Is it possible to have political opinions in the military without a conflict of interest?

2015-12-17T13:27:57-05:00

In it's latest bit of "journalism," The Beast published this page turner about the political rants of officers in the Pentagon. There's a bright idea. Let's spout our political opinions in front of a reporter. The public respects us. In some ways it's because we are an apolitical arm of the government. I'm not sure it's possible to vent political frustrations without undermining what we stand for. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/12/16/pentagon-troops-it-s-us-or-trump.html?source=TDB&via=FB_Page#

Pentagon Officers: We Quit if Trump Wins

The plans of the next president are personal to the officers of the Pentagon, who are threatening to retire if The Donald becomes commander-in-chief.

Response by LTC Stephen F. made Dec 17 at 2015 1:29 PM

2015-12-17T13:29:51-05:00

Yes COL Private RallyPoint Member it is possible to have political opinions in the military without a conflict of interest especially for those service members in the reserve components.
I realize you are most likely focusing this question on election politics.
However every organization of any moderate to large size has "office politics" extant much of the time. The US military certainly has office politics in play at every major formation from battalion/USAF squadron/etc. on up.
One thing that all service members need to be careful of is limiting political discussions with service members of your own rank and never trying to unduly influence those subordinate to you.
It is also very good to remember that all people are human and no candidate or office holder is subhuman and they all need to be treated with at least a modicum of respect.

Response by PO3 Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 17 at 2015 1:46 PM

2015-12-17T13:46:00-05:00

Yes... I hope ...

Response by Capt Walter Miller made Dec 17 at 2015 1:47 PM

2015-12-17T13:47:15-05:00

"The words broadly echoed what flag officers have said in the past about the reality show star: “Personally, I hope no one will be called upon to serve under a President T… I can’t bring myself to type the words,” retired Rear Admiral John Hutson, who once served as the Navy’s top lawyer, told The Daily Beast in July.

To be sure, those views are not uniform. Commanders deployed outside the Pentagon said they hear enlisted troops enthusiastically support Trump. Some describe enlisted service members fighting with family or other soldiers in defense of the real talk from the real estate mogul. But the Pentagon is an unusual military posting, one where it is easier to spot a general than a corporal. And if the divide between the enlisted and officers is true, the former—the base of Trump’s military support—are not a well represented population within the headquarters of the United States military.

Regardless, such fervor about political matters is a jarring thing to hear at first from those in uniform; they serve in a part of government that urges service members to drop any sense of identity or partisan politics. It is unusual to see someone in uniform even say whether they are Republican or Democrat, and if they do, often it is whispered like a secret; the final case of “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell,” if you will."

Response by CAPT Kevin B. made Dec 17 at 2015 1:52 PM

2015-12-17T13:52:03-05:00

Actually this points to a different perspective. The Pentagon, DHS, State, CIA, FBI, Justice, etc. have a bunch of incredible people who have been stifled for years. That's why morale is in the tank with a number of the good folk who depart and leave the ideologues behind who tend to be "yes men/women" who won't buck up to the boss. So the question becomes what do you fear more, the now or a possible loose cannon? All this tells me is the quitters should quit now because they already told me they're not good enough either way. The best people move the Country forward regardless. I want them in those jobs.

Response by PFC Chip Des made Dec 17 at 2015 2:04 PM

2015-12-17T14:04:01-05:00

trump is adraft dodger like cheney, when cheney was asked why his excat words were "
I had better things to do"!!! typical arroungence of a pathological LIAR and MURDERER!!!!

Response by MAJ Ken Landgren made Dec 17 at 2015 2:40 PM

2015-12-17T14:40:41-05:00

Military leaders nee to be pure intentioned and stoic in front of the troops and public.

Response by CPT Jack Durish made Dec 17 at 2015 3:07 PM

2015-12-17T15:07:44-05:00

Are we really debating politics or are we debating the security of the nation? It seems to me that what many regard as political rants are really voices of concern over the poor handling of security matters. We have a President who has spent seven years not only disengaging from world affairs which is tantamount to isolationism (and we know how that strategy has brought us into two World Wars). His Scty of State was playing fast and loose with document security (just to name one sin). His appointees to national councils carry membership cards in organizations that are terribly close to being enemies of the state. Sure, they want to shut us up and us strictures against political opinion as their weapon of choice, but is it really political?

Response by COL Sam Russell made Dec 17 at 2015 3:46 PM

2015-12-17T15:46:15-05:00

Read the article and find it difficult to believe that, "more often than not, they [currently serving officers in the Pentagon] proclaim they will leave." If there are officers currently serving that espouse those sentiments, please, don't wait for an election to drop your papers. Do your nation a favor and leave active duty NOW! If an officer truly felt that way, than the right move would be to resign--foregoing the benefit of a retirement pension. to retire is to remain beholden to the officer ethic.

I have served as a commissioned officer under Presidents Reagan, Bush-41, Clinton, Bush-43, and Obama. All were very different ideologically and politically. But, my service has never been about the politics of our civilian executives. I espouse George C. Marshall's view that commissioned officers should be apolitical--certainly in public. Here is a critical look at military leaders and politics. http://strategicstudiesinstitute.army.mil/pubs/parameters/Articles/09winter/corbett%20and%20davidson.pdf

Response by Sgt Aaron Kennedy, MS made Dec 17 at 2015 3:54 PM

2015-12-17T15:54:53-05:00

Possible, absolutely. Vocal... not so much.

We're literally electing the person who can send us to our deaths. And there is the real possibility of electing incompetence. That's scary.

Right now we have the advantage of saying whatever we want about whatever candidate we want, and not a soul can do anything about it. Our "frontrunners" aren't elected and don't place us within the confines of the UCMJ. The other candidates (Sen Cruz, Sanders, and Fmr Gov Bush) have are less polarizing and don't raise the vitriol level as much as the leads from each party, who are essentially "fair game."

