If you served in Viet Nam, have your feelings about US involvement changed or evolved? If so, how? What’s changed for you, or what hasn’t?

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:32:39 -0500

I returned home in 1972. Though I remained in the service, I also reengaged civilian life. I went to college and faced many of the negative pressures that society, in general, exhibited back then towards the country’s military. No one said “Thank You” until 1983. I didn’t visit “The Wall” until 1997. And I did not become anti-involvement until the ousting of Hussein in 1991, became the Southwest Asian outhouse quagmire that it now is today. What a fucking mess that is.

When I think of Viet Nam, I will always think that we bottom-of-the-ladder people did our best and tried to help some of the people a lot of the time. I know today that we were lied to by the highest brass and the top leadership in Washington. Politics and politicians got a lot of good boys killed in Southeast Asia for the sake of politics, and reelection potential, or “to save face.” Goddamn those people to Hell for what they did. I lost several friends in that war, and I will never forgive the people ultimately responsible for their deaths.

Today, it’s Southwest Asia, and we are engaged in another, mainly, political quagmire. Thousands more American men and, this time around, several women have been killed, and for what? Are we any closer to an end, political or military? I don’t know whom to believe, whom to trust? I know one thing about these two conflicts that is uncannily alike: our enemy in Viet Nam dressed and looked just like those we were trying to help. In Southwest Asia, the exact same issue has gotten more American lives lost in similar fashion.

Like a lot teenagers in their day, I, too, had all the answers when I was eighteen. Today, staring my seventies in the face, I realize I’ve never been as smart as I’ve been just opinionated.

Back to the point, have you changed your thoughts about or your opinions of your service in Viet Nam?

Response by Sgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 18 at 2019 4:50 PM

Sgt Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:50:42 -0500

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member I believed that aiding South Vietnam was a just cause, and still feel that way. My feelings of serving have not changed, as I am proud of serving my country. I came back from Vietnam in 1970 to a country that I did not recognize. My best friend was killed the day after I left country, so I was not in a good frame of mind to have to be confronted by maggots at LAX. To this day, I still have the same feelings about protestors. I fault our government for abandoning South Vietnam. In addition to American deaths, our government was responsible for the South Vietnamese that were killed in re-education camps.

If we are going to war, let the military do the job without meddling from our government.

https://thevietnamwar.info/vietnamese-re-education-camps/

Vietnamese Re-education Camps - The Vietnam War

Following the fall of Saigon on April 30, 1975, Vietnamese Communist government began to open hundreds of “re-education” camps throughout the country. Those camps, as Hanoi officially claimed, were places where individuals could “learn about the ways of the new government” through education and socially constructive labor. In 1975, it was estimated that around 1 … Continue reading Vietnamese Re-education Camps

Response by SCPO Morris Ramsey made Jan 18 at 2019 4:57 PM

SCPO Morris Ramsey — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:57:32 -0500

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member I have not.

Response by Patricia Overmeyer made Jan 18 at 2019 5:08 PM

Patricia Overmeyer — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 17:08:58 -0500

Wow, is this eerie. My husband and I were just talking about this last weekend. We finally finished Ken Burns' Vietnam documentary and were talking about the various issues that arose from that war, mostly political. For him, his opinions of his service in Nam haven't changed. He's still proud of his service. What changed for him as to his opinion of the war happened during the second or third month he was in the field. He no longer hated the enemy. What if our country had been invaded? Wouldn't we fight the same way? And wouldn't we use our children to fight the invaders? At that point, he realized that everything had a different perspective. War only serves to destroy and no one ever wins, except the Grim Reaper.

What changed about his opinions on the war itself came about from the various news articles, etc. that showed how our involvement was driven by politicians, generals, etc. And reading about the history of Viet Nam from prior to the French colonization through WWI, WWII and the rise of Ho Chi Minh. What if we had actually kicked the French out and let the Vietnamese determine their own government? Would they have chosen democracy as Minh had argued for? These were the things that changed his view of our involvement in the early 70s after he returned home.

