Local hero? A bit curious about that rack...

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 09:03:02 -0400

Saw this in the local paper .. was thinking "Great .. some good vet press" and then I started looking at the rack. I don't have that much experience with WW2 / Korea ribbons, but does this look kosher? What's the ribbon with the 4 stars?

http://dcourier.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&SubSectionID=1086&ArticleID=147322

He was eager to serve his country.

At only 14 years old, Ron Johnson lied about his age and enlisted with the Navy to fight the Japanese.

The legal age to join the military back then was 17 or 16 with parental consent. It was not uncommon, however, for young men to fib their way in, especially with the amount of anger Americans had right after the attack on Pearl Harbor, according to Johnson.

"Some were caught and sent to Leavenworth (a United States Disciplinary Barracks in Kansas)," Johnson said.

Fortunately for Johnson, he got away with it.

"I think it was because I was in combat all of the time and I was serving a purpose in combat and they didn't want to find out that I was only 14 years old," Johnson said.

Part of the reason may have also been that he was raised as an orphan in a Catholic convent, so when he used a fake name (Ronny Frascona) when enlisting, his records weren't the easiest to trace.

Johnson served from February 1942 as a gunner and dive bomber until the end of the war in August 1945.

He and his pilot never had to eject from their plane, but they did crash into the ocean five times (three of which were due to running out of gas).

"At that time of the war, which was the beginning, we often went beyond the call of duty or the intelligence or our brains," Johnson said.

One instance that made a significant impression on Johnson was when he rode on top of his plane rather than in it during a rescue mission.

When he was on the USS North Carolina, a fighter pilot had been shot down in the Bay of Truk and needed rescuing because he was wounded and within range of Japanese fire.

Johnson's pilot, Mr. Mead, devised a plan that put Johnson in great danger. Johnson agreed nonetheless.

Mead landed in the bay just outside the range of fire. Johnson tied a long rope around his waist. Mead tied the other end to the strut of the pontoon and Johnson swam to the wounded pilot. Once he reached the pilot, Mead dragged them to safety.

There was also the matter of getting all of them back on the USS Carolina in one piece. The King Fisher pontoon had only enough room for two people, a gunner and a pilot. Mead had to fly and the wounded pilot took the gunner's seat.

"My question was ... where are you going to put me?" Johnson recalls asking Mead.

Mead responded: "You're going to straddle the strut and I'm going to tie your hands and feet around it and your back is going to be to the propeller," Johnson said.

"What if we don't get off the ground and we crash?" Johnson continued.

"He said, 'Well, then you're dead,'" Johnson said.

"I said [sarcastically], 'Thanks a lot sir, I really agree with your plan here.'"

It was risky, but they managed to get into the air and make it back to the USS North Carolina safely.

After the war, Johnson continued to serve in the Navy from 1945 to 1950 as a boxer. Out of his 116 fights, he lost only once as an amateur and once professionally.

In May 1950, he re-enlisted with the airborne to fight in the Korean War that began in June 1950. He spent three years there leading a platoon.

Despite all of the action he saw, Johnson was only wounded once. Shrapnel from an exploding suicide plane in Okinawa struck him. However, he recovered quickly.

"The injuries weren't debilitating at all," Johnson said.

Johnson, 83, now lives with his wife, Caroline, in Cordes Lakes.

He used to frequently volunteer for organizations in his area before he went blind three years ago. Yet even today, he still helps out the community as much as he can with his fellow wartime veterans in the American Legion Post 122.

A fighter from start: Veteran saw heavy action in WWII, Korea - The Prescott Daily Courier

News, Information and Real Estate in Yavapai County including Prescott, Prescott Valley, Chino Valley, Dewey-Humboldt, Arizona, AZ

Response by Sgt David G Duchesneau made Jul 7 at 2015 9:05 AM

Sgt David G Duchesneau — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 09:05:30 -0400

Almost looks like a Vietnam Service Medal?

