Is Army War College currently an "absolute" discriminator for promotion to O-6 as a USAR JAG Officer?

2017-05-15T09:45:44-04:00

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made May 15 at 2017 9:47 AM

2017-05-15T09:47:39-04:00

Addendum: I meant to say "promotion to O6" instead of "promotion of O6" in the above question.

Response by COL Vincent Stoneking made May 15 at 2017 9:57 AM

2017-05-15T09:57:03-04:00

I don't believe it's "absolute" for JAG. I base this on knowing several basic branch officers who made O6 without it. I cannot believe that a specialist branch would be more strict on a MIL ED "requirement" that the basic branches.

Note: I 100% believe that it is an important selective criteria. Just not absolute.

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made May 15 at 2017 10:04 AM

2017-05-15T10:04:17-04:00

Although Navy, I've sat a number of boards. They have similarities amongst the services. "Absolute" would be an item in the Board Precepts. You should look up the past three years or so of them, presumably through the HR web portal. The precepts talk about what is measured, what if off limits, what is golden, and what "shall not be disadvantaged by". In other words, what is fair game for the Board. If the AWC isn't there, it isn't an absolute. BUT, if it is an accepted pedigree norm, not having it becomes an easy discriminator, usually at the third crunch when there are few slots and many still in the running. For us staff corps types, I'm sure a hard requirement for being a member of a State Bar for making O4 or O5 was likely there. We have a hard requirement for registration as a PE or Architect at the O5 flow point. So it's a matter of where you ultimately wind up on the pecking order with/without it. You know it will be higher with that bean, but making a difference that makes a difference? Your record will have to tell the rest of the story. BTW, I don't know what the promote percentage is. If it is say 30%, pedigree items are more of a factor vs. a 50% rate.

Response by LTC Stephen C. made May 15 at 2017 12:44 PM

2017-05-15T12:44:43-04:00

LTC Private RallyPoint Member, I can't speak specifically to the Judge Advocate General's Corps, but in the mid-nineties, I worked for an O-6, then attending the USAWC via the DEP. He stated then that the greatest single cause of attrition in the program was O-5s being picked up for O-6! So, at least at that time, completion of the USAWC was not an absolute criteria for selection to O-6.
I do agree with COL Vincent Stoneking, that completion of the school is an important selection criteria.
BTW, the O-6 of whom I spoke later made O-8, so perhaps some of those O-5 dropouts short changed themselves!

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 15 at 2017 3:22 PM

2017-05-15T15:22:10-04:00

Sir, this was a topic I just sat in on at OCAR.
I looked at the FY 16 stats. 22% select rate for the most recent JAG board but I cannot find any info on any other demographics beyond that. We just did a basic branch review for APL OPD and got some special stats from HRC and over 70 % were war college grads for basic branch. I have it on good authority that resident v. non resident doesn't matter, "You get the same degree and get to sit at the table." According to a GO and two O-6 who have repeatedly spoke in each others presence at different venues. I also hear time and time again, "take the school when you get it." Best of luck, Sir!

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made May 15 at 2017 8:10 PM

2017-05-15T20:10:44-04:00

A lot of check the block "must haves" for line officers aren't necessarily required for specialty branches (AMEDD, JAG, Chaplains, etc). However, if you DO complete War College, it does tend to separate you from your peers, and definitely gives you a nice check in the plus column.....

Response by COL Charles Williams made May 17 at 2017 12:46 AM

2017-05-17T00:46:23-04:00

Absolute... Never.... LTC Private RallyPoint Member But, it is most often prerequisite.... What does your promotion guidance state?