If we take an APFT while attending an Army School can the DA705(APFT Score Card) be transferred back to our units?

2018-11-05T17:29:31-05:00

If we take an APFT while attending an Army School (BLC, SLC, etc) can the DA705(APFT Score Card) be transferred back to our units to put in our file?

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 5:36 PM

2018-11-05T17:36:06-05:00

No. Only your command can administer a record APFT.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 5:37 PM

2018-11-05T17:37:59-05:00

It isn’t usually common but there is no regulatory guidance saying this can’t be done.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 5:44 PM

2018-11-05T17:44:28-05:00

A pt card from school shouldn’t be used back at your unit but I have seen some get away with it

Response by SSG Robert Perrotto made Nov 5 at 2018 5:49 PM

2018-11-05T17:49:24-05:00

wait - is not your schools NCO, and by Schools NCO, the CSM, requiring an APFT prior to you attending? thought that was standard operating procedure prior to attending any NCOES schools as failure of the APFT or H&W for these schools would be career ending. The APFT would then be a record APFT and no need to fudge the system by submitting your school 705

Response by SFC(P) Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 6:01 PM

2018-11-05T18:01:27-05:00

Unit does not have to but can decide to. I just attended the Pre-Warrant Officer Candidate Course this weekend at my states RTI(Regional Training Institute) and got my best score in my 7.5 years of service so my unit decided to upload the 705 into the system.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 6:10 PM

2018-11-05T18:10:11-05:00

At BLC (WLC 2014) they let us do it. At ALC 2018 they did not.

Bottom line I would not bet the farm on it. Keep pushing your PT and knock it out of the park back at your unit.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 6:13 PM

2018-11-05T18:13:31-05:00

My WLC/BLC, ALC and SLC APFT's didnt say anything except for me being on a perm. profile. Doesn't say "FOR RECORD" ...Where does it say a certain standard...or is it schoolhouse dependent? This is just my experience.

Response by SGT Jim Ramge, MBA made Nov 5 at 2018 6:16 PM

2018-11-05T18:16:13-05:00

There might be a newer AR 350-1, Dated 19 Aug 2014 out there but look for it and read this section.
“3–13. Physical readiness and height and weight requirements for military institutional training.”
Might answer your question...

Response by 1SG Patrick Burke made Nov 5 at 2018 8:18 PM

2018-11-05T20:18:12-05:00

Can it be done? Sure, all it takes is the training room NCO to log into DTMS and update your scores. See if he can add a few tabs while he is mashing away at the keyboard.
Let's start with the term 'record' as it appears in the regulation: "Commanders may administer the APFT as often as they wish; however, they must specify beforehand when the results are for record. RA and AGR Soldiers will take the APFT twice each calendar year. A minimum of 4 months will separate record tests. Soldiers that require make-up testing or re-testing for an APFT failure are exempt from the 4-month rule. The intent is for the RA and the AGR Soldiers to take a record APFT every 6 months" (AR 350-1, DEC 2017, p. 179).
When you hear record, that means this is the score that is going to be put into your record. There is no small print about picking your highest score or what ever, it is the score of the test the day the Commander states it is record. This is the one that is used for everything until the next record test, such as the promotion point worksheet. The APFT you take at school or given by anyone other than the Captain that has direct military authority over you is for screening purposes only. In the case of NCOES, a failure on the subsequent retry results in a "Did Not Meet Course Standards" which triggers a Suspension of Favorable Actions for failing an NCOES course. The Soldier is being removed for failing the course, not the specific reason of failing an APFT. The School house cannot conduct a 'record' APFT.
It also states that a Soldier should be able to pass the APFT at any time (some redeployment exceptions), so in theory your unit wants to do an APFT every Monday, you best be getting at least 180. In my 21 years of service, I have never seen the word "diagnostic" in any verbiage concerning the APFT, except for those officers in BOLC-B and that's only because they just learned how to spell APFT.

Response by 2LT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 9:32 PM

2018-11-05T21:32:17-05:00

It'll be up to your commander.
Similar to if you take an APFT at another unit.
As we train to standard, it shouldn't matter where you perform that standard.
It should state "Record" in the notes.
Your training NCO can enter it into DTMS.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 5 at 2018 11:56 PM

2018-11-05T23:56:11-05:00

As a 1SG I allowed Soldiers to use an NCOES APFT. I know Commander's administer the APFT, but let's think about this. An APFT is an APFT. I trust an APFT from an NCOES. Every NCOES I attended graded harder then back in my unit.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2018 12:32 AM

2018-11-06T00:32:14-05:00

Should it happen? Probably not. Does it happen? It probably happened 12 times, Army-wide, so far this week.

Soldiers need to realize that there is just about nothing that can’t happen in the Army, regardless of regulation or what should happen, if you get the right person/people to make a phone call or sign off.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2018 9:52 AM

2018-11-06T09:52:37-05:00

No because at NCOES it's not a record. It's just a requirement to complete the course. I just did SLC in January and that's exactly what the senior instructor told us. I think it was in the SOP too. That's why no one gets flagged if they fail that or height/weight in a NCOES school. They just get sent home with a failure to meet course standards.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 6 at 2018 10:48 AM

2018-11-06T10:48:11-05:00

I believe the APFT score card can be transferred back to your unit from the school house depending on your command but the score card from your unit can not be transferred to the school house.

Response by SSG Kelly Ferguson made Nov 6 at 2018 11:35 AM

2018-11-06T11:35:47-05:00

Yes

Response by 1SG John Cummings made Nov 10 at 2018 11:16 AM

2018-11-10T11:16:34-05:00

This is just more proof that the Army really cares about one thing. APFT... not much else. I saw so many dirt bag Soldiers get promoted because they have a high pt score, and they make terrible leaders, because all they know how to do is PT. the school says take an APFT, it's not for record, but if you fail we kick you out of school. your unit says if you fail an APFT you have 6 months to take another one and pass or we kick you out. and in the meantime no favorable action. fail at the rifle range? no big deal, maybe a counseling statement, but you are still going to school, getting that next promotion and getting an award for abc..... the army doesn't care if you can shoot, fight or do your mos, all they want you to do is push ups sit ups and 2 mile run...........

Response by SGT Tim Hooper made Nov 20 at 2018 10:34 PM

2018-11-20T22:34:21-05:00

Back when I served and was the assistant training NCO this would not have been a problem. But that was a long time ago.

Response by SFC Jeff Kinsley made Dec 10 at 2018 7:57 PM

2018-12-10T19:57:59-05:00

The APFT test you take during NCOES is pat of the school requirement and not to be used as the record APFT for the yearly requirements.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 3 at 2019 2:20 AM

2019-11-03T02:20:24-05:00

I just went to BLC and Sgl had access to DTMS and they have uploaded all our scores in.