Not sure if hiring managers really think like this or not ? If true we have a serious problem looking for work as Veterans.

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 12:34:29 -0400

I truly feel a article like the one below is what we as veterans and soon to be veterans should be talking about. Because if this is how hiring managers really think about us. Then we have a real serious problem once we leave the military, serve our country and pay are dues. Would love to hear and discusss if this has happened to any of my fellow retirees. If so how do we deal with it ? and most importantly how can we fix this ?

Response by MSG Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 25 at 2014 12:39 PM

MSG Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 12:39:26 -0400

Everyone is entitled to their opinion; however in this case, i believe the hiring manager needs a wake up call.  It's a shame to see our veterans treated like this.

Response by SGT James Elphick made Mar 25 at 2014 12:40 PM

SGT James Elphick — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 12:40:26 -0400

I work with veterans reintegrating into the workforce and I had a call about something similar to this exact thing this morning. First, we need to not just post it in our community but go through the appropriate channels. Tell the Better Business Bureau, tell your local Veterans Association and make sure the word gets out that a business is discriminating against Vets. On the other hand there are many organizations and businesses working to actually help vets and they will certainly be glad to take qualified, motivated individuals away from their competition

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 25 at 2014 12:58 PM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 12:58:02 -0400

SFC GV, I just read that small article in the JPEG image, and I have to say that manager is super ignorant.  This is my example: I had a break in service from 2004 to 2007.  I held different jobs before landing a job as a civilian contractor on Fort Riley, KS.  After I graduated college I took a part time job at Dillard's as a sale associate  which actually built my social skills because after all, I had to talk to folks.  The managers loved my rapport building skills with customers.  Customers would come in on my day off and ask if "Will" was working.  I could start a conversation with anyone of any age form 8 to 80 years old.  I approached people with a gentle heart, open minded, and I respected everyone no matter how they were dressed.  Oh wait, I was deployed twice so why didn't I just go drill sergeant on everyone?  Go figure.

Response by SFC Private RallyPoint Member made Mar 25 at 2014 1:28 PM

SFC Private RallyPoint Member — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 13:28:15 -0400

Now thats really sad and those are the people we go to war for and protect?

Response by SFC James Baber made Mar 25 at 2014 2:13 PM

SFC James Baber — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 14:13:55 -0400

Gabe, You know we have talked about this with each other before, and I think the biggest thing that is also a problem is that many of these companies are using the promotional value of them being veteran friendly just to get the government perks, but then in reality they aren't hiring veterans and using the excuse they are looking another direction, which most of us know is the backhanded way of sometimes saying oh you've been deployed, we don't want you coming in and blasting everyone or flipping out on our customers. It also applies to the age discrimination towards military retirees as well that may be in their late 40s or 50s just starting over again, we (the company) are going another direction, meaning we want a younger employee we can mold the way we want them to be. These businesses need to realize the experience, knowledge, discipline, teamwork, team players, leaders, and so much more they are avoiding and turning away that will be so much more beneficial to them than someone straight out of high school or has bounced around the job market for years with no stability. Military veterans and retirees will give their businesses the same dedication and service they gave the military and also help bring in potential business when people realize that they are military friendly and supportive as well. Just my two cents though.

Response by SPC Michael Hunt made Mar 25 at 2014 3:19 PM

SPC Michael Hunt — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 15:19:16 -0400

From my own experience, while enrolled in a CWT program through Voc Rehab... Macy's of St Petersburg, FL hired me as a salesperson knowing full well of my problems with stress. So this maybe an isolated situation.

Response by SSG Douglas Espinosa made Mar 25 at 2014 4:25 PM

SSG Douglas Espinosa — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 16:25:33 -0400

Unfortunately I see this here a lot. I worked for a retail company for a little while over a year then lost the job due to sales being down. That was this last October. Ever since that time I have not been able to find a job. I get told a lot that I am either over qualified, or that I am not a people person due to my extensive time in the service, afraid that I may snap, and the list goes on. I have a valid security clearance, speak, read and write a foreign language fluently I am willing to learn and work hard. If it weren't for the Post 9/11 GI Bill I would not be able to make it. My room mate is in the same boat. He served in the Army as well. We served in the same Company in Germany. When he learned I got out and moved here he came here in hopes to find a better job. Now both of us are living off of the GI Bill constantly looking for work.

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 25 at 2014 9:13 PM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 21:13:07 -0400

That article is also over ten years old.

