Mentorship vs fraternization

SGT Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Oct 2014 03:10:56 -0400

When do you think the line is crossed. Personally, the best mentorship I have ever recieved was from a senior NCO, when I was a SPC(P) and newly promoted SGT in his garage, watching some sporting event or other, a meal, and some drinks. My current duty station has very strong policies regarding NCO and junior enlisted fraternization, not to mention the standard Officer / enlisted fraternization policies. What do YOU think is acceptable, and what is to far?

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 11 at 2014 3:17 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sat, 11 Oct 2014 03:17:59 -0400

When I first joined, my first line supervisor eventually became a friend and mentor not only for work but off duty too. I kept my professionalism though and always called him by his rank and name. It wasn't until a few years later, about the time I got a supply room of my own, did I start calling him by his first name but only when we were at his house and both in civilian clothes. We are still friends to this day. Sadly, many people don't know how to separate the friendship from professionalism.

Response by MAJ Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 12 at 2014 11:51 AM

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:51:44 -0400

Mentorship = door open at work. Fraternization (or possible appearance of) = door closed, off post, and especially when alcohol is involved. Young soldiers better keep in mind that "appearance" is often the only difference.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Oct 12 at 2014 11:58 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:58:55 -0400

As said by others, the problem comes when the parties, be it one or both, can not separate work from play. The multitude of problems that comes from this cause tons of friction, and can lead to hostile and/or undesirable work environments. If the junior ranking SM isn't being held to the same standards as others in the same rank/grade/position, it's then that others notice it, and the problems begin. Double standards, toxic leadership, polarization, and blatant fraterization can break a unit down. This all comes on a case by case basis though. Some can work and play just fine, others cannot. I've noticed it a lot with newly promoted SGTs and SSGs that were promoted too quickly. They get comfortable under that senior, and begin to run rampant. The senior is too worried about losing a friend, instead of holding them accountable for their actions.

Response by SPC David S. made Oct 12 at 2014 1:26 PM

SPC David S. — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 13:26:43 -0400

I think in NG or AR this happens a lot. But in active this can cause a problem as it will effect the CoC. I feel it's much wiser to seek out friends that are within you rank.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Oct 12 at 2014 1:27 PM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 13:27:12 -0400

MAJ Private RallyPoint Member hit it right on the head - Appearance. If it would appear inappropriate to a reasonable adult it probably is. I always tried to keep my personal life and military lives separate for that reason. Having a beer with the troops at a sponsored event, going out with mixed ranks for lunch, playing in a pickup game after hours at a public place, staying late at the office to help out a SM, I would consider appropriate. IMHO anything at someone's residence or one on one in private before or after hours has that "appearance" factor.

Response by TSgt Joshua Copeland made Oct 12 at 2014 3:22 PM

TSgt Joshua Copeland — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 15:22:35 -0400

In AF terms, as long as the whole shop is invited it is usually ok. However if only a small group actually go on a routine basis, there can be a perception and becomes a no-go.

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Jan 2 at 2015 7:59 PM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Fri, 02 Jan 2015 19:59:45 -0500

That might have been great mentorship for you SGT Binswanger, but unless all his Soldiers were invited to the garage, that's showing favoritism. There is a good case by case where this works out great and there is nothing wrong going on (like yours probably was) but there needs to be one standard in the army, and its a no-go on fraternization.

Response by SFC(P) Tobias M. made Feb 24 at 2015 4:10 PM

SFC(P) Tobias M. — Tue, 24 Feb 2015 16:10:34 -0500

If you are looking at mentorship is not going to a bar and kicking some back. Mentorship is when you have on person take another under their wing and teach them the ropes. Getting them to be a better leader.

Fraternization is when you and that same person are involved in things that do not deal with the military. With that being said I will not take one E4 to the bar for a drink. I will take the entire platoon for a drink to show that I care as their PLT SGT.

The line is very bold and dark. There is no reason for you to be going and hanging out with your leadership as a lower enlisted. All it takes is one person to assume that something is going on and guess what? That thing is going on even if it is not going on. You have to be very careful.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Apr 21 at 2015 1:00 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 21 Apr 2015 13:00:57 -0400

I have come across many an instance where the purest of intentions may have been meant, but the situation seemed far too fishy. It is, indeed a slippery slope, but there are more than enough opportunities to means to ensure that the higher ranking of the individuals/groups are kept out of the limelight.