Response by LTC Jason Strickland made Jul 7 at 2015 9:06 AM

LTC Jason Strickland — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 09:06:03 -0400

No idea on this guy... It's tough to have to scrutinize each of these stories in the press lately. Hopefully he's on the up-and-up!

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 7 at 2015 9:47 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 09:47:38 -0400

The only real problem I see is that he is wearing an Airborne Glider Infantry beret. The article states he joined the Army in 1950, yet the Glider Corps was disbanded in 1948

Response by CPL(P) Bret Farritor made Jul 7 at 2015 9:49 AM

CPL(P) Bret Farritor — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 09:49:31 -0400

Well, I too am unable to ‘zoom’ in on the image. That said, it would appear this is what is displayed on the wearer’s left:

It would (again) APPEAR as though he is wearing:

United States Navy Aviation Observer or USN, USMC, USCG, Aircrew Badge
Combat Infantryman’s Badge

Bronze Star Medal
Purple Heart Medal
Air Medal
Army Good Conduct Medal
Navy Presidential Unit Citation Ribbon
China Service Medal
American Campaign Medal
Asiatic Pacific Campaign Medal w/4 Bronze Stars
World War II Victory Medal
Occupation Medal (the Ribbon is indistinguishable from Army or Navy)
National Defense Service Medal
Korean Service Medal
Philippine Liberation Medal (inverted)
United Nations Korea Service Medal

Pathfinder Badge
Expert Qualification Badge with two Qualification Clasps
Basic Army Parachutist Badge (Unit Flash unidentified)

Wearer’s right:

Presidential Unit Citation Ribbon although I cannot say for certainty if it is Army or Air Force.

I will not even try to determine collar devices, Commemorative devices or the unit lineage for the Enlisted Glider Patch Flash on his beret.

I would suggest contacting Jacey over at MyServicePride.com as she and those folks are very good at taking a closer look not just at the ‘hardware’ but then correlating if in fact it was at least ‘possible’ based upon self-attested dates of service, etc. they could have been awarded.

Response by MSG Brad Sand made Jul 7 at 2015 10:14 AM

MSG Brad Sand — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 10:14:04 -0400

There were somethings that were making me wonder, and then I read the story and saw he was in the Navy and Army, and I could buy what I could see. What actually kind of surprised me when I was considering the story and where and what he did...shouldn't there actually be more awards? Army and Navy Good Conduct medals, ETC? Nothing screamed "Stolen Valor!"

Response by LTC Paul Labrador made Jul 7 at 2015 10:15 AM

LTC Paul Labrador — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 10:15:36 -0400

Looks like he has (in order) as BSM, PH, Air Medal, GCM, (one I can't ID), American Defense Medal, American Campaign Medal, Pacific TO Campaing medal with 4 battle stars, WW2 Victory, Occupation medal, NDSM, Korean Service Medal, Philippine Lilberation Medal, Korea UN Medal.

Response by SFC Joseph Bosley made Jul 7 at 2015 12:06 PM

SFC Joseph Bosley — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 12:06:48 -0400

From looking at his rack and reading the story I don't see anything outlandish here. I do see his black beret and airborne/glider patch which was never authorized in that fashion to my knowledge. But to his defense at the time of his service the glider patch was worn on the garrison cap and with the black beret being army wide on the early 2000's is most likely a case of an old man trying to fit it. Although I have no idea what that yellow cord would actually stand for. Other than that nothing looks that out of place to me.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jul 7 at 2015 12:30 PM

PO1 John Miller — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 12:30:45 -0400

I'm no WWII expert but I am vaguely familiar with WWII era awards. I see a China Service Medal, which the awarding period was July 1937 to September 1939, so not a WWII medal. Something is definitely not right here, but I wouldn't say "Stolen Valor" without further investigation either.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jul 7 at 2015 12:51 PM

PO1 John Miller — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 12:51:27 -0400

At first I was confused because it said he was in the Navy but is wearing obvious Army decorations and beret. However the article does seem to say he joined the Army in 1950 to fight in Korea?