Response by MSG Jose Colon made Mar 25 at 2014 9:54 PM

MSG Jose Colon — Tue, 25 Mar 2014 21:54:52 -0400

A few years ago, I went to an Equal Employment Opportunity conference in Washington D.C. I took a class on "How to deal with former military bosses". The instructors were an Administrative judge and a lawyer. The amount of baloney that they spouted made me sick. If you didn't know better, we all are rampaging morons to them. I kept my mouth shut. What they didn't know was that over 50% of the attendees to their class were former military or active duty.

One of the ladies that was there with us was a civilian employee from the Pentagon. I didn't have to say a thing. The lady from the Pentagon went ballistic on them, and from there, we went to the organizers of the conference from the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission and presented a complaint.

That should tell you the mentality of many in the civilian community. It is sad, but true.

Response by SrA Zachary Bolling made Mar 27 at 2014 9:51 AM

SrA Zachary Bolling — Thu, 27 Mar 2014 09:51:25 -0400

I, as a Veteran, have come across this multiple times. I was twice deployed and made sure to put that on every job application I filled out and it was certainly on my resume. The problem I ran into the most is that nearly every company required submitting an app on line. I went to a handful of interviews and the whole time we talked about my experience in the military. I even put myself through the Police academy in Southwest Florida. There I shined as a PT and academic stud. I was told by everyone I met that I would get a job no problem. I went to 26 different agencies and smoked every PT test and did very well in the interviews. Every agency decided to "go a different way" usually with somebody's nephew or family friend over me. I was a cop in the military, but that apparently offers no value to a company that has the option of going with someone with no experience but has a "friend" on the agency. I was then told by a captain on the hiring board that they typically will not go with a veteran unless they know somebody. How messed up are these agencies that are responsible for the public service of their city to not hire the most qualified person. That left such a bad taste in my mouth that I decided to stop looking for a Police job and decided to get a job at my friends company. I might as well join them since I couldn't beat them. Is it possible that the military might help there members by supplying a full psychological exam before separating/retiring allowing them to have a full bill of mental health?  The bottom line is that every company is worried about the same thing when thinking of hiring a military vet. "Are they going to have a break down at work"

Response by SSG (ret) William Martin made Mar 27 at 2014 10:08 AM

SSG (ret) William Martin — Thu, 27 Mar 2014 10:08:42 -0400

For prior SMs who are told they are over qualified by a potential employer.  A retire 1SG told me he wanted to be a manager at a Home Depot.  When he applied he applied for a material handler (fork lift driver) and he only listed the experience necessary y for that position.  He got the job and when there was a position open that was more pay, he applied that the job from the inside.  Eventually he became the manager.  Does anyone understand what the retired 1SG did?

Response by SSG Michael Serman made Mar 29 at 2014 2:40 PM

SSG Michael Serman — Sat, 29 Mar 2014 14:40:07 -0400

I'm sorry so many of you have had a difficult time with potential employers. With that being said, I don't think this attitude is as wide spread as everyone is making it out to be.

The job market is tough no matter who you are. I live in one of the most economically depressed areas in the nation. When a position opens at the nearby mine, for example, there are over 2k applicants for a single position.

There are companies out there looking specifically for vets. I was hired by a large pharma company after six months of unemployment because of my vet status. I received preference over people with 10yrs sales experience when I had none.

In any case is that the kind of place you want to work? If I encountered that in an interview I would have to politely excuse myself and let them know just how wrong they are.

Response by Cpl Thomas Archambault made Apr 16 at 2014 6:53 PM

Cpl Thomas Archambault — Wed, 16 Apr 2014 18:53:39 -0400

I'm sorry that you encountered that. I own a SDVOSB mechanical piping company and my standing rule is no DD 214 NO JOB. Veterans know how to accomplish the task at hand. Veterans will go over, under, around, and through it to get it done and they don't ever leave one of their own behind! Don't let these civilian jack-legs rain on your parade. Our country stands strong because of people like us! As VBO's and SDVBO's businesses start to grow, we know full well on who we can depend on. Someday that hag might be asking you for a job.

Response by Sgt Christopher Collins made May 15 at 2014 9:52 PM

Sgt Christopher Collins — Thu, 15 May 2014 21:52:47 -0400

I would say it is probably true. I am in a Linkedin group and one veteran tried and tried and tried. So he decided to take his military career off his resume and his began getting responses.

Sad but true.

Response by MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca made Aug 4 at 2014 2:00 PM

MAJ Robert (Bob) Petrarca — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 14:00:26 -0400

Bullsh!t alert going into overdrive!

