Is the semi-centralized promotion system hurting quality NCOs when it comes to promotion?

SGT Kristin Wiley — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:09:31 -0400

The current semi-centralized promotion system (specifically concerning SSGs) authorizes 280 points towards military education. This is broken down into NCOES, Resident Military Training, and Computer Based Training. If you have ever been one of the most capable NCOs in your MOS at your unit, chances are you were the last to attend training. At least that has been my experience, and the experience of many NCOs I know. These quality NCOs 'hold down the fort' so others can attend training. This puts quality NCOs at a distinct disadvantage when it comes to promotion, because 280 points is a big chunk out of the total 800.

The most recent revisions to the promotion system has ALC worth between 90 and 112 promotion points. NCOs who have had the opportunity to attend ALC will almost always sit higher on the promotion list due to be allowed this opportunity. I am of the opinion that an NCO who maxes out multiple sections that required personal time and commitment to complete has more motivation and dedication towards being a quality leader than those who have simply been afforded the opportunity to attend a school. The experience gained on a deployment is many times more beneficial than NCOES, yet 30-months of being deployed (combat) is only allocated a maximum of 60 points. TDY assignments don't even hold value, but similar to deployments require a commitment that allows less time for military education.

Should the point system be modified to accommodate soldiers who have been unable to attend these courses through no fault of their own? Should points be allocated differently? If yes, how? Is the current system hurting quality NCOs?

The Army has many unique missions and well the promotion system may work well for 90% of units, it could be hurting the other 10%. With the downsizing that is occurring, we need to learn to do more with less, does the current system enable us to promote the best quality NCOs that are going to help shape the force for the future?

***THIS HAS BEEN MODIFIED SO THE RESPONSES FOCUS ON THE OVERALL TOPIC AND NOT MY INDIVIDUAL SITUATION****

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 2 at 2015 10:23 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:23:05 -0400

My favorite is all of the required military education/training we are to do, yet no points are authorized for some of that training

Response by SGT Kristin Wiley made Jul 2 at 2015 10:24 AM

SGT Kristin Wiley — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:24:56 -0400

On a side note, does any know of any resident military training courses that count for promotion points if taken in a civilian capacity? I'm more than happy spending my off-duty time towards self-development training.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 2 at 2015 10:38 AM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:38:15 -0400

Given all of the things that you have done to ensure your own success, I view this as a leadership failure rather than a system limitation. As with all systems, there are weaknesses and areas for manipulation. The solution you requested, school en route during PCS, is the ideal one and should not have been denied. That being said, your Rater & Senior Rater have a shared responsibility to ensure your career progression is not hampered. If they are including, "send to ALC immediately" on your NCOER based on your performance and the opportunity is not being afforded you (over 3 years), I would say that it is time to bring a heavier bat to bear. I'd invite CSM David Heidke , CSM Michael J. Uhlig and others into the conversation for their take.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 2 at 2015 10:38 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:38:19 -0400

Some branches are different, but within the past year, attendance for NCOES is now decided by HRC through an OML they dictates to units. Commanders can defer attendance for specific Soldiers, usually frowned upon unless it is medically related, but units can't request to send so and so to NCOES schools now, they are told who to send. I do not know if this is branch specific though.

Response by SSgt Scott Schwerman made Jul 2 at 2015 10:52 AM

SSgt Scott Schwerman — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:52:30 -0400

I feel people need to be promoted on their leadership skills as well as MOS knowledge. Yes you will need to be in a specific grade for x amount of months but then the above should be looked at instead of physical aspects.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 2 at 2015 10:59 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 02 Jul 2015 10:59:23 -0400

SGT Wiley,
I am very cautious but if everything is exactly the way you put it, then it sounds to me like your leadership from you section SGT to your company commander are failing you big time. Way back when I was an enlisted Soldier, our monthly counseling sections were the time to discuss about promotions and schools. During that time I was told when I could go and what I needed to do to ensure that I was eligible.
My advice to you will is to bring it up at your next counseling. Counseling sections are your opportunities to voice your concerns to your chain of command. Don't let it stop you from continuing to perform at highest level

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 3 at 2015 9:09 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 03 Jul 2015 09:09:47 -0400

Call your branch professional development NCO and ask to be slotted for ALC. It's pretty tough for a unit to override that person. It takes a battalion commander to sign off on a 4187 for an operational deletion for an NCOES, if I'm remember correctly.

Also, was this the question you meant to ask, or were you really trying to figure out how to get points? In response to your original question, everyone has had heartburn about the semi-centralized system since I went to the board 10 years ago. It was changed then because people who constantly deployed didn't have time to get points, now deployments count toward promotion. It's an ugly system but it's the best one since we haven't invented something better yet.

Response by SPC John Lebiecki made Jun 29 at 2016 3:52 PM

SPC John Lebiecki — Wed, 29 Jun 2016 15:52:54 -0400

Easily, yes. It takes into consideration too much that can be written off. The semi-centralized promotion system appears to emphasize too much on PT scores and not enough on overall soldiering.