Is it legal for a NCO to require you to surrender your military ID while taking a drug test (random at the unit) ?

2020-05-12T13:03:10-04:00

I was required to do so at my unit and was never given a satisfactory answer.. I told him only if he was a MP could he require my ID to be surrendered.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made May 12 at 2020 1:12 PM

2020-05-12T13:12:24-04:00

AR 600-8-14 (IDENTIFICATION CARDS FOR MEMBERS OF THE UNIFORMED SERVICES, THEIR ELIGIBLE FAMILY MEMBERS, AND OTHER ELIGIBLE PERSONNEL), paragraph 1.19.2

"Surrender the card when a military or civilian authority requires it for ID...."

The paragraph continues, but that's the key take-away. Urinalysis testing requires verification of photo ID, and they are authorized to request it as part of their ID process. Given the legality of eligible forms of ID (State Issued driver's license, passport, INS Form or "Green Card", etc) they don't necessarily "have" to take the CAC as a form of ID, but they can and there is no issue as long as they give it back.

It all depends on how technical you want to get with it.

Response by LTC Jason Mackay made May 12 at 2020 1:49 PM

2020-05-12T13:49:06-04:00

Yes. Order from the local commander being executed by appointed NCOs executing their delegated tasks. AR600-20 authority covers this para 2-8 and CH4. The ID card in the box method is part of the installation and unit SOP for conducting urinalysis. It has a lawful purpose and does not violate your rights, for them to hold government property (the ID Card) until they get your whiz quiz submission. Your appointed place of duty is the whiz quiz location until released (so you have no other place where you need to be with the ID). The regulation covering the test program demands that all those randomly (or 100%) selected and present for duty must report and submit to the test. The ID Card is part of that process and verification. Common sense wise, the UA can hold it up and match your brain housing group to the picture before slapping the PIA label on the sample.

Here is the section from the standardized template for the unit urinalysis SOP from ASAP:
8. The UPL will remove a new specimen bottle from the box in front of the Soldier and replace it with the Soldier‘s Military ID card. The UPL will then affix the label to the specimen bottle, in full view of both the Soldier and the observer, and hand it to the Soldier. The UPL will remind the observer not to take possession of the specimen bottle and to constantly maintain direct eye contact with the bottle until the UPL places it in the collection box.

It is common practice to place all ID cards in a stack with the UPL for them to prepare the inventory document in advance of the test subject at the table to be escorted with bottle overhead to the sample collection area.

Response by GySgt Kenneth Pepper made May 12 at 2020 1:50 PM

2020-05-12T13:50:11-04:00

I am curious as to why it would matter. The ID card is not your property. It is issued to you and you turned it back in when you left, right?
By turning over your ID for a urinalysis you were doing 2 things;
1. Establishing positive identity.
2. Establishing a control point where your bottle would be exchanged for your ID to ensure traceability of your sample.

And yes, I was the damn pecker checker myself on many occasions. I've seen more Marine units than a Navy wife.

Response by SFC Michael Hasbun made May 12 at 2020 3:29 PM

2020-05-12T15:29:34-04:00

"...Collection procedures outlined in AR600-85, the IBTC Guidebook and the UPL
Handbook will be followed. All verbal orders connected with the collection procedure are
lawful and are to be followed as such. A refusal to comply with orders relating to this
collection procedure subjects the soldier to punitive or administrative actions under AR
600-85, AR 135-18, AR 135-178, and AR 635-10."

Response by SFC Ralph E Kelley made May 12 at 2020 3:30 PM

2020-05-12T15:30:53-04:00

I'm with GySgt Dawson Webb on this one.

Response by LT Brad McInnis made May 12 at 2020 6:33 PM

2020-05-12T18:33:07-04:00

I used to take them at the Academy when people got "stage fright". I held it until they got over it and provided a sample. Never got in trouble and it was routine. I remember them taking ID's from sailors on the ship so they couldn't leave until the gave, but I do not remember there being a reg on it..

Response by SPC Private RallyPoint Member made May 12 at 2020 7:10 PM

2020-05-12T19:10:08-04:00

That’s just the SOP.
Give up the ID, come back with pee and do a one for one exchange. Period.

Response by SSgt Christophe Murphy made May 12 at 2020 8:29 PM

2020-05-12T20:29:10-04:00

ID cards are used to provide verification of someone’s identification. Thats kind of why they exist. That’s required for administrative, medical, and legal services at a minimum. I vividly remember them being required to verify individuals during drug testing to ensure the right people are being tested and no one was skipping out to avoid popping.

It’s unrealistic to think nobody outside of LEO or the MPs can ask for an ID.

Response by Sgt Tilmon Moye-Goines made May 13 at 2020 3:05 PM

2020-05-13T15:05:14-04:00

When running urinalysis at the Brig I was at no matter what service you were with everyone surrendered an ID in place of whichever collection bottle you chose. Once secured, you placed bottle with other samples and picked up your ID. No one else should take it only the one who is actually running the Urinalysis. It was a Naval Brig so we followed their instruction.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made May 14 at 2020 9:17 PM

2020-05-14T21:17:39-04:00

Absolutely

Response by SSG Sidney Galloway made Jul 5 at 2021 5:40 PM

2021-07-05T17:40:29-04:00

Can the 1SG take your HMMWV keys? Can your Platoon Sergeant lock away your field gear? Can your Shop NCOIC take over your work station? If you can answer one or more of these questions regarding military property correctly, the answer to your question will present itself.