Sorry should have specified that it was on the hiring managers. If they are using lame excuses like that to not hire deserving veterans that's BS

Response by SGT Jay Ehrenfeld made Aug 4 at 2014 3:36 PM

SGT Jay Ehrenfeld — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 15:36:29 -0400

Retreating, and scramble for jobs, additional protection for a veterans are a concern displaced in (RIF), said personnel director, who spoke on condition of anonymity. “It’s unfair, more should
Be on performance and not on status”, director said. (That is a Lie) (it based on status and not on performance). Veteran’s Groups said manager’s Discrimination against Veterans. Just because they are Veterans

Response by SGT Jay Ehrenfeld made Aug 4 at 2014 3:37 PM

SGT Jay Ehrenfeld — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 15:37:11 -0400

Response by SFC David Pope, MBA made Aug 4 at 2014 4:03 PM

SFC David Pope, MBA — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 16:03:42 -0400

Unfortunately there are the ignorant that only see the world from their little bubbles they live in. My experience in retail was much different. I got the job because I had been all over the world, and it helped that the hiring manager had a son in Afghanistan with the USMC. I am pursuing a Doctorate in Business Administration with a concentration in Organizational leadership and business ethics. My goal is to one day be able to lecture to HR managers about the benefits of hiring veterans. Part of my research involves two retired generals who work in the private sector. I have gathered all my research from my MBA courses and when I start school in Jan 2015 I will already be working on my dissertation. My guess is that the hiring manager in this case has something against the military, and she made up the other crap to sell her position on the matter. I remember guys coming back from Nam and getting the same line of BS.

Response by SFC David Pope, MBA made Aug 4 at 2014 4:26 PM

SFC David Pope, MBA — Mon, 04 Aug 2014 16:26:48 -0400

Many of your states has a job service office for unemployment and looking for job listings. In Utah they call it Workforce Services, and they have case workers who are trained to find jobs for veterans. I recommend if you have a GI Bill then use it. Employers are looking for skills they can use. If you are in high tech in the military then you can probably get hired on at a company that does similar work. If you are a grunt or in a combat arms role and you are not interested in law enforcement, fire or security. I suggest going back to school, that's what I did.
The VA helped me get my degree through Voc Rehab, and my counselor has been wonderful in explaining my rights as a veteran.

Use these tools, because you earned them.

Response by SGT Jay Ehrenfeld made Aug 5 at 2014 12:27 PM

SGT Jay Ehrenfeld — Tue, 05 Aug 2014 12:27:59 -0400

here is the CEO of Macys email address [login to see] I have written to them last night and I have not heard from them and I won't because it the upper crest whose is at fault

Response by MAJ Dallas D. made Oct 30 at 2014 2:38 PM

MAJ Dallas D. — Thu, 30 Oct 2014 14:38:30 -0400

When I retired I started a staffing agency to help veterans find jobs. I sat in meetings with CEO's, HR Managers and others and they almost always said the right thing but when it came down to it they would never follow thru.

I actually had a CEO tell me, "Look I want to say I am hiring Veterans for the PR but I will never hire a Veteran, all you guys have PTSD and I don't want to get killed by you one day".

I promise you it took every bit of my strength not to knock this guy out. Instead I stood up and said "I am sorry you feel that way, but I hope you sleep comfortably tonight in the freedom those Veterans have provided you", and walked out.

I then reported his company to the local Veterans Board and magically his company was removed from the city's list of Veteran Friendly Employees.

I am curious if anyone else thinks that all of the publicity WWP gets could actually be harmful to Veterans. It seems a large majority of the Civilian population now believes we are all ticking time bombs.

Response by PO3 Joel Salminen made Nov 1 at 2014 3:39 PM

PO3 Joel Salminen — Sat, 01 Nov 2014 15:39:36 -0400

As someone who has been in a hiring manager position for many years I am not aware of any anti-military bias from other managers. Obviously being a veteran myself I certainly a pro-military bias, but that bias does guarantee I would hire a veteran over a non-veteran. The most important attribute to a job candidate is their relevant experience, even greater than their educational background. That isn't to say education isn't important, but in my professional your skills and experience are constantly moving target.

My advice to those approaching the transition to the private sector is that you should step back and think of your military experience in a more abstract sense in terms of the life lessons you experience and the skills you developed from it.

For me my experience in the military taught me how to handle stress and not make bad decisions because of it. To be stationed overseas as an 18-year-old was a test of my maturity and responsibility, to work with classified information a test of my character and integrity, to demonstrate progression in all my positions a demonstration of my initiative and ambition.

