Is it legal or ethical for the company commander to make me violate my profile?

PFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 07:30:33 -0400

I have been struggling with infertility for awhile now and I'm finally getting one of the best procedures done next month which is during an ftx. I told one of my NCOs about the conflict and he told me that I can't get it done because the commander has stated that she is going to override any profile or note from the doctor so that I go? And I'm actually already on profile for a heart murmur that limits me from a lot. Why should I put my infertility and potential future family on hold because she said so? Is this right or should I do something about it ?

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 25 at 2016 7:42 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 07:42:20 -0400

Best option is to request use of your commander's open door policy, bear in mind your commander can require you to reschedule, so attempt to reschedule in advance and provide your commander with alternative timeframes that he can choose. That way both of you can be happy, you get your treatment, and he gets his FTX. Infertility sucks, My wife and I went Foster and have been very happy and stressed ever since!

Response by SGM Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 25 at 2016 8:10 AM

SGM Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 08:10:00 -0400

Your personal life doesn't take priority over the needs of the Army. I feel for your situation, I really do (my wife and I tried almost everything for 2 years before our first came along), but you responsibility to your unit and your dedication to your team should be your focus. Additionally, I don't know of any doctor that won't reschedule an appointment (even if it has to be timed to a cycle) due to military obligations.

Response by SGT Edward Wilcox made Aug 25 at 2016 8:44 AM

SGT Edward Wilcox — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 08:44:51 -0400

Your commander can require you to reschedule an elective procedure so that it does not conflict with scheduled training. The only caveat would be if the doctor was booked for months and that was the only appointment available. If the appointment was made before the training schedule was published, you might have a better leg to stand on. Always keep the training schedule in mind when making any appointments. you should get with the doctor. Find out if you can reschedule. If the doctor refuses to reschedule, then you will need to climb up the chain of command. Start with your commander, and work your way up from there. Be prepared to get shut down at each level. Again, the needs of the Army come first.

Your commander, however, does not have the authority to "override" any medical profile, including temporary profiles. If you have a murmur, you are already barred from re-enlistment. Why not wait until you get out to start fertility treatments?

Response by Capt Tom Brown made Aug 25 at 2016 9:06 AM

Capt Tom Brown — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 09:06:21 -0400

Sounds like you are getting some good advice even tho it may not be exactly what was hoped for. Rescheduling to more closely accommodate yr training schedule seems fairly reasonable. Unless the Dr's schedule for the procedure is booked so far out that it goes past the schedule. If you make a good faith effort to accommodate training commitments they should work with you. Also would your profile keep you from going to the field?

Response by SGM Erik Marquez made Aug 25 at 2016 9:20 AM

SGM Erik Marquez — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 09:20:37 -0400

PFC
Heart Murmur
Long term profile that "limits you a lot"
Sm is looking to get out of known, scheduled mission oriented training for a personal elective procedure.

PFC Private RallyPoint Member I in no way imply to look down on your personal wants, I have a beautiful wife and two wonderful sons. My wife was in the Army as well, only leaving the service as a Sergeant in order to better care for our sons needing more time than circumstances allowed while serving. ... All that to say, your personal want for a family is well received as valid as you make it.

However, were I your 1SG, or CSM and I looked at the facts above.... I think you would find yourself looking at a Med board and seperation if the medical condition, outlook and profile limiting your duties warranted it, or an uncontested offer of a separation for needs of the service member if it applied, and in any case i would would been anticipating you to ask for a seperation once pregnant as pregnancy, plus heart murmur profile and military service is really going to conflict. Id assume you would be wanting out of darn near all if not all military duties during your pregnancy as likley to be high risk..,,,,and you likley be very unhappy with the Army when that does not happen. So while Id never TELL you to take that option, I would not be surprised when it was requested.

Others have told you the truth.... Needs of the unit come before wants of the Soldier. You scheduled an appointment that conflicted with a scheduled training event...the Commander absolutely is right to tell you to reschedule.
Please review the Oath of enlistment you read and signed when you entered service.
And the Soldiers Creed you should have learned and committed to living.

Please consider what the words "Selfless Service" mean to you.
Ask yourself, who is doing my work, my shifts, My job...when I am "limited a lot"

You may find that Military Service is not the right choice for you. Make an adult, informed, educated and unemotional decision and do what is best for you... But keep in mind, your commander is going to do the same...only it will be what is best for the unit, the Army, the nation. And I have to just say it straight.. A PFC on profile for a Heart Murmur that "limits you a lot", and is looking to get pregnant which limits you a lot, and then care for a child which limits you a lot...when I look at all that... I see a Soldier that needs to choose to exit the service or be helped along.

I HOPE I'M WRONG.... and the flat text you wrote and some assumptions I made are dead wrong and you are such a valuable asset to the unt your command wants to keep you at all costs.. I really do hope you are that good at your job, committed to the mission and needs of your unit and fellow soldiers that your chain of command is looking to find ways to keep you in the service.
Best of luck.

Response by CPL Anthony Slaughter made Aug 25 at 2016 10:03 AM

CPL Anthony Slaughter — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:03:51 -0400

You should try to reschedule the procedure if possible, and then utilize your NCO support chain as well as your Commander's open door policy to discuss the issue and find a solution that works for everybody. However, your Commander absolutely does not have the authority to simply 'override' a profile given to you by a doctor, nor can you be ordered to violate it.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Aug 25 at 2016 10:49 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 10:49:54 -0400

I was going to respond, but after reading the response from SGM Erik Marquez, there is nothing else I can say or add to that. PFC Private RallyPoint Member , the SGM is spot on with his response.

Response by MSG Dan Castaneda made Aug 25 at 2016 1:29 PM

MSG Dan Castaneda — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 13:29:37 -0400

Just so I'm clear, you want the Army to pay for your procedure but don't want to fo what is asked from you. Does that pretty much sum it up? I agree with SGM Marquez, it's time for a med board.

Response by CPT Tom Monahan made Aug 25 at 2016 5:41 PM

CPT Tom Monahan — Thu, 25 Aug 2016 17:41:15 -0400

PDC Tyndell: How much time is left on your enlistment contract? Have you talked to your squad Leader/Section Cheif about not being medically fit for duty? Has your doctor given you a temporary or permanent profile and at what level. Keep in mind that you made a deal to do what is best for the
Service during your enlistment. Perhaps having a kid right now isn't in the cards. With your heart condition, perhaps you should talk with your doctor about a medical board before your CoC demands one. As a medically retired vet, I realized I couldn't preform due to a service connected illness and started the medical board process rolling with my doc.

Response by Cpl Mark Oresko made Nov 22 at 2020 7:26 PM

Cpl Mark Oresko — Sun, 22 Nov 2020 19:26:24 -0500

Well your message says “getting the best procedure done” which means you’ve already decided to put yourself before your unit. Correct? Doesn’t having a heart murmur put you and the baby at risk? Hopefully the doctor was aware of your heart murmur before suggesting a procedure that could compromise you and your future child’s health. Who recommended that you have this procedure scheduled? Your final question asks if it’s right for your commander to force you to follow through with your commitments. The answer to that is YES. If your child had school that ended each day at 2pm, and you decided that 1pm would be more convenient, think of the surprise you’d be giving a teacher by walking into their class, grabbing their student, and walking out with the child at 1pm. Your commander and the teacher are in the same position. Both are doing their jobs and are forced to act accordingly to a conundrum that you have created which is an unsafe and unhealthy predicament. And I’ll end with a question or two that you don’t have to answer, but I’m curious to know for the sake of your situation. Are you married? If so, what does your husband recommend you do?