If you are in your primary zone, are you required to go to the promotion board?

SPC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 08:40:12 -0400

I'm in my primary zone. I've been in for four years, and a SPC for two years. My current NCO gives me a counseling every month not recommending me for promotion, and each time, it's a reason such as I need to work on my "communication, responsibilty", things of that nature, as well as any mistakes I make during my work within that month. So he does not send me to the promotion board.
I'm not flagged. I've never received a UCMJ, have never had any legal trouble. I always volunteer to help, I always try to take the initiative to get things done when I'm aware of them. I try to spread knowledge, and generally do what I can to help other soldiers. And I've been told by my fellow soldiers that none of the sort I've mentioned are legitimate reasons not to send me to the promotion board. I feel that no matter what I do, the hiccups I have here and there are all that my direct line sees.
But I have heard that since I am in my primary zone, I need to go. Is this true? What can I do? I really want to go to the promotion board. I want to grow. But I feel I'm being unnecessarily shot down for things even many NCOs do.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 25 at 2018 8:49 AM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 08:49:56 -0400

Under the new promotion system, E4/5 in their primary zone for promotion must go to the promotion board.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 25 at 2018 9:32 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 09:32:08 -0400

Ah! Trying to become an NCO but you get shot down by many of them. Your going to read in comments below that the new policy says you have to have a board appearance at a certain amount of months etc. while that is true it doesn’t mean you will gain promotable status. Your company commander will circle yes on the report and your sergeant will take you. If you don’t have your first line leaders blessing your sponsor can tell the CSM “president of the board I don’t recommend this Soldier and this is why”. Most likely the CSM will not recommend you. I applaud you for wanting to grow so here’s some advice. You need to win over those NCOs. Acceptance is real important in the NCO core. That’s why we have induction ceremonies and talk to each other behind closed doors because NCOs trust each other “usually”. Even if you did get promoted to Sergent good chance you’ll fall under one of them. And guess who writes ur evaluation? Good chance those NCOs will. When you get looked at for SFC when ur a SSG. Good chance the staff sergeants right now will be CSMs etc. What I’m getting at is win over those sergeants. Ur not going to please everyone but give a little more effort. When ur sergeant tells you to do something or asks you something don’t say “why?” Just do it! Cause guess what he or she’s gonna say when you ask them to take you to the board with a recommendation. “Why?”. Lol get my point? as I know ur comment says I get shot down for stuff a lot of NCOs do. You need to realize they are NCOs and you are not. If your first line leader is shooting you down; to me it’s the same as all the other NCOs shooting you down. As I digress, if ur focused on going to the board don’t worry you’ll get that. If you want to gain promotable status and join the NCO core gain acceptance. I’ll leave it to others on rally point to give you tips.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 25 at 2018 12:25 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 12:25:59 -0400

Yes if you are in primary you are supposed to get sent to the board and if not, there has to be a damn good reason why they haven't been sent. I believe it has to be from the BN Commander on why someone isn't going but I could be remembering wrong.

If those are the things your NCO keeps counseling you on and hasn't done anything to help you improve on these alleged "communication and responsibility" issues then he or she should be in the 1SG office with you finding out why.

What mistakes do you make that he hasn't sent you? Everyone makes mistakes - that's how you learn. They would have to be very egregious for me to not send someone to the board.

Do these counselings have a plan of action? Does he do the follow up each month at the end of the counseling to dictate your progress or lack of?

Have you talked to your NCO? I would ask to speak with your NCO and PSG together and figure out what's wrong. Maybe your PSG doesn't know. Maybe he or she does. But this doesn't sound right at all based on what you've given.

Response by MAJ Javier Rivera made Jun 25 at 2018 2:50 PM

MAJ Javier Rivera — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 14:50:58 -0400

If you haven’t been to the promotion board there most be a justified reason for it; a documented reason. Your 1st line supervisor, like you stated, must counsel you every month and identify both areas to sustain and areas to improve. Additionally he/she must establish a plan of action in order to get you where you need to be and follow up. It all on the DA 4856.

My suggestion. Get all of your DA 4856 copies and review them. Do a self assessment and compare it with the documents. Pay special attention to the plan of action, leader responsibilities, and assessment. Here is the thing. If your NCO says you are not meeting the standard in a specific task/s he must bring it to your attention, be specific (key point discussion), work with you on overcoming the hurdle (show you what right looks like/plan of action), and follow up (assessment). All basic leadership! Not tell you what’s wrong and let you figure out. Next time he provides you with an end of the month counseling ask him to help you overcome those issues he identify. That is his job as a NCO! If the trend continues an open door with the 1SG should be in place.