Response by SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. made Jul 7 at 2015 12:58 PM

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 12:58:34 -0400

UPDATE:
The consensus of the hive mind is that this guy's story jives with the rack with the exception of the China Service Medal (dates of service could not have qualified) and the Glider Patch on the black beret.
I can not comment on the China Service Medal, but as far as the patch on the beret, some American Legion posts use the beret instead of the overseas cap. I think the Glider Patch is a bit "out of uniform", but I don't have any heartburn about it.

Can we say that all the other hardware is possible?

At least he isn't wearing the trip-CIB...

Response by LTC Bink Romanick made Jul 7 at 2015 2:24 PM

LTC Bink Romanick — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 14:24:30 -0400

He's a WWII and Korean Vet, I think that the ribbon with the 4 stars may be the asiatic Pacific Campaign but can't see it well. He has been both a marine or navy as well as Army. He's wearing the China Service Ribbon, pre WWII.

It looks legit and I can tell you that if he is NA they don't cotton to posers!

Response by GySgt Curtis L Leetch made Jul 7 at 2015 6:51 PM

GySgt Curtis L Leetch — Tue, 07 Jul 2015 18:51:40 -0400

His statements are wild, but plausable. I'm sure not going to question his story, unless someone or something turns up that gives me a reason to doubt... I just can't do that.

Response by PO1 John Miller made Jul 8 at 2015 4:21 PM

PO1 John Miller — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 16:21:54 -0400

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S., no Navy Good Conduct Medal, and the ribbon underneath the Navy/Marine Corps Presidential Unit Citation sure does appear to be the Vietnam Service Medal with four bronze stars!

Response by MSgt Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 4:41 PM

MSgt Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 16:41:24 -0400

Why are we trying to tear this guy apart?
He's 88 years old.....he told a wild ass story to a newspaper guy…..which btw I’d be more interested in having validated than his ribbon rack…..it's a great story….i’m sure it has the embellishments that come with time and a million telling but man how great would it be to find out that it happen as he said…tied to a plane…..awesome.
Is he trying to defraud the government or something....am I missing something?
Getting sick of every time an old guy has his picture taken with military stuff on it people go on the attack and try to prove something wrong…..makes me never want to wear my ribbons or uniform again….I mean God forbid if 50 plus year after I got out I put one on backwards, bought one that looks close to what I remember, or can’t find a discontinued uniform items so I go with my next best guess, or my memory fails and I say the wrong unit number or can’t remember it.
Our core values were true back then as they are today...Integrity first.......why can we not just be happy that a prior military guy is getting recognized and assume that he has integrity until he gives us a reason to doubt it.
Hell I don’t even want to post pictures of my Dad in uniform outside of the family (and I know he was in I went to his retirement ceremony) for the same reason….I don’t want someone trying to tear his uniform apart and disgrace his name for no reason.
Don’t get me wrong I know there are imposters out there…..but unless someone is trying to get personal gain, disability, etc….we don’t need to treat ever old veteran like a lying scumbag…….there has got to be better things a collective of people such as us can apply our “super powers” to that will make a difference in the world.

Response by TSgt Scott Hurley made Jul 8 at 2015 6:08 PM

TSgt Scott Hurley — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 18:08:43 -0400

Its the Asiatic Pacific Campaign Medal.
http://www.pinstopin.com/us-navy-medals-and-ribbons-
chart/bmF2eWdpcmwqb3JnfG1pc2N8TmF2eSBSaWJib25zKmpwZw_bmF2eWdpcmwqb3JnfG1pc2N8bmF2eV9yaWJib25zKmh0bQ/

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 8:07 PM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 20:07:27 -0400

There is one thing that caught my eye on this. His flash for his wings. That flash is from the 503th Parachute Infantry Regiment. The issue is that the 503rd didn't go to Korea. But he does have ribbons that he served in Korea. Maybe he went there with another unit and returned to be reassigned to them. But that is only thing that doesn't make sense to me.