After the election, that "release valve" is going to be closed, and closed hard, and the military is not going to be happy with any of the choices, because frankly we're never happy. We maintain a level of dissatisfaction from mild to extreme. And when we can't vent it just gets worse.

Response by SSG Leonard Johnson made Dec 17 at 2015 5:15 PM

2015-12-17T17:15:24-05:00

I think so.... Look at the state of the army now...it's like I don't even recognize it anymore...Low morale....I see NCO's walking around the PX out of uniform, and other NCO's not making the correction...I do feel this is a result of our current leadership trying to make the army a social experiment.... last month My wife and I were walking through the PX and saw a SPC male with makeup on....Not one NCO made the correction....I did walk up to him and told him as a retiree...you are a embarrassment to the uniform

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 17 at 2015 5:22 PM

2015-12-17T17:22:03-05:00

Political opinions are okay... Making public that you'll act like a petulant little child if the candidate you don't like wins... not okay. Especially if your opinion can be interpreted as being representative of your branch service.

Response by COL Jon Thompson made Dec 17 at 2015 6:20 PM

2015-12-17T18:20:55-05:00

Just about everyone I worked in my military career espoused their political beliefs in small circles. Years ago as a Captain with the 3ID in Germany, I was flying with then BG Eric Shinseki to/from Grafenwoehr to discuss gunnery options. This was in 1992 after Clinton was elected. He made a comment that at least the Senate balance still allowed the Republicans the ability to filibuster. Any officer doing it in public is not smart and that is extremely rare. But I think we have a responsibility as citizens and those who have the more at stake than most Americans to be politically knowledgeable and exercise our right to vote. I have always disagreed with those who say that military should not vote. I would bet there are just as many military officers that are frustrated with Obama and his policies as there are who would be frustrated with Trump should he get elected. I came in under Reagan and retired under Obama so I have seen the entire spectrum. We have to remember that the military's duty is to serve the Nation and protect the Constitution.

Response by LT Erik Frederick made Dec 17 at 2015 7:53 PM

2015-12-17T19:53:01-05:00

I think you have to seperate policy & principles from politics in terms Democrat or Republican loyalty. By way of example, I think people in the military ought to formulate their views on US involment in Syria, Libya, Iraq, Bosnia etc from the same principle; not merely which party POTUS comes from.

Response by Cpl Rc Layne made Dec 18 at 2015 1:30 AM

2015-12-18T01:30:19-05:00

Absolutely, you can have your opinion. The unfortunate side of the argument is that you may not be able to voice them as freely as you could as a civilian.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 18 at 2015 2:11 AM

2015-12-18T02:11:42-05:00

You bet we can have political opinions, but there are rules. You can't attend political rallies in uniform. You can't bring campaign literature to the office. You can't use Army resources to fund-raise.
But debating the issues of policy is as old as the Earth. Just be mindful of your audience and where you are at, keep it respectful, and you'll be alright.

Response by LCDR Private RallyPoint Member made Dec 18 at 2015 9:15 AM

2015-12-18T09:15:21-05:00

A long time ago, in a much simpler time...A mentor told me that an officer should participate in the political process by voting-then commit himself totally to supporting the will of the people following an election...

...that was back when anyone running for office basically fell a little "right" or "left" of the same camp.

The first CIC I served under was Clinton-Not someone I ideologically agreed with 100%, but overall, someone I at least felt fulfilled the minimum role of the office. More importantly, as a young officer, I felt his Defense staff represented a more holistic cross section of experience. Bush seemed like someone from "my side" in many respects...but there were key members of his administration with whom I vehemently disagreed. By comparison, Mr. Obama seemed less committed to being "part" of the system, and his administration, surprisingly biased.

In short, I feel the current Government is run more by ideology than ideas...more by rhetoric than results.

I think it's impossible for a person with any personal integrity, or reasonable intelligence for that matter (and let's hope that's most of our leadership in the Services)...not to be a bit distressed when a candidate from either side comes into office on a wave of uninformed, unbalanced, and let's face it-potentially dangerous opinions.

When asked, by younger officers, how I think "politics" affects them...I often respond by stating that the compromise which allowed for a standing military in the first place, and which is represented in our Oath of Office, is the cornerstone of a system which should always prevent the sort of horrors both sides feel possible should the "opposition" win an election. Even in the midst of our own Civil War, it was the intrinsic nature of the command element of both sides that allowed the war to end...and a re-unification to occur. When the politicians, and the people had seen their speeches play out into bloodshed...when the nation had suffered so much loss, it was the integrity of men like Grant, Lee, Hancock and Longstreet that led us (in a remarkably short period of time) to be unified enough to confront not one, but two world wars.

At the end of the day, no law has power unless those with the power to enforce it, act.

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Feb 8 at 2016 2:15 PM

2016-02-08T14:15:09-05:00

There is room for having personal political opinions, but we have to be very careful about how we voice those opinions. The danger is that our opinions are taken as an endorsement of one political view or another, particularly if we give it while we are in uniform or while executing our official duties. Officially we (the military) must remain apolitical. We serve the nation, not a particular political party, else we can be used as a an arm of a political party. That only leads to folly.

Response by Capt Richard I P. made Feb 8 at 2016 4:40 PM

2016-02-08T16:40:43-05:00

Robert A. Heinlein seemed to think not. And that only those who had risked their lives for the good of others could be qualified to hold meaningful political opinions after the end of their service.

Response by CPT Mark Gonzalez made Feb 8 at 2016 10:30 PM

2016-02-08T22:30:47-05:00

I would ask the question is it possible to have conservative values in the military without a conflict of interest?