a new system to track this "Commanders Portal" this new system took effect 1 June 2016. Eprofile is no longer available for commanders and 1SGs.
The Army realized that too many folks are severely injured and the numbers are not related to Combat but overall health and welfare, I again recommend you talk with your doctor.
If you need further information feel free to contact me- [login to see]
Hope this helps!
1SG Perea
There is a new profile system. So some of the advice you are being given is great but outdated. The new profile system does not allow anyone to over ride the doctors orders on a profile even the Commander. There is also a new system to track this "Commanders Portal" this new system took effect 1 June 2016. Eprofile is no longer available for commanders and 1SGs.
The Army realized that too many folks are severely injured and the numbers are not related to Combat but overall health and welfare, I again recommend you talk with your doctor.
If you need further information feel free to contact me- [login to see]
Hope this helps!
1SG Perea
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PVT Duran, you my friend are a young private. You should want to do PT. If you cannot do certain events, then inform the person running the PT, and then attempt a modified exercise. You are way too young to start trying to go against the command. Get with the program buddy. Welcome to the military.
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MSG Dan Castaneda
PFC Jim Wheeler - Seems like you got yourself a good wife. My wife use to wipe my ass as I was laying in bed dying of Malaria. She has embraced the suck with me. Now living it up as we decide "what's next?" I'm glad you turned out alright. Regardless of what permanent damage I leave this military with. I know its not as bad as those I carried off the battle field in bags. Good day to you sir.
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PFC Jim Wheeler
MSG Dan Castaneda - Fair enough.
I think I'm just bitter because I never did what I signed up to do (for better or worse).
Good day to you as well.
I think I'm just bitter because I never did what I signed up to do (for better or worse).
Good day to you as well.
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SFC William Sutherland III
Many don't realize that there are very few and far jobs between that allocate time for physical excerice! Think about it, you actually get paid to sweat! Building endurance makes you a stronger person and it sheds stress;
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MSG Dan Castaneda
SFC William Sutherland III - I absolutely agree. We don't do organized PT in SF, unless is a team event. However, doing PT is part of my daily duty. Like any other "big boy" I find time to make it happen.
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