Response by SSG Robert Webster made Jul 8 at 2015 8:15 PM

SSG Robert Webster — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 20:15:16 -0400

Since I have not read all of the comments, this may have been posted before but here is the information on the China Service Medal that a number of people appear to have an issue with.
Manual of Military Decorations" Department of Defense. July 1990. pp. D–12
Served ashore in China or who were attached to any of the vessels that operated in support of the operations in China between 7 July 1937, and 7 September 1939.[4]
1.The commemorative purposes for which the China Service Medal was established and authorized by General Order No. 176, dated 1 July 1942, are extended to include the services performed by personnel of the Navy, Marine Corps, and Coast Guard during the operations in China subsequent to 2 September 1945, and until a terminal date to be designated. It is further provided that the Secretary of the Navy may tender this medal to personnel of the Army or other components of the Armed Forces of the United States for service which he may determine to be commensurate with and consistent with the services for which the award is made to personnel in the naval service, and this provision for tender shall apply for all periods of time for which award of this medal is authorized. Served ashore in China or were attached to any of the vessels that operated in support of operations in China between September 2, 1945 and April 1, 1957.
2.The medal will be awarded to individuals who shall have been attached to, present, and serving on permanent duty with an organization of the naval service of the United States credited by the Secretary of the Navy with having participated in operations in China. Service In a passenger status, or as an observer, visitor, courier, escort, inspector, or other similar status when not permanently attached to an eligible unit, is not creditable toward eligibility for the above medal. Services performed in the Asiatic-Pacific area between 3 September 1945 and 2 March 1946, inclusive, shall not be credited toward individual eligibility for the China Service Medal unless the individual is already eligible for the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal for services performed prior to 2 September 1945.
3.Organizations will, consistent with the above dates, be credited with qualifying service for services performed on shore in China and such adjacent islands and territories as are recognized to be Chinese, or in ships operating in such territorial waters or contiguous ocean areas, or in aircraft based upon and operating from such territories or ships.
4.The China Service Medal shall not be awarded for any service for which another service medal is authorized except as provided in paragraph 2 above and not more than one medal shall be awarded to any individual. No clasps, distinguishing devices, or other insignia are authorized to be worn on the corresponding service ribbon except that Individuals to whom the medal has been or may be awarded for service performed under General Order No. 176, of 1 July 1942, shall upon becoming eligible for this award for service performed subsequent to 2 September 1945, wear a bronze star signifying the second award on the ribbon of the medal and on the service ribbon.

Response by Cpl Brett Wagner made Jul 8 at 2015 10:07 PM

Cpl Brett Wagner — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 22:07:05 -0400

I do not see a good conduct medal, but hey a lot of people served and never received one. If this guy is old enough to have served in China he would have to be about 92 and at that age I give him credit for remembering his own name. Hell I have to take out my driver's license when someone asks me my name.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 8 at 2015 10:43 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 08 Jul 2015 22:43:41 -0400

This link should help everyone ID medals in the future! The Institute of Heraldry. Great website: http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/

The Institute of Heraldry | Home

The purpose of this site is to provide information on United States Army heraldic entitlements; how they are displayed, and how and why it is worn.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 12:27 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 00:27:42 -0400

Lies. In 1942 he was 10 years old.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 7:49 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 07:49:18 -0400

One other thing that may just be nothing but he is wearing the Chief Pretty Officer Rank (E7). Maybe he is just wearing it because he was in the Navy and it say "USN" on it. I don't know if Navy Vets do that or not.

Response by CPT Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 8:14 AM

CPT Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 08:14:59 -0400

Yet another thing that I also noticed is the Army Good Conduct Medal Ribbon he is wearing. If was a Platoon Leader he would not have been awarded one. Officers don't rate them. It is for enlisted only. I am not sure how that would have worked. Maybe LTC Stephen C. could advise if officers in that era were given AGCMs.