Today, he's much more wary of politicians who say that we need to go to war than he was when he was a teenager. While he certainly agrees with our having gone after those who perpetrated 9/11, he doesn't agree that we needed to go into Iraq. And he wonders if we ever learned the lessons of Viet Nam as they apply to Afghanistan. He has concerns that politicians never seem to have a mission plan that includes withdrawal. He is concerned we have very few politicians who have actually served in combat to guide us away from war.

Excellent thoughts on the issue. BTW, you are/were smart...and opinionated. It's just that with more information and more years on the planet, your opinions have evolved. This is a good thing. ; )

Response by Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen made Jan 18 at 2019 6:58 PM

Lt Col John (Jack) Christensen — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 18:58:30 -0500

No, feelings haven't changed, just been authenticated over the years.

Response by SGT Philip Roncari made Jan 18 at 2019 7:19 PM

SGT Philip Roncari — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 19:19:45 -0500

I served in Vietnam during the early years 1966-67 ,My feelings on US involvement haven’t changed,my feelings about the Government have ,the misuse of the Military in these endless wars in the Mideast,the constant failure of the VA system to treat our Veterans,what’s changed for me is the American public’s favorable view of the current Service members ,what hasn’t is the honor and pride I have for the people that served in Vietnam,Welcome Home Brothers.

Response by SFC William Farrell made Jan 18 at 2019 7:38 PM

SFC William Farrell — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 19:38:14 -0500

My feelings about having served in Vietnam have not changed SCPO Private RallyPoint Member. In fact Id do it all over again. I too returned in 1972 at 19. I dont know where you got 1983 for your first thank you for your service. I never heard it until I was retired and wearing my uniform down to 911 in NYC as I do every year with the FDNY. I think what has changed is that the American public realized they sold us down the tubes and they are trying to make up for it now. I've always supported our military and I always will. Its our leadership that needs to change.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Jan 18 at 2019 9:44 PM

CPT Jack Durish — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 21:44:59 -0500

It saddens me when I hear or read Vietnam Vets complaining that our war was a political sham or that we lost. They've bought into the excuses invented by those who simply feared going to war. All Vietnam Vets should be proud of their service, their sacrifices, and their accomplishments. They shouldn't buy into the propaganda that is still oft repeated today.

Response by LTC John Griscom made Jan 19 at 2019 9:20 AM

LTC John Griscom — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 09:20:34 -0500

Was proud to serve, but never felt the politicians or the media had our back.
The military was not allowed to fight to win; had to get permission from Saigon or Washington to engage the enemy toward the end with reporters following everything with their own slant of events.
Will never go to San Francisco again.
We continue to fight piecemeal with no real end game.

Response by MSG Danny Mathers made Jan 19 at 2019 1:16 PM

MSG Danny Mathers — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 13:16:35 -0500

Outstanding piece, you hit the bull's eye. The only thing that has changed for me is respect for my enemy. Today, I would share a drink with a NVA Soldier or Charlie Cong. However, what has not changed is my disrespect for those that treated me and my Brothers like hog shit & nothing stinks worse! Years ago, I got the opportunity to work in Iraq as a DOD Security Contractor. It was great to be around Soldiers again. Surprisingly, I heard some Soldiers talk about Vietnam Veterans at a few DFACs which I heard some say to affect their Squard Leaders said most all Vietnam Veteran were doper; no shit! I am sure what or why it was a topic was because most of the contractors back in 2003 and later were Veterans. Contractors were not appreciated by most of Big Army. They couldn't understand why they made more money than they thought we did. Today's Soldiers have it a hell of a better life than we did. No KP, PX, Burger King, Mr Bean Coffee, Pizza Hut and several others. Dining Facilities that serve steaks, lobster and everthing you can get a a restraunt in the World except pork products. Today's Sodiers have showers, gyms, places to relax, swimming pools, computers and ability to call home almost anytime. All of which is is no where near what we had in Vietnam. Mud, Bugs, snake, Gooks, and a shower every three to four weeks. Opinions vary.

