If there is one thing you could change about the army promotion system what would it be?

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 07:10:03 -0400

Response by SSG Oliver Mathews made Mar 12 at 2014 7:27 AM

SSG Oliver Mathews — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 07:27:19 -0400

one thing? Place an emphasis on technical ability. Possibly using a test such as the Air force combined with the Promotion Board. Thats one thing...

Response by SGM Matthew Quick made Mar 12 at 2014 9:25 AM

SGM Matthew Quick — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:25:16 -0400

No AUTOMATIC promotions because you've reached a time in service milestone, especially specialist.  EARN IT!

Response by SGM Matthew Quick made Mar 12 at 2014 9:29 AM

SGM Matthew Quick — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:29:55 -0400

Specific/detailed centralized promotion board feedback (SFC through SGM) for non-selects explaining WHY they were not selected, compared to their peers.

I know this would be near-impossible with the amount of scoring board members compared to records, unless there were a quantifiable alternative.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 12 at 2014 9:32 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:32:56 -0400

I've already seen a couple of posts where people are saying bring back the skills test. I don't agree nor disagree with that being added, but I would like to point out this:

I've met numerous peope in the military and in the civilian sector that knew how to do a job forwards and backwards. However, many of those same people struggled to lead and/or teach others in how to do the job. Knowing a job should be one component in the promotion system, but I don't think it is the end all of making a good leader. There needs to be other components added if the system was going to be overhauled.

Response by SSG Christopher Settembrino made Mar 12 at 2014 9:36 AM

SSG Christopher Settembrino — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:36:35 -0400

I really wish we could go back to having a job skills test. It's one thing for a soldier or a NCO to be able to memorize regulations, but if they can't perfrom in the MOS they don't need to get promoted. Granted, yes it is that persons NCO's job to ensure that they are good at their job before sending them to the board. But we all know that there is toxic leadership out there and there are people that get sent to the board and pass it that should not have. I feel if we had job skill tests done before attending the board it would help with some of that.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made Mar 12 at 2014 9:39 AM

SFC Michael Hasbun — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:39:21 -0400

No TIG/TIS waivers.... period.

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Mar 12 at 2014 9:43 AM

SPC Christopher Smith — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 09:43:00 -0400

I would get rid of the Promotion Board, I've voiced my distaste of it several times already here on RP, so that is nothing new. I'd replace it with a skills test that incorporates critical thinking skills. This test would be reviewed above the Unit level.

Response by Maj Chris Nelson made Mar 12 at 2014 10:43 AM

Maj Chris Nelson — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 10:43:27 -0400

Having been a part time educator, one thing that I found in teaching was the development of grades... Tests give you a difinitive score that is backed up by an answer key. The answers are right....or wrong. Any papers that are written, while there is a degree of subjective, are based on a format (APA normally) with specific criteria that needs to be met.

The military promotion systems (this is for Army AND Air Force) rely on subjective data and the rater's ability to write bullets. You may have done more and greater deeds then someone else, but do not get promoted because your writing team stinks at it. I would like to see a system generated that removes almost all subjectiveness. Stick to measureable data points. High score wins. At promotion boards (especially record review boards), your PACKAGE is scored using specific criteria....but the information submitted is often subject to the human factor. Time in Service, Time in Grade, SQT testing....all these provide measureable data points. EPR/OPR provides the "sloppy factor".

Response by 1SG Shane Hansen made Mar 12 at 2014 12:05 PM

1SG Shane Hansen — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 12:05:22 -0400

I would like for the Command List Integration to go away. It's a lazy way out for both leaders and soldiers. To me it is accepting mediocrity and that is not okay.

I would like for board points to be reinstated. Not everyone performs the same and that should be recognized.

I would like for "Commander's points" to be reinstated. Again, not everyone performs at the same level and that should be recognized. But there should be some sort of checks and balances to ensure not everyone is getting max points.

I am probably alone in this, but I do NOT think deployments should count for promotion points either. It's double dipping to me, you already get points from whatever deployment/service award you received while deployed.

Response by SFC Stephen P. made Mar 12 at 2014 2:05 PM

SFC Stephen P. — Wed, 12 Mar 2014 14:05:42 -0400

Add in involuntary reclassification to fill critical shortages.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 13 at 2014 11:40 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 13 Mar 2014 11:40:10 -0400

Not a big fan of the job skills test.

I remember the the SQT and SDT, they had a bunch of issues then. That is why they were eliminated. That and you had people that received awards for their test scores but could not fire a weapon or navigate their way out of the PX. Some people are better at multiple guessing than others.

There were also huge inequities between MOS's some jobs had a 15 question test with a 30 minute time limit. More technical jobs had 50 question tests and 3 hour time limits.

Response by SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 13 at 2014 12:43 PM

SSG(P) Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 13 Mar 2014 12:43:08 -0400

Combat Deployments worth points.

It is a valuable leadership attribute, but pretty soon that category is going to be worthless because the SPCs and SGTs going for promotion will have never had a combat deployment. It'll just a category where no one has points in.

Response by SPC Christopher Smith made Mar 13 at 2014 3:29 PM

SPC Christopher Smith — Thu, 13 Mar 2014 15:29:18 -0400

I've already given one answer but here is another thing I'd like to see changed with the promotion system.

If I could change one thing, I'd add Tech/Spec 5 and 6. My reasons: a) Some people do not want to lead, they have no interest in developing other people around them but they love their job and excel at it. b) Keeps a senior person on board to properly do technical jobs with little oversight. c) will closely resemble the Warrent ability to be highly specialized without the outside hassle. I'm sure other reasons fit as well, but I do not have them currently.