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 9 at 2015 9:46 AM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 09:46:26 -0400

This is true. I stand corrected.

Response by SSG John Erny made Jul 9 at 2015 10:04 AM

SSG John Erny — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 10:04:00 -0400

Too much time has passed and the records keeping from that time frame was not so great. Perhaps he did the the things he claims perhaps he did not. He is an old man, leave it at that.

Response by PO2 Steven Erickson made Jul 9 at 2015 2:38 PM

PO2 Steven Erickson — Thu, 09 Jul 2015 14:38:22 -0400

I have to ask a question. I admit that it is based on the following personal biases:
1. I never served in combat
2. I don't place a lot of emphasis on "the rack" that a SM or vet may display

OK. So here goes...

Why is the idea of "stolen valor" such a hot button in situations like this? Why do we seem to be drawn so vehemently to an analysis of what somebody's got pinned on their chest, when there is no outward appearance of an attempt to "steal" valor or falsely claim rights/privaledges?

Clearly, this man served honorably and sacrificed a lot in that service. He's not verbally claiming to be someone he's not. Am I missing something?

Help me see - in a situation like this, as opposed to Brian Williams, or a veteran wearing the SS or MoH that s/he didn't earn - why an "assessment" of what he's wearing is so important?

Thanks... Again, please look at my self-described biases before you reply. Maybe they're waaaaay off.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 10 at 2015 12:03 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jul 2015 00:03:50 -0400

It ia the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal, and the stars represent the number of campaigns he was in.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 10 at 2015 12:11 AM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jul 2015 00:11:31 -0400

The ribbon with the four stars appears to be the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Medal, and the stars represent the number of campaigns he was in.

Response by COL Charles Williams made Jul 10 at 2015 12:43 PM

COL Charles Williams — Fri, 10 Jul 2015 12:43:59 -0400

SPC Jan Allbright, M.Sc., R.S. As an example... My Iraqi Campaign Medal has now 3 stars (I have seen more), for the three campaigns I participated in. My Armed Forces expeditionary Medal has 2 stars. I have seen Vietnam campaign medals and others with 4 stars... or more... There was just an article in the paper about Soldier who died, and the Army told the family he had 4 bronze stars, it turned out he had the Vietnam Service Medal with 4 campaign or service stars. There are also silver stars, like oak-leafs for when you exceed 5. The rest, best I can tell, are in the right order, and could be medals/ribbons that no longer commonly exist. I would never question this guy. I would shake his hand and thank him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_star

Service star - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A service star is a miniature bronze or silver five-pointed star 316 inch in diameter that is authorized to be worn by members of the seven uniformed services of the United States on medals and ribbons to denote an additional award or service period.[1] The service star (316 inch star) may also be referred to as a campaign star or battle star depending on which award is authorized the 316 inch star and the manner in which the device is used...

Response by LTC Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 10 at 2015 7:44 PM

LTC Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 10 Jul 2015 19:44:47 -0400

Done a little looking and on that bottom row the two outer ribbons are Korean Service and Untied Nations Service in Korea. 187th was in Korea and wore that glider patch on their garison cap. The flash behind the wings is a 501st regiment flash.

Response by 1SG Private RallyPoint Member made Jul 15 at 2015 12:55 PM

1SG Private RallyPoint Member — Wed, 15 Jul 2015 12:55:20 -0400

Our greatest generation indeed. We could use some of this guys resiliency in the "new modern Army."

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made Mar 23 at 2017 9:22 AM

SSG Edward Tilton — Thu, 23 Mar 2017 09:22:30 -0400

People can't just be what they really were. They are drawn to all of the shiny things available at Medals R Us.

Response by SSG Edward Tilton made May 28 at 2017 6:30 PM

SSG Edward Tilton — Sun, 28 May 2017 18:30:45 -0400

4 Stars is a new high, I thought three was the max