Response by SSgt Terry P. made Feb 4 at 2019 11:43 PM

SSgt Terry P. — Mon, 04 Feb 2019 23:43:51 -0500

SCPO Private RallyPoint Member My opinion will not change about my service there, I am in agreement with Sgt Private RallyPoint Member and others here.We fought for what we considered right and our brothers in arms. After seeing the aftermath of pulling out of Vietnam only affirms,we should have stayed and finished it.Our politicians betrayed us by succumbing to pressure from the media and the minor percentage( protesters) of the population.
Semper Fi

Response by Col Carl Whicker made Feb 17 at 2019 7:38 PM

Col Carl Whicker — Sun, 17 Feb 2019 19:38:11 -0500

I was a little too young to make it to Viet Nam, I graduated High School in 1974 and got my commission in 1978. I will say that as a Lieutenant I served with and for some Viet Nam veterans who were consummate professionals. They taught me what it takes to lead by example and have the moral courage to stand by my convictions. Unfortunately, I watched a great many of them being forced out of the USAF in the mid 1980's as they were passed over for promotion or reached high year tenure. They were proud of their service in Viet Nam, but didn't brag about it. They commanded my respect by doing their jobs and doing them well whether they got the recognition they deserved, or not. I am blessed to have learned from some of the finest officers and NCOs to ever wear the uniform!

Response by LTC Gary Earls made Feb 18 at 2019 11:38 AM

LTC Gary Earls — Mon, 18 Feb 2019 11:38:54 -0500

The South Vietnamese proved that they could stand up to the NVA in 1972 with the help of US air power. The Democratic Congress took their funding under President Ford. The Democrats lost the war and not the US troops. Those congressmen have no remorse to what they did to that nation. Talk to the relatives of those men who went though the "re-education camps". Tragic.

Response by SSgt Richard Kensinger made Mar 7 at 2019 10:36 AM

SSgt Richard Kensinger — Thu, 07 Mar 2019 10:36:07 -0500

I served as an AF ER medic for 4 years, 3 @ Andrews AFB. I am proud of my MOS. I deeply regret this Conflict. Too much physical and psychosocial trauma. With the GI bill I obtained an advanced degree in clinical psychology. I've conducted psychotherapy w/ many of my comrades, esp. field medics. The loss of life is staggering. And more civilians were killed during the Conflict than were combatants on both sides.
We were also betrayed by 5 of our presidents BTW. My C-in-C was Richard Nixon. In 1972 he froze all pay advancements and military promotions.
So now in my retirement I provide clinical consultations at no costs to fellow vets of all conflicts even a few from Korea. I conduct research on combat trauma and have 3 articles published in this regard.
I also remain very concerned about the high suicides rates in vets despite the VA efforts to contain this epidemic.
Rich

Response by SPC Earl Semler made Mar 11 at 2019 6:01 PM

SPC Earl Semler — Mon, 11 Mar 2019 18:01:39 -0400

Korea and Viet Nam were prime examples of the people on the ground not given the authority to run and win the war. Politicians were running the war from thousand of miles away. It is happening again in Iraq and Afghanistan. Give military the tools and the right to fight and wars will be won. I have never been ashamed of my time in Nam and never will be. I still think we screwed South Viet Nam.