Now that it has been many years since my service I don't have to spend a lot of time translating to others what my experiences did for me. In the beginning of my career it was very important to relate this experience to hiring managers and others and most certainly helped me land great opportunities.

Response by SP5 Rod Cross made Nov 10 at 2014 11:04 AM

SP5 Rod Cross — Mon, 10 Nov 2014 11:04:29 -0500

Waste Management, Inc offers a wealth of employment opportunites for qualified personnel tranisitioning from the military. Candidates interested in seeking employment should visit our website at http://www.wmcareers.com. They may also contact Rod Cross at [login to see] .

Response by SP5 Rod Cross made Nov 10 at 2014 11:04 AM

SP5 Rod Cross — Mon, 10 Nov 2014 11:04:36 -0500

Response by SSG Private RallyPoint Member made Nov 10 at 2014 11:36 AM

SSG Private RallyPoint Member — Mon, 10 Nov 2014 11:36:49 -0500

There was an article I read just the other day from the Washington Post, here a portion of what it said "one of the service members he served with in Iraq was turned down when he sought to volunteer with a national youth mentoring organization. “They asked him kind of elliptically, ‘Did you serve in Afghanistan?’ ‘Yes.’ ‘Did you serve in Iraq?’ ‘Yes.’ ‘Well, thank you for your service, but we’re concerned about post-traumatic stress disorder,’ ” Greitens recalled. “The message was: We don’t want you to talk to our kids.”

"Stories of painting schools, building playgrounds or feeding the homeless don’t attract the same attention as a mentally ill veteran who goes on a shooting rampage or one who has sustained life-altering injuries."

I've had hiring managers even asked what I did over there, and I tried to keep it to the job description I was interviewing for, but no, they don't want to hear that. Once they got the idea I was avoiding that line of question, I knew the interview is a bust. It's not like you can fight back, it's your word against there's. Here's the thing, you're a Veteran, which means you probably seen combat, so therefore you probably have PTSD, you are now a liability.

I mean really, it's not like anyone here can take anitbiotics and PTSD magically goes away. It's one of the reasons why I'm still unemployed. I know there's some perception by employers that if they hire us, we're going to miss work and cause problems oh and I love this one, "you're a Veteran, you might have access to guns". Well even if I wasn't a Veteran, I would still have access to guns, duh!

The media is no help either. I while back their was another mass shooting, and I heard the news reporter say they were trying to find out if there was a criminal history and if they had a military background. WOW! So now every shooting, you bet they will be looking to see if the shooter had any military background.

I don't want pity, I don't need a handout, all I'm trying to do is still be of service to my community in some form or fashion.

Response by 1LT Nick Kidwell made Nov 10 at 2014 11:38 AM

1LT Nick Kidwell — Mon, 10 Nov 2014 11:38:36 -0500

In a private security setting, I was told by a former LEO supervisor that I was "too military" in a position where at least half my co-workers were either veterans or serving National Guard soldiers.

Oh well. He's gone, and my current supervisor is satisfied with my job performance at the same poistion, so it's all good.

Response by MAJ Dennis Malone made Nov 10 at 2014 9:33 PM

MAJ Dennis Malone — Mon, 10 Nov 2014 21:33:09 -0500

I have submitted well over 20 cv's and cover letters for positions that I know that I could do even before I completed my project management and Lean Sigma Six Courses at Villanova. The ONE interview I was granted told me that all of my experience working with other nationalities and coordinating large efforts was nice, but I wouldn't be able to hack what a civilian project manager does. I know a lot of civilians, I am one now, and I haven't seen the type of dedication and stamina it took to do my wartime job in any of those folks, but I couldn't handle the civilian side...whatever! Geesh, I hate to quote my children when they were teenagers, but it seems like all of this talk about hiring a vet is just that...talk.

Response by SGT Kenneth Curtis made Oct 22 at 2015 1:30 AM

SGT Kenneth Curtis — Thu, 22 Oct 2015 01:30:58 -0400

When I first got out in 2013 I was in an interview to be a new Target stores Night Shift Inventory Leader. Dressed good, clean shaven, new haircut, and have my resume in hand. Interview went stellar and I felt like I nailed it. But as I was leaving, the lady after me was called in and I heard her, "Oh hello Jim!"..."Is that you Alice?". That's when I knew I was back to square one.

Seriously, I had the fact that I had numerous Soldiers under my charge and was also signed for roughly $150,000 - $2.5million at any given time. What does it take for us to get a job!?