Response by CSM Darieus ZaGara made Jun 25 at 2018 5:15 PM

CSM Darieus ZaGara — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 17:15:58 -0400

It is not as simple as you must attend a board. Must attend does not Guarantee support from the panel. I would ask to speak to mybPltvvSgt and the 1SG. The 1SG can better explain local policies and requirments. In fact the report goes from him to the commander on all prinary zone personnel, so the Commander and 1SG must be fully aware and be able to speak to it. Thank you for your service.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 25 at 2018 9:34 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 25 Jun 2018 21:34:51 -0400

When it says mandatory, it does not mean they have to send you , it means you have to appear in front of a board in order to get promoted

Response by CSM Richard StCyr made Jun 26 at 2018 1:54 PM

CSM Richard StCyr — Tue, 26 Jun 2018 13:54:32 -0400

An observation... When I would inspect counseling's as a First Sergeant and later as a CSM during battalion command inspections one of the things I would look at was those who were in the primary zones for promotion and not boarded and the reasons why supervisors were not recommending them.

A common error on the SQD LDRs part was they would not develop a plan of action to correct the deficiencies noted nor record the follow up results. Another was inventing standards for performance that didn't match those found in any of the regs as being required for promotion. After a couple iterations and getting the PSG/ SQD LDRs and later 1SGs on line; the problem corrected itself.

You should talk to your SQD LDR and PSG about your concerns and if that fails get on the 1SG calendar. If you can't stand up for yourself you probably are not ready to be a SGT as once the chevrons go on, you have to stand up for your Soldiers when they are rite. Google a copy of AR 600-8-19 Enlisted Promotions and Reductions the one dated 25 April 2017 in PDF format looks to be the most current. Read it and then have the conversations from a position of actually knowing the standard verses what you feel or think the standards are.

Hope that helps.

Response by PFC John Derek Ginsberg made Jun 26 at 2018 6:51 PM

PFC John Derek Ginsberg — Tue, 26 Jun 2018 18:51:48 -0400

If you wish to earn promotion you will earn it. Take heart...since you're not in any adverse status right now, you can take that as a sign of hope. As far as communication and responsibility, there just might be some independent study courses you could take to help improve that. As for it all, it takes practice, one hundred percent effort, and correct the mistakes. I've been out in the civilian world for decades, and this is always true. Best wishes.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jun 27 at 2018 2:45 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 27 Jun 2018 02:45:32 -0400

If you haven't already, start studying for the board.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 27 at 2019 12:12 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 27 May 2019 00:12:12 -0400

Doesnt the new rules say the commander is required to either send you or bar you?

Response by SFC Casey O'Mally made May 27 at 2019 5:32 AM

SFC Casey O'Mally — Mon, 27 May 2019 05:32:43 -0400

One of the things your first line owes you is a clear set of go/no-go criteria. Many have mentioned the plan of action section of the 4856. I think you need to ask for more. You need to sit down with your first line, utilizing the total Soldier concept, and ask what he/she expects from youbto obtain a recommendation. Go down the line. APFT, Weapon Qual, duties, performance, values, knowledge, leadership, discipline, uniform wear and appearance, etc. Literally every aspect of Soldiering and leading you can both think of. What is the standard, and how do you demonstrate achievement of the standard? If your first line comes back with (what you believe to be) unreasonable standards, like MUST get 300 on APFT (as compared to MUST get 180, prefer 270, for example), then bring it up the chain.

If all of the requirements seem reasonable, then the next step is moving to the 4856 and looking at which standards you are NOT meeting, and looking at a plan of actions for those standards.

Once I got good (not great) at counseling NCOs for initial NCOER counseling, I learned to literally go down the NCOER form with them and explain what "success" looked like, and what "excellence" looked like for each box. Compleye with qualifiable and quantitative standards. Success = 6 SH of college, excellence = 12 SH of college. Success = 1 Soldier passing promo board, excellence = 2 Soldiers selected as SOM at BN or higher. Etc. When it came time to counsel and do the NCOER there were no suprises, no hurt feelings. Obviously, you don't have an NCOER to go down, but using the same concept, you can set yourself up for the same result - no surprises, no hurt feelings. AND if it is a case of NCO just has it out for you, you have a black & white list of met expectations you can bring up the chain, later.

Response by SGT Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 26 at 2022 7:42 PM

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 26 Jan 2022 19:42:10 -0500

Why are you signing that you agree?