Response by CPT George Ruzicka made Mar 11 at 2019 9:05 PM

CPT George Ruzicka — Mon, 11 Mar 2019 21:05:37 -0400

I was raised & taught to respect our governmental leaders but that began changing after I arrived in Vietnam. When I went to Vietnam in 1968 consensus was that we were there to fight communism & support the S. Vietnamese government. After being in country for less than a month & working with the ARVN & S. Vietnamese it was very clear we should not have been there. The people just wanted to be left alone (no government from Saigon or VC. They just wanted their hootch, raise some chickens, pigs, etc. & grow some crops) with no outside interference. I saw S. Vietnamese corruption firsthand (ARVN looting businesses after the NVA were cleared out of Loc Ninh. This was done on the orders of the provincial chief). I also saw excellent as well as poor US leadership. From company grade leaders up to MG Keith Ware (1st Div) who were outstanding. On the other side had a full colonel read me the riot act because I called in arty on French Mgr's house as we began taking direct recoilless rifle from this house. The arty boys really came through & put the 1st rounds through the roof. No more recoilless fire & none of my guys were wounded. The colonel said that the US government had to make reparations ($10,000 in cash & 20,000 sandbags) to the French (Michelain rubber operation). Wonder where the sandbags went. After the colonel finished his tirade & left, his sergeant major winked at me & quietly said "well done" before he left. My men were a lot more important than some Frenchy's roof.
It was many years later later that it was revealed that our president's & staff had lied to the American people. So many soldiers were needlessly killed because of these politicians. Now I trust politicians as far as I can throw them.
I was fortunate during my tour in that I worked on some community self help projects such as building roads in the delta, bridges in III Corps, rebuilt town wells, etc.

Response by SGM Larry Lane made Mar 14 at 2019 12:49 AM

SGM Larry Lane — Thu, 14 Mar 2019 00:49:09 -0400

Short history note/lesson here. During WWII, Vietnam was held by the Japanese, and was actually an ally to the US. After the war, Ho Che Minh basically took control, and designated N. VM as a communist country. In the 50's NVM wanted total control of Vietnam, and conflict broke out between the French controlled south and the North. The S. Vietnamese asked the US for assistance in stopping the north from taking total control. So. Yes, I am a Vietnam veteran, having spent 2 yrs from 1969-1971. I believe that our involvement at this time was just. To stop the spread of communism. I still feel this way today. However, there were so many things that were so wrong during this time, 1959-1975. Politicians need to stay the hell out of fighting a war that they know nothing about. In this war, as in many others, there are many soldiers with 'stars' on their shoulders that are/were up close and personal with the war(s). They are there, they see what is going on, they know what needs to be done. Let them do their job. The people in Washington intervened in making battle field decisions from their desks. If Washington would have stayed out of the decision making, the war would not have lasted as long, and the results would have been different. (NVM was ready to sign a peace accord, but when the US stopped the bombing of NVM, they withdrew from the peace process, reorganized, and starting advancing again.) During the time of the war, America was going through growing pains again. Another 'movement'. The peace and hippy revolution. 'Make love, not war.' "War is not healthy for all living things'. The American people were caught up in the peace movement, and wanted the war to stop. They were fed propaganda videos about US service members committing mass murders, killing babies, etc. Even back in the 60's, there was fake news. Videos that were shown were cut and spliced together, and people believed everything that was shown to them. The problem was that when they saw these videos, they put the cause on the American serviceman, and retaliated toward them when we came home. Yes, I was spit on, called all sorts of names, had my luggage knocked out of my hands while going through an airport. Since this time, I believe that Americans have matured, and now know the truth behind the propaganda and lies that were told. I stayed in the Army for 24 yrs, and I see the difference of the way the servicemen are treated today when they return. People need to understand this: The service members themselves do not start wars, politicians do. The service members go to stop the wars.

Response by CSM Thomas Ray made Jul 4 at 2019 8:37 AM

CSM Thomas Ray — Thu, 04 Jul 2019 08:37:05 -0400

I served in 1970 and left active service in 1972, morale was at the bottom and veterans of the war felt like second class citizens. No one wanted to talk about your time overseas, including the VA. A lot of veterans of Viet Nam either ended up in jail or homeless and most because there was no PTSD recognized. It took a while for me but ultimately ended up back on active duty and ANG and did three tours in Iraq. Retired as CSM in 2010

Response by SP5 Wally Estes made Feb 22 at 2020 2:22 PM

SP5 Wally Estes — Sat, 22 Feb 2020 14:22:39 -0500

I couldn't understand why Uncle Sam was sending us a thousands of miles away from home when their was all the communist party and the Nazi party in the US!

Response by LTC John Griscom made Aug 9 at 2020 12:12 PM

LTC John Griscom — Sun, 09 Aug 2020 12:12:39 -0400

We need to quit fighting "Light Wars" and commit to either staying out or going full bore to defeat the enemy. Everything seems to be "piece-meal" with a little here and a little bit there.